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How will the new FDA crap affect diy-ers?

Paratech

I forgot
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It is sad that I just had to let go of yet another vape supplier.
VaporBeast now requires you to sign a document with the intent to verify age AS WELL AS a photo copy of your drivers license.
I have no trouble signing the document (after reading it there is NO legaleeze so I'm ok with that) but there is no way in hell I'd email a copy of my drivers license.
Sucks because I liked them.
They got my order right every time, shipped quickly, emailed tracking number, and all the things I like about suppliers.
On to the next one I suppose.
Below is a copy/paste of the email.

Thank you for your order. Due to current FDA Regulations classifying vapor products as tobacco products, as a retailer we are required under CFR21 Part 1140.14 to verify that the purchaser is over the age of 18.
Additionally due to the tobacco related state laws, we must also verify that the purchaser is over the legal age in their state of residence to purchase tobacco products.
In many cases this is over 18 years of age.
In an effort to complete your purchase, please fill out and return the attached age attestation form, along with a photo of your ID.
After we receive the signed form and ID, it will be reviewed prior to your order being released.
We thank you for your cooperation and apologize for the inconvenience.

(attach age attestation form)

Vapor Beast Cito Hitson | Loss Prevention / Vape Tech
Toll Free 1-877-821-6062
2544 Campbell Place #125 | Carlsbad, CA 92009
P 877.821.6062 | F 888.893.8028

Below is a copy/paste of the body of the contents of the form they want signed.

DATE ____________________________
I, _____________________________, hereby attest that I am ________ years old, which is over the legal
age to purchase vapor products in my state of residence and confirm that I authorize the release of
order _____________________.
Attached is a photo of my identification for authentication review by VaporBeast.com
For California: Attached is a copy of my identification and my billing address matches my
identification.
Note: Valid forms of government ID include State issued Driver License, State issued identification
card, passport, alien registration card, immigrant visa or Military Identification.
Signature: ___________________________________
 

AndriaD

Yes, I DO wear a mask! I'm vaccinated, too!
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Member For 5 Years
It is sad that I just had to let go of yet another vape supplier.
VaporBeast now requires you to sign a document with the intent to verify age AS WELL AS a photo copy of your drivers license.
I have no trouble signing the document (after reading it there is NO legaleeze so I'm ok with that) but there is no way in hell I'd email a copy of my drivers license.
Sucks because I liked them.
They got my order right every time, shipped quickly, emailed tracking number, and all the things I like about suppliers.
On to the next one I suppose.
Below is a copy/paste of the email.

Thank you for your order. Due to current FDA Regulations classifying vapor products as tobacco products, as a retailer we are required under CFR21 Part 1140.14 to verify that the purchaser is over the age of 18.
Additionally due to the tobacco related state laws, we must also verify that the purchaser is over the legal age in their state of residence to purchase tobacco products.
In many cases this is over 18 years of age.
In an effort to complete your purchase, please fill out and return the attached age attestation form, along with a photo of your ID.
After we receive the signed form and ID, it will be reviewed prior to your order being released.
We thank you for your cooperation and apologize for the inconvenience.

(attach age attestation form)

Vapor Beast Cito Hitson | Loss Prevention / Vape Tech
Toll Free 1-877-821-6062
2544 Campbell Place #125 | Carlsbad, CA 92009
P 877.821.6062 | F 888.893.8028

Below is a copy/paste of the body of the contents of the form they want signed.

DATE ____________________________
I, _____________________________, hereby attest that I am ________ years old, which is over the legal
age to purchase vapor products in my state of residence and confirm that I authorize the release of
order _____________________.
Attached is a photo of my identification for authentication review by VaporBeast.com
For California: Attached is a copy of my identification and my billing address matches my
identification.
Note: Valid forms of government ID include State issued Driver License, State issued identification
card, passport, alien registration card, immigrant visa or Military Identification.
Signature: ___________________________________

I would not have a problem with sending in a copy of my DL, but I *would* definitely black out the license number -- they don't need that info.

Andria
 

Artemis

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Member For 5 Years
I wonder if the vendors are going to disclose which verification program they are using. I don't want to be shocked after I order. I think will wait longer until the vendors get their shit together.
 

Ablonz

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I don't see how that would make a difference. From what I understand, the FDA has made it clear that if you intend to use anything in an e-cigarette, it becomes a 'tobacco product'. The 'intent' is the key, not how it's marketed. So things like cotton, wire, flavorings, etc. only become 'tobacco products' once you state your intention of using them in a vaporizer.
Well, could be like Hillary and say that you did not intend for it to happen that way.......You should be forgiven then.
 

Huckleberried

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At least one DIY vendor has been selling candy making supplies for a bit. I think it's OSDIY. Is a good move on their part.
 

