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Bad Nic Base/Nic Salt Base? Headache, aftertaste, HILIQ - HELP!

Discussion in 'DIY E-Liquid - General Discussion' started by mothzart, Jun 7, 2019.

  1. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    Hi,

    First of all I would like to say a few words about myself as this is my first post. I'm from Poland, long time smoker, vaping (with quality e-cigs) since approx. 2 months, and since then I switched to vaping instead of smoking 100%.

    At the beginning I was buying ready e-liquid's (first 12mg, now 18mg - and that's the right amount for me). Unfortunately I couldn't find "the right one" so I decided to make my own

    So... I read about DIY liquids (tutorials etc.) and I decided to order NIC BASE. Unfortunately in Poland you won't buy a base stronger then 20mg/ml so I ordered from HILIQ (this shop was recommended by a guy that works at a local vapeshop). The process was ...a bit tricky (and the delivery costed as much as the base itself), but eventually I received my NIC BASE (freebase nic, 200mg/ml, 150ml). I was surprised by the color - it was amber-colored. As it was 100% in VG a was shaking, shaking, shaking ...and shaking some more (approx. 10-15 min intensive shaking). Then I made my desired 18mg/ml liquid with ingredients (VG, PG, aroma) previously tested on a "ZERO-NICOTINE" e-liquid (which vaped great, lovely vanilla-like taste, great clouds etc.).

    But...

    When I made my liquid WITH that base (everything literally sterile, syringes etc.; counted 10 times; all precautions taken; waited 1 day to aroma blend in) it TASTED HORRIBLE. The after taste was chemical-like, salty (? - hard to describe) and ALSO it produced HEAVY HEADACHE (BUT NO dizziness, NO nausea, NO anxiety - so it couldn't be NIC OD). And if that wasn't enough it also produced (after 10-15 "clouds") THROAT ACHE (but not the kind that "scratchy" liquids produce - it WAS LIKE WHEN SICK WITH THE FLU) - I had to take some throat medicine for that.

    I contacted HILIQ distributors in PL - and told them that something's not right. Fortunately support for polish customers was quite good, and they (after my suggestion) changed the product to: "NIC SALT A" 200mg/ml 100ml in PG this time.

    But...

    When this arrived (although the color was perfectly transparent), and I made my liquid - THE F...NG SAME!!! The after taste is a little lower, and there is NO sore throat side-effect, but after a few (3-5 clouds) my head is pulsing with pain!!!

    There are some moments (like this morning) when I was able to vape approx. 10-15 clouds without that aftertaste and then there was no headache ...and EVEN some of the aroma was present. But soon after that AFTERTASTE+HEADACHE!!!

    SO MY QUESTION IS - WHAT CAN I BE DOING WRONG?
    ...OR IS THIS JUST FAULTY SALT-NIC-BASE?
    HAS ANYONE HAD SIMILAR EXPERIENCE?

    I shaken everything (the base before mixing[15 min, it had a little foam even], the liquid after mixing[frequently]), I keep the base in a refrigerator, I use sterile equipment, I made the "zero-nic" base as a control and it vapes great, I let it steep for a day or more. Everything according to the book...

    What should I do? Any solutions or is this a refund situation?

    BTW: NIC-SALT-BASE (Salt A) batch number is: MD:2019.03.13 - anyone has the same batch? Same problems?

    Thanks in advance :)
    cya

    P.S.1. When I vape and i don't come across this bad after-taste, the e-liquid seems (even though I made it weaker - 12mg/ml) to give me dizziness, unpleasant "rush" - a bit like OD, but no HEADACHE and no nausea. Maybe it's (also) much stronger then declared?
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2019
  2. KingPin!

    KingPin! In my defence, I was left unsupervised ^^ VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team Reviewer

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    How much are you adding? ml wise and how big is the batch you are making

    I.e

    Want to make 100ml juice
    70/30 VG/PG mix
    10ml Flavours (pg or VG)
    x = Nic added (PG or VG)

    200mg/ml is very highly concentrated compared to what you are used to 20mg/ml

    Nic will darken over time when oxygen gets to it - keep it airtight as much as possible possibly extract it into smaller brown bottles and put them into the freezer so you aren’t opening the big 150ml bottle every time

    I’ve not used Hi Liq before as to whether it’s any good or not @5150sick has I believe
     
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  3. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    What atomizer are you using, watts and resistance? Also as KP said let us know the ml or grams of nic you're adding to the mix.
     
