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I must preach the gospel of PWM to the masses.

MannyScoot

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So today was fun.

First I had a Corn Snake (which my genius ass thought was a poisonous Cottonmoth) get IN MY FACE as I walked into my room to get some boxers out of the dresser. I notice.. some picture frames on the floor. Wonder what happened? I pick them up to put them back, sit one of my old dog down, go to sit another one do-.. OH FUCK. I was literally face to face with what knocked the frames off, a VERY LARGE, six foot long Corn Snake. Just flicking his tongue at me.

He was adorable, I will say. I would've picked him up and got him out with my bare hands had I known it wasn't poisonous, but sadly he ended up retreating under some furniture and I had to call the cops to remove it.

I had an ENTIRE, NEW TUBE of Epoxy harden fully in the container for no obvious reason. Happened five minutes after opening it, barely got to use ANY of it. At least I got the magnets in.

Then I sat down for SIX FUCKING HOURS, soldering iPWM after iPWM, slowly realizing the horrifying reality that I got a batch of duds. This is the second time in two months, if it happens a third time I'm probably gonna switch my flagship board over to the NLPWM or the BA Silent PWM. I love the iPWM and when you get good ones they work great but, two dud batches in 40 days. Jesus..

I just got it all cleaned up, then my desk fan fails abruptly.

WHY
NLPWM is acting real good after first week...... iPWM even after new pot install is still not hitting constant and build after build, too much messing around with finding coils to finding a good voltage range.

With NLPWM and buttons voltage can be adjusted to the tenths and is very accurate no matter what ohms your coil is at. I'm enjoying the NLPWM waaay better .... Even better than a DNA 250 !!!
NLPwm left
iPWM right
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Mikhail Naumov

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Not hitting constant? What do you mean, I've never had issue out of the iPWM board outside of duds from the retailer, so I'm curious to know what you mean by that.

His silent PWM's and Ant PWM's I've had nothing but amazing luck with.. his iPWM's, well I still have good luck as far as the boards that show up working have continued to work.

The iPWM's have all been hardline accurate for me, RMS PWM and all.

Installing the pot wrong could've burned out a trace or some shit, also there's a TON OF FUSES AND IMPORTANT SHIT around the pot solder terminals, so it's very easy to just, desolder a fuse or some shit because your hand moved a single centimeter. I've now switched to soldering up the wire on the OPPOSITE side of the board where there's minimal components to avoid this issue.
 

Mikhail Naumov

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I'd REALLY like to use some of the newer NLPWM's, but they've been out of stock for like two straight months. Ugh.

Also the NLPWM just has a digital pot, it has almost the same range as an iPWM. Also it's only rated for 30A Cont 60A Pulse, where-as Big Al's board is 60A Cont, 120A pulse. That's another HUGE factor for me. I've been avoiding them because they're so big, have a pre-mounted meter and just generally want you to use fucky actuated buttons. Also the 60A pulse rating is for three seconds. A true pulse is 8-10 seconds. The NLPWM is NOT a high current board.

The NLPWM just looks like a bare minimum, beginner's modding board to me. I've also heard of several of them failing past 45A or so, and the volt meter's on some old ones I've seen randomly just tank and go out. I dislike the idea of a digital pot because it too is something that can fail, but if it fails you could be hitting 1,000W when you think it's around 100W.

This is why I haven't used them as of yet..

Like yeah, they make CLEAN mods, but that's anything that only has a three wire install from the board and mounts onto the side of the box. Outside of that, I personally can't find very many pro's to it.
 
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MannyScoot

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I'd REALLY like to use some of the newer NLPWM's, but they've been out of stock for like two straight months. Ugh.

Also the NLPWM just has a digital pot, it has almost the same range as an iPWM. Also it's only rated for 30A Cont 60A Pulse, where-as Big Al's board is 60A Cont, 120A pulse. That's another HUGE factor for me. I've been avoiding them because they're so big, have a pre-mounted meter and just generally want you to use fucky actuated buttons.

The NLPWM just looks like a bare minimum, beginner's modding board to me. I've also heard of several of them failing past 45A or so, and the volt meter's on some old ones I've seen randomly just tank and go out. I dislike the idea of a digital pot because it too is something that can fail, but if it fails you could be hitting 1,000W when you think it's around 100W.

