Battery Nooob Needs Advice For Kanger Subox 50w

[BLACKTOOTHGRIN]

Yesterday I pre-orderd the new Kanger Subox Mini Starter Kit.



This will be my first box mod that uses replaceable batteries.
Previously I have been using the iStick 20w and iStick 50w that charge internally.
With that said....
I really have no idea what battery will work best in this mod.
The only recommendation that Kanger gives is to buy a
suitable 18650 cell that has an output of 20amps or above.
Well...there's lots of those out there, and at this point I don't know one from another or how to choose one over the other.

What would you all recommend for this 50w box and why?
(I normally Vape a Subtank Mini at around 25w, but would potentially like to increase the power with this new version of Subtank Mini should it handle it without burnt hits)
The shop I ordered from recommended a Samsung 25R for this mod. Is that good? Any others?


**Note**
I noticed that this box has the same open vent on the battery door like the original Kbox, so a Red battery would be nice for appearance, but completely insignificant if the quality isn't there.
LG HE2? LG HE4?

I also need advise on a quality battery charger that will hold up over time, but not kill my wallet.
I've heard the Xtar chargers are Okay, but That's about it.

Best and cheapest place to buy authentic batteries and chargers?

 

[Lefty]

Either one of the HE's would be fine. The Samsung is a good choice as well. There are shrink wraps available for not much to color co-ordinate if you so desire. You need only to peel the original and trim the wrap length for flat top then use a hair dryer or heat gun to shrink it. http://battwrap.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=5
The Xtar's are good chargers. The latest Efest and Nitecore's are up to the task as well.

 

[UncleRJ]

I use and really like the Samsung 25R batteries. Actually I need to order a couple more of them.

I suggest you get two of them to keep in rotation. Possibly three if you vape a lot and will be using higher wattages wich will deplete the batteries faster. One in the mod, another charged on in your pocket if needed.

Xtar makes a good charger. I suggest getting at least a two bay charger. Even better a 4 bay charger just to have the extra capability in the future. A 4 bay charger is not much more than the two bay.

 

[BoomStick]

+1 on both previous replies.

 

[scotterics]

I concur with all... Samsung 25R... Xtar charger (the VP series are very nice)

If you plan to "carry" a spare battery with you at work or whatever PLEASE buy a little case for it instead of just throwing it in your pocket

 

[BLACKTOOTHGRIN]

Either one of the HE's would be fine. The Samsung is a good choice as well. There are shrink wraps available for not much to color co-ordinate if you so desire. You need only to peel the original and trim the wrap length for flat top then use a hair dryer or heat gun to shrink it. http://battwrap.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=5
The Xtar's are good chargers. The latest Efest and Nitecore's are up to the task as well.

Thanks for the input and the link.
Good to know there's an option like that.

I use and really like the Samsung 25R batteries. Actually I need to order a couple more of them.

I suggest you get two of them to keep in rotation. Possibly three if you vape a lot and will be using higher wattages wich will deplete the batteries faster. One in the mod, another charged on in your pocket if needed.

Xtar makes a good charger. I suggest getting at least a two bay charger. Even better a 4 bay charger just to have the extra capability in the future. A 4 bay charger is not much more than the two bay.

Are these what you're talking about:
http://www.lightningvapes.com/products/samsung-inr-18650-25r-battery
And what's the difference between a 18650 at 20amps and one at 35amps like these:
http://www.lightningvapes.com/produ...drain-rechargeable-battery-flat-or-button-top

Do I need flat or button top?
Do they make a higher mah battery in the 18650 that will last longer?

How's this in comparison to the Xtar chargers:
http://www.lightningvapes.com/collections/battery-chargers/products/efest-luc-v4-lcd-usb-charger

Where have you found to be the cheapest and most reputable place to buy batteries and chargers?

 

[Jon@LiionWholesale]

Agreed, LG HE2 or Samsung 25R. As for the charger personally I would buy Efest or Xtar but if you're on a budget Nitecore I2/I4 will do the job for a bit cheaper.