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  4. VAPEROXX

    VAPEROXX Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    In my experience as a Nicotine Salts mixer, Nic Salts oxidizes more rapidly than freebase for whatever reason. I have also learned that if Nic Salts reach that point of dark amber color just before it turns to a brown color, it becomes very pungent in smell and taste and can no longer be used. It often kills flavoring as well as causes a variety of minor physical symptoms such as headaches, nausea, and a cough immediately after inhaling. My opinion based on this experience is that you received a bad batch that has overly oxidized possibly due to poor laboratory practices or substandard packaging. Good Nic Salts should be virtually clear and colorless with no discernible taste and should be non-intrusive in your mixes. Also, for reference, a PG based Nic Salts is much easier to work with and carries the Nicotine much better.

    http://vapingunderground.com/threads/wts-wtt-aspex-performance-coils.434798/
     
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  5. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    I have had none of these issues with salts in the 1.5 years I've been using them to mix with. Yes it does color faster but does not get peppery or lose its strength, it isn't oxidized. Salts don't really oxidize actually, something to do with the added acid. It also doesn’t mute the flavors at anywhere from 3-18mg, haven't used them higher than that. As far as smell I only get the same light odor or taste I get from fresh freebase which disappears in a mix.
     
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  6. VAPEROXX

    VAPEROXX Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    I had this issue once with a batch of 100mg nic salts from Nicotine River. Turned brown, nasty taste, coughed my head off, headache and killed my recipes. And Nic Salts do still oxidize. The Benzoic Acid only neutralizes the alkaline properties of the Nicotine. This does slow the oxidation process but only marginally. Oxygen still combines with the Nicotine molecules producing a "rusting" effect. This process, if left unchecked by not ensuring the nic salts are properly sealed, will ruin the Nicotine just like freebase.

    http://vapingunderground.com/threads/wts-wtt-aspex-performance-coils.434798/
     
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  7. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    I've used 250mg salts with none of the issues you've mentioned, I would have returned it before using if I could smell them.
     
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  8. VAPEROXX

    VAPEROXX Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years Unlisted Vendor

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  9. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    True. Still would have contacted the vendor before using if the salts were stored properly.
     
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  10. VAPEROXX

    VAPEROXX Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    I received the Nicotine Salts from Nicotine River in good condition. But as I used it, it deteriorated rapidly in the container (over a period of 1 month). By that time, obviously it was too late for Nicotine River to do anything about it.

    http://vapingunderground.com/threads/wts-wtt-aspex-performance-coils.434798/
     
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  11. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    That should not have happened even with hit salts.
     
  12. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    Wow :) Huuuge thanks for so much info :)

    Actually a little UPDATE (although I don't want to jinx it yet) - today I just ..."soldiered on" and smoked the liquid until it got this weird taste/headache vs. good taste ratio UP and as the day went on ....there was a lot more vanilla/milky AROMA and the chemical after-taste was appearing after 7th (cloud)...then 10th ...then NONE :D

    I guess that it just had to be:
    a) REALLY well shaken - BASE, before making a test batch (10 min)
    b) made into a weaker strength (12mg/ml instead of 18mg/ml) - I was in my local vapeshop and the guy that was there told me that salts are usually approx. x1,9 stronger (IS THAT TRUE?)
    c) laid to rest for a while

    1. I made my first batch VG70:30PG / 10ml / 18mg/ml 7% Aroma [Panna Cotta - i like vanilla/carmel-like taste] so I added 0,9 ml (0,94mg) of the NIC salt - but this batch wasn't shaken for as long.
    2. Second batch was a control batch with ZERO NIC
    3. Third was made using REALLLY well shaken BASE and in 12mg/ml (but if what the local reseller says, that it's approx twice as strong it would be 24mg) - a added 0,6ml (0,62mg)
    4. Fourth was like the first but well shaken and with a different aroma.

    First I tested the batch #1 - therefore this post. Then I tested the third, and after approx 12h it started to "even out"

    BTW: One thing sueprised me as hell! NO (NONE!) THROAT HIT - almost like my e-cig was off :) - gotta get used to not having throat hit I hues... although when I started vaping it was the most annoying thing, and now I miss it a little (I guess it's like when your loved one snores... first you hate it - then you cannot sleep without it ;P). Also there's less "smoke".
    BTW2: I'm a beginner - I use Joytech Ego AIO 1500mah with 0,6 original SS316, I'm writing because someone asked. For my use it's enough, although in the furure i would like something with a stronger battery, and a bigger tank.