This is why I haven't used them as of yet..
The iPWM does not function like the NLpwm...... I don't know what version this is, but it kicks ass.....
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ShowerHead

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It's working perfectly.... The guy who built it.... Wasn't that sharp..... All I bought was a new cell (2) cells weren't balanced.... With the new Maxamps works perfect....
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How are you liking the top mount fire button?
 

Mikhail Naumov

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I personally would hate it, as it seems 30mm stuff is as big as he can get away with, and even it seems to be touching the button slightly. I use a lot of atomizers over 30mm, so unless you did it on an N1, I could never use a top mounted button. My shit would obscure it.

Also good the hear the iPWM is working good.

ANNOUNCEMENT:

Big Al is discontinuing the LiPo iPWM board and the LiPo Silent PWM boards in favor of the Ant iPWM (yet to be released on the website, but he has them made and tested. Same features, same everything, just smaller) and the Ant Silent PWM board (50A instead of 60A, but otherwise the same board but smaller, again) will be replacing the Silent PWM board. He is also discontinuing the OKL-T20 board due to a lack of sales.

Very, very soon ALL my iPWM's will be Ant iPWM powered. This means I can put iPWM's in 1590G's, 1590A's and 1550P's without using VERY small batteries. This is great news. The 2S-4S Sled iPWM and Silent PWM boards will be staying.
 

MWorthington

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If you're unsure of taking the gamble on a cheaper setup (SMD has a lot of good setups and a lot of shit ones, you just have to know which ones to buy) and don't need a ton of extra shit, you can get a tried and true, DAMNED good Weller 40W soldering station for around $40 or so. It has a variable dial with a 40W range, a VERY good iron with a decent tip, a good iron stand and a sponge well. You'll have to buy extra tips as time goes on, but I have one of these I used to use before I went to my SMD and it to this day works perfectly. I know people who have Weller stations from the 80's that still work like a dream. Those fucking products LAST.

They damn sure do! I've got a 40 watt Weller I've had since 1992 and it works as good now as the day I bought it!
 

Mikhail Naumov

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That's the $2.50 button Big Al sells directly from his website. As cheap as they are, they're pretty good low cost switches with quite a responsive throw.
 

Mattp169

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so i emailed xohm a while back to see if they had any dimebox mods left. I knew vaporbeast blew threw some last year for like $60
got one then
and one of ebay new for about the same
well weeks later I get an email saying they found 1 black pwm model for me
$55 later and it will be here thursday
now I will have 3
 

Vlad1

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Please stay the hell out of this thread if all you want to do is argue and spread misinformation. I created this thread about PWM and not about batteries or anything else. This is thread made to help people understand PWM, not a place for you to measure your dick in public. This thread was made to help people and spread information, not for you to get your shits and giggles in on a Friday night. To the MANY of you on this forum who have a clear and stated issue with me, either take it to my PM's or just don't say it. Small minds don't get very far. I don't care if you don't like me, this isn't a social call thread, I don't want it ending up shoved in the Mud Pit because you wanted to turn into a keyboard Spartan or talk about shit that isn't PWM related on this occasion.

I'm not going to make this TOO long, as I want you to read it, but make no mistake here. I am here for your hearts and minds. PWM vaping is a beautiful thing once you get into it, and here is why.

PWM stands for pulse width modulation, I'm sure most of you know that. Do you know what PWM is? Truly? If you don't, do not feel bad or stupid as it's not common knowledge. The way a typical PWM circuit works in vaping applications is through a duty cycle timer. Say you have two 18650's in series. Fully charged. That's 8.4V before voltage drop and battery sag. Allow me to be generous and say after voltage drop and battery sag, on a full charge this mod has 8V left in the cells.

So you have 8V of raw input when all is said and done. What does this mean from here? Well, on a PWM mod you're going to have some way of adjusting the power, typically via a voltage division dial called a potentiometer. These little wheels work by first, resisting current, but they have a dial that allows you to change how much they resist it. 100% power means no resistance is taking place, 0% means it's resisting as much as it can. Though in vaping applications it tends to be a bit different still. We in vaping mostly use them to dial through a timer range, a part of that duty cycle I mentioned earlier.

