Doctor visit turned to worry..

[ShadowMelt]

I went to doctor for a normal visit about a week ago. I talked to her about issues nothing related to me breathing or anything. It was a normal check up type of thing. She did her normal listen to me breath check which doctors do all the time and side my right lung was whizzing and asked if I have been coughing and I said no. I been vaping for 1 and half years chain vaping I guess you can say on 3mg nic. She ordered an x ray and called me with the results after agonizing day and said it was "walking pneumonia". This is weird to me and I don't know if was from vaping or what or if I really got pneumonia when I did not feel sick at all. She also said radiologist are not 100% certain if anything is there. Anyone had anything like this?

Sent using my S7 Edge with Tapatalk app

 

[f1r3b1rd]

sorry for your troubles cap; but, I doubt vaping had anything to do with it. According to WebMD walking pneumonia is caused from an infection.

ive had 2 lung xrays since I sarted vaping 4 years ago; and, both have shown zero signs of damage. The last one was done 5 months ago, and according to the doctor, my lung showed no signs of me ever having smoked. I was a 2 PAD smoker for almost 20 years.

 

[gakudzu]

Infections are caused by bacteria. Don't vape bacteria

Take your antibiotics, and get well soon.

 

[Whiskey]

Infections are caused by bacteria. Don't vape bacteria

Take your antibiotics, and get well soon.

This^^^^
Hope it clears up fast, Shadow

 

[Rickajho]

You don't necessarily feel all that ill with walking pneumonia. That's why it isn't called "lying around and feeling like I'm gonna die" pneumonia. It can still get slowly worse with time. Or it can get better on it's own too.

You can get viral pneumonia or bacterial pneumonia. If it's bacterial you take antibiotics and it goes away. Viral pneumonia is the more scary one because there isn't medication for it.

To answer your question: If we were all coming down with some kind of vape related pneumonia I'm pretty sure no one would be vaping. So no - it's not vape related. Contrary to misconception, no one is filllng their lungs with gallons of liquid from vaping. Quite the opposite actually: Producing vapor is a hygroscopic process - it sucks moisture out - it doesn't put it in.

Your MD might be a bit over-cautious on this one - but better that than blowing off symptoms. And it's still winter - people are coming down with all sorts of respiratory crap this winter. So your MD has probably seen (or rather - heard) a pile of respiratory issues with that stethoscope this season.

Do what doc says and feel better sooner.

 

[jjdell]

Dont know if this helps but i used to get, years ago before vaping even existed, pleurisy and sometimes pneumonia. Why i dont know but almost every year. Then i was told about pneumovac, a vaccine for pneumonia and pleurisy type problems. The Doc said some swear by it some say its a waste of time, 50/50. So i said no worries I'll try it. Glad i did, never had it since.

 

[eSMOKA]

I doubt this has anything to do with vaping, however...

Make sure you're cleaning your tanks and replacing your coils and wicks at least weekly. If you are using AIO devices that are hard to clean thoroughly, stop using them. AIO devices that are hard to clean thoroughly are bacteria magnets.

 

[freemind]

I highly doubt vaping has anything to do with it.

I have been a chain vapor for 3 or 4 years, and no issues. I was a 3 PAD smoker before that. Never had an issue.

 

[AlbyKortoona]

I doubt this has anything to do with vaping, however...

Make sure you're cleaning your tanks and replacing your coils and wicks at least weekly. If you are using AIO devices that are hard to clean thoroughly, stop using them. AIO devices that are hard to clean thoroughly are bacteria magnets.

Hmm...I don't think so. Perhaps you could enlighten me on the facts there.

 

[Whiskeywarrior]

Isn't PG antibacterial?

 

[AndriaD]

Isn't PG antibacterial?

Yes... anti-microbial in fact.

Andria

 

[eSMOKA]

Hmm...I don't think so. Perhaps you could enlighten me on the facts there.

No facts because no data. Just pure logic. You don't clean something that contains residue, it's gonna attract or grow some bad things which may or may not be bad to vape. I don't touch AIO vapes.

