Does Vaping Suppress The Immune System?

[thedogofdoom]

I've been vaping now for well over a year. I'm definitely in the more advanced class of subtank users, i.e. I know what I'm doing. I know all about VG and PG ratios, PG allergies, etc.

Before I started smoking and swiftly switched to vaping, I got maybe a couple of colds a year. In the last 6 months or so however, I've been sick maybe 8 times. I thought that whatever problem I'd been having had gone away, but I got sick again last week, got mostly over it, and then got sick again today.

There are studies out there that say vaping suppresses the immune system. I'm starting to believe them. BUT my friends that vape, don't have the same problem. I have the same shitty diet as them, but I probably vape more. I don't know if maybe I started taking vitamin C every day, or drank a lot more water, or fixed my diet if it would help, but I'm in good shape. Pretty thin and muscular. Problem is I can't keep getting sick like this. I'm a singer in my band, and we're (dare I say) on the verge of blowing up at least locally.

I don't want to quit vaping, because I like it. I'm a low nicotine user who's definitely dependent on it, so I thought it would be nice to vape because I could still have the nicotine without all the other stuff.

What do you guys think? Is it time for me to just give it up? It seems like I'm the only one with this problem, but I also can't think of anything else that would cause me to get sick this much.

 

[Jimi D]

Vaping has the opposite effect on me. I haven't had a chest cold in years. A head cold in a couple of years that lasted a couple of days.

 

[BigNasty]

I think we have covered this bullshit before.
You were fucked up prior to vaping.
Smoking fucked you up more.
Not smoking you notice your shit is fucked up and blame vaping.

Those studies are bullshit.


You have got the HIV? it is vaping's fault.

 

[Rossum]

I've been vaping now for well over a year. I'm definitely in the more advanced class of subtank users, i.e. I know what I'm doing. I know all about VG and PG ratios, PG allergies, etc.

Before I started smoking and swiftly switched to vaping, I got maybe a couple of colds a year. In the last 6 months or so however, I've been sick maybe 8 times. I thought that whatever problem I'd been having had gone away, but I got sick again last week, got mostly over it, and then got sick again today.

Just out of curiosity, for how long did you smoke, and what PG/VG ratio juice do you use?

 

[AmandaD]

Your profile shows you're 18 - sounds like you need to get a good health checkup! Lots of things can affect your immune system, and vaping is probably the least likely. However, it's obviously healthiest not to put anything at all in your lungs. For those of us who smoked for many years (in my case 40) vaping is harm reduction.

 

[Zamazam]

When I smoked I got bronchitis a couple times a year plus every cold that came around. Since I started vaping the bouts with bronchitis are gone along with a lot of other health ailments. I suggest you get a through checkup. Vaping does not suppress your immune system. Your genetic background and lifestyle will.

 

[thedogofdoom]

Just out of curiosity, for how long did you smoke, and what PG/VG ratio juice do you use?

Only smoked for a few months before my friends made me quit, I mostly use 90/10

 

[RatRacer]

Only smoked for a few months before my friends made me quit, I mostly use 90/10

Honestly, if you are a popular band lead singer, I would bet the constant exposure to other human beings in a enclosed venue greatly increases your chances of picking up bugs of all sorts.
I don't get nearly as sick as I used to when smoking, and that decreased even further with the end of habitating bars.

 

[SteveS45]

When smoking I never got colds and after quitting and vaping I feel HEALTHIER and still do not get colds!

 

[SteveS45]

I think we have covered this bullshit before.
You were fucked up prior to vaping.
Smoking fucked you up more.
Not smoking you notice your shit is fucked up and blame vaping.

Those studies are bullshit.


You have got the HIV? it is vaping's fault.

OH Yeah one more thing........ What he said!

 

[AndriaD]

Hanging out in bars also leads to drinking alcohol, which is a real bastard to the immune system. It also does mean hanging out with a lot of other people who drink alcohol and hang out in bars, so you get to enjoy whatever microbes they're playing host to.

If you only smoked for a few months before you started vaping, I have to wonder why you bother. You might be "dependent" but that's a long, long way from "addicted", which is what most of us were to cigarettes after decades of use. Dependent is like, getting headaches because you give up coffee. Addicted is like, you give up eating very much so you have enough money to buy cigarettes. Been there, done that, on both.

