gauges to try? (316L twisted pair, single coil RTA MTL)

Discussion in 'New Builders Corner' started by DudeMan, Nov 12, 2019.

  1. DudeMan

    DudeMan New Member

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    howdy folks,

    new to vaping. i'm going with a 'Berserker V1.5 MINI MTL RTA' tank, on top of an iStick Pico (75W) with sammy 25R battery.

    from looking at mouth to lung builds, i'm leaning toward higher-ish resistance, lower wattage. .75Ω - 1.4Ω @ <20w
    twisted pairs seem like they would have good surface area, and not hard to make.

    i'm looking at 316L stainless steel wire from Kbee on ebay. not sure which gauges to try. :confused: any suggestions?

    i have looked at https://www.steam-engine.org/coil (thanks whoever linked to this!) 28 to 32 gauge?

    cheers :cheers:
    /DudeMan
     
  2. MyMagicMist

    MyMagicMist Platinum Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee

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    You may even want to try 26 awg. It works up rather nicely for plain old twisted wire coils.

    If you go for an inner diameter of 3 mm in the coil you'll need 21 wraps to get .75Ω & 40 to get 1.4Ω.

    2 mm ID requires 54 wraps for 1.4Ω & 28 wraps for .75Ω. I would avoid 2 mm for 1.4Ω with 26 awg though as that becomes too massive to be feasible really, even at .75 it is a bit much. You might try that with 28 awg.

    .75Ω for 28 awg at 3 mm ID takes 14 wraps which is hedging mass wise. 1.4Ω with 28 awg at 3 mm ID takes 26 wraps.

    Now, if you're using regulated mods then mass kind of becomes a bit irrelevant. More likely than not in that case you'll also be using dual cell batteries. That kind of set up can handle pushing more mass.

    I sometimes use twisted Stainless 26 awg but build to .3Ω to .5Ω on a single cell mech. It does alright giving me about 2/3 days use off a charge. That's 26 awg twisted wrapped 8 times around 3 mm for .3Ω & 14 wraps for .5Ω. More than naught though I keep it simpler and use single strand no twisting 26 awg for .5Ω at 7 wraps over 3 mm, .3Ω at 4 wraps, or as I got currently .45Ω at 6 wraps. It does rather well too. :)

    Keep in mind a simple mnemonic, mass and mechs don't mix. :) It can "work" but it's not usually something you rave about.

    By the by, I'm not great expert coil builder. This is just a sharing of my general experience. @Shredtravolta or @raymo2u are probably some of the better master coil builders. They can likely offer better guidance than myself and will now pop in eventually. :)
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
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  3. nadalama

    nadalama Senior Moderator Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    I think in the range of wire you'd want to use in a Berserker Mini, your best bet will be 26 or 28 ga round.

    Personally I have never been fond of twisted - seems to spit and pop a lot, plus you have such limited space in the Berserker, to get the coil up above 0.7 ohms, plain round may be the only way to do it.

    30 ga is a little hard to work with on its own, in my opinion. 26 or 28 will give you a coil that has some substance, won't pull all out of shape when you go to wick it, and will last a reasonable length of time provided you don't shock it with 75 watts of power.

    I'd stick with N80, too, provided you aren't sensitive to nickel. N80 wire's resistance is sort of in the middle of resistance range, between Kanthal on the high end and Stainless Steel on the low end, but it ramps up faster than Kanthal and to me, that makes it much more pleasant to use.

    Seems like I also remember you want to stay at about 2.5mm for the Berserker. It's tiny in there.
     
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  4. Wb80

    Wb80 -DIY-demon- VU Donator Gold Contributor

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    26 or 28g. 2.5mm id. The deck is tight on the 1.5. But i like it. It is verry tight mtl
     
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  5. DudeMan

    DudeMan New Member

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    thank you everyone!

    your input and time is much appreciated. :)

    interesting. i plan on doing a lot of experimenting. will definitely make some simple round coils of varying sizes/lengths.