    Wish me luck, and don't close this topic just yet and set it as [SOLVED]

    Thanks once again
    ...I'LL BE BACK ;D
     
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  13. jinx'd

    jinx'd Gold Contributor

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    you talk'n to me ?
     
  14. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    @jinx'd - no... I was't talking to you :) - i just used a saying

    Now I have a different problem - DRY HITS :/

    The taste is great, the whole thing mixed well etc. About the strength - I found that 18mg/ml (salt) is just right. Maybe it hits a little faster but I didn't feel like it was twice as strong as NIC BASE.

    About that problem.... When I put a new fresh (original) coil (SS316 0.6Ohm) I found that it was working good for about A DAY :( After that (especially after charging the pen at night - therefore having more power when fully charger) in the morning I got dry hits. Also I had to prime the (new) coil with "store-bought" e-liquid - it had to go through approx. 1ml of it before I could put in my DIY liquid.

    So my first thought - PG:VG ratio (PG30:70VG) was to thick, so I made a 50/50 liquid. It got A LITTLE better, but still I was getting dry hits and also the top of my AIO was getting really hot quite fast. I had to limit the time of a single puff to approx 2sec (while normally it was approx 5sec), and also the "bursts" had to be shorter and with longer intermissions (2secPUFF-5secBREAK), and then after 4-5 bursts like that i had wait a few minutes until the head got colder, otherwise DRY HIT - ALL OF THAT - REALLY ANNOYING - especially when you have only a few minutes of break to vape. At the same time - when I was switching to "store-bought" liquid everything was going back to normal, even on a coil which previously had dry hits. ALSO... I found out that there was brown-ish residue inside the mouthpiece after a day of vaping even though my DIY liquids are almost transparent.

    Now I'm waiting for a 1.0 Ohm coils to arrive - my logic is that it gives less power (also uses less battery), while the cotton "supplies" the coil with the liquid at the same paste. But it's only my guess... :/

    ALSO - I am looking for an upgrade - when I'll have some money I'm looking to buy "SMOK G80 with TFV4 HEAD". This set should "supply" the liquid fast enough and and it should have a rebuildable coil which would be great for me (I'm definately a DIY guy).

    Any advice - someone had the same problems with salts? ..or maybe the AIO is the problem?
     
  15. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    Honestly all of your problems would be fixed with a device that gives you more control over the settings. Something simple like an istick 30w or pico 25 would be sufficient.
     
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  16. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    Yup, I agree 100% - I do need some new equipment (although I've been using eGo AIO/vaping[regular insead of smoking] only for approx 2 months) cause i threw myself "in to deep waters" from the start by DIY'ing liquids etc.

    ...the only problem is ...money :/

    But when I'll be able to make a purchase my preliminary choice is SMOK G80 with TFV4 Head (which is only 30$ on AliEx: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Orig...Vape-G-80-Kit-with-Spirals-e/32846128263.html ). I was also taking in considaration ELeaf Ikuu i80 with MELO4 Head ( http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Orig...-Melo-4-Atomizer-80W-box-mod/32837805242.html )
     
  17. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    Always choose eleaf over smok, always. You would get longer battery life if you go with a simple VW mod vs a device that has tc options.
     
  18. SteveS45

    SteveS45 Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee

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    Don't listen to all the SMOK haters because I have had nothing but great experiences with mine. I actually own a few of them unlike the people knocking them.

    [​IMG]
     
  19. susieqz

    susieqz Silver Contributor

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    oh, i had good experiences with smok too.
    for the 3 weeks before it died.
     
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  20. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    I owned a smok...that's the reason I'll never own another.
     
  21. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    To be honest I found very mixed reviews about SMOK G80 vs iKuu(n) i80 both here, on YT, and also in a local vapeshop.

    I think I'm going to take the risk and go with the SMOK - it has interchangeable batteries (huge plus), the set that's on AliEx has a TFV4 head Kit which should have 1 RBA coil (again a plus), much more coils overall and TC control ...no opinion here, I'm not experienced enough to say anything.

    And also my (subjective) visual taste just "pushes" me rather towards SMOK - the i80 (watched on YT) looks like it's gonna feel plastic-ish, the "fire" button as a whole side-panel also doesn't convince me.

    And if that's really gonna disappoint me - I'll have to buy a new mod (the TFV4 head is supposedly a good design).