 

[Jon@LiionWholesale]

Thanks for the input and the link.
Good to know there's an option like that.



Are these what you're talking about:
http://www.lightningvapes.com/products/samsung-inr-18650-25r-battery
And what's the difference between a 18650 at 20amps and one at 35amps like these:
http://www.lightningvapes.com/produ...drain-rechargeable-battery-flat-or-button-top

Do I need flat or button top?
Do they make a higher mah battery in the 18650 that will last longer?

How's this in comparison to the Xtar chargers:
http://www.lightningvapes.com/collections/battery-chargers/products/efest-luc-v4-lcd-usb-charger

Where have you found to be the cheapest and most reputable place to buy batteries and chargers?

Yes the 25R full part number is INR18650-25R.

Pretty sure a flat top is best for that.

If you're using it at 50W then a higher mAh battery won't be able to handle the current and will therefore last less time than an optimized battery like the 25R or HE2 even though they have less mAh. It could also be unsafe at that high power if you ever tried it on purpose or accidentally. If on the other hand you were using it only at really low settings (I don't know how low it goes) then it's possible a higher mAh battery might last slightly longer. Personally I'd just do 25R or HE2 and not worry about it, that's your best bet.

The chinese companies rate their batteries higher even though the batteries aren't actually any better. That Efest 35A is pretty much identical in testing to the LG HE2, but it costs more.

We use the Efest LUC V4 chargers here and they're our favorites.

 

[BoomStick]

You don't really know who makes the efest battery because they're not a battery manufacturer. Get the Samsung or Lg. Common charger ranking is
1. Xtar
2. Efest Luc
3. Nitecore

 

[BLACKTOOTHGRIN]

You don't really know who makes the efest battery because they're not a battery manufacturer. Get the Samsung or Lg. Common charger ranking is
1. Xtar
2. Efest Luc
3. Nitecore

Thanks.

Yes the 25R full part number is INR18650-25R.

Pretty sure a flat top is best for that.

If you're using it at 50W then a higher mAh battery won't be able to handle the current and will therefore last less time than an optimized battery like the 25R or HE2 even though they have less mAh. It could also be unsafe at that high power if you ever tried it on purpose or accidentally. If on the other hand you were using it only at really low settings (I don't know how low it goes) then it's possible a higher mAh battery might last slightly longer. Personally I'd just do 25R or HE2 and not worry about it, that's your best bet.

The chinese companies rate their batteries higher even though the batteries aren't actually any better. That Efest 35A is pretty much identical in testing to the LG HE2, but it costs more.

We use the Efest LUC V4 chargers here and they're our favorites.

Wow.
Thanks for the save!
I didn't realize that, and I definitely don't need the damn thing popping off in my face!!

Guess I'll go with the Samsung or LG's.
What's the difference between the LG HE2 and HE4??
Any idea on this Samsung? It's a completely different part number, but an 18650:
http://www.evape.us/samsung-18650-2600/
How much is TOO much to pay for any of these batteries?

And how much is TOO much to pay for the Efest and Xtar chargers?

 

[Jon@LiionWholesale]

Thanks.
Wow.
Thanks for the save!
I didn't realize that, and I definitely don't need the damn thing popping off in my face!!

Guess I'll go with the Samsung or LG's.
What's the difference between the LG HE2 and HE4??
Any idea on this Samsung? It's a completely different part number, but an 18650:
http://www.evape.us/samsung-18650-2600/
How much is TOO much to pay for any of these batteries?

And how much is TOO much to pay for the Efest and Xtar chargers?

That Samsung 26F you linked has the same problem as the higher mAh batteries I was referring to. It's the wrong chemistry and has a very low amp limit. Basically look for amp limits. If the site doesn't list an amp limit, find a different site. You're looking for at least a 20A continuous discharge current from a big brand (Sony/Samsung/LG) or at least 35A from a Chinese company since they inflate their ratings. You'll find that you can't do better than the 25R or HE2.

