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Fudgey Finger

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Member For 2 Years
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Yeah I was going pretty fast when I made these. I did have to stop twice to move my core holders though. Luckily I knew enough to keep the same tension when I stopped the drill but I can see that being the point in the process that will give me the most trouble. I wish I could do it without core holders but collapsing cores are the bane of my building existence.

They aren't really my first aliens though. I built 2 strands of alien wire just a couple weeks ago, but these ones went the easiest.

I'm going to try some alien staples now. Can you guys offer any advice on deciding what gauge decore to use? I know its 3 to 1 with round wire, but I'm not completely sure how to do it with ribbon.

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Jriley

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Member For 3 Years
Yeah I was going pretty fast when I made these. I did have to stop twice to move my core holders though. Luckily I knew enough to keep the same tension when I stopped the drill but I can see that being the point in the process that will give me the most trouble. I wish I could do it without core holders but collapsing cores are the bane of my building existence.

They aren't really my first aliens though. I built 2 strands of alien wire just a couple weeks ago, but these ones went the easiest.

I'm going to try some alien staples now. Can you guys offer any advice on deciding what gauge decore to use? I know its 3 to 1 with round wire, but I'm not completely sure how to do it with ribbon.

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Works the same way with ribbon buddy, fraliens I make my wife are 30G ka1 frames and 6ply .3R ka1 , that's 26G decore

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Fudgey Finger

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Works the same way with ribbon buddy, fraliens I make my wife are 30G ka1 frames and 6ply .3R ka1 , that's 26G decore

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Maybe I didn't phrase it right. If I wanted to make a 6x0.4 alien staple I'm doing the math like this

6x0.4=2.4mm
2.4/3= 0.8mm

So by my math I would need to decore a piece of claptoned 40g. What am I doing wrong?

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Jriley

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Member For 3 Years
Maybe I didn't phrase it right. If I wanted to make a 6x0.4 alien staple I'm doing the math like this

6x0.4=2.4mm
2.4/3= 0.8mm

So by my math I would need to decore a piece of claptoned 40g. What am I doing wrong?

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Lol, ribbon is .1 thick ..... So .6 because 6 of em.
Then your frames .32 for 28G (.32*2=.64) .25 for 30G (.25*2=.5)
Add it all together and wadda got bippidy boppidy boop

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Fudgey Finger

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Yeah but I'm not talking about a framed staple. I'm referring to a staple coil with no frames. Also, if ribbon is .1mm thick, then are you saying you would use the same decor if it was 6 pieces of 0.3 ribbon as you would with 6 pieces of 0.8 ribbon?

Just to be clear, the only thing I know about alien math is that you want your decore to be about 1/3 of your final core thickness.

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Jriley

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Member For 3 Years
Yeah but I'm not talking about a framed staple. I'm referring to a staple coil with no frames. Also, if ribbon is .1mm thick, then are you saying you would use the same decor if it was 6 pieces of 0.3 ribbon as you would with 6 pieces of 0.8 ribbon?

Just to be clear, the only thing I know about alien math is that you want your decore to be about 1/3 of your final core thickness.

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Oh no frames, never seen that.

When using frames, it doesn't matter because your not using ribbon that's that big anyway, or that is that much taller than your frame. Most frames match or are relatively close to same size height wise as the core.

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Fudgey Finger

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Ok well thanks for the help. Yeah I much prefer my staples without frames. My favorite build by far is 6x0.5 with 38g wrap. I'm just not sure how I will figure out the right size decore for the alien. I guess I can just wing it.

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champton

Bronze Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Here's what I used on my last build before I coiled it up. Fuck springiness! :D

46512539_s-soldeerbranders-5411244601000-soldeerbrander-toolland.jpg

Damn dude, overkill much? :D


Shit, what kind of RDA is that? Gotta get me one of those. Me like!
 
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Fudgey Finger

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Damn dude, overkill much? :D



Shit, what kind of RDA is that? Gotta get me one of those. Me like!
It's the ammit dual coil rta. They also make a single coil version. I just got it a week ago on the trading post. It has stellar flavor and a decent deck, but it isn't very good for really chunky coils. Not much of a juice capacity either.

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champton

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Member For 4 Years
So it's kinda like my Mason 24mm. It's not good for really chunky coils either. :p

I'd use my Obese Buddha, but it's a bit harder to trick on that thing. I use that when I just want thick clouds. I find it easier to trick with my trusty Mason.
 