    ...but, NONETHELESS this is still gonna take some time, until it arrives - until then I have to do something about those dry hits etc...

    Today I made a modification to one of my BF SS316 coils - i made the channels that support the cotton with liquid a little wider. This coil has the outer barrel, and the insides (i made a "contraption" that pushes the insides from the outer barrel using a clamp).

    The insides have airflow channels on "west" and "east" which go from the top to the bottom of the coil therefore "mixing" the liquid with the air on the cotton and the wire when I inhale. On the "north" and "south" side there are small channels which "pump" more liquid from the bottom of the tank - AND THOSE I WIDENED with a dremel. The effect - less dry hits, but the taste changed (I made those modifications on a coil previously used with my DIY liquid which had some dry hits on it).

    But all of that is still very strange to me - on HILIQ site they even mentioned that the "Salt B" has an issue with carbonization, it wasn't mentioned in the "Salt A" description, but who knows. ON THE OTHER HAND - when I put "store-bought" liquid into a coil that gives me dry hits with my DIY liquid everything goest back to normal. I'm clueless - it would be best if someone who used that "Salt A" from HILIQ could say if that might be the issue.
     
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  22. SteveS45

    SteveS45 Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee

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    I have heard for years that SMOK doesn't do TC well but it works great for me~! You know what they say though? Subjective :coffee::coffee2:
     
  23. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    TFv4 rba head isn't bad and the t3 coil is good for a drop in. If you can still find it the single coil rba head it is a bit better, not so finicky with the wicking. All in all I was happy with the tfv4 when I was using it.
     
  24. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    ...OK, no more SMOK vs. eLeaf dillema - just bought the g80 :)

    Now only wait... and wait... and wait... :/
     
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  25. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    A little demonstration of what I just did with the coil. It made vaping possible again and dry hits occur less often, but the taste is ...well ...bad :( Some of the hits aren't dry but they taste a little burnt. It's nowhere close to a first 100% normal experience from a new coil well primed but I guess it has to work for me until the "dragon" (in polish SMOK = DRAGON) arrives.

    Here's the pic:
    http://oi64.tinypic.com/a5du1c.jpg

    UPDATE: I made the same thing on a less burnt coil (but still it was giving me dry hits on my DIY liquids), it was also washed (boiling h2o w/citric acid "bath" then Isopropanol "bath") and so far it's working pretty well - we'll see tommorow. But maybe that's gonna make some real change (at least until SMOK).
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2019
  26. Smoky Blue

    Smoky Blue VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    Coils are cheap to start with, but smok is famous for having bad coils.
    You really do not need to "wash" your coils... especially with citrus acid and any sort of alcohol.
    That alcohol is probably what is killing that coil and causing a harsh burnt feeling and taste..
    Just go buy a few packs of coils or a better unit other than smok.
     
  27. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    Well actually those "baths" + widened liquid intake + priming with store-bought liquid (approx 1ml has to go through) work pretty good. Before cleaning there was a lot of burnt residue and there was nothing but dry hits. OFC it still doesn't solve the problem, but it let's me use coils for longer than 1 day.

    I can't say much about SMOK, but still I think that it's gonna work better than my eGo AIO which is, let's say it, a pretty small device.
     
  28. Smoky Blue

    Smoky Blue VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    Issue is what is in your juice..

    too much sweeteners and other additives makes coils not last long, then toss in smok.. yeah..

    but cleaning with citric acid and alcohol, is never a bright idea.. do as you wish, this is your diy :)
     
  29. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    Well, I really like my DIY liquids sweet, but I put only a little aroma (half what's suggested). When I was smoking store-bought liquids (even sweeter) there was no dry hits, at least not after 1 day of vaping.

    The coils are cheap, but I cannot change a coil everyday, because now what I was going through was:
    - fresh new coil (0,6; without widened intake)
    - primed with store bought liquid
    - works great ...for 1 day
    - then every other intake is a dry hit

    After modifications (pic above) + 2 "baths" the coil looks almost like new (a lot of residue was left in the citric acid water).

    And then when I prime the same coil with store liquid again and switch to my DIY liquid it works almost like a new coil (~90%?). Nontheless this works (even with widening) for approx. 2-3 days then the taste gets "dry-hit-ish". And so ...I have to rotate the 4 coils I got right now, until my "refurbishment" won't do any difference.