Artemis

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Well I'm not happy at all with the age verification. I have been hit twice in my life already with my identity being stolen. Looks like I might have to ditch all the online shit and go locally for coils.
 

Huckleberried

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Well I'm not happy at all with the age verification. I have been hit twice in my life already with my identity being stolen. Looks like I might have to ditch all the online shit and go locally for coils.
To my understanding, at least, shops aren't able to make them anymore. Maybe that's just if they install them. Hmmm. Not sure about that part, is worth looking into, I suppose.
 

Artemis

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Member For 5 Years
I should have said premade coils such as Triton 2 minis. I am making my own coils now. Not the greatest but it will do for now. I do use tanks when I exit the house. I don't trust my rebuildable tanks at all. I'll figure it out.
 

mattdarat

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Member For 4 Years
I will just enter my 2 cents. If an item is marketed at vaping they can and will ban it. Take kanthal wire, toaster manufacturers use this in toasters and if i am not mistaken a heavier Guage is used on electric driers. If a hobby shop sells it for diy repair on a smoking model train it's not regulated. If a vape shop sells it it can now be considered a tobacco product. No not everything will be considered tobacco unless it is sold as such. As far as nicotine that is not a controlled substance as of yet and has other purposes. This will be a regulation nightmare for the FDA and i can only assume that the regulations will not and cannot be enforced unless vendors are knowingly marketing their products as vaping products. Even mods can be made to be variable volt/watt flashlights with a little 510 threaded light bulb or attachment to accept a light bulb. What the end consumer does with it is entirely up to them. Vaping in and of itself was originally comprised of multiple parts that were never intended for this use. Tobacco is tobacco and this other stuff is not.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
 

Huckleberried

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Seems to me, that even though they're trying to send us back to 2007... thanks to those before us, we got to where we are. We will again, somehow.

I do not envy the mountains of paperwork they've created for themselves.
I should have said premade coils such as Triton 2 minis. I am making my own coils now. Not the greatest but it will do for now. I do use tanks when I exit the house. I don't trust my rebuildable tanks at all. I'll figure it out.
Trust in the force, young Jedi.
129fs238648.gif
If those are doing ok for you at home for hours, or days, without issue, they'll be fine out of home, too. I understand.
 

AndriaD

Yes, I DO wear a mask! I'm vaccinated, too!
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I will just enter my 2 cents. If an item is marketed at vaping they can and will ban it. Take kanthal wire, toaster manufacturers use this in toasters and if i am not mistaken a heavier Guage is used on electric driers. If a hobby shop sells it for diy repair on a smoking model train it's not regulated. If a vape shop sells it it can now be considered a tobacco product. No not everything will be considered tobacco unless it is sold as such. As far as nicotine that is not a controlled substance as of yet and has other purposes. This will be a regulation nightmare for the FDA and i can only assume that the regulations will not and cannot be enforced unless vendors are knowingly marketing their products as vaping products. Even mods can be made to be variable volt/watt flashlights with a little 510 threaded light bulb or attachment to accept a light bulb. What the end consumer does with it is entirely up to them. Vaping in and of itself was originally comprised of multiple parts that were never intended for this use. Tobacco is tobacco and this other stuff is not.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Yes, exactly, and I maintain that IT IS NONE OF THEIR DAMN BUSINESS what people buy things FOR, and for them to act as though it is their business, that's just plain fascist totalitarianism, and I WILL NOT HAVE IT, I will not abide it, I will not be a party to it, and I certainly will not be bossed around by it.

To my mind, the definition of civil disobedience is, do what you will if it harms no one (or even if there is harm, but harm only to oneself), and there is no need whatsoever to broadcast at large what one intends to do. This has been going on for decades now with rolling papers and certain types of pipes, and will doubtless continue for those items, and now also vape items. Just because some stuffed shirts think they have the right to dictate the morality and behavior of everyone at large, does NOT make it so.

But in order to play this game, one must be self-sufficient -- you must have a stockpile of nicotine in the freezer and learn to make your own ejuice; you need to learn to make your own coils -- none of it is rocket surgery; all parts are very simple skills that anyone can learn, with a little initiative and effort.

unjustlaws.jpg

Andria
 

Paratech

I forgot
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Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
It is sad that I just had to let go of yet another vape supplier.
VaporBeast now requires you to sign a document with the intent to verify age AS WELL AS a photo copy of your drivers license.
I have no trouble signing the document (after reading it there is NO legaleeze so I'm ok with that) but there is no way in hell I'd email a copy of my drivers license.
Sucks because I liked them.
They got my order right every time, shipped quickly, emailed tracking number, and all the things I like about suppliers.
On to the next one I suppose.
Below is a copy/paste of the email.