EndDetour

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Member For 4 Years
It's been months since I've been on here. Just looking through the last few weeks of builds has me impressed and feeling rusty. So my 3rd Lucifer mod( rather a frankenstein version of my third Lucifer) finally kicked the bucket. I've been missing my series but I haven't had the money for another series mod for a while. My buddy at our local vape shop set me up with a Kooper plus 200w for practically free. I don't have a lot of negatives as far as regulated mods go other than the fact it can't make its mind up about the resistance at any given time. Well my wife's fuchai kicked the bucket as well so I came out of pocket for her new sigelei kaos and she couldn't be happier. It really raised the bar compared to the fuchai. Long story short I decided to treat me self to my first 26650 mod. Decided on the Cartel Boss limited edition clone in copper for $15. Nabbed a couple efest 4200mah and a kidney puncher 4000mah batteries. Figured I'd meander on here and see what new innovative shit you guys are up to. For a while now I've been building purely out of necessity and going for quick builds. I'm gonna be building some new shtuff to see what works best with this beast. Cartel should be here Monday. Anybody have any suggestions?


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KarmicRage

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Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
Hi there, Some tidy looking coils you've done there. How does that twisted wire helix build you've done vape? Looks like it would vape fairly well like.

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EndDetour

Bronze Contributor
Member For 4 Years
I don't remember the particulars. I want to say the frames were 2x28g kanthal w/36g ni80x4 +26g n80 cable core 38g ni80 helix. .18ohms single coil. Heats up fast. Decent flavor and vape production. She likes it but nothing special. I'm gonna be taking a couple hours over the weekend to make a half a dozen coils and I need ideas. What's your favorite coil for flavor so far?


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EndDetour

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Member For 4 Years
I don't remember the particulars. I want to say the frames were 2x28g kanthal w/36g ni80x4 +26g n80 cable core 38g ni80 helix. .18ohms single coil. Heats up fast. Decent flavor and vape production. She likes it but nothing special. I'm gonna be taking a couple hours over the weekend to make a half a dozen coils and I need ideas. What's your favorite coil for flavor so far?
afb29cb8685b714240d4b8c8f728c0cf.jpg



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Carambrda

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So it's kinda like my Mason 24mm. It's not good for really chunky coils either. :p

I'd use my Obese Buddha, but it's a bit harder to trick on that thing. I use that when I just want thick clouds. I find it easier to trick with my trusty Mason.
Just order the 24mm postless deck (from vapergate.com) if you want more build space inside your 24mm Mason. I have both the 24mm and the 30mm Mason Gemini Series II (they're identical to the regular version Masons, excepting only their binding posts), and I have both the 24mm and the 30mm postless deck (and I also have the Obese Buddha).
 

KarmicRage

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Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
I don't remember the particulars. I want to say the frames were 2x28g kanthal w/36g ni80x4 +26g n80 cable core 38g ni80 helix. .18ohms single coil. Heats up fast. Decent flavor and vape production. She likes it but nothing special. I'm gonna be taking a couple hours over the weekend to make a half a dozen coils and I need ideas. What's your favorite coil for flavor so far?


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I can't say I've found an absolute favourite yet, I keep switching between multicore staggered fused claptons and Alien variations. I want to get to a staggerton/alien staggerton level and see what they have to offer. You mention you a hot flavourful vape in your post, you might want to follow Raymo2u as he quite likes his "hot and wet vape" as he calls it and he's got some killer builds, also look at the people he follows on Instagram as there's even more eye candy there :)

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raymo2u

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Those were all previous builds of mine I've posted on here.
a34140670a76347138a0531d2db04a9c.jpg
16d36da0359b96091f2e89dab8e8e0cc.jpg
here's a couple newerish ones. I need guidance you beautiful fuckers. What's new? What's hot? What's gonna give me the flavor and heat I seek? What are your favorites?


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Been some time since I last saw your face in this thread, good to see you havent dropped off the earth :D:D

Personally I like 5 Core 28g SS Aliens with 4 Wraps/3mm ID, I would do 3.5mm for Single Coils.
Ive gotten pretty picky about my vape and there really isnt anything that competes for heat, flavor, and ramp time than these babies....