    And I hope it's the thickness of the juice, not the nic salt, otherwise I'm stuck with a lot of nic salt and no option for vaping it.

    BTW: I wonder when there's going to be a solution that makes cotton obsolete and the coils will work for months ;)
     
  30. nadalama

    nadalama VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year Moderator

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    The only Smok I own is a G80, came with a Smok Spirals tank. I have had great service out of both the mod and the tank. It's a very basic mod, but it works well enough and for sure doesn't seem like a piece of junk. I did buy a wrap from VaporSkinz for it so the finish wouldn't start chipping and looking crappy. So many of Smok's finishes don't hold up well.

    Would recommend you use the RBA, so you won't have to buy Smok's factory coils. The 0.5 ohm Clapton coil that came with my Spirals RBA is still in there, at least six months now, still being used, and it's quite a good coil. I rewick it every couple weeks and it's held up like a champ.
     
  31. nadalama

    nadalama VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year Moderator

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    I've had Vaporesso ceramic coils (cCells) last for months. They do have some cotton in them, but the ceramic is unbelievable.

    The Horizon Krixus was an attempt at a tank with a ceramic coil with replaceable cotton. I have one somewhere but wasn't experienced enough with building at the time I got it, and I was all thumbs and making a mess. Ended up breaking the coil housing.
     
  32. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    A bit of updating...

    I recieved new BF SS316 coils (NOT original this time - some knock-off called "XFKM" that's 5 times cheaper, and 1.0 ohm) ...and they work GREAT!

    First of all I much preffer 1.0 in my eGo AIO 1500 - it produces enough vapor (actually I wouldn't be able to tell the difference between 0,6 and 1.0), the battery lasts longer (a whole day without any worry) and what's MOST IMPORTANT - NOW THERE ARE NO MORE DRY HITS, NONE! :) [without my modifications]
    My theory is that why the cotton provides the same amount of liquid, the coil vapes at a lower power/temp - therefore no burning. Just to be cautious I switch to store liquid and vape a little a few minutes before I go to sleep and the AIO goes charging, and in the morning I just do it in reverse, as all of my previous coils were burned in the morning after charging.

    As for now I vaped approx 3 days and no problem, but we'll see...

    As for the SMOK and the RBA - that was one of my main cons that decided about what to buy. The SPIRALS tank (in this set) doesn't have the RBA but the TFV4 has one RBA + some wire and cotton.

    ...but...

    Now i want to go a bit further in my DIY'ing - I want to build my own (clapton?) wire with KANTHAL ( smth like that: ) - i even found wires to bulild them, dirt cheap, but I have one question, well two:

    Is there a difference between "KANTHAL A1" and "KANTHAL D"?
    Is there a possibility to check the ohms with a normal multimeter? (and what values I should expect from a DIY wire build)

    thanks
     
  33. nadalama

    nadalama VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year Moderator

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    I don't use kanthal at all, do not know the difference between A1 and D, but do know that you can read your coil on any regulated mod. If one of these days you move to mechanicals, you should always read your coil on a regulated mod or an ohmmeter before you ever even THINK of hitting it with power in a mech.

    And just for what it's worth, if you can find a source for the Spirals RBA, it is worth buying, if you don't mind a fairly tight draw (the Spirals is pretty tight, not quite MTL but close, whether you use the stock coils or the RBA). I did buy my first one separately, since one was not included in the G80 kit, but then bought a separate Spirals Plus tank (4ml instead of 2) and the RBA came with it. I absolutely refuse to buy Smok factory coils.
     
  34. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    Well, about the SMOK - there should be a TFV4 head with RBA coil, and there also should be some sample wire and cotton. I guess I'll just use that as an example for further builds. I also forgot that regulated mod's do read resistance(DUH!). But all of that is the future ...as for now the package is still en route.

    Now about those 1.0 coils for eGo AIO 1500 - they are better, but the problem unfortunately still occurs. Not after 1 day but after approx. 2-3 days, and the vapor that is produced is not that much as a "dry hit" but more like ..."dryhit-ish". When I sense that, I changed the coil to a new one, and the used one I treat with running tap hot water (I resigned from citric acid and IPA baths) and then I mechanically try to scrape (although there's really not much residue on the wire) with a thick needle, and left to dry - so far it helps, but doing that every other 2 days is a pain in the ass :/

    Now, my theories are that this problem might be caused by one of 4 factors:
    1) The NIC salt is prone to burning the coil (worst case scenario)
    2) The liquid is to thick for ego AIO (although i made it 50:50 - calculation made by "LiqCalc" app on my smartphone)
    3) The aroma is too sweet (I give 8% "Vanilla Pudding" [recommended 7-10%], and I just like my vapor sweet and the vanilla taste, I wouldn't like to resign from that, though I can make the aroma less intense). Also, if I had to, I would put my money on this one, because I had a similiar issue with a store-bought liquid "Milky Pudding", that was even sweeter, and it was VG70:30PG
    4) The AIO is just not designed to deal with such liquids and on the SMOK all should make things better. My hope is in the RBA coil mostly.