The HE2 and HE4 are different colors. There may be other slight differences but the spec sheets are the same and in our testing they look the same.

Personally I prefer Samsung.

Not really appropriate for me to discuss the pricing since I'm a vendor.

 

[BLACKTOOTHGRIN]

Oh...I didn't realize that.
I'll stick to trying to find a good deal on the 25R's or HE2's then.
I appreciate the extra info on everything.
Thank you.

 

[BLACKTOOTHGRIN]

Does anyone know of a good deal on the Xtar VP4?
Ive been looking everywhere and best price I can find is $37.
Theres gotta be some shops offering special coupons or discounts, but I sure havent found them.

 

[BLACKTOOTHGRIN]

Thank you all for your battery wisdom.

I ended up with the XTAR VP4 - Samsung 25R's and wrapped them in Red and Black.
I really dig the charger and think it was definitely the right choice for me.
Haven't been able to try out the batteries because the Subox hasnt arrived yet, but I did get an email saying it is shipping out today.
So hopefully it wont be much longer of a wait.

 

[BoomStick]

Nice choices. I really like that charger. It'll probably be the next one I get.

 

[scotterics]

Excellent choices.... Enjoy

 

[kpe]

How safe is it to charge directly from the Subox Mini?

Is it really necessary to use an external charger? It seems you need to purchase a quality charger to be on the safe side; and I simply don't have the money to spent another 20-30 bucks on a charger if I go with a Kanger Subox Mini purchase.
Would I be better off just charging directly from the device or is that unwise?

 

[Zamazam]

LG HE4. The kit comes with stickers you can put on your batteries so they look red though the little K window.

 

[Zamazam]

How safe is it to charge directly from the Subox Mini?

Is it really necessary to use an external charger? It seems you need to purchase a quality charger to be on the safe side; and I simply don't have the money to spent another 20-30 bucks on a charger if I go with a Kanger Subox Mini purchase.
Would I be better off just charging directly from the device or is that unwise?

Perfectly safe.

 

[kpe]

Alright, good to know.

This will be my first kit with replaceable batteries and I am concerned about the safety in relation to the ohms and battery usage. I've been using basic evod kits for the past year or two, so my knowledge is limited.
I ordered two Samsung 25R batteries and a pack of the vertical 1.5 ohm coils along with the Subox Mini.

 

[BoomStick]

Alright, good to know.

This will be my first kit with replaceable batteries and I am concerned about the safety in relation to the ohms and battery usage. I've been using basic evod kits for the past year or two, so my knowledge is limited.
I ordered two Samsung 25R batteries and a pack of the vertical 1.5 ohm coils along with the Subox Mini.

The resistance of your build has nothing to do with battery safety in a variable wattage mod. Battery voltage and watt setting determine the amp load placed on the batteries. The batteries you ordered will handle that mods max input current just fine.

 

[mkhilario]

I use and really like the Samsung 25R batteries. Actually I need to order a couple more of them.

I suggest you get two of them to keep in rotation. Possibly three if you vape a lot and will be using higher wattages wich will deplete the batteries faster. One in the mod, another charged on in your pocket if needed.

Xtar makes a good charger. I suggest getting at least a two bay charger. Even better a 4 bay charger just to have the extra capability in the future. A 4 bay charger is not much more than the two bay.

You can get a Xtar MC2 charger for about the same price as a single battery. I am perfectly happy with mine.

 

[NemesisVaper]

Not much else to say, everyone else has covered it well.

+1 for the efest LUC 4 bay, great charger and you can charge at 1A which beats waiting fifty years at 500mA.

HE4 and HE2 perform the same for me.