Patient: Doctor, it hurts when I do this.
Doctor: Then STOP DOING THAT!

Andria

 

[SteveS45]

You can hang out in bars at 18?

 

[RatRacer]

You can hang out in bars at 18?

If the local laws allow that age for band members that are performing. I just threw that scenario out there, but he never stated as such.

 

[AndriaD]

You can hang out in bars at 18?

In GA you can... you just can't drink.

Andria

 

[tritonenneptunus]

This is a peculiar post. I've never had a problem vaping but if you are having so much problems then stop, it's pretty simple. You don't have to go pulling BS "studies" out of your hiney to scare everyone to death that doesn't know much about vaping. I assume that as a newbie if I was another newbie who read the post I would get worried and google it and then find all these lies about vaping. But maybe that's just an assumption... I'm just going off of what I'd do.

 

[JuicyLucy]

I've been vaping now for well over a year. I'm definitely in the more advanced class of subtank users, i.e. I know what I'm doing. I know all about VG and PG ratios, PG allergies, etc.

Before I started smoking and swiftly switched to vaping, I got maybe a couple of colds a year. In the last 6 months or so however, I've been sick maybe 8 times. I thought that whatever problem I'd been having had gone away, but I got sick again last week, got mostly over it, and then got sick again today.

There are studies out there that say vaping suppresses the immune system. I'm starting to believe them. BUT my friends that vape, don't have the same problem. I have the same shitty diet as them, but I probably vape more. I don't know if maybe I started taking vitamin C every day, or drank a lot more water, or fixed my diet if it would help, but I'm in good shape. Pretty thin and muscular. Problem is I can't keep getting sick like this. I'm a singer in my band, and we're (dare I say) on the verge of blowing up at least locally.

I don't want to quit vaping, because I like it. I'm a low nicotine user who's definitely dependent on it, so I thought it would be nice to vape because I could still have the nicotine without all the other stuff.

What do you guys think? Is it time for me to just give it up? It seems like I'm the only one with this problem, but I also can't think of anything else that would cause me to get sick this much.

Shitty diets affect people in different ways, as does stress, irregular sleep, sleep deprivation etc. Vaping may also effect people differently also, but I'd look at your lifestyle as a whole before solely blaming vaping for your increased number of colds.

And I agree that those so-called studies are pure malarky. The vast majority of vapers are much healthier than they were as smokers.

 

[SteveS45]

This is a peculiar post. I've never had a problem vaping but if you are having so much problems then stop, it's pretty simple. You don't have to go pulling BS "studies" out of your hiney to scare everyone to death that doesn't know much about vaping. I assume that as a newbie if I was another newbie who read the post I would get worried and google it and then find all these lies about vaping. But maybe that's just an assumption... I'm just going off of what I'd do.

Very well put. My GF who quit smoking before I had the balls to has been using Cig-A-Likes and recently she said to me she wanted to quit using them and her reason was............... Ready for it? Popcorn Lung!

So for the next half an hour I explained to her how I had already researched it and there is NO Diacetyl in her e-Cigs an how most flavorings do not contain it. I also went into it was breathing the chemical in a powdered form and Yadda Yadda Yadda. But that is what propaganda is designed to do.

 

[JuicyLucy]

Very well put. My GF who quit smoking before I had the balls to has been using Cig-A-Likes and recently she said to me she wanted to quit using them and her reason was............... Ready for it? Popcorn Lung!

So for the next half an hour I explained to her how I had already researched it and there is NO Diacetyl in her e-Cigs an how most flavorings do not contain it. I also went into it was breathing the chemical in a powdered form and Yadda Yadda Yadda. But that is what propaganda is designed to do.

I am going to scream if one more ignoramus tells me I'm going to get popcorn lung.

 

[SteveS45]

Back to the OP as he was asking a legitimate question on what we think. My answer is this................

GO TO A DOCTOR and get yourself a Professional Medical Evaluation and DO NOT use the Internet as your Diagnostician

 

[SteveS45]

I am going to scream if one more ignoramus tells me I'm going to get popcorn lung.

Do You realize how long it took me to alleviate my GF's concerns. My Father is recovering from Obliterative Bronchiolitis Pnuemo-Thorasic Surgery as we speak and I have dealt with this issue for over a month. He was a smoker and a Cabinet Maker in his working life and exposed to many chemicals and has Emphysema.