 

[AlbyKortoona]

As far as I know, vegetable glycerin and propylene glycol are both considered naturally antibacterial, so I'm unclear as to where the "pure logic" applies. Cleaning tanks and replacing coils on a weekly basis sounds a bit arbitrary also...

 

[AndriaD]

As far as I know, vegetable glycerin and propylene glycol are both considered naturally antibacterial, so I'm unclear as to where the "pure logic" applies. Cleaning tanks and replacing coils on a weekly basis sounds a bit arbitrary also...

I dunno about VG, but PG is sprayed via hospitals' and Drs' offices' ventilations systems to retard all microbial growth. Bacterial, viral, fungal, what-have-you. I think somebody is just a clean freak, a bit OCD.

Andria

 

[jjdell]

Cool, im now gonna bathe in PG!

 

[HazyShades]

I went to doctor for a normal visit about a week ago. I talked to her about issues nothing related to me breathing or anything. It was a normal check up type of thing. She did her normal listen to me breath check which doctors do all the time and side my right lung was whizzing and asked if I have been coughing and I said no. I been vaping for 1 and half years chain vaping I guess you can say on 3mg nic. She ordered an x ray and called me with the results after agonizing day and said it was "walking pneumonia". This is weird to me and I don't know if was from vaping or what or if I really got pneumonia when I did not feel sick at all. She also said radiologist are not 100% certain if anything is there. Anyone had anything like this?

Sent using my S7 Edge with Tapatalk app

Greetings Shadow. Vaping isn't the culprit unless you've
been vaping massive amounts of diacetyl. A year and a half of 3mg/ml nicotine is,
even cumulatively,
an insignificant amount of stimulant for most people
and wouldn't have anything to do with a wheeze.

If the x-rays show a dark area in the same place consistently over several months
then you might consider checking it out further, but it's probably just snot moving around.
Vaping will help you expectorate that crap.

However, there is a strain of flu going around that can make you sick for over a month.
Some are calling it the Chemtrail Flu. Watch out for that crap and Vape On.

 

[Zod]

... it was "walking pneumonia". This is weird to me and I don't know if was from vaping or what or if I really got pneumonia when I did not feel sick at all. She also said radiologist are not 100% certain if anything is there. Anyone had anything like this?

Yes, me. I first noticed a wet cough from a chest infection the weekend of Oct 9, 2016. A couple of months later I saw my Dr, who said ride it out. Still hacking away, I returned last week. He tested my lung capacity and exhalation strength, both ok, and he ordered x-rays. I get the results tomorrow.

I've since hit the Ovid medical database and searched for the latest (2015/2016) studies on vaping. In my last search of academic journals I'd found no evidence of harm, but that was a couple of years ago. This time around I found a peer-reviewed study accepted for publication on Feb 2017: "Recent Updates on Electronic Cigarette Aerosol and Inhaled Nicotine Effects on Periodontal and Pulmonary Tissues"

The authors conclude that aerosol nicotine may contribute to lung disease since it undermines the lung's ability to heal via inflammation and via interfering with the critical "myofibroblast differentiation" (the process creating the connective goo in your tissue).

In other words, vaping is hard on tissue and it will keep a lung infection parked on your chest indefinitely.

I'll follow up with the x-ray results ...

 

[HazyShades]

Yes, me. I first noticed a wet cough from a chest infection the weekend of Oct 9, 2016. A couple of months later I saw my Dr, who said ride it out. Still hacking away, I returned last week. He tested my lung capacity and exhalation strength, both ok, and he ordered x-rays. I get the results tomorrow.

I've since hit the Ovid medical database and searched for the latest (2015/2016) studies on vaping. In my last search of academic journals I'd found no evidence of harm, but that was a couple of years ago. This time around I found a peer-reviewed study accepted for publication on Feb 2017: "Recent Updates on Electronic Cigarette Aerosol and Inhaled Nicotine Effects on Periodontal and Pulmonary Tissues"

The authors conclude that aerosol nicotine may contribute to lung disease since it undermines the lung's ability to heal via inflammation and via interfering with the critical "myofibroblast differentiation" (the process creating the connective goo in your tissue).