Thank you for your order. Due to current FDA Regulations classifying vapor products as tobacco products, as a retailer we are required under CFR21 Part 1140.14 to verify that the purchaser is over the age of 18.
Additionally due to the tobacco related state laws, we must also verify that the purchaser is over the legal age in their state of residence to purchase tobacco products.
In many cases this is over 18 years of age.
In an effort to complete your purchase, please fill out and return the attached age attestation form, along with a photo of your ID.
After we receive the signed form and ID, it will be reviewed prior to your order being released.
We thank you for your cooperation and apologize for the inconvenience.

(attach age attestation form)

Vapor Beast Cito Hitson | Loss Prevention / Vape Tech
Toll Free 1-877-821-6062
2544 Campbell Place #125 | Carlsbad, CA 92009
P 877.821.6062 | F 888.893.8028

Below is a copy/paste of the body of the contents of the form they want signed.

DATE ____________________________
I, _____________________________, hereby attest that I am ________ years old, which is over the legal
age to purchase vapor products in my state of residence and confirm that I authorize the release of
order _____________________.
Attached is a photo of my identification for authentication review by VaporBeast.com
For California: Attached is a copy of my identification and my billing address matches my
identification.
Note: Valid forms of government ID include State issued Driver License, State issued identification
card, passport, alien registration card, immigrant visa or Military Identification.
Signature: ___________________________________

So today I received another email from VaporBeast.
It was short and to the point but here is the important part of it;

"As of yesterday, we implemented an online verification system. Using this, you will not have to send a photo ID. If the online verification system is unable to verify you, only then will we request an ID.
Have a Vapetastic Day! We look forward to assisting with your vaping needs in the future."

I then re-ordered to check this out.
My order stated it was in "on hold" status so I entered a chat session with them to clarify.
The following is the important part of that chat;
"It will be on hold until our guy here that handles orders that are on hold verifies everything, then we will release it."
"we just need to go over the order and verify your date of birth that you inputted which will take an hour or so"

With that said, I take back what I said.
I checked my order about an hour later and it had changed from on hold to "Processing"
So it looks like all is back to normal, at least with VaporBeast.
By the way, the only info I entered was my birth date.
Yes, I know providing that info can indeed be considered PII (Personally Identifiable Information just to prevent those that don't know from having to google it) but we already use this as a verification method with most of the vape sites we use.
That doesn't make it any better but it is damn sure better than a photo of my drivers license.
 

mackman

Member For 4 Years
I had just the opposite experience with them. Had been a customer for a number of years and the online verification couldn't verify me. Talked to a very pleasant person who said the owner even couldn't get verified and they could mail me a form to return and blah blah blah...no thanks... I feel for these small business owners, the backbone of our country getting screwed again by gov't regs
 

Johnny Hotsauce

Member For 4 Years
So today I received another email from VaporBeast.
It was short and to the point but here is the important part of it;

"As of yesterday, we implemented an online verification system. Using this, you will not have to send a photo ID. If the online verification system is unable to verify you, only then will we request an ID.
Have a Vapetastic Day! We look forward to assisting with your vaping needs in the future."

I then re-ordered to check this out.
My order stated it was in "on hold" status so I entered a chat session with them to clarify.
The following is the important part of that chat;
"It will be on hold until our guy here that handles orders that are on hold verifies everything, then we will release it."
"we just need to go over the order and verify your date of birth that you inputted which will take an hour or so"

With that said, I take back what I said.
I checked my order about an hour later and it had changed from on hold to "Processing"
So it looks like all is back to normal, at least with VaporBeast.
By the way, the only info I entered was my birth date.
Yes, I know providing that info can indeed be considered PII (Personally Identifiable Information just to prevent those that don't know from having to google it) but we already use this as a verification method with most of the vape sites we use.
That doesn't make it any better but it is damn sure better than a photo of my drivers license.
They didn't ask for the last 4 of your SSN? A lot of online Vape stores are using BlueCheck and BlueCheck requests the last 4 of your SSN.
 

Paratech

I forgot
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They didn't ask for the last 4 of your SSN? A lot of online Vape stores are using BlueCheck and BlueCheck requests the last 4 of your SSN.
They did not.
If they had, I wouldn't have placed my order.
Even just the last 4 is still PII.
With the amount of online vendors available, I don't need to purchase from any that require information that I don't want to share.
That is just me, everyone else can do as they please.
Me, I'll be keeping as much PII to my self as I can.
 

mjag

Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Looks like a lot of the online vendors have figured things out. I did not have to give PII to eciggity and ecigcity and i heard ecig.com has dropped the last 4 digit nonsense as well. Like @Paratech I will not shop at any online vendors that require PII, I like to keep my identity to myself.

Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk
 

hashtagvapemail

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I make and mix my own fluids. How will the FDA regulations affect me on getting my materials? The nicotine, the PG, the VG, all the individual flavor concentrates. I understand all new hardware from August 8th and onward will have to jump through all the stupid hoops to be able to be available on the market and will probably be stupid expensive because of the regulations, but i'm wondering about my juice diy stuff? How will it affect me getting kanthal and everything else? I'm seeing this, that, and the other thing on it, but nothing that really makes sense to me. Call me an idiot, but I don't understand political jargon to save my life. I know this is going to be a huge shit down the throats of ecig users, stores, and manufacturers everywhere. That much is clear, but I'm not seeing how exactly it will affect me when say I need to buy a new mod or tank or my diy fluid stuff.

Edit: I wasn't positive where to post this so I just stuck it here. If a mod says it must be moved then I won't be upset.

For DIY'ers, there is really only one thing to watch out for, and that's regulation around the sale of nicotine, which I don't think is in place at all right now. You will have to nic your own juice, no shop will be able to legally do that for you without becoming a manufacturer and requiring PMTA on your DIY juice.

For the flavorings, most of those are the same as used in cooking, if they really clamp down you may just need to get them from baking sites (since these would not be components since there are no other components sold there and they realistically will not be able to pull off requiring PMTA for vanilla extract as a deemed tobacco product when sold from Williams Sonoma (or where ever, that just came to mind).

DIY will be safe as long as you can get nicotine, because trying to claim all PG or VG based flavors as tobacco products (when sold by retailers that do not sell any other tobacco products) would never stand up in court, in my opinion. And McCormick has much deeper pockets to fight it than most in the vaping business community do. Personally, I would be on the lookout for flavor vendors that are not vape related, and don't advertise as such at all. If you buy vanilla extract from the Publix or Walmart it's not a component, if you buy vanilla extract from your local vape shop, it becomes a component based on my read of what they're saying.

But for the next few years, you won't see any change, things will start to change in spring of 2018, that last six months you'll start to see what this really shakes out to be as companies actually start going through PMTA and others see how they fare, and then make decisions on whether it's worth the cost and risk.
 

AndriaD

Yes, I DO wear a mask! I'm vaccinated, too!
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For DIY'ers, there is really only one thing to watch out for, and that's regulation around the sale of nicotine, which I don't think is in place at all right now. You will have to nic your own juice, no shop will be able to legally do that for you without becoming a manufacturer and requiring PMTA on your DIY juice.

For the flavorings, most of those are the same as used in cooking, if they really clamp down you may just need to get them from baking sites (since these would not be components since there are no other components sold there and they realistically will not be able to pull off requiring PMTA for vanilla extract as a deemed tobacco product when sold from Williams Sonoma (or where ever, that just came to mind).

DIY will be safe as long as you can get nicotine, because trying to claim all PG or VG based flavors as tobacco products (when sold by retailers that do not sell any other tobacco products) would never stand up in court, in my opinion. And McCormick has much deeper pockets to fight it than most in the vaping business community do. Personally, I would be on the lookout for flavor vendors that are not vape related, and don't advertise as such at all. If you buy vanilla extract from the Publix or Walmart it's not a component, if you buy vanilla extract from your local vape shop, it becomes a component based on my read of what they're saying.

But for the next few years, you won't see any change, things will start to change in spring of 2018, that last six months you'll start to see what this really shakes out to be as companies actually start going through PMTA and others see how they fare, and then make decisions on whether it's worth the cost and risk.

Vanilla Extract at the grocery is mostly alcohol though, and also has sugar. Bad choice for vaping!

Andria
 

hashtagvapemail

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OK, so who beside people in the vaping industry are suing? Are any of those places going at it? THAT is why I seriously wonder if any of those things will be involved.

I know we're all pretty well screwed, but I can't imagine that all things vape can be involved without this being even bigger than it already is.

So my take on this from what they've said is that while they can't deem kanthal, they can deem kanthal when they have a reasonable expectation that it will be used as part of an ENDS. Meaning that you can buy cotton, but if you buy cotton from a vape shop it becomes a deemed product;same for the rest.

All of this stuff will have to be purchased from places that don't sell anything vape related in my opinion (although I don't know how much testing you could do on a piece of wire with known material properties, or some cotton). I think that's where the rubber meets the road, the rest of the world won't be affected, just any vape shops, or people who want specific types of wire or cotton that may not be able to purchase it after the two year mark, unless it's been through PMTA.

What I would expect is that you cease to get these smaller items though larger retailers and get them instead from speciality sites that aren't vape related.
 

hashtagvapemail

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Vanilla Extract at the grocery is mostly alcohol though, and also has sugar. Bad choice for vaping!