21577022_442952729432718_8338571497857613824_n.jpg
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If your looking at singles I suggest a wide Ribbon build using N80 .3, around 12-15ply + 28g SS Frames, 3 Wraps/3.5mm ID


20481980_125965251351039_2835596769562198016_n.jpg
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EndDetour

Bronze Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Been some time since I last saw your face in this thread, good to see you havent dropped off the earth :D:D

Personally I like 5 Core 28g SS Aliens with 4 Wraps/3mm ID, I would do 3.5mm for Single Coils.
Ive gotten pretty picky about my vape and there really isnt anything that competes for heat, flavor, and ramp time than these babies....

21577022_442952729432718_8338571497857613824_n.jpg
21576468_130939374209249_348124579857694720_n.jpg
19436986_453354228358256_548900471151001600_n.jpg
17587434_287946628301855_7216126415463251968_n.jpg




If your looking at singles I suggest a wide Ribbon build using N80 .3, around 12-15ply + 28g SS Frames, 3 Wraps/3.5mm ID


20481980_125965251351039_2835596769562198016_n.jpg
17265556_981216278677546_940076763801714688_n.jpg
23595710_916508918505062_7561626512605052928_n.jpg
15623597_941907449242996_7341368512218136576_n.jpg

First of all...it's good to see you keeping at it. Beautiful work. And I saw you picked up the aeronaut 2. My aeronaut is for the most part the only rda I work and the deck is wearing out so I've been looking at either getting the 2nd deck alone or the whole 2.5 setup. Any thoughts?
Second... I've never worked with SS. How does it compare to N80 or K-A/K-D in terms of flavor, resistance, springiness/ease of work, ramp time, applicability to mechs?
And third I threw this together in an hour or so. I'm so fucking out of practice. I'll be hooking it up tonight or tomorrow and I'll let you know the resistance, flavor, heat etc.
745d4411793243e7f078860d7c39b869.jpg
0e05f03fd29668cbf25915d45ae8c848.jpg
d7ba3d01d63391b990606d0b982f6751.jpg

28g K-A1 frames staggered in 36g N80
Frames half fused to 3x.5x.1 N80 ribbon
6x40g N80 + 2x36g N80 turned into cable sandwiched between the frames and then half staggered
I don't know what the fuck to call it yet....


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Jriley

Bronze Contributor
Member For 3 Years
First of all...it's good to see you keeping at it. Beautiful work. And I saw you picked up the aeronaut 2. My aeronaut is for the most part the only rda I work and the deck is wearing out so I've been looking at either getting the 2nd deck alone or the whole 2.5 setup. Any thoughts?
Second... I've never worked with SS. How does it compare to N80 or K-A/K-D in terms of flavor, resistance, springiness/ease of work, ramp time, applicability to mechs?
And third I threw this together in an hour or so. I'm so fucking out of practice. I'll be hooking it up tonight or tomorrow and I'll let you know the resistance, flavor, heat etc.
745d4411793243e7f078860d7c39b869.jpg
0e05f03fd29668cbf25915d45ae8c848.jpg
d7ba3d01d63391b990606d0b982f6751.jpg

28g K-A1 frames staggered in 36g N80
Frames half fused to 3x.5x.1 N80 ribbon
6x40g N80 + 2x36g N80 turned into cable sandwiched between the frames and then half staggered
I don't know what the fuck to call it yet....


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A pitchfork with a twisted core

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raymo2u

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First of all...it's good to see you keeping at it. Beautiful work. And I saw you picked up the aeronaut 2. My aeronaut is for the most part the only rda I work and the deck is wearing out so I've been looking at either getting the 2nd deck alone or the whole 2.5 setup. Any thoughts?
Second... I've never worked with SS. How does it compare to N80 or K-A/K-D in terms of flavor, resistance, springiness/ease of work, ramp time, applicability to mechs?
And third I threw this together in an hour or so. I'm so fucking out of practice. I'll be hooking it up tonight or tomorrow and I'll let you know the resistance, flavor, heat etc.
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SS is a great material for Mechs IMO, its all I use anymore. If you get decent Sanvik SS it will last months like any other wire. It ramps faster than KA1 or N80, it has a lower resistance, it colors better and its almost as soft as N80 so its easier to work with. Use multiple smaller cores for best experience, I like 5x28g SS 4 Wraps/3mm ID but not everyone likes their vape as warm as I do.
 