Back to your 8V of power, I didn't forget, don't you worry. In a duty cycle, that 8V will be applied all the time. It doesn't matter where the dial on the potentiometer falls, you're getting full voltage ALL the time. So how can this be, it certainly doesn't feel or vape like full voltage on lower power settings, does it? No, this is because you're controlling the time that voltage is applied. At 10% on the potentiometer dial, that would mean through whatever the set cycle time period is (which is much less than a single second, mind you, but it varies), that 8V of power is only being applied 10% of the time which would leave a 90% gap of no power.

What this creates is a power source that is being switched on and off VERY quickly, this is why a lot of PWM mods have an audible buzz when you're using them. This is great for a lot of reasons, as you can keep your overall vape experience down to a lower power range, but you can still taste that fast ramp up perk that comes along with vaping at higher voltages. This is also why PWM mods typically vape 'harder' at similar voltage settings to their DC counterparts. This is because the volt meter on a PWM mod is giving you the most accurate estimate of the DC equivalent of what your duty cycle is vaping like.

PWM mods now are rare, or shit. Back in early regulated vaping, PWM was everywhere. Provari was the PWM king, using a type of PWM known as RMS (Root Mean Square) which results in a pulse so fast that on a scope it reads like a flat line, like DC would. Some PWM boards still use this today, like the Voltrove NLPWM. Though you don't see PWM, not true PWM anyway, as much as you did back then. Which I find saddening, as the new intelligent / smart PWM regulators available to modders have all sorts of features like locking, on/off, favorites, diagnostics and more. Making them very similar to the regulated retail mods most vapers use. RMS PWM also can allow you to literally adjust all the way down to 0V, up to maximum battery voltage. Abandoning the duty cycle completely to give a more DC-esque experience.

This is where I'm getting to my point. Sure, DC is nice, DC has a lot of advantages, but I feel PWM is the best thing we can use for vaping. For more accurate uses, RMS can nearly mimic DC. On top of this, with inputs ranging from 2S (8.4V) to 6S (25.2V), PWM regulators offer ranges of power that can satisfy ANY vaper, rather it be a tootle puffer or a madman who vapes 2,500W builds. The new PWM regulators easily available to modders make PWM mods easier than ever to make, and I as a modder even specialize in them.

Sure, PWM boards can't offer temperature control or custom screens like a DNA or SX could, yet anyway. Though I found those things very gimmicky and left unused in the grand scheme of things, I find that the most important aspect is, the quality of the vape. This is why I feel how I do, because with PWM regulation you can get a quality of vape that can be fine tuned to suit ANY vaper, and with regulators that switch at 25Khz, you can't even hear the annoying buzz anymore.

I implore you to give PWM a real chance sometime if you never have, as it's a truly amazing way to vape that allows you to find that EXACT sweet spot that is essentially your vaping nirvana.


Been a long while since I visited these forums but came across your post and had me going HMM. ;) Not trying to discredit your information as I have no problem with PWM devices at all if the frequency they switch at is adequate. Perhaps what you stated I've misunderstood or perhaps it's just unclear so I'm trying to help in spreading the information.

The POT is not used to resist current in the output circuitry it's only purpose is to set the timing (duty cycle) in the switching circuit that the output transistor depends on. This is why we don't need high a amperage POT as they typically consume milliamps. Decreasing the POT decreases the duty cycle in turn reducing the RMS voltage applied to the atomizer.

In your example of 8V. The voltage is not applied all the time it's only applied the duration of the duty cycle. If your running 50% duty cycle the 8V will be applied 50% of the time, 10% duty cycle it's applied 10% of the time etc.. The only time the max voltage would ever be applied would be at 100% duty cycle.

RMS (Root Mean Square) is not a type of signal rather it's a method to calculate the DC equivalent of a varying signal. It has nothing to do with how fast (frequency) of a signal is other than it's use in calculating the equivalent DC voltage. RMS can be applied to the old devices that ran 20hz or less that you could hear / feel switching or as fast as 100Ghz and faster for example. Basically the faster the switching circuit and transistors are capable of the less noticeable it is, but RMS is not a type of a signal i.e. RMS PWM.

If a scope reads a PWM signal as a flat DC it's because the scope is defective, is not capable of tracing the signal at the speed it's switching (need a faster more sensitive scope) or the signal is being filtered with caps and the measurement is being taken at the wrong location but it's still PWM signal.

As I stated I have no problem with PWM devices, in fact I'm still using 2 SX devices and a Renegade in temp mode (all Yihi) which uses a PFM signal but because they switch fast enough I don't notice and they're just so damn reliable & consistent I have no need to change.
 