In other words, vaping is hard on tissue and it will keep a lung infection parked on your chest indefinitely.

I'll follow up with the x-ray results ...

Find out how much nicotine was used in the study you mention.
You may find that the amount of both nicotine and carrier were well above the amounts likely to be used by a vaper in a lifetime.
Anything you inhale other than fresh air will affect your ability to fight infection.
Both VG and PG have been shown to be bateriacides, however chain vaping
will keep your cilia overloaded..too much of anything is too much

 

[AndriaD]

Find out how much nicotine was used in the study you mention.
You may find that the amount of both nicotine and carrier were well above the amounts likely to be used by a vaper in a lifetime.
Anything you inhale other than fresh air will affect your ability to fight infection.
Both VG and PG have been shown to be bateriacides, however chain vaping
will keep your cilia overloaded..too much of anything is too much

That's kinda what I was thinking; really skeptical about this "study" -- wasn't this the one where they found that cigarette smoke killed the cells in like 10 minutes, but vaporized nicotine had little effect?

Some people are more prone to lung problems, particularly smokers and even ex-smokers. That doesn't mean that vaping is the cause of it.

Andria

 

[HazyShades]

That's kinda what I was thinking; really skeptical about this "study" -- wasn't this the one where they found that cigarette smoke killed the cells in like 10 minutes, but vaporized nicotine had little effect?

Some people are more prone to lung problems, particularly smokers and even ex-smokers. That doesn't mean that vaping is the cause of it.

Andria

Hi @AndriaD!
I'm even more skeptical than you if that's even possible..
I note stuff like it's the poster's very first post and he's quoting studies
that mention "academic journals" but neglects to QUOTE which journals and which studies...
Seems pretty ANTZy to me...

To the above I'll add that my ex wife worked at Papanicolau Cancer Research Center
gavaging rats with amounts of alleged toxins under study
which were equivalent to the amounts a normal human would take several lifetimes to
ingest...
AND that whenever a study was coming to a verifiable conclusion either way
the study would be scrapped for some usually ridiculous reason..
Keep in mind that cancer research is 125 Billion dollar industry...

Regards,
Hazy

 

[AndriaD]

Hi @AndriaD!
I'm even more skeptical than you if that's even possible..
I note stuff like it's the poster's very first post and he's quoting studies
that mention "academic journals" but neglects to QUOTE which journals and which studies...
Seems pretty ANTZy to me...

To the above I'll add that my ex wife worked at Papanicolau Cancer Research Center
gavaging rats with amounts of alleged toxins under study
which were equivalent to the amounts a normal human would take several lifetimes to
ingest...
AND that whenever a study was coming to a verifiable conclusion either way
the study would be scrapped for some usually ridiculous reason..
Keep in mind that cancer research is 125 Billion dollar industry...

Regards,
Hazy

What I noticed is how that was that poster's FIRST AND ONLY post at VU. And how he was tossing around a term like "myofibroblast differentiation" which is total greek to any layperson, and then use a word like "goo" to define it? Hmm, say my skeptic-cells; something really fishy there.

What a "study" like this seems to UTTERLY fail to take into consideration is, how would this "myofibroblast differentiation" be under the influence of CIGARETTE SMOKE??? Because nearly all of us, if we weren't inhaling vapor, most of us with at least a little nicotine, we would definitely be inhaling cigarette smoke, I don't give a SHIT how many doctors say "don't do that." The cigarette-smoking addiction is not usually responsive to ANYTHING a doctor says, no matter how many doctors say it, nor how forcefully they say it. Very, VERY few vapers who are vaping nicotine were not first addicted smokers -- we are the precise target audience for the great boon of vaping, we are who vaping was MADE FOR. Without vaping, we would be smoking, and these white-coat demigods/charlatans really need to understand that right down into their TOES.

Andria

 

[XEVU]

What I noticed is how that was that poster's FIRST AND ONLY post at VU. And how he was tossing around a term like "myofibroblast differentiation" which is total greek to any layperson, and then use a word like "goo" to define it? Hmm, say my skeptic-cells; something really fishy there.

