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Mech Squonk Mods, Need Help/Advice

SiCkHiTrEg

Member For 1 Year
So as of right now I have been using a Pulse squonk mod with either the pulse 24 or the dead rabbit. I have a vicious ant spade on the way and will most likely use one of those rdas with it. Haven’t had any issues thus far, however I am now questioning some things and am looking for help and advice from others with more experience.

1) I have only used kanthol as far as coils go, but read in several places that Nichrome is better in mechs and have been thinking of swapping?

2)Types of coils for this setup for best flavor. I have tried many pre built coils and wires. I am now getting into trying to make my own coils which also factors in above if I should switch to nichrome. Ive used mainy fused claptons and aliens, but have read that naked 22g or 24g wire is better in mechs. So I am learning on how to make different coils etc but obv not very good yet because I always used pre builts. Id like opinions on which type of coil people think give best flavor.

I think for now that is pretty much where I am at. I love squonking and love mechs. I have the tools to make my own coils and understand the basics of battery safety and ohms law. The pulse runs a single 20700 and the VA spade runs a single 18650. I still have a lot to learn, but enjoy researching and learning. I’ve read a lot and continue to do so. Any advice, opinions, tips,etc... is very greatly appreciated. Thanks so much.
 

fightinggoat

Bronze Contributor
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
I’m a big proponent for naked wire builds with 22-24ga nichrome or SS, I get amazing flavor and terrific vape production from mine.

I also really like single coil builds for single battery mechs.
 

mach1ne

Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
a lot of people pick a wire and fight to the death over whether its better or not. just try them all and decide for yourself. they all have a time and place to shine imo. i mostly use mech mods of all types. i choose/mix my materials based on my target resistance mostly (which is dictated by the batteries im using). i use a lot of kanthal on unregulated series mods, and i like to make my staple variants nice and wide, so they usually have at least some kanthal ribbon in them to help keep resistance up.

as far as good coils for an unregulated squonker, i like to keep my resistance up high enough to make sure the battery will make it through a bottle of juice. this means i am usually using a ~.2 ohm single coil (usually leftover coils from ~.1 ohm parallel box builds), or a smaller dual coil setup in something tiny like a low-pro, or mako shorty.

learning to build is the best way to go imo. buying coils leaves you at the mercy of fate basically. lots of the cheap options are junk in one way or another (bad build quality/wire, poorly designed with 30 gauge wrap, totally mislabeled things like 'alien' wire thats actually claptoned ribbon etc). there are some good (on paper) looking premade coils out there with 36 and higher wrap, real aliens etc, but you are still not in control of material or anything. maybe you would be better with 30/40 aliens for your smaller atty, but no one makes them. when you make your own you can try whatever you want. i highly recommend it, even if you just get to fused claptons or aliens and stick with that.

check out the squonker forum, its full of pro squonkers that have you covered for all your squonking questions (and likely encourage you to spend all your money on squonking stuff :p)....and come hang out with us in the post your builds thread/coil building area. we will make sure you get where you want to be as a builder :cheers:
 

Fudgey Finger

Silver Contributor
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
My favorite build on a single battery is dual parallel 24g N80 on a 3mm bit. I can't remember how many wraps I use but you could adjust the amount of wraps based on how warm of a vape you prefer. Just remember to build within your battery's CDR.

On my pulse 24 I use 26g n80 dual parallel on a 2.5mm bit. It's good for fruity flavors but isn't the best for complex custards and creams imo.

With a single battery mech I much prefer a plain round wire build.
 

JuicyLucy

My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic
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a lot of people pick a wire and fight to the death over whether its better or not. just try them all and decide for yourself. they all have a time and place to shine imo.

This is true and quality wire is not that expensive
 

SiCkHiTrEg

Member For 1 Year
Thanks everyone for all the great information. Definitely going to be building my own coils, just going to need to learn lol. I know theres a ton of videos so shouldn’t be a problem. Just not sure if i should grab kanthol or nichrome. I just heard that nichrome takes less time to ramp up and that is great in mechs. It makes sense I guess, but like I said I have only used kanthol and currently am using premade coils until i get some wire at which point I will start making my own. And I am definitely aware of mislabled pre built coils and am sure that I bave been gotten a few times unfortunately.
 