EndDetour

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Member For 4 Years
SS is a great material for Mechs IMO, its all I use anymore. If you get decent Sanvik SS it will last months like any other wire. It ramps faster than KA1 or N80, it has a lower resistance, it colors better and its almost as soft as N80 so its easier to work with. Use multiple smaller cores for best experience, I like 5x28g SS 4 Wraps/3mm ID but not everyone likes their vape as warm as I do.

I love a hot vape. Cool just isn't satisfying. So you have me intrigued, however I'd be worried about putting builds like the one above but in ss on my mech. I have that 26650 cartel L.E. on the way. I have a couple efest 4200mah 26650 25A continuous 50A pulse and one kidney puncher private label 4000mah 26650 30A continuous 60A pulse batteries. You don't think our beefy ass coils would overdraw them?


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Carambrda

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SS is a great material for Mechs IMO, its all I use anymore. If you get decent Sanvik SS it will last months like any other wire. It ramps faster than KA1 or N80, it has a lower resistance, it colors better and its almost as soft as N80 so its easier to work with. Use multiple smaller cores for best experience, I like 5x28g SS 4 Wraps/3mm ID but not everyone likes their vape as warm as I do.
Contrary to popular belief, SS doesn't ramp up faster than N80. That is, if we can assume both the wire thickness and the watts are the same, BUT... if using SS for your core wires, resistance will be lower so as a result from that you'll end up getting more watts if you're on a mech, therefore getting faster ramp only because you're sending more battery power to the coils. SS also cools down slower than N80, again if we can assume the wire thickness is the same.

For a hot vape I'll typically use KA1 on a series mech, and, if it turns out to be too hot for me, I'll try to tame it by choosing N80 for my wrap wire and still be able to use KA1 for my cores. Using .4×.1 Ni80 for my ribbon stack in my staple coil build also produces a warm, dense, saturated, wet vapor with big clouds and equally big flavor, but it wasn't usable on the mech because I'm vaping on it at almost 170 watts in wattage mode whilst also using a power curve to boost the ramp up of this build so now it ramps up actually pretty fast despite there is a lot of metal in it.
 

Carambrda

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I love a hot vape. Cool just isn't satisfying. So you have me intrigued, however I'd be worried about putting builds like the one above but in ss on my mech. I have that 26650 cartel L.E. on the way. I have a couple efest 4200mah 26650 25A continuous 50A pulse and one kidney puncher private label 4000mah 26650 30A continuous 60A pulse batteries. You don't think our beefy ass coils would overdraw them?


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Grab the iJoy 26650... I own four of them and am using them in my Vapergate The 99 dual 26650 series tube mech with a clunky ass .24 ohms build on it. It uses a metric tonne of KA1 and half a bag of Cotton Bacon, and it vapes hotter than satan. The iJoy is 30A CDR, 4200 mAh. It gives noticeably better performance than the green or purple Efest 26650. Pulse ratings are useless.
 

Fudgey Finger

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Contrary to popular belief, SS doesn't ramp up faster than N80. That is, if we can assume both the wire thickness and the watts are the same, BUT... if using SS for your core wires, resistance will be lower so as a result from that you'll end up getting more watts if you're on a mech, therefore getting faster ramp only because you're sending more battery power to the coils. SS also cools down slower than N80, again if we can assume the wire thickness is the same.

For a hot vape I'll typically use KA1 on a series mech, and, if it turns out to be too hot for me, I'll try to tame it by choosing N80 for my wrap wire and still be able to use KA1 for my cores. Using .4×.1 Ni80 for my ribbon stack in my staple coil build also produces a warm, dense, saturated, wet vapor with big clouds and equally big flavor, but it wasn't usable on the mech because I'm vaping on it at almost 170 watts in wattage mode whilst also using a power curve to boost the ramp up of this build so now it ramps up actually pretty fast despite there is a lot of metal in it.
You forgot to mention that ss transfers heat faster though. A ss wrap will heat faster than a nichrome wrap even though when under power the nichrome will ramp up faster.

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Carambrda

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You forgot to mention that ss transfers heat faster though. A ss wrap will heat faster than a nichrome wrap even though when under power the nichrome will ramp up faster.