What a "study" like this seems to UTTERLY fail to take into consideration is, how would this "myofibroblast differentiation" be under the influence of CIGARETTE SMOKE??? Because nearly all of us, if we weren't inhaling vapor, most of us with at least a little nicotine, we would definitely be inhaling cigarette smoke, I don't give a SHIT how many doctors say "don't do that." The cigarette-smoking addiction is not usually responsive to ANYTHING a doctor says, no matter how many doctors say it, nor how forcefully they say it. Very, VERY few vapers who are vaping nicotine were not first addicted smokers -- we are the precise target audience for the great boon of vaping, we are who vaping was MADE FOR. Without vaping, we would be smoking, and these white-coat demigods/charlatans really need to understand that right down into their TOES.

Andria

Indeed!
I would still be smoking.
Even if vaping is only HALF as bad as smoking cigs that's HALF the shit that isn't going in to my lungs.
I'll take VG and PG any day over tar and the other carcinogens...
Just my opinion and my lungs.
Vape on!


I'm not a feather plucker or a feather plucker's son but I'll pluck a feathered pheasant until the feather plucker comes.

 

[ShadowMelt]

I'm still waiting to go get my second x-ray to see if it went away. I ended up getting sick and she wants me to wait until that clears up. She listened to my lungs again and the whizzing went away

Sent using my S7 Edge with Tapatalk app

 

[The Cromwell]

I do not even rinse my tanks when I recoil.
Must be 6 months since I rinsed my everyday vape Subtank mini.

Of course I do not share my vapes.

 

[HazyShades]

I'm still waiting to go get my second x-ray to see if it went away. I ended up getting sick and she wants me to wait until that clears up. She listened to my lungs again and the whizzing went away

Sent using my S7 Edge with Tapatalk app

Shadow, I had a shadow in one lung for 6 months..making me freak out
when my son was only 5...Took him with me to the doctor's office every month for a pic
until the afternoon when the tech came out from developing the film with a big grin and gave me a thumbs up.
'twas a persistent walking pneumonia...

Don't set up any negative waves, Bro. Go for your 2nd pic in the knowledge that you'll be fine
and stay out from under chemtrails...
Regards,
Hazy

 

[The Cromwell]

I make my own chemtrail.

 

[AndriaD]

I do not even rinse my tanks when I recoil.
Must be 6 months since I rinsed my everyday vape Subtank mini.

Of course I do not share my vapes.

I vape the same flavor all the time, so I see no need whatever to "wash" my atties -- in fact, I use just one Achilles, all the time; the other one hasn't even had a wick in it for probably 6 months. The only time I've ever needed to clean whatever atty I was using was when it gave me a bad taste that I couldn't get rid of with a new coil and wick, so I took it all apart and boiled it for 10 minutes, then reassembled, re-coiled, and re-wicked... problem solved, bad taste gone. I use 85% or more PG, which anti-microbial -- nothing growing in MY Achilles! If and when I ever decide to use my other Achilles, I'll probably boil it first, just because it's been so long since it was used. Ditto that for any of my Kayfuns too, which haven't been used in a couple of years, other than the authentic I just bought.

I do rinse my active Achilles with fresh water whenever I re-wick, and that quite suffices. In between re-wicking, if the gunk is looking bad but I don't have time to do a new wick, I've been known to flush it with plain PG, then refill with juice.

But to return to that probably-bogus "study": none of these "studies", if they do not compare the effects of vaping to the effects of smoking, are worth a good goddamn. The ENTIRE POINT of vaping is to do something safer than smoking, for probably 98% of all vapers everywhere. For that other perhaps 1%-2% who started vaping yet were not smokers, I guess they take their chances... and their chances of remaining healthy as a vaper are a damn sight better than of remaining healthy if they had instead become a smoker. And if vaping did not exist, then surely some of them WOULD HAVE become smokers.

Andria

 

[The Cromwell]

I rinse the RBA deck when re coiling/wicking. And clean the drip tip pretty much daily, but that is it.
I have also used the same DIY flavor in this same tank for almost 2 years. It has probably been rinsed out 3 times?
I rinse the tank out when I mess up and burn a wick.