You can only get popcorn lung if you worked in a popcorn factory.

 

[Thejackson5]

Rip must have done those studies he was referring to.

 

[BigNasty]

Did your vaping dry your knuckles?
Acute headaches?
Thyroid issues?
Anal cranial insertion syndrome?

Better go buy some of that rip trippers shit.

 

[SteveS45]

This just looks like another of those fake posts that is only posted so that Search Engines can find the Title. If not then maybe he will come back and post and I will offer an apology but right now I am sticking to the conspiracy theory............. Does something stink?

 

[thedogofdoom]

Thanks to those of you for reminding me about propaganda. All I can say is it does its job well. You're right I shouldn't have been sucked into the bullshit.

I suppose I'll go see a doctor and try to sort out my diet and sleep patterns.

Thanks guys, and vape on.

 

[thedogofdoom]

This just looks like another of those fake posts that is only posted so that Search Engines can find the Title. If not then maybe he will come back and post and I will offer an apology but right now I am sticking to the conspiracy theory............. Does something stink?

Not a fake post, just misguided paranoia.

 

[BigNasty]

I have had bloated inbred cat piss smelling neck roll beards try too tell me my vape would kill me, all the while smoking a top ryo..Cause they saw it on the news.
Jet fuel, vapor trapped in lungs, popcorn lung, antifreeze.. unknown chemicals... etc

In all the phlegm rattling, mouth breathing glory..

 

[SteveS45]

Not a fake post, just misguided paranoia.

Hey buddy my offer of an apology still stands, it's up to you to accept it or not!

Just it Grinds My Gears when people use the Internet for sources of Medical Information.

 

[JuicyLucy]

You are good @thedogofdoom

You know, a lot of folks do have sensitivities to Pg or Vg, things like that.

A lot of us just worry about vapers buying into the VERY BAD SCIENCE being touted as truth.

 

[SteveS45]

 

[thedogofdoom]

Hey buddy my offer of an apology still stands, it's up to you to accept it or not!

Just it Grinds My Gears when people use the Internet for sources of Medical Information.

I accept of course

 

[JuicyLucy]

 

[inspects]

Vaping has the opposite effect on me. I haven't had a chest cold in years. A head cold in a couple of years that lasted a couple of days.

^^^^^THIS^^^^^......haven't been sick in a year++ since starting to vape.

 

[AndriaD]

^^^^^THIS^^^^^......haven't been sick in a year++ since starting to vape.

I had a bacterial sinus infection back in the fall... but it was after visiting my mom in the hospital, and also shortly after starting to use a steroidal asthma medication (steroids DO suppress the immune system); and just now, I've been struggling for a week-10 days with something, might be a mild case of flu... but the weird thing with both was the near-total lack of chest involvement, so it was hard to know I was sick, until it was really advanced; with the bacterial sinus infection, I had zero chest involvement; with this current thing, there's been just a little coughing-up, which is what makes me think "flu" rather than "cold." Also digestive upsets seems to point to that. But it was hard in both cases to even realize I *was* sick, with the lack of deep-chest mucusy cough.

I think the fact that it's probably flu, yet isn't laying me flat on my back, would seem to indicate that in fact my immune system is in much better shape as a vaper than I was as a smoker.

Andria

 

[inspects]

I think the fact that it's probably flu, yet isn't laying me flat on my back, would seem to indicate that in fact my immune system is in much better shape as a vaper than I was as a smoker.

Andria

I'd certainly guess your immune system is in much better shape vaping, than while smoking.....!

I surely feel mine is...I used to get nasty colds during the winter, guaranteed.....now....nadda.

 

[AndriaD]

I'd certainly guess your immune system is in much better shape vaping, than while smoking.....!

I surely feel mine is...I used to get nasty colds during the winter, guaranteed.....now....nadda.

Heh... it's been kinda funny, with the little bit of coughing-up I've had recently, thinking "ew, gross!"... and then realizing, I used to do that CONSTANTLY! And it was a hell of a lot grosser when it was all cigarette tar yuck! So glad I don't do to myself anymore.

Andria

 

[Lost]

I've been vaping now for well over a year.

In the last 6 months or so however,

Math.

 

[thedogofdoom]

Math.

What's your point exactly? I've been vaping for a little over a year, and I've started noticing the symptoms in the last 6 months.