Arthur-VU

Silver Contributor
Member For 2 Years
On my Pulse BF, with a single-coil RDA, I get great flavor and clouds until the batt is run down to 2.8v (safe as per Mooch) using a 24g SS316L 5-spaced-wraps on 3mm ID which comes out to 0.25 Ohms...

But with any mech you need to know the safe CDR amp limit of your battery, unless you do not value your face and hands much, because if you build too low and chain-vape, bad things can happen.

It is recommend to watch all of Mooch's videos, especially his 'Minding your mAh's' series, starting from Episode 1, even if you are a veteran of using mech mods.

In case you don't know, Mooch is an authority on the use of lithium ion cells for vaping and regularly tests them and rates them as part of his professional daily work in building and testing power control systems, and he offers his info to all of us vapers as a public service to educate and keep us safe.

see here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCePHh3NMvu3rW2LFJeOWo-Q/videos
 

PoppaVic

Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
I would never use nichrome again, but that is because I suffered it very early and I always tasted copper/blood flavors, instead of the ejuice. Otoh, Kanthal never gave me a flavor on its own - ever. And, I learned (eventually), that SS worked well with mech, VW and TC.

If you are making coils, then by all means: stock a few types and sizes. "Complex" and "hybrid" wires may work "better". (for some def of better and a lot of subjectiveness). BUT, you can learn a lot and get 'er done with a very modest investment in plain wire in the ni/kanth/fecral and SS departments. Personally, I would never, ever, ever steer a newb to clapton/fused-clapton/whatever "premade" coils - mech or regulated - unless I knew they had eye/hand/motor-control issues.

Like cooking, or reloading, or soldering, or welding, or leatherwor - pretty much anything: you have to DO IT more than once or twice, (in several ways with several materials), to get a FEEL for it.

All that said, I own a couple mechs - so I am ready for zombies - but I avoid them for daily use. Why? Because I have to build waaay low and swap cells with a single; or build waaaaaay high for a 2xS mod like the NC. Absolutely love that we CAN use them; absolutely don't want to fight it all daily to enjoy a vape to/from/at work.

Welcome to the Permanent Floating Riot Party ;-)

PS: Yes, batteries and ohms-law get really, really important.. I may have to kill zombies in anger cuz my batteries no longer charge ;-)
 

Arthur-VU

Silver Contributor
Member For 2 Years
I would never use nichrome again, but that is because I suffered it very early and I always tasted copper/blood flavors, instead of the ejuice. Otoh, Kanthal never gave me a flavor on its own - ever. And, I learned (eventually), that SS worked well with mech, VW and TC.

If you are making coils, then by all means: stock a few types and sizes. "Complex" and "hybrid" wires may work "better". (for some def of better and a lot of subjectiveness). BUT, you can learn a lot and get 'er done with a very modest investment in plain wire in the ni/kanth/fecral and SS departments. Personally, I would never, ever, ever steer a newb to clapton/fused-clapton/whatever "premade" coils - mech or regulated - unless I knew they had eye/hand/motor-control issues.

Like cooking, or reloading, or soldering, or welding, or leatherwor - pretty much anything: you have to DO IT more than once or twice, (in several ways with several materials), to get a FEEL for it.

All that said, I own a couple mechs - so I am ready for zombies - but I avoid them for daily use. Why? Because I have to build waaay low and swap cells with a single; or build waaaaaay high for a 2xS mod like the NC. Absolutely love that we CAN use them; absolutely don't want to fight it all daily to enjoy a vape to/from/at work.

Welcome to the Permanent Floating Riot Party ;-)

PS: Yes, batteries and ohms-law get really, really important.. I may have to kill zombies in anger cuz my batteries no longer charge ;-)

OMG - every point you've made here I am like "yes, Yes, YES!!!"

Thank you. :stars2:
 

JuicyLucy

My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic
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Didnt even think about SS. So SS works pretty wellin mechs as well? I definitely don’t want to get extra taste from the metal.