If youd like to see a certain colour throughbthebvent holes, a coloured sticker on the battery will let you choose. If not then of course HE2 are red(ish), HE4 are yellow, HD2 are purple, old 25r are blue and the new ones are green. Any of those cells will serve you well though you may as well go for The extra 500mAh and forget the HD2.

 

[Jon@LiionWholesale]

Not much else to say, everyone else has covered it well.

+1 for the efest LUC 4 bay, great charger and you can charge at 1A which beats waiting fifty years at 500mA.

HE4 and HE2 perform the same for me.

If youd like to see a certain colour throughbthebvent holes, a coloured sticker on the battery will let you choose. If not then of course HE2 are red(ish), HE4 are yellow, HD2 are purple, old 25r are blue and the new ones are green. Any of those cells will serve you well though you may as well go for The extra 500mAh and forget the HD2.

+1 but the really big selling point of the LUC chargers is the 2A charging, something that is tough to find.

 

[NemesisVaper]

+1 but the really big selling point of the LUC chargers is the 2A charging, something that is tough to find.

True.

They say in the manual that it's just for 26650 but it let's me set it to 2A for a pair of 18650 in the middle channels. Wasn't sure if it was truly doing 2A, I guess it can't tell the difference between them anyway.

 

[CloudySkies]

The subox Mini kit has stickers to put on your battery so that it coordinates with your mod. No need to buy a certain color battery, just get the one you want and slap the sticker on. White mod comes with black sticker, black mod comes with red. I own both. I'd suggest a MaH higher than 2700 and as for charge times, I use a 2A charger and the device will only draw as much as it needs from it. Go high, never go low. 2700 doesn't last me all day ever, I have one that goes up to 3400mah and that one will barely squeak by on a full days use (I sleep like 4 hours a day, so yes 20 hours...don't have kids)

 

[NemesisVaper]

The subox Mini kit has stickers to put on your battery so that it coordinates with your mod. No need to buy a certain color battery, just get the one you want and slap the sticker on. White mod comes with black sticker, black mod comes with red. I own both. I'd suggest a MaH higher than 2700 and as for charge times, I use a 2A charger and the device will only draw as much as it needs from it. Go high, never go low. 2700 doesn't last me all day ever, I have one that goes up to 3400mah and that one will barely squeak by on a full days use (I sleep like 4 hours a day, so yes 20 hours...don't have kids)

There aren't many batteries out there over 2500mAh that have a high enough amp limit for the Kbox mini. If the board were 100% efficient you'd need 15A cells, but it won't be.

If the cells you're using aren't LG Samsung Sony Panasonic etc, the amp limit printed on them is probably a lie. MAh is important but safety is even more so.

Samsung 30Q 3000mAh are ideal or LG Hg2.

 

[mkhilario]

I bought 3 different 18650 batteries at roughly the same time: New gen Efest 2800mah now clearly marked as 35A continuous discharge, an Imren 2600mah 38A, and a new gen green Samsung 25R. The Samsung was the cheapest and longest lasting.

EDIT: Just for clarification, the primary test rig was a mech mod running a 0.8 ohm 5.25 amp build.

 

[NemesisVaper]

No such thing as an 18650 with more than a 30A continuous.

Imran rewrap LG and Samsung cells. That Imran is probably a 25R with inflated specs. Depends what the top cap looks like. If the positive contact has three connections to the positive pole then it's a Samsung. If it has four it's probably an LG.

You're probably ok with them in the Kbox Mini, as they should do 20A. However nobody really knows. LG and Samsung put their name on all the grade A cells. They usually sell the B grades to rewrappers, after first removing any trace of their name and logo.

A decent 3000mAh OEM cell should give more vape time, unfortunately efest and Imran are probably living about capacity which is why the 25r lasted longer.

Don't believe a word they print on the label. The big names have to care about your safety or they'll be held accountable by major corporations. Rewrappers don't give a shit.

 

[Jon@LiionWholesale]

No such thing as an 18650 with more than a 30A continuous.