You all have done your job correcting, me and I understand now what I need to do about my problem, but there's nothing 'mathematically' wrong with my post.

 

[Rossum]

Only smoked for a few months before my friends made me quit, I mostly use 90/10

It's difficult for most of us who smoked for decades to relate to this because the near universal experience is that we get far fewer colds than when we were smoking. Is this simply because we quit smoking or is it due to the mild antiseptic/protective effect of PG? Personally, I think it's some of both. I run 35% PG...

 

[Whiskey]

What's your point exactly? I've been vaping for a little over a year, and I've started noticing the symptoms in the last 6 months.

You all have done your job correcting, me and I understand now what I need to do about my problem, but there's nothing 'mathematically' wrong with my post.

I hope you find out what is causing the problems, I think that if you have been vaping for a year and the issues started 6 months ago that it may be a reaction to many things, as far as vaping, maybe an introduction to a new juice flavor, a PG/VG ratio change can get sensitivities ruffled. Another thing may be change of seasons. All that aside , Welcome to VU, Glad to have you here

 

[Lost]

You all have done your job correcting, me and I understand now

That's why I didn't explain it better. I tried to add more, but it all sounded preachy. So why bother with one word? I don't know... it was late. That gap of over a half a year is pretty telling that some other factor is involved. (But preachy.)

Here's the most indirect thing I can say: Vaping is a big unknown, so it leads to more uncertainty and speculation. It's easy to blame vaping for any health changes. Hell, my brain kept trying to go there there for a good while; over a year. Even for a cold.

Here's an example: Someone starts randomly feeling lethargic. Blaming the mysterious thing is the easiest route. But soooo many people are low on Vitamin D. Some people have genetic insulin or thyroid issues. Blood panel: better answer.

You can throw a dart at a diagnosis list and come out better than reading anything online. It's sad, considering that the internet is supposed to empower us with knowledge. Not for this. Just confusion with scattered bouts of hysteria.

 

[SteveS45]

 

[thedogofdoom]

That's why I didn't explain it better. I tried to add more, but it all sounded preachy. So why bother with one word? I don't know... it was late. That gap of over a half a year is pretty telling that some other factor is involved. (But preachy.)

Here's the most indirect thing I can say: Vaping is a big unknown, so it leads to more uncertainty and speculation. It's easy to blame vaping for any health changes. Hell, my brain kept trying to go there there for a good while; over a year. Even for a cold.

Here's an example: Someone starts randomly feeling lethargic. Blaming the mysterious thing is the easiest route. But soooo many people are low on Vitamin D. Some people have genetic insulin or thyroid issues. Blood panel: better answer.

You can throw a dart at a diagnosis list and come out better than reading anything online. It's sad, considering that the internet is supposed to empower us with knowledge. Not for this. Just confusion with scattered bouts of hysteria.

Fair enough. Although, you guys that are saying don't get your info from the internet are a paradox. Should I believe someone from the internet when they tell me what's on here is wrong? Or are they wrong? Then you're back at square one again, and you've found incorrect information from the internet.

Not saying any of you are wrong, just noticed this.

 

[MyMagicMist]

Fair enough. Although, you guys that are saying don't get your info from the internet are a paradox. Should I believe someone from the internet when they tell me what's on here is wrong? Or are they wrong? Then you're back at square one again, and you've found incorrect information from the internet.

Not saying any of you are wrong, just noticed this.

People here are a family that belong to the biggest family, human beings. You will never again disrespect them in such a way as to question their combined years of experience in life, as well in regards to vaping. These people volunteer time and work to find current and valid factual information to prepare it for reading by those coming to vaping. They do this gladly because their motivation is to save lives.

All of these people have sons, daughters, cousins, uncles, aunts, mothers, fathers, brothers, sister who they offer this information to without hesitation. They have no reason to lie or say something false and if they ever do so it may be in error of communication only, they admit to this openly and correct themselves. No deception lies here in this forum regarding vaping. You may find some joking, pranks going on at times but all of us are very seriously honest regarding this stuff. We save lives with it, why lie and cause harm?

Personally, this past year I had a slight touch of walking pneumonia. My nephew had it from going to our local high school. Look up the phrase kennel crud. It is a general sickness that effects dogs when kenneled closely together. It also works the same for humans. People spread bacteria, viruses. My wife went into my nephew's room to help him a bit. She got the pneumonia and well, it passed to me as well. All of us in our household had it a bit to varying degrees.