I use SS exclusively and am a full-time mech squonker and have been for years - to me SS is the cleanest tasting of them all - but everyone is different, a few can't stand SS, but not that many from around here at least
 

Arthur-VU

Silver Contributor
Member For 2 Years
Didnt even think about SS. So SS works pretty wellin mechs as well? I definitely don’t want to get extra taste from the metal.
With Kanthal and Ni80 (nichrome), their resistance is fairly constant regardless of voltage/wattage applied.

Per linear inch, SS wire has ~half the resistance of Kanthal.

Example, 5 wraps of 24g Kanthal on 3mm core = ~0.50 Ohms whereas 5 wraps of 24g SS316L on 3mm core = ~0.25 Ohms...

Lots of this can be demonstrated with the COIL WRAPPING and WIRE WIZARD tabs on Steam Engine here: http://www.steam-engine.org/coil.asp

Another factor to consider is the MASS of the coil. IMHO more than 170mg of wire mass on a mech mod, of ANY wire material has too high a heat capacity (I prefer to keep heat capacity below 85) and will have both a slow ramp time as well as decreased battery life.

Steam Engine's WIRE WIZARD will show you the coil mass, but the COIL BUILDING tab does not.

The 24g SS316L 5-spaced-wraps on 3mm that comes out to 0.25 Ohms that I mentioned previously, has a heat capacity of 56, wire mass of 113 and surface area of 111, and ramps quick, produces lots of flavor and vapor, and is efficient down to 2.8v, at which point there is pretty much no vapors at all.

Maybe if you have not use SS wire before, you can try this ^ build and use it as a starting point?
 
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Pastorfuzz

Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
VU Patreon
At the moment i'm only using SS on mine because I have about 8000 ft of it.
I use SS on my parallel mechs and at .25 the taste pops and the hit is smooth.
Have dual SS fused claptons, 26X40, 8 wrap 3.5 mm. .28 in my Modfather on a regulated at the moment and the flavor is great.
My tastebuds are a little worn out so I can't tell the taste difference between the different metals though.
 

Gavlan

Bronze Contributor
Member For 3 Years
On my Pulse BF, with a single-coil RDA, I get great flavor and clouds until the batt is run down to 2.8v (safe as per Mooch) using a 24g SS316L 5-spaced-wraps on 3mm ID which comes out to 0.25 Ohms...

But with any mech you need to know the safe CDR amp limit of your battery, unless you do not value your face and hands much, because if you build too low and chain-vape, bad things can happen.

It is recommend to watch all of Mooch's videos, especially his 'Minding your mAh's' series, starting from Episode 1, even if you are a veteran of using mech mods.

In case you don't know, Mooch is an authority on the use of lithium ion cells for vaping and regularly tests them and rates them as part of his professional daily work in building and testing power control systems, and he offers his info to all of us vapers as a public service to educate and keep us safe.

see here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCePHh3NMvu3rW2LFJeOWo-Q/videos
I have this build in one of my atty's right now , SS is about all I use now my Nichrome and Ka get used in some things but 90% SS here.
Also 6 wraps - SS316 L - 2.5 dia spaced is about the same .
Try them all and you'll know what's best for you. :devil:
 

PoppaVic

Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Yeah. From Kanthal, you look at SS and mutter "where the hell you been all my life??"

I am NOT anti-kanthal, anymore than I would be against a smoker.. I understand smoking, and kanthal - and SS can be yer bestest friend. If you ever want to toe-dip in TC, then SS should be tried.. In either case. SS works in VW mode. Win-Win-Win. YMMV. Invest now.
 

PoppaVic

Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
At the moment i'm only using SS on mine because I have about 8000 ft of it.
I use SS on my parallel mechs and at .25 the taste pops and the hit is smooth.
Have dual SS fused claptons, 26X40, 8 wrap 3.5 mm. .28 in my Modfather on a regulated at the moment and the flavor is great.
My tastebuds are a little worn out so I can't tell the taste difference between the different metals though.

"My tastebuds are a little worn out" - ok, that avatar is Bad-LLAMA ;-)
 

Arthur-VU

Silver Contributor
Member For 2 Years
Yeah. From Kanthal, you look at SS and mutter "where the hell you been all my life??"

