It is still a statement from the owner, and there lies the conflict of interest ... unlike a third-party tester that puts their reputation/ livelihood on the line and has no conflict of interest.
Become a Patron!
Diketones, Oils, Sugars; All-in-one page: (note: outdated info here)
- Thread starter Mikser
- Start date
It is still a statement from the owner, and there lies the conflict of interest ... unlike a third-party tester that puts their reputation/ livelihood on the line and has no conflict of interest.
wllmc
VU Donator
Gold Contributor
ECF Refugee
VU Challenge Sponsor
VU Challenge Team
Vape Media
Member For 5 Years
everyone arguing over if they do or dont use acetoin not one person contaced them but me and matt. if you are going to stand against something I say know the facts. facts is they use acetoin in a few flavors. did they lie to me ? they actually corrected me. like I said want a more specific answer ask one or conduct your own clearstream project can only cost a few million lol.
Your honesty or trustworthyness is not the question, nor is it in doubt. The question is quite simple. Are there third party acetoin test for FA? No or not yet, is the answer.
wllmc
VU Donator
Gold Contributor
ECF Refugee
VU Challenge Sponsor
VU Challenge Team
Vape Media
Member For 5 Years
ya but there obviously is 2 sides of that coin. you think no one has ever provided false documents either? that stance is 6 of 1 half a dozen of the other cant trust anyone.
In my case, the answer is I don't care. I am not only satisfied, but impressed with FlavorArt's transparency and safety testing.
They have always been a trusted asset to this community IMO. I'm betting 99% of DIYers feel the same way.
.
wllmc
VU Donator
Gold Contributor
ECF Refugee
VU Challenge Sponsor
VU Challenge Team
Vape Media
Member For 5 Years
You need to update that chart @Mikser it still says no info about acetpoi and flavors with diketones
which we have already proved to you is INCORRECT
everyone stop an think about this
FA flavors are artificial MEANING they put chemicals together to make them. In order for there to be acetoin in them, they would have to put it in there, so if they arent actually using acetoin why would one have them tested for it. its like testing gasoline for amounts of skunk urine in it just to prove its not there.
Acetoin was being used as a replacement for AP by many companies it wasnt something that was even being used necessarily
They do not need to have flavors they know to be bad for vaping tested for anything. They know what they put in there has DA/AP and it should not be used for vaping so why waste time and or money on something that you tell people not to use for vaping when these tests are for vaping purposes.
ALso have you contacted FA about why they dont seperate the kitchen and vaping favors on their website or are you just taking someone else's word for it. You show less and less credibility with everything you do
TO ANYONE NEW TO DIY OR RESEARCHING DIKETONES, AP, AND ACETOIN IN FLAVORINGS -
I WOULD NOT TRUST ONE WORD TYPED BY MIKSER
which we have already proved to you is INCORRECT
everyone stop an think about this
FA flavors are artificial MEANING they put chemicals together to make them. In order for there to be acetoin in them, they would have to put it in there, so if they arent actually using acetoin why would one have them tested for it. its like testing gasoline for amounts of skunk urine in it just to prove its not there.
Acetoin was being used as a replacement for AP by many companies it wasnt something that was even being used necessarily
They do not need to have flavors they know to be bad for vaping tested for anything. They know what they put in there has DA/AP and it should not be used for vaping so why waste time and or money on something that you tell people not to use for vaping when these tests are for vaping purposes.
ALso have you contacted FA about why they dont seperate the kitchen and vaping favors on their website or are you just taking someone else's word for it. You show less and less credibility with everything you do
TO ANYONE NEW TO DIY OR RESEARCHING DIKETONES, AP, AND ACETOIN IN FLAVORINGS -
I WOULD NOT TRUST ONE WORD TYPED BY MIKSER
Thx for reminding me about stars. As you can see i already moved FA text higher and now i need to make a new table and upload a pic somewhere and then place it in the first post... i will do this tomorrow since it takes some time. FA was moved to 3 stars (not because of the noise here, but because they do have D/AP testing reports for all their vaping flavors (i didn't know for the information that they cannot list their vaping and kitchen flavors separately due to regulations; this changes things because otherwise their official website really is a mess with everything put in the same basket). Thx for clearing things up.
Last edited:
Why not redo your graphics and just get rid of those stars altogether ... it is at best a subjective rating system and is being confused with trust. Ditch the star rating system and list alphabetically with comments regarding disclosures ... it will be more objective.
oh look more info left out
wonder flavors says on every flavor it MAY contain Diacetyl and on their website it says they are working to provide more specific info in the future
If the OP wants transparency maybe he should be a little more transparent himself and not omit information left and right
wonder flavors says on every flavor it MAY contain Diacetyl and on their website it says they are working to provide more specific info in the future
If the OP wants transparency maybe he should be a little more transparent himself and not omit information left and right
wllmc
VU Donator
Gold Contributor
ECF Refugee
VU Challenge Sponsor
VU Challenge Team
Vape Media
Member For 5 Years
nic vape has Nictrace..... you can see reports on every batch through the batch ID but they are not on this list lol but we all know things change from batch to batch so Ive always said also so what one batch 5 years ago tested good. how many didnt or how many havent but were never tested because all the glitter and glamour of one test they decide to release. 30 prior may not have shown the best to publish results.... but Im not that paranoid guy in the window. I trust everyone until Im givin a reason not to.
note to self... never try to get over on Matt.
