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How to order extracts without Diacetyl

Gratefulvapes

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First off I don't claim to be an expert these are just the conclusions that I have made given my own research.


First off lets look at how diacetyl forms in e-liquid:

-Diacetyl is a by product of Ethanol (Pure Alcohol) it forms naturally in Ethanol when the glucose is converted through fermentation into Ethanol
-Acetoin will convert into Diacetyl simply by oxidizing in air during steeping/fermentation
-Acetyl Propionyl when it comes in contact with certain bacteria it can cauterize into diacetyl
-I already mentioned this but its worth mentioning any extract with ethanol can potentially turn into diacetyl (Given how unreasonable avoiding all ethanol extracts are we dont worry too much about this one)
-Burytic Acid the now standard substitute for Acetoin, AP (acetyl Propionyl) and diacetyl will also cauterize into diacetyl through a lengthy set of conversions
-Glucose in e-liquid extracts can ferment and form diacetyl
-Crudely extracted nicotine (extracted with a yeast) may combine with ethanol in extracts to create diacetyl
-A extract vender may buy an extract of say burytic acid and their vendor might add some diacetyl into it for a better flavor without the extract companies awareness, we saw this with Capella's V1 Vanilla Custard
-Contamination from a unclean working environment (certain bacteria meet with AP to make diacetyl)


All in all a complete avoidence of all Diacetyl is near impossible, however there is no need to add acetoin, AP, and diacetyl to the mix.

Ok now then how to avoid buying these products and know which are safe to use:


TPA: They have an amazing amount of information on their extracts, by far my favorite and most trusted vendor. All of their extracts that contain a, or ap are marked as such under their product discriptions but also be aware that if your on their bulk order page you will not see that they contain these ingredients until clicking on the product name. For instance if i go on TPA web site and go to the bulk sizes section and look up butterscotch It will only show a list of sizes and prices, but if you click on the name butterscotch you will see the following note*** Note: This flavor contains 'custard' ingredients: Acetoin & Acetyl propionyl. The following link explains the frequent questions & concerns involving custard notes.**

**On a side note it is worth mentioning that TPA is the only vendor that I know of besides Flavor Art that has a vendor that is restricted of all use of diacetyl in their factory, as it would be a violation of their insurance policy.

**Also TPA uses some oil based extracts these should always be avoided, you can check this by looking at the msds for the extract that your buying. These are found at the top of the bulk sizes section. One off hand that uses an oil base is gingerbread sugar cookie, the msds stats it uses a ginger oil, which is a well known lung irritant.

http://shop.perfumersapprentice.com/specsheetlist.aspx

Capella - Unless the extract specifically states that it is a, ap and diacetyl free (I believe the only flavors that state this are the V2's), call them and make sure, they add that flavor to more than just custards. All in all I dont trust them but they have things you otherwise wouldnt be able to get at other places (such as the vanilla custard), at a much higher price too.

Flavor West - The have a list off all extracts that should be avoided in a list on their natural and artifical extracts section. The list can be found on the lower left hand side of the extract page and it is called "Flavor West Acetoin, Acetyl propionyl, and diacetyl extract list"


Flavor Art - The only flavor company that does lab test on their extracts to test cytotoxicity, If an extract impedes more than 30% of cellular function it is deemed too toxic to use. By far the best system, and most safe, but also an Italian company and they are by no means cheap or competitive as far as pricing but they have the best tobacco extracts i have tried and those are worth the extra money.
 

BigNasty

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FW has pulled shady bullshit and lies a couple times. Just be safe and write them off entirely.
 

Gratefulvapes

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FW has pulled shady bullshit and lies a couple times. Just be safe and write them off entirely.

Big nasty I have not heard much bad about flavor west, did you have a bad experience? Care to elaborate I'm curious why you say that? Im not vouching for them being an honest company, just curious why they should be avoided in your opinion.

Personally I think they have some good flavors that you can't get else where, but thats just my preference to keep my options open. All the flavoring companies have different specialties and thus different "best flavors."
 

wllmc

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Its a shame post like this exists. we all appreciate the tread but you know what I mean also. It shouldnt be this hard, every manufacture or retailer should just clearly label anything with D/A/AP including any subs. It should be as easy as hmm wonder if this has diacetyl let me check, oh yup it does. lol I dont get why these manufactures just wont say what the heck is in it is beyond me .
 

vulcandeathbuny

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This thread got me to looking at all the flavors and brand names ive bought since i started DIY. Most were FA due to everyone on here recommending them so much. However i have cinnamon red hots by Signature. Cant seem to find any info on them anyone got a link?

Sent from my LG-L40G using Tapatalk
 

Huckleberried

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This thread got me to looking at all the flavors and brand names ive bought since i started DIY. Most were FA due to everyone on here recommending them so much. However i have cinnamon red hots by Signature. Cant seem to find any info on them anyone got a link?

Sent from my LG-L40G using Tapatalk
Signature is TFA, re-branded by ECX.
 

juicy76

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And hard to get it to blend properly in a mix IMHO.uuuuggggg.lol
 

Huckleberried

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This thread got me to looking at all the flavors and brand names ive bought since i started DIY. Most were FA due to everyone on here recommending them so much. However i have cinnamon red hots by Signature. Cant seem to find any info on them anyone got a link?

Sent from my LG-L40G using Tapatalk
Signature is TFA, re-branded by ECX.
This might be what you're looking for. http://shop.perfumersapprentice.com/componentlist.aspx?sku_search=223M78
 

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