RDA's I rinse with each rewicking and re-lube Orings with PG on a Q tip.

 

[Zod]

Yeah, Andrea, that was my first post and I gotta say, THANKS for that WARM welcome. I'm touched by your fearless pursuit of knowledge and the health of your fellow vapers, truly.

I linked the phrase "myofibroblast differentiation" to a formal definition and illustration, and provided an accessible alternate phrase for readers who couldn't be bothered to follow the link: "connective goo in your tissue". The paper I cited is the most recently published lit review on the topic. It's not original research:

PubMed (National Library of Medicine), Google-Scholar, Scopus, EMBASE, MEDLINE (OVID) and Web of Knowledge databases were searched to identify articles that assessed the effects of e-cig on periodontal and pulmonary health. All levels of available evidence (including in vitro studies, studies in animal models, case reports and case series) were included.​

As for the details of this Highly Suspicious Source, alas, I only provided the full title. If only there was some way of using that title to "search" the Web.

It's yesterday's news that e-cigs are far safer than smoking and nobody here needs to hear it. Save it for policy lobbying.

For the last five days I've been vaping a 50% stronger nicotine (a mix of 6mg and 12mg) and my hacking has decreased. It's likely the same amount of nicotine in my system as I haven't experienced cravings, but the difference: I'm spraying my lung tissue with nicotine less frequently. What I want to underscore here is that a high FREQUENCY of tissue exposure to low-nicotine juice could well interrupt more cellular healing events than a less frequently-vaped but higher-nicotine juice. The folks with the PhDs don't know yet.

 

[AndriaD]

For the last five days I've been vaping a 50% stronger nicotine (a mix of 6mg and 12mg) and my hacking has decreased. It's likely the same amount of nicotine in my system as I haven't experienced cravings, but the difference: I'm spraying my lung tissue with nicotine less frequently. What I want to underscore here is that a high FREQUENCY of tissue exposure to low-nicotine juice could well interrupt more cellular healing events than a less frequently-vaped but higher-nicotine juice. The folks with the PhDs don't know yet.

I'm not sure who "Andrea" is, but I suspect this is true; this is the major reason I've never gone for the modern sub-ohm craze, but stay with a very-tight-draw RDA that provides excellent flavor at 9-10 watts, with my 85% PG ejuice -- I have asthma, so can't handle the huge amount of vapor that seems currently to be the fad -- the less ejuice I vaporize and inhale, the better for my asthma, and I can easily verify this on days when I vape more than usual -- I'm pretty much ok with about 5ml per day, but if I start getting close to 10ml per day, as I often used at first, with Kayfuns, then I get very wheezy and cloggy and find it hard to cough up what I can definitely feel in my lungs.

I've found the amount of nicotine to be largely irrelevant in almost all respects. Although withdrawing from WTA was rather challenging and required 15 months, dropping nicotine from 10mg to 3mg over about 9 months' time was about as hard as rolling off a log. I didn't find 10mg nicotine to bother my lungs particularly, though WTA did seem to burden them more heavily than plain nicotine; I first started lowering from 10mg because of my Achilles RDA, which provides really excellent TH; when I found how easy it was to drop to 9mg and 8mg, I decided to continue dropping it down to my current 3mg in order to make my nicotine freezer-stash last longer.

Part of the constriction of asthma is due to inflammation, and I definitely feel more constriction if I vape more ejuice than normal, but at 3mg, I doubt if the nicotine is the reason for that inflammation. I suspect it's just the irritating/drying nature of PG, yet if I vape a lot of VG (anything more than 15%), then it coats the airways so heavily, the constriction is even worse, and definitely more palpable -- it feels like a hairball in there that I can't get rid of.

The major problem, always, is that those PhD people don't bother comparing the effects of vaping with the effects of smoking -- and that is really all that matters, to those who need to get away and keep away from cigarettes; overstating any negative effects of vaping is likely to perpetuate smoking, which is the REAL killer. So yes, as an asthmatic, I do find there are some drawbacks to vaping, on the state of my asthma -- in fact, my asthma has actually worsened since I switched to vaping. Is that sufficient cause to give up vaping and go back to smoking? Not on your or anybody's life. Although it's true that death from asthma does still happen, it is FAR less likely than death from cancer or COPD if one is a smoker.