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The SS wrap just transfers the heat (energy) away from the cores faster than the N80 wrap does, thereby causing the cores to heat up slower when compared to using the N80 wrap. It means slower heating of the juice that's trapped between the cores and wrap. But you're also forgetting that heat energy is not the same thing as temperature. Look up the "specific heat" (also referred to as "specific heat capacity") for both metal types. If we can assume that both the thickness and the length of the wrap wire are the same, then logically the volume must be the same, but the mass and the density are not. Therefore, we have to convert "specific heat" to "volumetric heat capacity". Volumetric heat capacity equals specific heat multiplied by density. So, because the SS wrap requires more heat energy from the cores before it reaches the same temperate as the N80 wrap, the SS wrap takes longer to reach that same temperature. Finally, because the heat energy that's coming from the cores can only enter the wrap via the wrap's surface, the lower thermal conductivity of N80 causes the N80 wrap's surface to heat up even faster still, i.e., the N80 transfers the heat away from its own surface slower.

Now, because the N80 wrap causes BOTH its own surface AND that of the cores to rise in temperature faster compared to using the SS wrap, the juice starts to evaporate from these surfaces faster compared to using the SS wrap.
 

EndDetour

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Grab the iJoy 26650... I own four of them and am using them in my Vapergate The 99 dual 26650 series tube mech with a clunky ass .24 ohms build on it. It uses a metric tonne of KA1 and half a bag of Cotton Bacon, and it vapes hotter than satan. The iJoy is 30A CDR, 4200 mAh. It gives noticeably better performance than the green or purple Efest 26650. Pulse ratings are useless.

Dude on a budget here. I got what I got coming. I'm truly in love with series mods. I've gone through breaking, repairing and then playing Frankenstein with 3 Lucifers. I don't need a dual 26650. I'm gravy with the boss for a new tube mech after my stingray x 18650 took a dump. I got this so so Kooper plus 200w for those outrageously low ohm builds. And I'm more than halfway through building a series mech mod out of exotic hardwoods and reclaimed copper. As obtuse as this sounds im getting the 26650 to not be so chunky in my pocket at work compared to the Kooper plus


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raymo2u

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What I meant was, for the same wire size the SS will ramp up faster, again Im a mech user and I was speaking about cores....as a outerwrap it makes no difference. But 28g N80 versus 28g SS the SS will be hotter and ramp up more quickly....thats all I meant. Dont worry...I completely understand why :wait:

If your a builder and your still using a Regulated mod than basically every mod will act the same way and there really isnt a point other than show to build different things. Most builders prefer mechs in the circles I know.

@EndDetour 26650 is older battery tech and there isnt a single 26650 with a continuous rating (realistically) over 25a CD, 18650s have a lower internal resistance and most will out power the best 26650 (in every way other than capacity). You may want t look into the new 20700 cells if you fancy a new powerful battery with decent capacity and amperage ratings
 

CrazyChef v2.0

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What I meant was, for the same wire size the SS will ramp up faster, again Im a mech user and I was speaking about cores
Absolutely true. If @Carambrda were to put a single wire 22g SS316L and a single wire 22g N80, both 10/11 wraps and 3.0mm I.D., on 2 identical mod/attie combos, he would see the SS heating up faster. Much faster.
Dont worry...I completely understand why
:D :D :D
If your a builder and your still using a Regulated mod than basically every mod will act the same way and there really isnt a point other than show to build different things.
Gotta disagree with you here. I use both mechs and regulated mods. There's a huge difference between an alien, a fused Clapton, or a framed staple in the same RDA on say my Cartel 160 or one of my Hexohms.
 

Jriley

Bronze Contributor
Member For 3 Years
I honestly can't believe I ever used a regulated mod, I will forever carry batteries now because changing them every 30 mins doesn't bother me.. I will forever carry juice with me because I like dripping n driving I'm OG with them knees. I love adjusting my floating pin, spending 30 mins dialing in the clutch on my button justtttt righttttt.
Most of all I love making tangled up piles of wire , getting pissed off and throwing my drill and cuss and say I'll never make coils again just to come home after work and do it again!!!
All these "inconveniences" I fucking love every moment. Amen and good day sirs

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Fudgey Finger

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there really isnt a point other than show to build different things.

Really? You think a SSFC has the same vape qualities as a multi-core fused Clapton with the same resistance?