Andria

Yeah, it was just as an example...definitely a poorly chosen one, but the first that came to mind that I could use to easily illustrate what I think the differences will be and where the defining line in the sand will be.

It's all speculation though, until people start getting fined, they've been pretty loose in their language on a lot of this because ( I think ) they're reaching farther than they legally can and are trying to lord over some real gray areas (like free samples of zero nic juice, or anything zero nic being considered deemed at all) that would be very hard to defend in court based on their definitions and mandate (IMO).
 

hashtagvapemail

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You could do that. But, the regulations are regarding companies, not individuals. So, seeing as how I'm actually a Limited Liability Corporation (LLC), there will be regulations that will apply to me, but not to @raymo2u . Ray is just a guy that makes good quality coils. I'm a company. I foresee Ray making some good money after August 8th... :D
If he's selling then he's liable as a manufacturer if they are sold with the intent to be used for vaping. It doesn't matter to them if you're a large corporation or an unregistered sole proprietor, they'll come after you. The only difference is in the amount they can take from you personally based on the business's status (LLC, Corp, proprietorship whether officially listed with a DBA or not).

I'd be careful and get an LLC at least between you and the world if you're thinking about selling anything related to any of this stuff at all.
 

dave61

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Member For 4 Years
Always keep in mind during prohibition booze was illegal

but you could buy all the sugar,grains and flavorings to make it without restrictions
it will be the same with vaping
 

freemind

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Always keep in mind during prohibition booze was illegal

but you could buy all the sugar,grains and flavorings to make it without restrictions
it will be the same with vaping
And people that say that forget a few things.

Making shine is ILLEGAL. You can make wine, or beer. You can't make spirits, legally.

If you get caught making shine without a license, you will be charged with a felony. You will sit many years in prison for it.
 

mjag

Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
For anyone in S. California there is going to be some get togethers to discuss Prop 56 which is coming up for vote in November, not good news if it passes:

q4D9YIA.png


Here is a cut and paste from this reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/electronic...p_56_tax_ballot_measure_industry_meetings_in/

On November 8th, when Californians vote for the next President, you will also vote on Proposition 56, which increases the tax on cigarettes AND vapor products. This could result in a new tax of 62-69% (or more) on vapor products.

This ballot proposition is not what it appears; government and multi-billion dollar pharmaceutical interests lose money as smoking rates decline. This November, they want to make up the difference by taxing vapor products just like cigarettes, at the cost of Californians’ lives.

The supporters of this initiative are very quick to tell you that the money collected from this tax will ONLY be used to fund anti-smoking programs, healthcare, cancer treatment, and research. The only reason they can get away with saying this is because they are betting on the fact that most voters won’t bother to read the actual initiative text. If you do read it, you’ll find that there are plenty of loopholes allowing that money to be used for completely unrelated things. For example, paying $36 million per year to Attorney General Kamala Harris’s own office to use however she likes. But the worst loophole of all is the one that says if this additional tax results in a decrease in tobacco sales (that’s the goal) and that decrease results in a decrease in sales tax and other money the state gets, like MSA payments, (which it will) then the funds can be used to supplement those losses. Which means the majority of this money will go into the general fund. This shouldn’t come as a surprise though. If you look at California’s past uses of smoking-related tax money, (also supposed to be used for smoking prevention) only 4.3% of it actually goes towards smoking prevention activities and education. The rest goes to the general fund. The California government is addicted to tobacco money, and if and when that money goes away, they’ll sacrifice whatever – or whoever – they have to in order to replace it.

ATTEND ONE OF THE MEETINGS IN THE ABOVE LOCATIONS TO LEARN HOW YOU WILL BE IMPACTED AND HOW YOU MAY HAVE A CHANCE IN PREVENTING PROP 56 FROM GAINING A MAJORITY OF YES VOTES.

If you are a resident in California who is allowed to vote but you are not registered to vote, REGISTER TO VOTE NOW! If you are a business in the vapor industry, ask ALL your customers the same thing! There are no excuses and to be perfectly honest the chances of a "vapor vote" making enough of a difference will DEPEND ENTIRELY ON YOU.
 

dave61

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Member For 4 Years
And people that say that forget a few things.

Making shine is ILLEGAL. You can make wine, or beer. You can't make spirits, legally.

If you get caught making shine without a license, you will be charged with a felony. You will sit many years in prison for it.