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Mikhail Naumov

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That's actually exactly what I trying to convey, I know 8V isn't applied through the entire cycle. Layman electronics are hard to word. But I don't really see anything wrong with how I did it, either. You make it sound like I was explaining pulse mode on a SnowWolf, which isn't the case at all.

Yes I know RMS isn't a signal, it's what our VM's use to give us the closest DC number to our duty cycle. But some boards like the NLPWM with a digital pot can make use of RMS conversions and alter the entire cycle. A regular RMS would be like a volt meter conversion wired up to a straight output channel on a basic 555 board. Boards like iPWM's and NLPWM's make use of RMS conversions to effect how the cycle runs in the first place. This gets, convoluted, when you try to explain it to people with little to no grasp on electronics. So I didn't bother, I was trying to get the big picture across.

Some cycles are entirely timerless. Some are not. Some timers run on different frequencies. There are so many variables here, yet again, like all electronics.

It's not a one size fits all by any means, and I was trying to keep things as layman as possible.

My pot explanation was more of what a pot is in general, not specifically for PWM uses. As it can be a rheostat or a variable resistor depending on how it's wired.

Had plenty of PWM's run a flat signal on a scope because of the timing, it's not a bad scope issue. This depends entirely on the timing frequency, the circuit and where the pot is.

Telling people all this in exact terms is about as useful as explaining why you need a properly rated DPDT in a switcher box (series to parallel or vice versa) to avoid switch arcs and one cell getting the load dumped into into it. You get a bunch of 'huh' and 'what' responses.

That's all I'll say on the matter, I can see where this will end up going already. I explained like 2% of the entire spectrum of PWM in this thread, there isn't enough space in the character limits to get it all in there and adding detail usually just adds confusion to readers.
 
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Mikhail Naumov

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I'm breaking away from this thread, due to a recent uptick in orders I'm getting very busy and don't have the time to come on other threads much anymore sadly. And seeing how this thread now has four separate shit shows in it, it's tainted and ruined in my eyes.

If anyone else wants to preach, be my guest, the flock is yours. Most of my time online is checking PMs and communicating with customers, then I'm doing the same thing on two subreddits and FB at the same time AND I have orders to work on. I'm so happy it's picked up, but it has ate some of my free time.

I'll still be around, sort of. My M&PWM thread is going to be 99% of where I post though. Unless they release.. a 50mm Voltrove.. oh yes I'll post about that.

If anyone has questions for me, of any kind, I will ALWAYS be reached via PM. I had 2 hours of free time yesterday, and I kind of liked it. Been way too idle way too long, and seeing this seed I planted months back grow is a wonderful feeling. Thank all of you who have supported me, ordered from me and continue to help out M&PWM. You guys are superheroes in my eyes.

I'll still post, from time to time, on random threads. But, not very often, I used to post a lot but as M&PWM has risen, my time to fuck around has fallen.
 
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Vlad1

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That's actually exactly what I trying to convey, I know 8V isn't applied through the entire cycle. Layman electronics are hard to word. But I don't really see anything wrong with how I did it, either. You make it sound like I was explaining pulse mode on a SnowWolf, which isn't the case at all.

Yes I know RMS isn't a signal, it's what our VM's use to give us the closest DC number to our duty cycle. But some boards like the NLPWM with a digital pot can make use of RMS conversions and alter the entire cycle. A regular RMS would be like a volt meter conversion wired up to a straight output channel on a basic 555 board. Boards like iPWM's and NLPWM's make use of RMS conversions to effect how the cycle runs in the first place. This gets, convoluted, when you try to explain it to people with little to no grasp on electronics. So I didn't bother, I was trying to get the big picture across.

Some cycles are entirely timerless. Some are not. Some timers run on different frequencies. There are so many variables here, yet again, like all electronics.

It's not a one size fits all by any means, and I was trying to keep things as layman as possible.

My pot explanation was more of what a pot is in general, not specifically for PWM uses. As it can be a rheostat or a variable resistor depending on how it's wired.

Had plenty of PWM's run a flat signal on a scope because of the timing, it's not a bad scope issue. This depends entirely on the timing frequency, the circuit and where the pot is.

Telling people all this in exact terms is about as useful as explaining why you need a properly rated DPDT in a switcher box (series to parallel or vice versa) to avoid switch arcs and one cell getting the load dumped into into it. You get a bunch of 'huh' and 'what' responses.

