Let's talk inception!

Hello all my fellow DIY enthusiasts, newbies, and lurkers,

So I want to hear how you come up with your ideas for recipes from their inception. Do you use cookbooks, do you use memories of things you've eaten, do you use your deepest desires of what a wonderful juicy genetically engineered fruit concoction might taste like? Then when you come up with an idea for a recipe, for example, a strawberry cream zeppola with powdered sugar, how do you go about strategizing it's creation? Do you go back through your SFT, do you use your instinct, is it divine intervention? Once you've created it's first iteration, how do you go about evolving it?

So I, for the most part, go by my favorite desserts, look at cookbooks, and that is pretty much it. Once I come up with a recipe, I have a pretty good idea of what concentrates I am going to want to use, so I check out my SFT and devise my percentages. Then I mix (by weight), age, and taste. The catalyst for this is that I have over 100 concentrates now, and I want to get more creative, be more unique and less derivative in my recipes, and think I can get some ideas from all of you wonderful people.

So let's hear it.

EDIT: For anyone who might not know SFT - single flavor tests

This is an interesting question and I think this will be a long lived and informative thread as it evolves. Very good question indeed.

Honestly, I look at the concentrates I have on hand. I look for the dominant flavor that is calling out to me, the I ask myself, "now, what kind of undertones do I want to compliment this flavor?" Once I have those, I decide what undertones I want stronger and which ones I want in the background. Once I have all this in mind I look up these flavors online to remember what percentages are best for their place in that role and mix.

If the recipe is good, then it goes into my recipe app, if not (as long as it isn't horrible) I vape the bottle and either see what I can do to tweak it or start from scratch on a new one. There's no real rhyme or reason to the concept, just my imagination. You never know what will come out in the end.

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midknight420 said:

This is an interesting question and I think this will be a long lived and informative thread as it evolves. Very good question indeed.

Honestly, I look at the concentrates I have on hand. I look for the dominant flavor that is calling out to me, the I ask myself, "now, what kind of undertones do I want to compliment this flavor?" Once I have those, I decide what undertones I want stronger and which ones I want in the background. Once I have all this in mind I look up these flavors online to remember what percentages are best for their place in that role and mix.

If the recipe is good, then it goes into my recipe app, if not (as long as it isn't horrible) I vape the bottle and either see what I can do to tweak it or start from scratch on a new one. There's no real rhyme or reason to the concept, just my imagination. You never know what will come out in the end.

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So you don't single flavor test all your concentrates and take notes? I'm just making that assumption by you saying you check their percentages online. I didn't do SFT when I first got all my concentrates, but now i'm going back and doing it and finding that a lot of my flavors have hidden depths and intricacies at certain percentages that I wouldn't have noticed otherwise. So I have a notebook that I'm keeping all of those notes in as I go through and test them all.

88ArDeN88 said:

So you don't single flavor test all your concentrates and take notes? I'm just making that assumption by you saying you check their percentages online. I didn't do SFT when I first got all my concentrates, but now i'm going back and doing it and finding that a lot of my flavors have hidden depths and intricacies at certain percentages that I wouldn't have noticed otherwise. So I have a notebook that I'm keeping all of those notes in as I go through and test them all.

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That's a great idea. I have done SFT on some, but not all, Of my concentrates. I'm going to have to do that, and the notebook is genius. I can't believe that I never thought of that. And things likethis is what this thread will be amazing for. I can't wait to hear some others chime in. Might find something new that we never considered otherwise.

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To me, anyone who really wants to become a real recipe creator can find no better role model than HIC

Here is an example of how a real mixing rock star does it --->>>> HIC's PINK BUBBLE GUM

(Read this even if you don't like or want Pink Bubble Gum)

that is a great question.. I've been mixing and testing for 5 years when I dont know anyone who was mixing. I'd try flavors at shops back in the early days still making coils hang out at the local vape shop I'd find a flavor i really liked and buy what i thought might be in it.. omg it was bad at first not knowing honey flavor tasted like foot..lol lot of disasters on a small scale but disasters none the less. then I got one down all on my own a cereal flavor. it was good still is good. I was on and crackin I made clones of ones i liked. then fairly quickly the recipies started popping up Google search.. lots of trial and error then a lot of people to bounce ideas off of.