    Also to solve the issue by trial and error I made two 10ml test batches:
    - One is VG30:70PG, 8% Aroma
    - The second is 50/50, 4% Aroma
    ...when they will steep we'll see...

    What's your guess?

    thanks
     
  35. nadalama

    nadalama VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year Moderator

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    Did a little reading about this eGo AIO device. Are you using it for MTL vaping? If not, that could be the cause of your dry-hit problem. It's designed for MTL and probably does not have the airflow or an open-enough juice inlet for DL vaping.
     
  36. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    I received some info from the polish branch of the seller (HILIQ). He said that Salt A is designed ...for POD's :/// [FUUUU!!!] and that it shouldn't be used in regular devices as it burns coils etc.

    Actually it is written in the description ( https://www.hiliq.com/en/unflavored-200mg-ml-nicotine-salt-base-100ml ), but I first ordered NIC FREEBASE, and when it turned out to be amber-colored had extremely chemical taste and caused few hours of HEADACHE (and it wasn't NIC OD - i wasn't feeling dizzy, nauseous etc. just the headache) I asked for a recommendation and a different product as I wasn't trusting the NIC FREEBASE, and SALT B CAN CAUSE CARBONIZATION - I received no recommendations - they just SENT me the "SALT A" and said, I quote "it's a popular product".

    This salt supposedly should be used with low powered devices, at low temp. My only option right now is to (I HOPE...) use the RDA, and regularly change the cotton and clean the wire (+change it from time to time). Anyone had similar experience?

    BTW: Salt B is theoretically designed to be used with MOD's but the max dosage is 6mg, and the feeling is at 50% ( https://www.hiliq.com/en/unflavored-200mg-ml-nicotine-salt-base-100ml-b ), it still causes carbonazation + ...it can cause allergic reactions and caughing.
     
  37. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    OK, so I recieved "the Dragon" (SMOK) yesterday :) ...to be accurate Smok G80 Kit + TFV4 - so firstly I am quite suprised that all of that costed me approx 30$ (114PLN), - at some point I was it was a scam or something, but not - everytning originally packaged, tons of instructions etc.

    To be even more accurate it's this: http://pl.aliexpress.com/item/32846128263.html + this: http://pl.aliexpress.com/item/32868934939.html + 18650 Battery "Samsung" (knock-off or not it works).

    Now I've been vaping for less then 48h so I can't say much as I did not even fully understand the menus, I used only the TFV4 Tank (Spirals is still in the box) and I chose the MTL 1.8ohm (above-ohm?) coil since I'm vaping at 18W (I tried 1 or 2 puffs at 40W - too much).

    Now to [INITIAL! - I'll update later] Pros and Cons:

    Pros:
    - Tons of equipment, including RBA coil, O-rings, tank extensions etc
    - Tons of options, even "Puff Counter" is "flashy" for my at this point
    - Vaping (MTL!) is not like drinking a thick milkshake through a straw - It requires a lot less energy to vape
    - Refilling e-juice is GREAT [TFV4] - just one "click!" one "squirt" and DONE ;) (in comparison to eGo AIO where I had to partially "deconstruct" the device, and there was always some juice on the device or my hands
    ...there are probably more Pros, but at this point this only this comes to my mind.
    - My e-juice seems to work with that coil well (no dry hits, no burnt coils etc) - we'll see for how long... (no jinxing)

    Cons:
    - Top MAJOR CON - There is a LOT less aroma coming from the vapor (especially sweet, there's practically none, fruit flavor comes out a bit better) + there's always the addition of "new device aroma" (best felt when inhaling on a turned off device). I hope that this "new device" aroma is gonna go away in time...
    - The vapor seems a little bit ..dry and more "cigarette-like" instead of "watery-like" when vaping on eGo AIO ...a LITTLE more "throat hit" too
    - The dripping tip has no helix and that sometimes causes a bit of hot juice to hit my tongue (but maybe that residue was causing the burnings in eGo AIO)
    - It's heavier ;P

    Will write more when I get to know this device better.