Andria

 

[HazyShades]

Yeah, Andrea, that was my first post and I gotta say, THANKS for that WARM welcome. I'm touched by your fearless pursuit of knowledge and the health of your fellow vapers, truly.

I linked the phrase "myofibroblast differentiation" to a formal definition and illustration, and provided an accessible alternate phrase for readers who couldn't be bothered to follow the link: "connective goo in your tissue". The paper I cited is the most recently published lit review on the topic. It's not original research:

PubMed (National Library of Medicine), Google-Scholar, Scopus, EMBASE, MEDLINE (OVID) and Web of Knowledge databases were searched to identify articles that assessed the effects of e-cig on periodontal and pulmonary health. All levels of available evidence (including in vitro studies, studies in animal models, case reports and case series) were included.​

As for the details of this Highly Suspicious Source, alas, I only provided the full title. If only there was some way of using that title to "search" the Web.

It's yesterday's news that e-cigs are far safer than smoking and nobody here needs to hear it. Save it for policy lobbying.

For the last five days I've been vaping a 50% stronger nicotine (a mix of 6mg and 12mg) and my hacking has decreased. It's likely the same amount of nicotine in my system as I haven't experienced cravings, but the difference: I'm spraying my lung tissue with nicotine less frequently. What I want to underscore here is that a high FREQUENCY of tissue exposure to low-nicotine juice could well interrupt more cellular healing events than a less frequently-vaped but higher-nicotine juice. The folks with the PhDs don't know yet.

Sarcasm will get you nowhere..Since I'm not as nice as my friend Andria
I want you to :
a. State your credentials
b. Tell me if you know what citing a scientific paper means.

You've linked to a summary of an article, NOT to an actual study
AND you've interpreted said summary as if you were qualified to do so.
However, the linked to article does not in any way support you findings.

My opinion as a lay person with MD's and lab techs in my immediate family
AND as a long time vaper
is that you are either an ANTZ fear monger which we get MANY of
or a vaper trying to sound smarter than you are.

 

[HazyShades]

I've found the amount of nicotine to be largely irrelevant in almost all respects

I've found, as a vaper and I don't pretend to have any authority beyond personal experience,
that a high percentage of VG has been the only variable significant to breathing difficulty.

Nicotine is a stimulant. If you state that using it gives you hypertension
or other cardiovascular problems I'll agree. But that isn't what was stated.
What was stated isn't conclusive evidence of anything.

 

[AndriaD]

I've found, as a vaper and I don't pretend to have any authority beyond personal experience,
that a high percentage of VG has been the only variable significant to breathing difficulty.

Nicotine is a stimulant. If you state that using it gives you hypertension
or other cardiovascular problems I'll agree. But that isn't what was stated.
What was stated isn't conclusive evidence of anything.

Yes, more VG definitely causes me a lot more breathing difficulty. But, I did find that WTA seemed to make the wheezing a bit worse, and as I slowly, gradually dropped it, my breathing slowly, gradually, got better. The one statement he made with which I can totally agree is that less exposure to vaporized ejuice is better than more exposure. I believe this will be made clearer and clearer, with all these people huffing huge amounts of ejuice daily with the modern hardware.

The funny thing about nicotine is that yes, it's a stimulant... which has the paradoxical effect of calming you, due to its ability to organize neurotransmitters... much like Ritalin or Adderall for ADHD. And though it's true that nicotine *can* be vasoconstrictive, it can also have just the opposite, paradoxical effect. It's a very interesting "drug" which hasn't been studied *nearly* enough, because until recently, it was tied to tobacco, which became the public health scapegoat and whipping boy. The jury is most definitely still OUT on nicotine, and may not be IN for many years or decades, though it's beginning to be quite apparent that nicotine is not nearly the Bad Guy it has been thought to be, for so long.