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JuicyLucy said:

To me, anyone who really wants to become a real recipe creator can find no better role model than HIC

Here is an example of how a real mixing rock star does it --->>>> HIC's PINK BUBBLE GUM

(Read this even if you don't like or want Pink Bubble Gum)

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That is definitely very cool and the depths that he went to figure all that out is quite impressive. That is a very scientific approach that works in that area, but I don't know would work in other areas.

For example something much more complex like a carrot cake. There is science behind a stick of gum, but there is something more in a good carrot cake than just science. But the way that HIC puts together flavors is ridiculous. NONE of those flavors would be flavors I'd have guessed were in bubble gum. NONE.

88ArDeN88 said:

That is definitely very cool and the depths that he went to figure all that out is quite impressive. That is a very scientific approach that works in that area, but I don't know would work in other areas.

For example something much more complex like a carrot cake. There is science behind a stick of gum, but there is something more in a good carrot cake than just science. But the way that HIC puts together flavors is ridiculous. NONE of those flavors would be flavors I'd have guessed were in bubble gum. NONE.

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that was awesome what a great bubble gum history lesson wow. and who would of thought. really cool..ty for sharing

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88ArDeN88 said:

That is definitely very cool and the depths that he went to figure all that out is quite impressive. That is a very scientific approach that works in that area, but I don't know would work in other areas.

For example something much more complex like a carrot cake. There is science behind a stick of gum, but there is something more in a good carrot cake than just science. But the way that HIC puts together flavors is ridiculous. NONE of those flavors would be flavors I'd have guessed were in bubble gum. NONE.

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It often holds true in truly great juices - amazing mixers like Will, Smokie Blue quite often have unexpected flavor ingredients by doing a real hard look and knowing what flavors do, not just hmm, carrot and a cake, and nuts, etc Mix and should taste great! Usually it won't

JuicyLucy said:

It often holds true in truly great juices - amazing mixers like Will, Smokie Blue quite often have unexpected flavor ingredients by doing a real hard look, not just hmm, carrot and a cake, and nuts, etc

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Yes, I agree with you 100%. I think the way I said what I said was wrong. What I meant was you can look at the science behind creating bubble gum to dig deep and find out what HIC did, but what do you take a look at to do that for something like carrot cake or coconut cream pie. Do you go by trial and error, do you look at cookbooks, do you just have a feeling?

88ArDeN88 said:

Yes, I agree with you 100%. I think the way I said what I said was wrong. What I meant was you can look at the science behind creating bubble gum to dig deep and find out what HIC did, but what do you take a look at to do that for something like carrot cake or coconut cream pie. Do you go by trial and error, do you look at cookbooks, do you just have a feeling?

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First a disclaimer: I am no guru in recipe creation for sure

Cook books are a great start for inspiration, but getting to the root of flavors is another;

Look at Chef's Nilla Cake clone collaboration recipe thread: the final (and best according to those who vape it) had no Cake flavoring at all #130, though the original attempts were loaded with various Cake or Cake Batter flavorings. It does have some cupcake - but it is more heavy on support flavors, many not really something I'd think of if considering a Vanilla Cake - at least on first blush

JuicyLucy said:

First a disclaimer: I am no guru in recipe creation for sure

Cook books are a great start for inspiration, but getting to the root of flavors in another;

Look at Chef's Nilla Cake clone collaboration recipe thread: the final (and best according to those who vape it) had no Cake flavoring at all #130, though the original attempts were loaded with various Cake or Cake Batter flavorings. It does have some cupcake - but it is more heavy on support flavors, many not really something I'd think of if considering a Vanilla Cake - at least on first blush

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I'm assuming they are trying to clone Elysian Labs Nilla Cake? I didn't see that stated anywhere. I love that flavor and make my own version of a clone of it, and it has hardly any cake flavoring. It took me a while to get it to where it is. 10 iterations at least. I know how I got where I did with it, but I'm looking for how you get to the final version of a recipe you created and how you decide where to start.