I said this numerous times; this research is about transparency and based on publicly available information about D-A-AP levels. I know RF is testing each batch they make and their customers can check diketone testing results of each bottle they bought separately. This is truly admirable. The problem is that they do not publish their diketone levels publicly - it means one can check how much A/AP each flavor has only AFTER buying, not BEFORE buying.
One may say that is because each batch they make is slightly different, so results may not be the same each time, but the reality is that it's not a good information and they could write a range at least. See, buyer doesn't care much about the difference between 538ppm or 574ppm of A/AP for example (+/-5%), but if you write only that a certain flavor has A/AP, that could mean either 80ppm or 50,000ppm of A/AP, which is a huge difference (and at the end it may result in buying or not buying a certain flavor). I hope they will publish their results publicly soon since i heard they put a lot of work in their research as well. I hope Walt can help here.
@wllmc I couldn't find any info about levels of daap on NicTrace; it seems they practice the same approach as RF - you can see what's inside only after you buy a thing which you cannot return. Were you able to find any published test results about their flavorings? Either way, it's a good info and i will include their company soon. Thx.
To reach one star companies have to provide info about D-A-AP for each of their flavors separately (see RF for example), so customers may decide OR explicitely say on their website (and not by your email or on forums) that their flavors do not contain any D-A-AP (all three). This way concerned vapers may get enough information before they buy anything. If they say we don't add Diacetyl in any of our flavors, that is not enough information for a potential buyer, since any of their flavors may be full of A/AP. Btw GF is not testing any flavors at all.
I see an opportunity here and @Mattp169 could contribute a lot; i can see a lot of passion here. Negativity and critic opinion may both be very beneficial for this project and help finding all the flaws or new details. It is clear that research is not optimal, that many things can be improved and updated with new findings and many new info found. Negative opinion and challenging details often contribute more to the project than applauding or silence. I would just hope that Matt would focus more on presenting facts, numbers and reports, rather than just sharing his opinion.
I agree rating system makes it more subjective, but using star system is way more powerful and it may contribute to changes faster. Noone wants to see themselves at the bottom of the list + more explicitly are shown the results or pointed manufacturer's attitude to vapers (when hiding things). I fear that without any ratings an overall comparison would lose too much.
oh look they dont publish the levels before you buy
nope not at all
I mean I cant see that this flavor contains less then 25 ppm AP at recommended usage levels or less then 10ppm of acetoin
Nope I cant see that at all
and even if I could see that I mean thats not very specific is it. And we need specific numbers published don't we?
@Mikser You ready to stop lying ??????????
really?????????????????????????????????????????This is what i am talking about!Now, this is a great contribution Matt! I will update RF info today!
so american companies get updated with true info and european companies get slandered .
oh love the emoji. is that you trying to run around and cover your ass and hide all your lies and disinformation?
do you know how hard it was for me to find that info?
took me 30 seconds to load their website and look at a picture. That info has been there for ages. You mean in all your research you never looked at a picture on the companies website. Then your research is so flawed and useless you should delete this thread entirely, because if in seconds I can find stuff you supposedly researched; then how can anyone trust your research? How are people suppose to trust your data which is clearly flawed beyond all belief?
IMHO you have no business trying to maintain a thread with important information like this. You are either a completely incompetent researcher or have a hidden agenda. The fact you lie so much and skew the data on FA yet FA is the first brand mentioned in your thread title which is indexed by google, says to me you are biased against FA and may be trying to discredit them.
You clearly are unqualified and have no place trying to do this, so delete your original post with all its lies and misinformation and biased opinions and let this thread die.
gopher_byrd
Cranky Old Fart
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
ECF Refugee
Member For 5 Years
VU Patreon
Just made a fresh batch...
If you want to maintain a thread with updated disclosures by different flavorists, I for one would visit often and even 'watch' the thread. If your objective is to gain notoriety by creating a rating system with your name ... bad idea. A 'Mikser rating' is not more subjective, it *IS* subjective.
Btw, this is getting tiresome, and I am actually getting tempted to hit the IGNORE button.
still lies about FA maybe we should inform FA they are being slandered in this thread see if they want to take legal action against Mikser.
I would have done that ages ago if I wasnt afraid some new member to the forum or community wouldnt find this thread via google and think the info in the OP was actual factual, non biased and useful
With enough due diligence, BS is easily exposed.
Time and energy spent on making this thread is not trivial. Reasons for doing so include ...
- die-hard 'do gooder'
- paranoid hypochondriac
- fame whore
IGNORED
cant defend your lies? attack the person questioning and exposing your lies. typical ... oh so typical
I have to add this so readers won't be confused (you can delete the entire thread if you think the info are misleading or a thread is bad for the forum or vaping community).
Note: Lots of information in this thread is outdated.
You can find updated version, many new findings and more companies compared on ELR website.
Note: Lots of information in this thread is outdated.
You can find updated version, many new findings and more companies compared on ELR website.
Okay, you needa lay off the paste...
I vote nuke this misinformation thread and booting this ANTZ poser fuck.
But then again this is the ONLY thread he posted in the forums, no intro but just slander and misinformation wrapped in a guise do-gooder bullshit.
ive been calling him out on his bullshit on ELR
he has lots of people ignoring his shit
only bad thing is if someone deosnt kill the top post
people doing google searches will see these threads
and if they dont read the whole thing might believe these threads to be actually acurate
he has lots of people ignoring his shit
only bad thing is if someone deosnt kill the top post
people doing google searches will see these threads
and if they dont read the whole thing might believe these threads to be actually acurate