Under the law you can make 50 gal a year of shine for your own use under the rules
As far as not vaping because some people decide Im not old enough or free enough
to decide how I want to live.
Maybe Im old but I was actually born when this country was still free and not run by Liberals that decide they know better than I do whats best for me
 

freemind

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Under the law you can make 50 gal a year of shine for your own use under the rules
As far as not vaping because some people decide Im not old enough or free enough
to decide how I want to live.
Maybe Im old but I was actually born when this country was still free and not run by Liberals that decide they know better than I do whats best for me
False.
Federal Distillation Laws
Federal law states that it is legal to own a still of any size. It doesn't matter if you have a 1 gallon still or a 100 gallon still. According to the feds, it is legal to have a still for decoration, distilling water, distilling essential oils, etc. The still does not need to be registered with anyone and no permits are needed as long as it is being used for the aforementioned purposes. However, be advised it is illegal to distill alcohol without having either a "distilled spirits permit" or a "federal fuel alcohol permit." It does not matter if the alcohol is for personal use only, not for sale, etc.

A common misconception is that only stills 1 gallon and smaller are legal. This is not true. Actual law merely states that stills 1 gallon or less that are not being used to distill alcohol are not tracked by the TTB (see more on this below. It is perfectly legal to own a still larger than 1 gallon so long as it is not being used to distill alcohol or it is permitted to be used for distilling fuel alcohol or spirits.

I've also heard the FALSE line many times about "it's legal for XX gallons a year. Completely false.

Not being an asshole, I'm just tired of this false rumor making it's rounds. If anyone ever watched the show moonshiners, you would already have known how wrong those claims are.

It has not been legal to distill spirits in a forever, without proper licensing.
 

dave61

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Member For 4 Years
You are permitted under law to make 100 gal per household member per year too operate tractors or vehicles or machinery
That is under federal law all it takes is a permit to make fuel and usually everyone is accepted
Lets face ity the 10% ethanol in your gas is nothing but shine
 

freemind

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You are permitted under law to make 100 gal per household member per year too operate tractors or vehicles or machinery
That is under federal law all it takes is a permit to make fuel and usually everyone is accepted
Lets face ity the 10% ethanol in your gas is nothing but shine
Actually, it isn't shine. If you drank the ethanol that the distilleries make, you'd be dead. It is REQUIRED as part of the licensing of the distillery, that poison is added to the ethanol to make it undrinkable.

It all seems fairly simple, when one only does a google search to get some half assed info off the net. There are many requirement to that license to distill ethanol for fuel. That's the thing google doesn't tell you, the important details.

The paperwork required, and the inspections you are subject to, will get you nailed if you are skirting the law.

But hey, it's not gonna be me spending 10+ years in prison, so people can do what they want.
 

dave61

Bronze Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Actually, it isn't shine. If you drank the ethanol that the distilleries make, you'd be dead. It is REQUIRED as part of the licensing of the distillery, that poison is added to the ethanol to make it undrinkable.

It all seems fairly simple, when one only does a google search to get some half assed info off the net. There are many requirement to that license to distill ethanol for fuel. That's the thing google doesn't tell you, the important details.

The paperwork required, and the inspections you are subject to, will get you nailed if you are skirting the law.

But hey, it's not gonna be me spending 10+ years in prison, so people can do what they want.


Im not here to argue with you i just tell from first hand experience
As far as googleing it I dont need to I was raised by bootleggers and moonshiners
And for a first time offense its usually 90 days to 6 months if you get caught
And they charge you with tax evasion

It will be the same vape they will get you for tax evasion if they make it illegal

Of course I still have a bathtub and a 49 ford lol
And there are many on here know what the 49 ford was for lol
 

r055co

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I would stock up on NIC and wire for sure, VG,PG and cotton should be OK as they are used in food and beauty. Flavors, like Capella's and Loran's , again, OK. Inported flavors I don't know. I have gone the prepper route and stached devices,batterys, wire, cotton, attys, nic, vg,pg, flavors and anything else I can think of. Hope it helps, but then I don't trust government.

You ar absolutely correct! And that's why the FDA is being sued right now, because of the following shit... How can you say a SS wire tobacco???
How??
Just look at it
Where in the hell do you see tobacco in a SS WIRE??
They are so fucking stupid... So corrupt and so greedy!!!

VAPE ON

Buy all you can while you can :xD:

OK here's my two bits, we're going to get fucked no matter what, even if we are victorious with some wins with the law suits. Vaping has changed (and not for the good) and never will be the same again. Our Corporate controlled oligarchy of a Government will not allow it to prosper, too much of a threat to their masters bottom line. So to be prepared this is what I very highly recommend -

1. Stock up on 100mg Nic PG based Juice in the freezer, this is the weakest link. Stored in the freezer it can last decades. They will come after it and soon, this should be your most important focus at this time

2. Stock up on some RDA's and RTA's, you can find sales of old school devices damn cheap. I've gotten quite a lot for under $10 each, some as low as $3.

4. Get some backups of your favorite Mod's but also get some quality fully Mechanical Mod's, I'd recommend a few tube and a few Parallel Mods. Mechs are damn near bullet proof and if something breaks usually very simple to fix. Regulated Mod's have chips, electronics fail, some sooner than others but ultimately they have a limited life span.