Andria

 

[HazyShades]

Yes, more VG definitely causes me a lot more breathing difficulty. But, I did find that WTA seemed to make the wheezing a bit worse, and as I slowly, gradually dropped it, my breathing slowly, gradually, got better. The one statement he made with which I can totally agree is that less exposure to vaporized ejuice is better than more exposure. I believe this will be made clearer and clearer, with all these people huffing huge amounts of ejuice daily with the modern hardware.

The funny thing about nicotine is that yes, it's a stimulant... which has the paradoxical effect of calming you, due to its ability to organize neurotransmitters... much like Ritalin or Adderall for ADHD. And though it's true that nicotine *can* be vasoconstrictive, it can also have just the opposite, paradoxical effect. It's a very interesting "drug" which hasn't been studied *nearly* enough, because until recently, it was tied to tobacco, which became the public health scapegoat and whipping boy. The jury is most definitely still OUT on nicotine, and may not be IN for many years or decades, though it's beginning to be quite apparent that nicotine is not nearly the Bad Guy it has been thought to be, for so long.

Andria

Ah but WTA isn't pure nicotine..as such it would affect your asthma...there's solids/alkaloids floating around in there that aren't nicotine.
As far as agreeing that less is better than more
I've stated elsewhere and so have you
that fresh air is best.

Yes, subohming is overkill and unnecessary.

 

[AndriaD]

Ah but WTA isn't pure nicotine..as such it would affect your asthma...there's solids/alkaloids floating around in there that aren't nicotine.
As far as agreeing that less is better than more
I've stated elsewhere and so have you
that fresh air is best.

Yes, subohming is overkill and unnecessary.

Over at ECF, in their library article about WTA, there was mention that it *may* contain "nitrosamines"... which may be the reason that someone with already-compromised lungs might find it more challenging than vaping plain nicotine. You could be right about about some solids in it; some of the WTA I used was very cloudy and murky... but the superior WTA products -- those from AromaEjuice and the now-defunct WholeCig -- are generally as clear as nicotine. But all WTA causes a good deal of coil and wick gunking, so it very clearly doesn't vaporize as cleanly as nicotine. That, and the higher addictive potential (compared to plain nicotine) is why I always advise that if one doesn't truly NEED it in order to prevent returning to smoking, one should definitely leave it alone. Compared to smoking, it is most definitely the lesser evil... but it's a can of worms that can be rather difficult to handle, once opened, and can be quite challenging to get closed.

Andria

 

[Zod]

Sarcasm will get you nowhere..Since I'm not as nice as my friend Andria
I want you to :
a. Your credentials
b. Tell me if you know what citing a scientific paper means.

You've linked to a summary of an article, NOT to an actual study
AND you've interpreted said summary as if you were qualified to do so.
However, the linked to article does not in any way support you findings.

My opinion as a lay person with MD's and lab techs in my immediate family
AND as a long time vaper
is that you are either an ANTZ fear monger which we get MANY of
or a vaper trying to sound smarter than you are.

I've a Masters in Information that probably required citing somewhere in the region of 1,000 sociology papers over the 16-course load.

Two years ago I needed to nail down current research on the safety of vaping since I was making a hard push at a retirement home to allow a family member to vape. I used my wife's university access to track down and read the relevant scholarly papers, which would otherwise have cost me $40 a pop. The big finds from my 2015 study were three 2014 literature reviews, which between them covered the research to that point. I even emailed Dr. Farsalinos, to ask if he knew of any work being down on Alzheimers and e-cigarettes, specifically; he wrote back to say he was confident, no, he'd know about it, but there was evidence that nicotine was beneficial for Alzheimers (fyi, it targets the same receptor as the anti-Alzheimers drug Aricept, stimulating cells that would otherwise atrophy into plaque; however, other studies demonstrate that nicotine stimulates the growth of "tangles" in the brain, which is half the fight).

As I mentioned above, I found zero evidence of harm until recently when I was motivated by my own fucked up lungs to see if anything new had appeared, and lo and behold ...

 

[HazyShades]

all WTA causes a good deal of coil and wick gunking, so it very clearly doesn't vaporize as cleanly as nicotine.