Did I get sick from vaping? Fuck no, I was sick from pneumonia being shared during the Winter when kids all go back to school. Shit happens, that's life for you. Have I been sick from vaping? Yes but only mildly and it was kind of expected. Look up vaping flu over the Electronic Cigarette Forum to read more about the sickness I had. Generally, I had to let my body expel toxins 35 years of smoking half a pack to a pack a day had put into me. The vaping drew that shit out but good. I did puke once, thankfully it was only once.

I apologize if my scrawling here seems harsh. Some of us very much dislike those who are far less experienced in life insulting their friends, family by suggesting those friends and family are feeding them bullshit. That's not very nice at all to do. I don't go tell your friends that you feed me bullshit. Wait, I just might now. You pissed me off by this. No, I won't because I'm more the adult here than you. I've learned to be better than being common. That's why I'm being a bit jagged here in this. You need to learn, enjoy a little lumping. Alright, I'm finished with this damn soap box.

* kicks the soap box out the window *

 

[AndriaD]

Fair enough. Although, you guys that are saying don't get your info from the internet are a paradox. Should I believe someone from the internet when they tell me what's on here is wrong? Or are they wrong? Then you're back at square one again, and you've found incorrect information from the internet.

Not saying any of you are wrong, just noticed this.

An important cliche I've always heard... "consider the source." If the source is some public health nazi with an ax to grind and income to lose, their opinion is not to be trusted nearly as much as the opinions of *those who actually vape*.

Andria

 

[MyMagicMist]

I try to help. * hug * You know though, stupid be .

 

[thedogofdoom]

People here are a family that belong to the biggest family, human beings. You will never again disrespect them in such a way as to question their combined years of experience in life, as well in regards to vaping. These people volunteer time and work to find current and valid factual information to prepare it for reading by those coming to vaping. They do this gladly because their motivation is to save lives.

All of these people have sons, daughters, cousins, uncles, aunts, mothers, fathers, brothers, sister who they offer this information to without hesitation. They have no reason to lie or say something false and if they ever do so it may be in error of communication only, they admit to this openly and correct themselves. No deception lies here in this forum regarding vaping. You may find some joking, pranks going on at times but all of us are very seriously honest regarding this stuff. We save lives with it, why lie and cause harm?

Personally, this past year I had a slight touch of walking pneumonia. My nephew had it from going to our local high school. Look up the phrase kennel crud. It is a general sickness that effects dogs when kenneled closely together. It also works the same for humans. People spread bacteria, viruses. My wife went into my nephew's room to help him a bit. She got the pneumonia and well, it passed to me as well. All of us in our household had it a bit to varying degrees.

Did I get sick from vaping? Fuck no, I was sick from pneumonia being shared during the Winter when kids all go back to school. Shit happens, that's life for you. Have I been sick from vaping? Yes but only mildly and it was kind of expected. Look up vaping flu over the Electronic Cigarette Forum to read more about the sickness I had. Generally, I had to let my body expel toxins 35 years of smoking half a pack to a pack a day had put into me. The vaping drew that shit out but good. I did puke once, thankfully it was only once.

I apologize if my scrawling here seems harsh. Some of us very much dislike those who are far less experienced in life insulting their friends, family by suggesting those friends and family are feeding them bullshit. That's not very nice at all to do. I don't go tell your friends that you feed me bullshit. Wait, I just might now. You pissed me off by this. No, I won't because I'm more the adult here than you. I've learned to be better than being common. That's why I'm being a bit jagged here in this. You need to learn, enjoy a little lumping. Alright, I'm finished with this damn soap box.

* kicks the soap box out the window *

...so the typical fuck your politely stated opinion because I'm older and I know better? Nothing I haven't dealt with before. My stating a paradox is not disrespect, nor is it a jab at anyone on this forum. I've only found sensible and polite people on Vaping Underground until I opened this thread.

My post was not disparaging to vaping. My post did not explicitly say that vaping was the cause for my problems. I simply asked you guys if you thought that vaping could be the cause of it. Even then I was manly asking if other people had been able to pinpoint vaping as an immunosuppressant.