Imran rewrap LG and Samsung cells. That Imran is probably a 25R with inflated specs. Depends what the top cap looks like. If the positive contact has three connections to the positive pole then it's a Samsung. If it has four it's probably an LG.

You're probably ok with them in the Kbox Mini, as they should do 20A. However nobody really knows. LG and Samsung put their name on all the grade A cells. They usually sell the B grades to rewrappers, after first removing any trace of their name and logo.

A decent 3000mAh OEM cell should give more vape time, unfortunately efest and Imran are probably living about capacity which is why the 25r lasted longer.

Don't believe a word they print on the label. The big names have to care about your safety or they'll be held accountable by major corporations. Rewrappers don't give a shit.

Mostly agree with this but Efest and Imren are not like the really crappy rewrappers (like trustfire) in that the batteries are generally pretty decent and for sure really do have the mAh they say they do. The reason they don't seem to is that the internal resistance is really too high for the high discharge rating they give. So if you're running them at a lower discharge rating (for example running the 2500mAh 35A at 20A) they'll give all the mAh they say. If you try to run that battery at 30A or 35A you'll get loads of voltage sag and you won't be able to utilize all the energy in the battery, so they don't last as long as another battery with lower internal resistance and mAh (like the 25R which has legendary low internal resistance).

 

[NemesisVaper]

I'm just wondering what that Imran actually is. The MXJO I saw was almost definitely a 25r,just with 300mah added to the label.

It had three contact points on the positive contact, an 0 stamped onto the negative at the edge and I assume I'd have found the two line serial/code and the single line code on the tube.

 

[mkhilario]

My Imren has a four connection flat positive contact. I bought it because several of the local hardcore sub-ohm guys including the dude who made my mech mod uses them. None of the 3 batteries are disappointing at all as far as battery life, but the 25R has a slight edge.

 

[NemesisVaper]

God knows what cell that is then bud.

I've no doubt they perform decently. I have a set of efest that are doing great in my Sigelei. I just wouldn't trust them in an unprotected device, because I don't know what they are. My way of thinking is if Dewalt wouldn't use them in a drill, I won't use them in a mech.

If they'd open up and be honest I'd buy them, it just seems very shady what they tend to do with specs and phony amp limits that's all.

Best way to get a "hard hitting" cell is to buy OEM. I assume when people say one cell "hits harder" than another they're expressing the feeling of less voltage sag. A grade batteries should sag less than the ones that are rewraped. Even a good cell and setup drops voltage noticeably. You'd be lucky to see 3.4v measured at the atomiser with a good cell and a 0.2ohm build.

 

[mkhilario]

I run a 0.7-0.9 single coil on my mech so I'm not worried. But I recommend the Samsung 25R for the OP based on my personal experience (I also have a Subox kit). When I need to buy another battery it will be a 25R.

 

[sswick]

Mostly agree with this but Efest and Imren are not like the really crappy rewrappers (like trustfire) in that the batteries are generally pretty decent and for sure really do have the mAh they say they do. The reason they don't seem to is that the internal resistance is really too high for the high discharge rating they give. So if you're running them at a lower discharge rating (for example running the 2500mAh 35A at 20A) they'll give all the mAh they say. If you try to run that battery at 30A or 35A you'll get loads of voltage sag and you won't be able to utilize all the energy in the battery, so they don't last as long as another battery with lower internal resistance and mAh (like the 25R which has legendary low internal resistance).

I agree with Jon, I purchased 2 of his Samsung INR-18650-25R batteries. I even bought an external charger from him which holds both batteries and even came with a car charger.

I can vape all day long on these batteries and according to the Subox display, the battery doesn't even drain half way after a full day of vaping. I vape a lot as well, as I used to be a pack a day smoker. It's to the point now that I don't even bother to carry the 2nd battery on me anymore because so far not only has the battery been extremely reliable, I'm all but guaranteed I won't even drain it 1/2 way. The 25R's are a little cheaper than the other batteries on this thread and for my buck so far I can almost guarantee you'll get the same excellent results I've had. No point in buying another brand of battery when you can spend less on the Samsung and get perfect results.