I am NOT anti-kanthal, anymore than I would be against a smoker.. I understand smoking, and kanthal - and SS can be yer bestest friend. If you ever want to toe-dip in TC, then SS should be tried.. In either case. SS works in VW mode. Win-Win-Win. YMMV. Invest now.
Truth and Wisdom here. Word, brother :)
 

Fudgey Finger

Silver Contributor
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
Didnt even think about SS. So SS works pretty wellin mechs as well? I definitely don’t want to get extra taste from the metal.
Lots of people here prefer SS. I personally get a bad taste from SS though so it really is best to just try the different wire materials and see what you like. Another reason that I personally am not a big fan of SS is that it is hard for me to hit my target resistance with SS unless I use a single coil. SS has a lower ohm per foot than N80 or Kanthal. SS also ramps up slower than Nichrome 80 which is another reason I am not a big fan. It all depends on what YOU prefer though so try some of each. Kanthal is really good for a series mech, but I don't have much use for it at 3.8v
 

SiCkHiTrEg

Member For 1 Year
What is the ramp up time with ss like? I also heard that ss ohms can varry and change as it heats up / cools down which kind of worries me with mechs? Can anyone with more experience explain these things because I am very interested in trying ss out on a dual coil build in my pulse bf and vicious ant spade once I get it inside a dead rabbit rsa. Will that be ok?
 

Arthur-VU

Silver Contributor
Member For 2 Years
What is the ramp up time with ss like? I also heard that ss ohms can varry and change as it heats up / cools down which kind of worries me with mechs? Can anyone with more experience explain these things because I am very interested in trying ss out on a dual coil build in my pulse bf and vicious ant spade once I get it inside a dead rabbit rsa. Will that be ok?
Ramp time is related both to wire mass and wire gauge and if you look on Steam Engine the HEAT CAPACITY.

You can build SS coils with lower heat capacity, which means faster ramp time.

Dual coils which is double the wire mass will usually ramp slower, especially if you want to use exotic coils.

On a mech either parallel or twisted will ramp faster than staggertons or aliens, and simple single-wire builds will ramp even faster than parallel or twisted, all because of lower wire mass.

You really need to look at Steam Engine and play with the numbers and see how the heat capacity, wire mass, and heat flux changes and the surface area. All of this data can be seen in the COIL WIZARD tab.

Go, have fun with it. :stars2:
 

SiCkHiTrEg

Member For 1 Year
Ya def will. I only have messed with kanthal, but am going to try ss and nichrome soon. Def more excited to try ss from what I am hearing though.

I have a question about ohms law and battery safety though if someone wouldn’t mind clarifying. So as stated above I am currently using an ijoy 20700 inside of a pulse bf mod. Now the coils I am using are rated at .23 ohms dual aliens. The battery says 3.7v, 11.10wh (not sure what this is), rated at 40 amps (mooch says rated more at 30 amps after testing) and 3000 mah.

So when trying to make sure the .23 dual aliens will be ok in my pulse with that battery I entered the 3.7v and .23 ohm build into the calculator and it gave me 16.08696 amps and 59.5 watts. The 16 amps is well under the “rated 40”on it or 30 amps after actual battery testing of the ijoy 20700. So I would be fine then correct?

Wanted to try a dual framed staple alien build in the same setup rated at .18 ohms which bumped the amps up to 20.55556 and wattage to 76.05556 which still keeps the amps low enough to be safe right? Or am I doing something wrong?
 

Arthur-VU

Silver Contributor
Member For 2 Years
Ya def will. I only have messed with kanthal, but am going to try ss and nichrome soon. Def more excited to try ss from what I am hearing though.

I have a question about ohms law and battery safety though if someone wouldn’t mind clarifying. So as stated above I am currently using an ijoy 20700 inside of a pulse bf mod. Now the coils I am using are rated at .23 ohms dual aliens. The battery says 3.7v, 11.10wh (not sure what this is), rated at 40 amps (mooch says rated more at 30 amps after testing) and 3000 mah.