That's all I'll say on the matter, I can see where this will end up going already. I explained like 2% of the entire spectrum of PWM in this thread, there isn't enough space in the character limits to get it all in there and adding detail usually just adds confusion to readers.

I wasn't trying to suggest you were stating anything about any specific device at all just trying to clarify what was stated in the original post about RMS & PWM as to not spread misinformation or misunderstanding. I'll Multi quote the statements I was referring to and attempting to clarify.

Well, on a PWM mod you're going to have some way of adjusting the power, typically via a voltage division dial called a potentiometer. These little wheels work by first, resisting current, but they have a dial that allows you to change how much they resist it. 100% power means no resistance is taking place, 0% means it's resisting as much as it can.

The POT is used for the switching circuitry in setting the duty cycle, not the output power circuitry. It has nothing to do with resisting current in the output circuit other than setting the duty cycle in the switching circuitry, again that's why we don't need high amp POTS.

In a duty cycle, that 8V will be applied all the time. It doesn't matter where the dial on the potentiometer falls, you're getting full voltage ALL the time.
The full output voltage is only ever applied when the duty cycle is at 100% no other time would full voltage be applied. Granted when the duty cycle is not 100%, the output voltage during active high of the duty cycle would be equal to battery voltage -sag -efficiency loss and low of the duty cycle would be 0V, with the RMS voltage being a lower value due to the frequency & duty cycle of the PWM signal.

using a type of PWM known as RMS (Root Mean Square) which results in a pulse so fast that on a scope it reads like a flat line, like DC would.
There is no such thing as a type of PWM known as RMS. PWM is a signal type, RMS is a method to calculate the DC equivalence in a varying signal and has nothing at all to do with how fast the pulse is.

PWM (Pulse Width Modulation) is never a flat line by definition it pulses and is measurable in both frequency and duty cycle. If it were a flat line like DC neither the frequency nor the duty cycle would be present or measurable hence not a PWM signal. And again if a scope is measuring a known PWM signal as a flat line, and is not measuring a duty cycle or frequency it could be due to the scope being defective, not fast enough to measure the switching frequency or being measured from the outputs of a filtered signal. PWM has a measurable frequency and duty cycle when tested correctly with adequate measurement devices.

After all that is the purpose of PWM in our use, to cheaply alter the RMS output value by reducing or increasing the duty cycle to meet our preferences. If the signal maintained a flat line we wouldn't achieve that with PWM.

For more accurate uses, RMS can nearly mimic DC.
Again RMS is not a signal type, it doesn't determine the duty cycle, frequency or amplitude it's a method to determine DC equivalency of a varying signal.
 

Mattp169

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the technical stuff doesnt matter to me. I have to admit some of it is beyond me while I do understand most of the basics
What matters to me is this
1. PWM works for vaping it feels as good or better then any mod I have used
2. I understand my ohm limitations based on what the board and batteries can handle
3. If any of my 3 PWM devices break either I or a modder can repair them fairly easily regardless of what any government entity tries to do to the vaping industry because nothing except the 510 connection is specific to the vape industry. Where as if my ipv 3li dies someone (maybe even myself) could repair it but the cost may not be worth it or the proprietary parts used will be unavailable or something making the repair unfeasible.

I expect all 3 of my pwm devices to last me the rest of my life with the occasional repair

PWM works for vaping while its not specific to vaping so you can always get PWM boards even if you need to build one or have one built. Plus the replacement cost on a PWM is way less then say a DNA or a SX board
 

Iliketurtles

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Taking a quick look at the nlpwm board its powered by a programmable micro controller - same kinda thing thats on an Arduino. These are like a limited kind of computer chip that you program the logic of yourself, the pwm signal will be a derivation of the clock pulse signal and adjustable by a programmed function of the chip between however many levels they set it up for - on an arduino I think it is 256 different values for the pwm output. It looks pretty elegant to me, I might buy one for shits and giggles. Bit expensive though....I mean not in the grand scheme of things as a micro controller board with that stuff built in is probably worth 'roughly' that money...but for a PWM circuit.
 

MannyScoot

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Can someone explain this.....

I'm seeing my battery voltage is 12.4v and I see the voltage on my vape as 11.7volts....... if I'm Vaping a dual coil .20 ohm coils what's the wattage ? I have it set at 5.0 on the potentiometer

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MarkS

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By the way I cipher it's around 68 watts.