I tend not to use recepies of food...being a bit of a foodie and having a passion for cooking, I ususally think e juice that is trying to mimic a food just winds up being a second rate mockery of the dish..... alot of my ideas come from liquors. and spices.

pulsevape said:

I tend not to use recepies of food...being a bit of a foodie and having a passion for cooking, I ususally think e juice that is trying to mimic a food just winds up being a second rate mockery of the dish..... alot of my ideas come from liquors. and spices.

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I do enjoy cooking as well, but I don't look for my juice to recreate the textures that I find enjoyable in a dish. So like cheesecake I know isn't going to have the crunchiness of the crust of the same density in the cake, and I think that is what throws it off. Otherwise the stuff I recreate I think is pretty darn good.

I am constantly SFTesting. Like every day. I also watch tons of YouTube videos about mixing....Noted, Mixlife, DIYorDIE, Fresh from the Kitchen, DIY Downunder.....

Most of my recipes come from Pinterest. No s***. Pictures of food inspire me. Sometimes I’ll even make said thing to get an idea of texture, taste, etc....otherwise it’s just looking at what I have and thinking, yeah, that might work. Knowing your flavors is pretty key doing that approach. I have notebooks full of flavor notes.....scrawled on post-it notes, napkins, random scraps of paper.

Start to finish. Berry Marscapone Cake. White cake with buttercream frosting, mixed
dark berry jam like layer, Marscapone.

Ok. I have a few cake flavors. I went with WF Fluffy White Cake because I felt like it’s a better choice over FW White Cake. It has more backbone and can hold up to stronger flavors without getting lost. And it has a really nice buttercream frosting. WF Marscapone because I thought LA cream Cheese Icing might be too heavy....and that 2 week minimum steep is a killer. And I wanted to find a use for Marscapone because I hadn’t yet. WF Bumbleberry because I hadn’t used it yet.....a more red berry forward, but I think it def works. I could have used FA Forest Mix or Caps Harvest Berry as well or any combo of berries. VT Sweet Cream to mellow things out, cream it up. Caps NY Cheesecake to also cream things up and give a little boost and more twang to the Marscapone.

I may tweak the recipe a bit.....might try darker berries instead. Just to see how it works.

A very obvious recipe. Nothing too complicated or fussy. I am definitely not a mixing god like @HeadInClouds. The subtleties he can figure out blow my mind. I’m not there yet. My recipes are good(sometimes) but pretty straightforward. I’m defnot reinventing the wheel......

JuicyLucy said:

To me, anyone who really wants to become a real recipe creator can find no better role model than HIC

Here is an example of how a real mixing rock star does it --->>>> HIC's PINK BUBBLE GUM

(Read this even if you don't like or want Pink Bubble Gum)

Click to expand...

Goddamm, Just reread this one. Damn. Brilliant.

wildgypsy70 said:

Goddamm, Just reread this one. Damn. Brilliant.

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Humbling but inspirational, isn't it?

JuicyLucy said:

Humbling but inspirational, isn't it?

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It is! Makes me wanna go mix something simple yet so well thought out that it doesn’t look like it’s gonna work but it does. Which is not my forte. Lol! Genius. I don’t even really like vaping bubblegum and I wanna go mix this.

wildgypsy70 said:

It is! Makes me wanna go mix something simple yet so well thought out that it doesn’t look like it’s gonna work but it does. Which is not my forte. Lol! Genius. I don’t even really like vaping bubblegum and I wanna go mix this.

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That's how I felt. I can't say that it's necessarily something I'd vape a lot, but I was a bit stunned by the flavor match. The next time I remember experiencing that was with @wllmc's Dr. F'n Pepper. http://vapingunderground.com/threads/dr-pepper.206592/ ( he changed the name, lol )

Most of the recipes I make for myself are of food I like to eat. Then I just use experience to decide what flavors/brands will get me to the profile I want.

Test it and decide if a flavor needs to be added to make another pop more, smooth out, or moisten the vape.

When making a recipe, I think of how each flavor tastes instead of just using the name of it. If that makes sense. For example, in deep fried Oreo, if I looked at INW vanilla shisha, I wouldn't think it would fit but I knew from tasting it that it would add to the cream center and a little nut flavor into the cookie. Green apple flavor burst is another example. I'll leave it at that.