5. Stock up on good quality Wire, some don't think it will be effected and they may be right. But quality wire in the gauges used for Vaping very well may be very difficult to find. I stocked up on it just to be safe.


Premium Vape specific cotton may be difficult to find but I'm not worried, this is at the very bottom of my list. I stick with Koh gen Do so I'm not worried about Cotton at all.
Batteries, they may be regulated a bit more like disclaimers or what not. But the shear amount of devices like R/C, Drone, etc. crowd I'm not stressing about them either
PG, VG and flavoring, not at all. It's food, you can get it pretty much anywhere, I'm not worried.

Vaping is going underground and Black Market, Mechs are easy to make, hell the first Mod's were Modified Flash lights so shit will be available. The regulated devices though will eventually die and will be very expensive and hard to get. This is why I did my homework and jumped head first into the Mech world, actually enjoy the hell out of it to be honest.

Don't stress, prepare and HAMMER YOUR GOVERNMENT REPRESENTATIVES weekly. Tell them you will actively work to remove from office any Representatives who support the FDA and Government actions against Vaping. I may be very cynical about the outcome but I will not roll over and go quietly.

Hope for the best but definitely prepare for the worst.
 
To the best of my knowledge, pg and vg are not considered ENDS by the regulators but liquid nic is. I also saw somewhere that court action on the nicopure suit may be happening sometime this fall. Lets just hope that some sensible judge will rule that these godawful regulations need to be redone.
 

TheRealSean

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Maybe all this shit will just go way in time. If not black market mods, bath tub brew ejuice, you have to know a guy to get a tank, late night nicotine runs across state lines. When Americans are passionate about something and that something is vaping we great creative. History will be made and it will be call The Boston Vape Party.
 

Teresa P

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Maybe all this shit will just go way in time. If not black market mods, bath tub brew ejuice, you have to know a guy to get a tank, late night nicotine runs across state lines. When Americans are passionate about something and that something is vaping we great creative. History will be made and it will be call The Boston Vape Party.
Already been done - but the subject was alcohol, and it was the Prohibition. The results will be the same as soon as the government gets their massive cut and control.
 

Lotus Insane

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Gonna be interesting in 10 years when everybody is walking around with cigalikes and the last of us "Undergrounders" will be walking around with mods, they will look at each other and wisper, "he(she)'s a Mecher, and Undergrounder. I thoughts those people were driven away? Didn't they stand up to the Masters? Shh! We're not suppose to talk about that!" .... I know for a fact we are gonna be looked at fuckin' weird as hell by the sheeple populous in those times...

(sorry a little off topic, just ignore my interjection...)
 

r055co

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Gonna be interesting in 10 years when everybody is walking around with cigalikes and the last of us "Undergrounders" will be walking around with mods, they will look at each other and wisper, "he(she)'s a Mecher, and Undergrounder. I thoughts those people were driven away? Didn't they stand up to the Masters? Shh! We're not suppose to talk about that!" .... I know for a fact we are gonna be looked at fuckin' weird as hell by the sheeple populous in those times...

(sorry a little off topic, just ignore my interjection...)
Fuck'em, I could give a shit. Let them continue to worship Big Brother and live in the Matrix. Some of us value thinking for ourselves and have a clue.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 

AndriaD

Yes, I DO wear a mask! I'm vaccinated, too!
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Fuck'em, I could give a shit. Let them continue to worship Big Brother and live in the Matrix. Some of us value thinking for ourselves and have a clue.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

Absolutely. And the wisdom of my stocking-up has become apparent this pay-period, which is a really tight pay-period due to my husband missing 3 days of work (and thus all the OT for those 2 wks) during the time my mother was dying and getting buried, 2 wks ago, plus the fact that we no longer have her BP card which she let us keep, to subsidize our trips to their house, 45 mins from us, since it was no longer usable after her death, so now we also have to budget all our gasoline into the regular budget -- if I was still smoking, we'd REALLY be hurting; if I was still needing to buy ejuice or pre-made coils, I'd be hurting a little... but since I bought everything I might conceivably need for a really long time, before 8/8, our current constraints aren't that bad -- we paid all the bills and still have a reasonable, if somewhat tighter than usual, budget for groceries, and have a half-tank of gas. And I keep vaping as usual, as I expect to keep doing for the rest of my life.