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Mattp169

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ok question
im looking for wraps for one of my pwm boxes
the newest dimebox came in a plain black finish that is smooth. Its scracthed the hell up in 2 weeks - SO i thought a wrap would be nice
but not sure how to get one
I know the led screen,510 and pot and fire button probably wouldnt be pre cut
but i need something that the is enough material to do this

and I cant match the dimensiions of this to any hammong or alpine tech box
my dimensions are approx:
101mmx52mmx26mm

anyone got a suggestion
 
Thank you for this I'm looking to get in to pwm mods and this help me a lot any pointers anyone wants to show me or where to get a good deal on one?
 

inspects

Squonkamaniac
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Thanks for this a lot so where can I get a good deal on a nlpwm board and in closer and everything I'll need for it and can you please me a list of what I'll need to make one?
You might be better off just buying a mod from 5150mods on ebay....he built a bunch of them for me. By the time you purchase all the parts, laser engraving....he isn't making much money on the mods.

If you would like his email address PM me.
 

MannyScoot

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You might be better off just buying a mod from 5150mods on ebay....he built a bunch of them for me. By the time you purchase all the parts, laser engraving....he isn't making much money on the mods.

If you would like his email address PM me.
I second that... 5150 mods are solid !

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Droogbc

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It's unfortunate that things went the way they did with the OP and his business attempt, but this thread did convince me to try a PWM mod as my next device.

I want a lipo mod. Already have a balance charger and some rc related lipo knowledge, so lipo is the obvious next step in my vaping adventure, but I have a lot of questions.

I'm unsure though if a 3s or 4s pack would suit my needs better. How far down can the newest pwm boards dial back? If, for example, a 4s pack can only be dialed down to deliver 10v at a minimum I'd most definitely go 3s, but I'm a bit out of my depth here. What are the lowest recommended builds that can be installed on 3s/4s pwm box? Can anyone elaborate a bit to help me decide?

Also, considering mah, and enclosure. I don't want an enclosure that is going to fall over every time I place it down. I have big hands, large pockets, and am not afraid of a larger/thicker mod especially if it will make it more stable and have the benefit of allowing a larger mah battery. That said, I don't want anything too squat like the boxer lipo mod. I don't have any type of reference when people usually mention various Hammond and ati boxes, having never seen or held one, but would a 3s 4000mah pwm mod be doable while still being reasonably comfortable to hold and pocket? Any specific make/model enclosures that you can suggest I look at?

Also wondering about which of the current pwm boards are most highly recommend. Again, quite out of my depth here and don't want to make the wrong choice, especially if this is going to end up being an expensive device.

Then theres ancillary stuff like buttons and 510 connectors. Anything I should spend extra on for best results, or are most builders like 5150 and whiterose using top tier stuff already?

What do ya figure such a device would cost, ballpark, and would you lean 5150, Whiterose, or elsewhere?
 

MarkS

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It's unfortunate that things went the way they did with the OP and his business attempt, but this thread did convince me to try a PWM mod as my next device.

I want a lipo mod. Already have a balance charger and some rc related lipo knowledge, so lipo is the obvious next step in my vaping adventure, but I have a lot of questions.

I'm unsure though if a 3s or 4s pack would suit my needs better. How far down can the newest pwm boards dial back? If, for example, a 4s pack can only be dialed down to deliver 10v at a minimum I'd most definitely go 3s, but I'm a bit out of my depth here. What are the lowest recommended builds that can be installed on 3s/4s pwm box? Can anyone elaborate a bit to help me decide?

Also, considering mah, and enclosure. I don't want an enclosure that is going to fall over every time I place it down. I have big hands, large pockets, and am not afraid of a larger/thicker mod especially if it will make it more stable and have the benefit of allowing a larger mah battery. That said, I don't want anything too squat like the boxer lipo mod. I don't have any type of reference when people usually mention various Hammond and ati boxes, having never seen or held one, but would a 3s 4000mah pwm mod be doable while still being reasonably comfortable to hold and pocket? Any specific make/model enclosures that you can suggest I look at?

Also wondering about which of the current pwm boards are most highly recommend. Again, quite out of my depth here and don't want to make the wrong choice, especially if this is going to end up being an expensive device.