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JuicyLucy said:

To me, anyone who really wants to become a real recipe creator can find no better role model than HIC

Here is an example of how a real mixing rock star does it --->>>> HIC's PINK BUBBLE GUM

(Read this even if you don't like or want Pink Bubble Gum)

Click to expand...

That is an exceptional thread. I read through it when I was thinking about making a bubble gum juice, and used HIC's recipe with increased percentages. Was just bowled over at the amount of research and time that was obviously invested. As you said, it is a worthwhile read.

I do anything from sounds, feelings, music, even observing what colors people wear, to occasions from funereal birthdays weddings and graduations, as well as cooking and drinking recipes to fantasy types..
Even been known to mix up diet recipe mixes for ejuices..
The only thing holding yourself back from mixing, is knowing your single flavors and what they can do for you at any given amount.

Let’s keep this going! I love it. I like to recreate things attached to memories as well @Smoky Blue. I also will take a look at my flavors and say okay that would work. Sometimes I find that a bit too derivative though. Last night I made a peanut butter chocolate caramel ice cream. It came out good. But could be better. When I started a couple months ago I got all these flavors at once and just started mixing without SFT. Now I’m going back and doing 5 a day. Last night I did FA custard premium, WF angel cake, HS Australian chocolate, and a couple others. I got little 5ml bottles to make testers. 100 of them and am doing 3 samples at varying strengths of each flavor. Taking notes. I know it will make me a better mixer.

This is a fun thread In my early mixing days, most ideas came from google images ha. I would just search google until I found something that looked good and tried to make it in a vape but now that I have a cookbook of my own basically I would say all my personal favorites that I vape all the time are attached to memory or emotion and when I vape I am somewhat submerged in that feeling or mood. I'm not saying I think its this big spiritual thing but for example my biscochito recipe I only vape around the late fall because it reminds me of some cookies my mom used to make at that time of year.

There are times like huck mentioned Dr Fn Pepper was all homework and at the time and on the devices we used to use there was no better Dr Pepper flavor. I might tweak it a little these days for my style of vaping but I just read about Dr Pepper for a couple days before I even tried to translate it into a vape.

Most of all I think the community and staying active inspired me to get better and turn out better flavors. Making something for yourself is no problem I'll vape almost anything lol but making something other people will vape and enjoy is another thing, if you have ever made juice for a friend even once you know what I mean. Oh its to sweet or not sweet enough or I said apple but I really want some sour lemon flavor to shine through The only way to do that is to learn what everyone else likes or is into currently is to stay involved in the community and try other peoples recipes and experiment.

I like this thread. Here's an idea I had a few days ago. I think this might work for some recipes. I would think mostly bakeries and maybe some tobaccos. As an example say you wanted to create a cake with icing. You would create your cake base separate from your icing and then once you've steeped them, if needed, to where you want them, you would add the icing to cake. For an apple pie, you would create the crust and apple filling separate like the cake.This would require some testing to get the ratios of cake to icing to work well together. I don't know.....maybe it would be more work than it's worth? It would sort of be like creating your own flavors and then using those to add to a recipe. Anyway, I might try it just because

KGuardian said:

I like this thread. Here's an idea I had a few days ago. I think this might work for some recipes. I would think mostly bakeries and maybe some tobaccos. As an example say you wanted to create a cake with icing. You would create your cake base separate from your icing and then once you've steeped them, if needed, to where you want them, you would add the icing to cake. For an apple pie, you would create the crust and apple filling separate like the cake.This would require some testing to get the ratios of cake to icing to work well together. I don't know.....maybe it would be more work than it's worth? It would sort of be like creating your own flavors and then using those to add to a recipe. Anyway, I might try it just because

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So one of the things I always thought about doing was like making a concentrated mix of Vanilla Custard or other flavors that take a while to steep and then using those in a mix. I don't know that it would change the overall result though.

So I was just watching an old video from Wayne at DIY or Die, and I think I am going to try his layering method out. I really like what he did. He decided what he wanted to make and instead of just going at it, he broke it down into a base note, body note, and accent note, made the base note and tested it, made the body note and tested it, etc. When I make a recipe I kind of just look at my SFT notes and determine stuff from there and just go at my percentages, I don't really break it down like he did, and never even thought of doing it like that. I think it's really cool. I linked the video below