 

[tjd1990]

Hey guys, I saw this asked already but I wouldn't mind a second opinion on this, how safe is it to use the device's built in charger? I really don't have the cash to buy a dedicated charger in addition to the mod.

Also, is it safe to leave it charging over night? That would be the easiest way to go for me however if it isn't safe I wouldn't do it, of course.

 

[NemesisVaper]

It's safe but might be slow, not sure on the charging current. I'm guessing 500mA, but if it charges at 1A a cell should charge in well under 3 hours.

I'd hope there was minimal risk of fire etc, but I wouldn't risk charging unattended. I don't even charg my phone over night. Depends how you feel about it.

 

[m0rg0o7]

hey guy im a complete battery noob and was wondering if this is the correct battery everyone is talking about as i need a second battery to keep up ? and tjd1990 i charge through my Mod and it takes about 3-3.5 hours , but i alway keep an eye on it and once fully charged take it off. Best to be safe

 

[NemesisVaper]

hey guy im a complete battery noob and was wondering if this is the correct battery everyone is talking about as i need a second battery to keep up ? and tjd1990 i charge through my Mod and it takes about 3-3.5 hours , but i alway keep an eye on it and once fully charged take it off. Best to be safe
View attachment 27140

Yes, that's a 25R. Looks like it may be the new green wrapped revised one too.

 

[m0rg0o7]

cheers for that think ill get 1 or 2 ordered lol

 

[PyroTekRob]

Just picked up a subox to back up my iStick 50w. Because of the changeable batteries. I've seen others recommend a Panasonic battery also, are they as the Samsung 25R and the LG HE2/4 recommended here? Sorry I can't recall the model # of the Panasonic, I can get it when I get home.

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk

 

[Jon@LiionWholesale]

Just picked up a subox to back up my iStick 50w. Because of the changeable batteries. I've seen others recommend a Panasonic battery also, are they as the Samsung 25R and the LG HE2/4 recommended here? Sorry I can't recall the model # of the Panasonic, I can get it when I get home.

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk

Would not recommend any Panasonic for vaping.

 

[PyroTekRob]

Would not recommend any Panasonic for vaping.

Ok, thank you.

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk

 

[jeroen92]

Would anyone recommend a Red AWT 3000mAh 40A battery for this one?

 

[Zamazam]

I'd go with a LGHE4 or a Samsung 25R.

 

[BoomStick]

Buying Sony, Samsung and LG batteries from a known, trusted vendor is the way to go. Then you know the actual manufacturer, model and specs of the cell you're buying.

 

[mkhilario]

Would anyone recommend a Red AWT 3000mAh 40A battery for this one?

No. 3000mah? 40A? Both specs are fake. Will it work? Probably. Just get a Samsung 25R, works as advertised.

 

[VapinGeorgie420]

Would anyone recommend a Red AWT 3000mAh 40A battery for this one?

It will be fine. I have a couple and they work fine. Just note these are not 40A batts. Like efest they use they're pulse ratings for marketing. The AWT are 20A continuous. 40A is they're pulse rating, even then I wouldn't trust that I'd say 30 for Max pulse. Stay 20Amps or lower when using these to play it safe. I also recommend Sony,Samsung, Lg these batteries are cheap to buy unless your going with Sony's there a lil higher. No reason to skimp on rewrap batts with false advertisement. I recommended the Lg poop brown ones in regulated mods they hold a charge forever and are rated for 20Amps.

Sent from my XT1049 using Tapatalk

 

[BigNasty]

My rule of thumb mantra for batteries is this.
Sony, Samsung, LG, MNKE.
MNKE are the rocking horse turds of vaping since they stopped making them but some are still floating around.

 

[VapinGeorgie420]

I loved those MNKE batts

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