So, I get that you smoked for x ammount of decades. I wish I had a cookie to give you, but I don't. Unfortunately, your time on Earth makes your thoughts and experiences no more valuable than mine. I'm sorry if you thought my noticing a paradox was disrespectful, but for all I know you could be feeding me bullshit right now. People on the internet lie about their experiences and age all the time to seem more mature or what have you. So forgive me for taking a more careful approach when taking advice from strangers.

 

[AndriaD]

...so the typical fuck your politely stated opinion because I'm older and I know better? Nothing I haven't dealt with before. My stating a paradox is not disrespect, nor is it a jab at anyone on this forum. I've only found sensible and polite people on Vaping Underground until I opened this thread.

My post was not disparaging to vaping. My post did not explicitly say that vaping was the cause for my problems. I simply asked you guys if you thought that vaping could be the cause of it. Even then I was manly asking if other people had been able to pinpoint vaping as an immunosuppressant.

So, I get that you smoked for x ammount of decades. I wish I had a cookie to give you, but I don't. Unfortunately, your time on Earth makes your thoughts and experiences no more valuable than mine. I'm sorry if you thought my noticing a paradox was disrespectful, but for all I know you could be feeding me bullshit right now. People on the internet lie about their experiences and age all the time to seem more mature or what have you. So forgive me for taking a more careful approach when taking advice from strangers.

Ok... it's *possible* that vaping may be involved; you may be sensitive to something in your vape, which is causing the secondary effect of leaving you open to infection, illness in general. And every human body has its own quirks. However, the general experience of most vapers is that if there is illness, it is most likely not vaping that is causing it, outside of 1) nic sick, 2) allergy. The best way to know? Quit vaping, see if you improve.

Andria

 

[thedogofdoom]

Ok... it's *possible* that vaping may be involved; you may be sensitive to something in your vape, which is causing the secondary effect of leaving you open to infection, illness in general. And every human body has its own quirks. However, the general experience of most vapers is that if there is illness, it is most likely not vaping that is causing it, outside of 1) nic sick, 2) allergy. The best way to know? Quit vaping, see if you improve.

Andria

I understand all of that, I just don't appreciate being talked down to.

 

[MyMagicMist]

...so the typical fuck your politely stated opinion because I'm older and I know better? Nothing I haven't dealt with before. My stating a paradox is not disrespect, nor is it a jab at anyone on this forum. I've only found sensible and polite people on Vaping Underground until I opened this thread.

My post was not disparaging to vaping. My post did not explicitly say that vaping was the cause for my problems. I simply asked you guys if you thought that vaping could be the cause of it. Even then I was manly asking if other people had been able to pinpoint vaping as an immunosuppressant.

So, I get that you smoked for x ammount of decades. I wish I had a cookie to give you, but I don't. Unfortunately, your time on Earth makes your thoughts and experiences no more valuable than mine. I'm sorry if you thought my noticing a paradox was disrespectful, but for all I know you could be feeding me bullshit right now. People on the internet lie about their experiences and age all the time to seem more mature or what have you. So forgive me for taking a more careful approach when taking advice from strangers.

And that's learning for you, too. You're already aware of this kind of stuff. That's a positive for you. As I said, I do apologize for some harshness. No, I was not exactly trying for the typical talking down to a younger person, from age argument. See it read as such though also see I misread a bit too, read too much that was not there. My humbled apologies. You're good and you're also right my experience is no more, or less important than your own.

Watch out for AndriaD there, she's a cunning old bird. At the moment she's more diplomatic. My clouds get in my way sometimes. * chuckles * She'll help sort us all out.

Ah, before I forget, I was not talking about you being stupid. What I was calling stupid is all the damn propaganda all over, not only on the web and internet. It was that stupid what brought here to ask questions. You didn't need my shit raining down on you for trying to learn. Again, sorry.

 

[AndriaD]

I understand all of that, I just don't appreciate being talked down to.

It's unavoidable when one is 18 -- but cheer up, you'll outgrow that.

It's also a usual effect of spewing the misinformation that the ANTZ have been bombarding the media with, especially when that misinformation is completely contrary to the experience of almost all vapers. You really do have to consider the source, when looking at ANYTHING in the media about vaping -- you'll come to understand that the media doesn't know anything about anything -- they're mouthpieces, spewing according to the wishes of the highest bidder -- those who pay their salaries.

Andria