Then theres ancillary stuff like buttons and 510 connectors. Anything I should spend extra on for best results, or are most builders like 5150 and whiterose using top tier stuff already?

What do ya figure such a device would cost, ballpark, and would you lean 5150, Whiterose, or elsewhere?

I have used two manufactured boards, Big Al’s and Voltrove, as well as made my own PWM circuit for Mods I’ve built for myself. The manufactured boards are nice in that they offer more features but in the end all three get the job done. It’s nearly a toss up between Big Al’s and Voltrove. Each offer a little something different in the way of features.

Enclosure wise I prefer Alpinetech 1590N1 as it gives you plenty of room. It’s a big enclosure!

Other parts I like: Varitube V2 510, Mitec MSW-16A01, 93PR1KLF 1K Trimmer Potentiometer (for Big Al’s), 93PR10KLF 10K Trimmer Potentiometer (for Voltrove and self made).

The biggest LiPo you will likely be able to use is a 2200 mAh 3S (a 2200 mAh 4S will be VERY tight in the aforementioned enclosure) however I personally run a 1800 mAh, 65C Constant, 3S with an XT-60 connector because it gives me more room inside the box.
 
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Droogbc

Silver Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Awesome, thank you very much for the insight! Very much appreciated.

I had read a lot of folks mentioning 2200mah as a max, but then I saw 5150 post a 3s 4000mah DNA250 mod which had me wondering.

https://m.facebook.com/5150mods/pho...127211710629293/?type=3&source=49&__tn__=EH-R

Is that just a huge enclosure that looks deceptively pocketable due to no real point of reference in the pic, or just able to fit more inside because no xt60 connectors inside, or am I way off?
 

MarkS

Gold Contributor
Member For 5 Years
Awesome, thank you very much for the insight! Very much appreciated.

I had read a lot of folks mentioning 2200mah as a max, but then I saw 5150 post a 3s 4000mah DNA250 mod which had me wondering.

https://m.facebook.com/5150mods/pho...127211710629293/?type=3&source=49&__tn__=EH-R

Is that just a huge enclosure that looks deceptively pocketable due to no real point of reference in the pic, or just able to fit more inside because no xt60 connectors inside, or am I way off?

It will depend on the enclosure internal dimensions, LiPo pack dimensions, and other things in or protruding into the case (i.e., VM/display, potentiometer, fire button, 510, circuit board/PWM circuit, wiring, and connectors). I consider a lot of Mods pocketable that are quite large. I personally consider the N1 enclosure very pocketable but that’s something that varies by the individual.
 

Droogbc

Silver Contributor
Member For 4 Years
It will depend on the enclosure internal dimensions, LiPo pack dimensions, and other things in or protruding into the case (i.e., VM/display, potentiometer, fire button, 510, circuit board/PWM circuit, wiring, and connectors). I consider a lot of Mods pocketable that are quite large. I personally consider the N1 enclosure very pocketable but that’s something that varies by the individual.
I hear ya. I don't mind a big mod either, and find most everything pocketable. Just find it surprising they managed to fit a 4000mah 3s in there when most of the bigger pwm boxes seem to max out at 2250 or maaaybe 2800. I guess having everything onboard the dna board helps when squeezing everything into an enclosure, comparatively speaking.

One more question. Do these boards/mods have any kind of short circuit protection on the atomizer end of things? I'd hate to have an atty short and meltdown the box/car/house.
 
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MarkS

Gold Contributor
Member For 5 Years
Yes, it conserves a lot of space. Many times Moders will direct solder a LiPo to the DNA board (not me, I like easy serviceability).

I honestly don’t know about short protection on the boards I mentioned. On my self made PWM I installed fuses.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Deebee

Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
Soo many inconsistencies, first off RMS PWM has nothing to do with the speed at which the duty cycle is pulsed and everything to do with the resulting output.
RMS stands for Root Mean Square which is literally the Square root of the average squared. Why is this important, because using the average voltage (which is what almost every PWM board displays) gives an innacurate account of the power output and cannot be used to calculate true power output or compared to DC voltage.
With RMS PWM the displayed voltage can be used to accurately calculate power output. The RMS voltage is the exact same as the Voltage reported by regulated DC mods and can be used in exactly the same way.