    Kbee has a 4 pack of 24, 26, 28, 30. i'm going to get 32 as well just to try it (twisted).

    i appreciate the info. SS being the safest, i am starting there.

    i have a drill index (standard) i plan on using for wrapping the coils. so it might end up being something other than metric. :eek:
    thanks for everything nadalama. :)

    noted, and thanks. :)

    cheers :vino:
    /DudeMan
     
  6. Anibird

    Anibird Platinum Contributor Member For 1 Year Reddit Exile

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    Gonna jump in here. What's the easiest way to twist the wires? I have some ss that's very thin so I think I should twist it to make it usable. Anyone have any tips on twisting?
     
  7. DudeMan

    DudeMan New Member

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    i plan on using a cordless drill. loop a length in half, then hook it on an S hook on my workbench. twist the end and place it in the drill chuck. then spin the drill. that way you don't need equal lengths of wire.

    i've seen youtube videos of people using pen caps if you don't own a drill.
     
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  8. Anibird

    Anibird Platinum Contributor Member For 1 Year Reddit Exile

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    Guess I'll check some vids cause I don't own a drill. I'm not allowed to use power tools :D
     
  9. DudeMan

    DudeMan New Member

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    there are hand crank drills you know. ;)
     
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  10. Anibird

    Anibird Platinum Contributor Member For 1 Year Reddit Exile

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    No I didn't know. Guess I need to look into them. Thanks!
     
  11. DudeMan

    DudeMan New Member

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    you're welcome.

    hand_drill_IMG_1883.jpg
     
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  12. MrMeowgi

    MrMeowgi The Vapin' Drummer Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    You can use a sharpie and a coffee cup also. Wrap a loop through the finger hole of the cup. Holdnthe loose ends with pliers and spin the crap out of it
     
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  13. MyMagicMist

    MyMagicMist Platinum Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee

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    Got one similar to the style pictured below.

    [​IMG]

    It belonged to Papaw John. He could use it, and go faster than a corded, or battery powered drill. Never got as good with one but do know how to use them. When he took me out to set corner posts for fence he instructed me to always throw in a handful of bent up rusty nails in the post hole prior to setting the post. His dad son of a German immigrant had taught him that, his dad taught him. Simple explanation, "it keeps the bad away."
     
  14. Synphul

    Synphul Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    If doing stainless for mtl, simple round wire like just coil off a spool wrapped into a coil, 26-28ga. If looking to do twisted I'd opt for 28-30ga. Keep in mind mtl uses small puffs, you want the wire to ramp up rather quickly. And cool down quickly as well, thinner gauges work well for that.

    8-9 wraps of 28ga ss316L at 2.5mm id or 7 wraps 28ga ss316L at 3mm id will get you around .70-.75 ohms. The resistance isn't really important on a regulated mod so much as the wattage and wire mass (thickness of wire, amount of wraps. Overall metal that needs to be heated). 6-7 wraps 3mm id of 28ga ss316L twisted would get you around 0.5-0.55 ohms. 6-7 wraps of 3mm id ss316L 30ga twisted (2 strands) would be around .7 to .75 ohms.

    Not my image, just one I grabbed online and this says it's triple strand twisted. It still shows a fairly snug twist if you decide to go that route. A lot of times I see people starting out doing twisted and they're so loose they begin coming apart, unwinding. Large gaps between each overlapping strand. They work better when they're twisted up tighter and hold their shape.

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. DudeMan

    DudeMan New Member

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    many thanks Synphul. i'm going to start with simple round coils as you and others have suggested in 26, and 28ga. will be using temperature control, so i hear you on the mass being important for quick ramp up/cool down.

    plan on starting with lower wattage and temps, then slowly ramp up to find what works.

    thanks again.
    /DudeMan
     
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  16. gbalkam

    gbalkam Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee Reddit Exile

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    I dont think that RTA Mini will hold 2 *or even 1* 3.0mmid coil, they are pretty tight to work in. Prob 2.0 x2. For flavor a simple 1 core clapton. For low wattage and decent flavor. 28ga core would do and easier to work with than a 30ga core.
     
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  17. DudeMan

    DudeMan New Member

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    it IS small in there. smaller than i pictured in my head.
    first wire, 26AWG i wound onto a 7/64" (2.78mm) bit. came out to .53Ω, but after some use settled out at .58Ω.
    been working really well @ 18w with temperature control between 240°-300°F

    when i re-wick and have better lighting, i'll post pics, # of windings etc.

    cheers everyone :cheers:

    [edit for wire size]
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2019
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