Enough said.
Good to cross swords with you, Andria.
I'll leave you to argue with the rest of the doctors..

 

[Whiskey]

My opinion as a lay person with MD's and lab techs in my immediate family
AND as a long time vaper
is that you are either an ANTZ fear monger which we get MANY of
or a vaper trying to sound smarter than you are.

Yea that
I'd bet money on it

 

[Zod]

Yea that
I'd bet money on it

You're on. Does CDN $1,000 sound good to you?

I'll propose these terms: I provide a copy of my email exchange with Dr. Farsalinos, the names of the three 2014 lit reviews I discovered, and a selfie dated tomorrow at 10:20am of my doctor and I holding an x-ray of my lungs between us.

We can exchange email addresses via the moderator for the funds transfer.

 

[The Cromwell]

Vaping does not work for everyone folks.
People react differently to different things.
Penicillin for instance can save your life or kill you.

For myself some ingredients in flavorings cause me major mouth and throat inflammation along with sore lungs. 1 day of vaping the wrong juice will do it to me. Takes 3-4 days to recover.
quite painful. I have no known allergies to any medicines or food stuffs.
I carefully DIY with flavorings that I have cautiously tried out.
And no it is not PG.
I toss about 1/2 or more of the flavorings I try.

Had I not found a gas station Clayton brand tobacco juice I could vape I would still be smoking.
I was doing DIY within 30 days of starting vaping over 2 years ago.
It was the only way I would still be vaping instead of smoking.

 

[2WhiteWolves]

You're on. Does CDN $1,000 sound good to you?

I'll propose these terms: I provide a copy of my email exchange with Dr. Farsalinos, the names of the three 2014 lit reviews I discovered, and a selfie dated tomorrow at 10:20am of my doctor and I holding an x-ray of my lungs between us.

We can exchange email addresses via the moderator for the funds transfer.

As far as I know, you will not be aloud to take a pic of your x-ray.... wouldn't allow it. I wanted to take a pic of the x-ray, he said No. Maybe your Dr will be different.

 

[The Cromwell]

Doctors are required to provide you with a copy of ALL your medical records upon request. In the USA at least.

I know I have done it a few times when relocating to a different area so I could give them to whatever doctor I went to see there.

 

[2WhiteWolves]

Yes, I know that. But, to take a pic with the Dr and the x-ray is different.

 

[The Cromwell]

Yes, I know that. But, to take a pic with the Dr and the x-ray is different.

A picture maybe, but you should be able to get a copy of the Xray.

I have a folder of Xrays and some CD's with Cat scan images on them.
I have degenerative disc disease.

 

[Zod]

What the hell kind of community is this?

 

[2WhiteWolves]

A picture maybe, but you should be able to get a copy of the Xray.

I have a folder of Xrays and some CD's with Cat scan images on them.
I have degenerative disc disease.

Zod said this:
"a selfie dated tomorrow at 10:20am of my doctor and I holding an x-ray of my lungs between us."

That is what I'm talking about. A pic with Dr, Zod, and x-ray. I'm not talking about copy of x-ray and getting a pic of that. He can do whatever the hell he wants to do with his copy of x-ray.

 

[The Cromwell]

somewhat dysfunctional.
But mostly OK.

 

[Zod]

A picture maybe, but you should be able to get a copy of the Xray.

I have a folder of Xrays and some CD's with Cat scan images on them.
I have degenerative disc disease.

I'm sorry to hear that.
My doctor's pretty mellow, I doubt he'd have a problem with a selfie (though for privacy I wouldn't include our faces).

 

[HazyShades]

Yes, I know that. But, to take a pic with the Dr and the x-ray is different.

My old lady's doc gives her a CD with the pics on it.

 

[HazyShades]

What the hell kind of community is this?

It is a vaping community which has seen and dealt with dudes like you many times.

LOL, This is not ECF.

Try them, maybe they'll play along with you.
https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/

I suggest that if you're paranoid of what vaping nicotine might do to you
the best alternative is to quit cold turkey.

BTW, that gambler that you want to bet money and swap pics with is a moderator on sabbatical

See ya.