    Any advices for someone who wants to use this device as more as "nicotine provider" than a "huge flashy cloud trickster"? (with DIY e-juice, made with "Salt A" - see above)

    Thanks :)
     
  38. Smoky Blue

    Smoky Blue VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    Yeah, if you use nic salt in a sub ohm, you do not want to make it a 50mg... a 12mg would be fine.. it will still chuck clouds, as that is the nature of the mod setup you bought.
     
  39. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    Yup, I know that a sub-ohm coil is a "no-no" for me ;) My target is actually something close to 1.0-1.5 ohm, the juice I'm making is 18mg.

    The problem (which i described two post above) is that HILIQ has "SALT A" and "SALT B". And while the Salt B is designed also for bigger devices, the A is designed for POD's (to be honest I still don't know 100% how they work ;P). In my eGo AIO it was burning 1.0ohm coils in 1 day - we'll see how (long, without burning) it performs on pre-build coil (a chose 1.8 MTL on purpose instead of building RBA straight away) on this device.

    And YES - even though I'm operating at 1/4 capacity (18W is the sweet spot - excess juice doesn't hurt my tongue, while at 20W it does - interesting :)) I still get some good clouds, although nothing like I see in my local vapeshop (where they smoke 3-6mg, or maybe even 0mg, and just make clouds all day ;))

    To be continued... :)
     
  40. mothzart

    mothzart New Member

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    Ok, so I'm after a few days of testing "the dragon" (SMOK) [with TFV4, original SPIRALS head still in the box] and so far:

    - I've been using 1.8ohm MTL coil, which worked great for me :) The whole time I had ONE dry hit (device in my pocket, half-full tank, and I switched from 18W to 22W). After 6 days of intense vaping there was absolutely no burnt after taste, since today. Great news for me considering that on eGo AIO the coil lasted approx 24h.
    - The "new device" taste was/is gone now
    - The hot juice "spitting" on my tongue was easily solved - I simply reduced the airflow :)
    - The aroma problem is probably caused by aromas I used in my DIY liquids. I'll see with the new coil...

    Today it started tasting burn-ish and I "deconstructed" (for the first time with some juice inside - made a mess ;)) the device, cleaned it etc.

    ...and, finally [oh boy, oh boy! ;P]...

    - I am testing my semi-self-made [the wire was present, I just placed the wick] RBA 0,7ohm. The device (still at 18W) produces a LOT more vapour (duh!), and I have to switch my habits of smoking cause after a few hits I get dizzy (18mg/ml; Salt A), and also it uses liquid much faster ;D And ...It WORKS - i know, for some of you it's just "another day at the office" but to me it's great news.

    Now to the "questions section":
    1) Everything works great but from time to time I get quite loud popping sound. Why is that? How to get rid of that?
    2) Should I use that little contraption that tightens the air intake (it goes just under the wire)?
    3) What does SOFT/NORM/HARD/MAX options really do when in wattage mode? ...and why when I switched from SOFT (which I used all the time) to NORM the detected 0.7 ohm went to 0.00ohm [there even was no "NEW COIL?" question]? ...is that like the acceleration/how fast the coil goes to full set wattage on the coil?
    4) Should I expect some leaking? (with the 1.8 MTL there was none, but the design was different)

    ...now for my future DIY'ing...

    5) What type of material should I use to achieve a 1,0-1,5 ohm coil (preferably clapton[?]) as I also want to make them myself?

    again thanks in advance for answers :)
     
  41. Letitia9

    Letitia9 Therion/Nano Junkie VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years VU Challenge Team

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    Occasional popping is normal, I pretty much ignore as it seldom happens to me.
    Soft normal hard is just for regulating ramp time on the coil. I usually just use normal, do sometimes use hard if I'm using beefy dual coils.
    Leaking is generally due to wicking or vacuum loss, one of those things you just have to try one change at a time to figure out the fix. Sometimes it isn't leakage, it is simply condensation. Condensation does not always have a fix but can be reduced by closing af when not in use, changing draw style, different dt, etc. Another trial & error sort of thing, you may have an atty where you just have to live with it.

    To lean more about wire good place to ask questions is in the builder's corner.
     
    Smoky Blue likes this.

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