Andria
 

RatRacer

a touch oɟɟ
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Absolutely. And the wisdom of my stocking-up has become apparent this pay-period, which is a really tight pay-period due to my husband missing 3 days of work (and thus all the OT for those 2 wks) during the time my mother was dying and getting buried, 2 wks ago, plus the fact that we no longer have her BP card which she let us keep, to subsidize our trips to their house, 45 mins from us, since it was no longer usable after her death, so now we also have to budget all our gasoline into the regular budget -- if I was still smoking, we'd REALLY be hurting; if I was still needing to buy ejuice or pre-made coils, I'd be hurting a little... but since I bought everything I might conceivably need for a really long time, before 8/8, our current constraints aren't that bad -- we paid all the bills and still have a reasonable, if somewhat tighter than usual, budget for groceries, and have a half-tank of gas. And I keep vaping as usual, as I expect to keep doing for the rest of my life.

Andria
My condolences on your mum's passing.
 

r055co

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Member For 4 Years
Absolutely. And the wisdom of my stocking-up has become apparent this pay-period, which is a really tight pay-period due to my husband missing 3 days of work (and thus all the OT for those 2 wks) during the time my mother was dying and getting buried, 2 wks ago, plus the fact that we no longer have her BP card which she let us keep, to subsidize our trips to their house, 45 mins from us, since it was no longer usable after her death, so now we also have to budget all our gasoline into the regular budget -- if I was still smoking, we'd REALLY be hurting; if I was still needing to buy ejuice or pre-made coils, I'd be hurting a little... but since I bought everything I might conceivably need for a really long time, before 8/8, our current constraints aren't that bad -- we paid all the bills and still have a reasonable, if somewhat tighter than usual, budget for groceries, and have a half-tank of gas. And I keep vaping as usual, as I expect to keep doing for the rest of my life.

Andria
Sorry about your Mum, I went through my Dad's battle with Cancer and lost him last year. Wiped me out both emotionally and financially so I can relate.

Anyway not a day goes by that I'm not thankful that I stockpiled. Only things I pick up now is items that really peaks my interest. I then throw an item or two maybe to add to the Stash.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 

AndriaD

Yes, I DO wear a mask! I'm vaccinated, too!
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My condolences on your mum's passing.

Sorry about your Mum, I went through my Dad's battle with Cancer and lost him last year. Wiped me out both emotionally and financially so I can relate.

Anyway not a day goes by that I'm not thankful that I stockpiled. Only things I pick up now is items that really peaks my interest. I then throw an item or two maybe to add to the Stash.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

Thx guys. I just keep getting thru each day as best I can, really grateful not to be in any worse financial straits than we are, and also that she's no longer in pain. Diabetes can kiss my ass.

Andria
 

TheRealSean

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Thx guys. I just keep getting thru each day as best I can, really grateful not to be in any worse financial straits than we are, and also that she's no longer in pain. Diabetes can kiss my ass.

Andria
First I have herd of your moms passing. I lost my mother right at three years ago. Yes I admit was a mama boy. Still hurts to this day as much as the day she died. Hang in there and try and keep your spirits up.
 

AndriaD

Yes, I DO wear a mask! I'm vaccinated, too!
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First I have herd of your moms passing. I lost my mother right at three years ago. Yes I admit was a mama boy. Still hurts to this day as much as the day she died. Hang in there and try and keep your spirits up.

It's hard, sometimes. I'm trying as hard as I can not to cry, because of my dehydration/leg cramp problems... but there are times when I can't fight off the "dry sobs." I had a lot of problems with my mother, with our relationship, but stilll... my only mom. It still seems impossible, that she's just gone.

Andria
 

TheRealSean

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Member For 3 Years
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Member For 1 Year
It's hard, sometimes. I'm trying as hard as I can not to cry, because of my dehydration/leg cramp problems... but there are times when I can't fight off the "dry sobs." I had a lot of problems with my mother, with our relationship, but stilll... my only mom. It still seems impossible, that she's just gone.

Well I hope my bring it up didnt ruin the rest of your day. Sometimes as it was for me the kind words from my friends just made it worse. Just answering questions over and over cause her death was sudden. If you feel the need to chat privately just look me up.
 

AndriaD

Yes, I DO wear a mask! I'm vaccinated, too!
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It's so recent, it's rarely out of my thoughts for more than a few seconds at at time, unless I'm sleeping. My dreams have been helter-skelter, not always about her, but just strange and long and intense. I guess it's just part of the process. I can barely drag myself from bed in the morning/noon, but the bladder wants emptying, no matter how much I want unconsciousness. I guess it's a good thing, or I'd just stay comatose.

Andria
 

TheRealSean

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Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
It's so recent, it's rarely out of my thoughts for more than a few seconds at at time, unless I'm sleeping. My dreams have been helter-skelter, not always about her, but just strange and long and intense. I guess it's just part of the process. I can barely drag myself from bed in the morning/noon, but the bladder wants emptying, no matter how much I want unconsciousness. I guess it's a good thing, or I'd just stay comatose.

Andria
Well hang in there.
 

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