So when trying to make sure the .23 dual aliens will be ok in my pulse with that battery I entered the 3.7v and .23 ohm build into the calculator and it gave me 16.08696 amps and 59.5 watts. The 16 amps is well under the “rated 40”on it or 30 amps after actual battery testing of the ijoy 20700. So I would be fine then correct?

Wanted to try a dual framed staple alien build in the same setup rated at .18 ohms which bumped the amps up to 20.55556 and wattage to 76.05556 which still keeps the amps low enough to be safe right? Or am I doing something wrong?
Seems like you got a good handle on this.

I personally will not build below 0.23 on a mech, even if using a 30a CDR rated battery, due to my own paranoia about risk. Hence I am not comfortable giving advice on your 0.18 Ohm build. If it were me, I would build higher.

There are many types of coils you can build with higher resistance that can still give a satisfying vape experience, and each of them has their own sweet spot in your RDA, that you need to find what works for you.

That means you need to experiment a little bit, but that's all part of the fun, and very satisfying when you figure it out.

This is what I put in my Pulse BF on the Wasp Nano:

(click to view the picture)--->View attachment 107937

3mm ID, 24g SS316L, 5x wraps, spaced 3mm apart, 0.25 Ohms, wicked hard and tight.

So tight that you have to THREAD the cotton into the coil and not PULL the cotton (too thick to PULL), which holds a TON of juice for dripping or squonking - such that you can get 10-15 hits before needing to juice the cotton again.

Morten Oen has both tutorials for, and testing of different wicking methods on his YT channel that you can see here:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMS4GxDHLPvXr5oQrthU60A/videos?disable_polymer=1

Hope this helps! :)
 

strigamort

Bronze Contributor
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
Ya def will. I only have messed with kanthal, but am going to try ss and nichrome soon. Def more excited to try ss from what I am hearing though.

I have a question about ohms law and battery safety though if someone wouldn’t mind clarifying. So as stated above I am currently using an ijoy 20700 inside of a pulse bf mod. Now the coils I am using are rated at .23 ohms dual aliens. The battery says 3.7v, 11.10wh (not sure what this is), rated at 40 amps (mooch says rated more at 30 amps after testing) and 3000 mah.

So when trying to make sure the .23 dual aliens will be ok in my pulse with that battery I entered the 3.7v and .23 ohm build into the calculator and it gave me 16.08696 amps and 59.5 watts. The 16 amps is well under the “rated 40”on it or 30 amps after actual battery testing of the ijoy 20700. So I would be fine then correct?

Wanted to try a dual framed staple alien build in the same setup rated at .18 ohms which bumped the amps up to 20.55556 and wattage to 76.05556 which still keeps the amps low enough to be safe right? Or am I doing something wrong?
Yes, you will be fine. I don't mind pulling a little more than cdr (on quality batteries using the *actual* cdr) because I don't take long pulls. In fact, my pulls are typically around 1 second or less. This is considered pulsing, not continuous discharge. Unfortunately there are no set rules for pulsing and there are no actual figures that state what a safe pulsing discharge would be for any given battery.

I think it's somewhat unfortunate that we are tied to batteries that weren't designed for our uses. Mooch says that all of the battery oem's would rather not have us as customers. Makes sense as the product is designed to be used inside a battery pack where the cells are protected from the elements and flotsam of teenage pockets. If we had batteries designed for us they'd have a wrap far better suited to abuse and wouldn't be the things of motherly nightmares across the globe.

Bottom line is that we have what we have and each of us is responsible for the batteries safe use. I'm pretty grateful for what we use because I have learned a hell of a lot that I'd never have studied otherwise. These powerful cells are like my motorcycle. There may be inherent danger associated with them, but I believe that with the right attitude and willingness to learn, the dangers can be mitigated to the point where it's safe enough for me to enjoy without excess worry.

As for the calculators... I love them and mess with them constantly. I can't tell you how many times something clicked in my understanding while playing around with them.

Also, nichrome definitely tastes metallic to me. Stainless has been the perfect choice since I started building wire and coils a few months back.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3000 using Tapatalk
 

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