Every PWM on the market Except for NLPWM and SPWM control the output by blindly setting duty cycle with no reguard to input voltage, which causes power fade as the battery weakens, and as stated above leaves us to read a mostly unuseable average voltage with an onboard voltage divider or a Voltmeter.
RMS PWM boards put out the same power with a fresh battery as they do a dead battery, display the actual and correct Voltage output, give the same power at the displayed voltage as regulated mods.
Also it should be noted that RMS PWM boards are the only boards who's output is directly controlled rather than just the result of a fixed duty cycle same as an old school timer mod. Why bother to use a microcontroller if you are not going leverage the processing power to give a better output than a 555 timer.

If you truly want to preach PWM to the masses ,you should do so in an unbiased and factual manner.
 

Carambrda

Platinum Contributor
ECF Refugee
Member For 5 Years
Soo many inconsistencies, first off RMS PWM has nothing to do with the speed at which the duty cycle is pulsed and everything to do with the resulting output.
RMS stands for Root Mean Square which is literally the Square root of the average squared. Why is this important, because using the average voltage (which is what almost every PWM board displays) gives an innacurate account of the power output and cannot be used to calculate true power output or compared to DC voltage.
With RMS PWM the displayed voltage can be used to accurately calculate power output. The RMS voltage is the exact same as the Voltage reported by regulated DC mods and can be used in exactly the same way.

Every PWM on the market Except for NLPWM and SPWM control the output by blindly setting duty cycle with no reguard to input voltage, which causes power fade as the battery weakens, and as stated above leaves us to read a mostly unuseable average voltage with an onboard voltage divider or a Voltmeter.
RMS PWM boards put out the same power with a fresh battery as they do a dead battery, display the actual and correct Voltage output, give the same power at the displayed voltage as regulated mods.
Also it should be noted that RMS PWM boards are the only boards who's output is directly controlled rather than just the result of a fixed duty cycle same as an old school timer mod. Why bother to use a microcontroller if you are not going leverage the processing power to give a better output than a 555 timer.

If you truly want to preach PWM to the masses ,you should do so in an unbiased and factual manner.
For me, the only PWM mods worth vaping on are non-LiPo ones the output of which is just the result of a fixed duty cycle same as an old school timer mod. The voltage sag behavior characteristics of a pair of round lithium-ion rechargeable cells in series causes the averaged power output of each subsequent pulse to be a noticeably downward slope during the pull especially at the sart of the pull, just like the power output of a mech mod also is a downward slope also especially at the sart of the pull. The downside is that each subsequent pull will be weaker due to discharging the batteries another notch. But with a potentiometer you can just keep adjusting the width of the pulses to counter that effect. If you go to France you might soon notice PWM mods by a brand called Surric Vapes are still a hit over there. I'm not French, but I live next door to France (i.e., Belgium), and, I own two Surric X-Vault mods myself so think I understand perfectly why these so-called "primitive" PWN mods are such a big success. So pardon my French, but... the type of power output that you claim to be "better" just translates to a vape experience best described as merde. :poop:
 
I got this for 20$ wanted a vape and this was my option don't really know anything about it any comments or tips on how to use if properly?
 

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TrollDragon

Silver Contributor
Member For 4 Years
ECF Refugee
I got this for 20$ wanted a vape and this was my option don't really know anything about it any comments or tips on how to use if properly?
First and for most take that Crown 3 off of that mod and don't use it on there again!

I assume it is a series PWM mod so you should build it like you would for a series mechanical, keeping your CDR battery current in mind. There are no safety or protection features built into it, it is an old mod. PWM mods fire at the current battery voltage and the pot on the side adjusts how long that pulse with be, it is NOT a variable voltage or variable wattage mod. If it is series then you will be putting 8.4V to the coil on fresh batteries and if is a parallel mod then you will be putting 4.2V to the coil.

Pick up some good batteries for it such as the
Molicel P28A 2800mAh 35A.
Molicel P26A 2600mAh 35A.
Sony VTC5D 2800mAh 25A.
Sony VTC5A 2600mAh 25A.
Samsung 20S 2000mAh 30A.

Treat it as a mechanical, stay within battery CDR limits and DO NOT use any RTA with a pre built coil like the Crown 3 you have on it now. If that coil shorts there are no protections, you will be just another story on Facebook about the guy whose mod blew up in his hand. Pre made coil are notorious for possibly shorting out, we see shorted Smok coils on a regular basis at the shop where I work.

If you have never used mechs before then do yourself a a really big favor and find a regulated mod that you can throw any tank on.
 

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