Unless when you say "build different things" you are referring to mods. Though I doubt that because this is a thread about building coils

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Carambrda

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What I meant was, for the same wire size the SS will ramp up faster, again Im a mech user and I was speaking about cores....as a outerwrap it makes no difference. But 28g N80 versus 28g SS the SS will be hotter and ramp up more quickly....thats all I meant. Dont worry...I completely understand why :wait:

If your a builder and your still using a Regulated mod than basically every mod will act the same way and there really isnt a point other than show to build different things.
Not if you're using a regulated mod with power curves. Most of the time I use mechs, but not all of the time... that's just because I like to experiment from time to time with coil building and some of my coil builds turn out to vape really well on a regulated mod with power curves, but perform poorly on a mech.
Most builders prefer mechs in the circles I know.

@EndDetour 26650 is older battery tech and there isnt a single 26650 with a continuous rating (realistically) over 25a CD,
Wrong. The iJoy 26650 is tuly 30A continuous. https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/t...lts-overrated-but-a-great-30a-battery.764411/
18650s have a lower internal resistance and most will out power the best 26650 (in every way other than capacity). You may want t look into the new 20700 cells if you fancy a new powerful battery with decent capacity and amperage ratings
The internal resistance of the iJoy 26650 is on par with most of decently performing 18650s, just not the best ones. If pulsed at 40A it actually even gives the same power as the Sanyo 20700A so no, the new 20700 cells are not necessarily always a better choice... it still simply depends.
 

EndDetour

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@EndDetour 26650 is older battery tech and there isnt a single 26650 with a continuous rating (realistically) over 25a CD, 18650s have a lower internal resistance and most will out power the best 26650 (in every way other than capacity). You may want t look into the new 20700 cells if you fancy a new powerful battery with decent capacity and amperage ratings[/QUOTE]

I am obviously way out of the loop. Well now that I have that sucker on its way, I guess when the batteries take a dump I'll scrap the mod for copper. You know I love mechs man. First mod that had the heat and density I craved was my stingray x. Making the shift to the lucifer was nothing but an improvement. I've gotten enough people on the mech and series bandwagon I'm gonna be making them myself. I could never understand charging an outrageous amount of money for a threaded short pipe of metal with a trigger. Now custom woodwork with customizable and replaceable parts I get. Im making my mod with Brazilian ebony, African Blackwood, lignum vitae, teak and reclaimed copper. I can dismantle it, clean it, optimize it to my liking and switch between parallel and series in about 2 minutes or less. When I'm done I'll post something about it if your interested.




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Carambrda

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Absolutely true. If @Carambrda were to put a single wire 22g SS316L and a single wire 22g N80, both 10/11 wraps and 3.0mm I.D., on 2 identical mod/attie combos, he would see the SS heating up faster. Much faster.
On the mech, yes of course because the lower resistance of the SS translates to higher watts. But you missed the part where I said "assuming the watts are the same" so... in fact I was referring to how it all works on a regulated mod.
 

CrazyChef v2.0

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Okay, so I decided to do a test of N80 vs. SS316L for ramp up. We all seem to have differing opinions, with mine being that SS316L will ramp up faster.

So, I have 2 (almost) identical setups:
  • Coils: 22g, 3.0mm ID, 10/11 wraps - one is SS316L, the other N80. Leads cut to identical length, and no further trimming before installation.
  • RDAs: Vandy Vape Pulse 22
  • Mods: Cartel Revenant 160 - one is the BLAQ, one is the SS version. Identical chipsets.

Coils/RDAs:
bNPRXvF.jpg


Mods:
mxuVGdI.jpg


Coils installed:
CbDUJpO.jpg


RDAs on Mods - N80 on the BLAQ, SS316L on the SS
NLFV4di.jpg




The verdict:
 

CrazyChef v2.0

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After I made the video, I switched the RDAs with the mods - with the SS316L on the BLAQ and the N80 on the SS just to see if there was a difference. There wasn't. The results were exactly the same.
 

EndDetour

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Gonna try it on a couple of Purge mods. Making sure that 2 Samsung 25R batteries are fully charged before I do the test.

DLVRWqb.jpg

My question is: why would both you and ray assume the ss Ramps faster and gives a hotter vapor? I have no experience vaping on or building with as.
My hypothesis: the ss is made of denser particles and where n80 may reach its melting point faster the ss is able to get hotter and retain the heat more efficiently than the n80.
Or maybe I'm off in left field



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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