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Prebuilt 0.47 OHM coils reading at 0.25

TrackDay

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Hey guys,

I just put two new prebuilt 23G 0.47 OHM kanthal coils into my flawless we our here doe RDA and I'm getting an OHM reading of 0.25. I've put it on my coil master OHM reader and my mod and they're both reading it at 0.25. My post screws are tight and both coils are firing perfectly, heating from the inside outwards. What have I done wrong to get such a low reading? I've put together 0.36 OHM tiger coils into my Vaperz Cloud X1 Competition RDA which read almost a perfect 0.37 so I'm not really sure what I've done wrong. Any answers or solutions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!
 

Markw4mms

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Just a guess, but are the coils rated at .47 ohm each? If so, and you're running them in parallel then the reading would be in the ballpark.
 

TrackDay

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Just a guess, but are the coils rated at .47 ohm each? If so, and you're running them in parallel then the reading would be in the ballpark.

Thanks for the quick reply mate. Yep, they're 0.47 ohm each and it's a dual coil build. Sorry if this is a stupid question but why would it read 0.25 instead of 0.47? I'd be really interested in some links that would give me a better understanding if you could throw them my way.
 

Markw4mms

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http://www.steam-engine.org/ohm.asp

Steam Engine will help you figure out anything you need to know for safe building. In a nutshell, when you're running dual coils they are connected in parallel which means the resistance is half of the resistance of a single coil (given that the two coils are of the same resistance value)
 

MannyScoot

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23g or 24g kanthal is a large diameter for moving a current ... It will ohm low specially when you hit low wraps (4) or (5) or (6) wraps.... To get them to ohm higher you need to go more wraps..... But .25 is correct to be safe on a parallel mod.

I'm not a professional coil Maker but I had problems with 24gauge kanthal when I began vaping.... Getting it to ohm above .20 .....

I needed a lot of wraps and making tigers and other wraps to get it corrected. But using steam engine or a coil app should make it simpler and without less headaches......

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk
 

MannyScoot

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I started using Vape Tool app

It's free and very good.... I loved Steam Engine but I lost my phone with the app and now I have to pay for the new app.

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk
 

TrackDay

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http://www.steam-engine.org/ohm.asp

Steam Engine will help you figure out anything you need to know for safe building. In a nutshell, when you're running dual coils they are connected in parallel which means the resistance is half of the resistance of a single coil (given that the two coils are of the same resistance value)

Ah makes sense! Thanks for the link I'll definitely be checking that out.

23g or 24g kanthal is a large diameter for moving a current ... It will ohm low specially when you hit low wraps (4) or (5) or (6) wraps.... To get them to ohm higher you need to go more wraps..... But .25 is correct to be safe on a parallel mod.

I'm not a professional coil Maker but I had problems with 24gauge kanthal when I began vaping.... Getting it to ohm above .20 .....

I needed a lot of wraps and making tigers and other wraps to get it corrected. But using steam engine or a coil app should make it simpler and without less headaches......

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

Thanks for the reply mate. I'm going to check out steam engine and I've just got an app on my phone to help me as well. I'm currently using an IPV6x for my RDA's and the book doesn't specify the lowest ohms it can handle. Will 0.25 be safe with this mod? I'm assuming so as I just read about another guy running 0.16 ohms using the same mod.

Thanks again guys.
 

nightshard

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Thanks for the quick reply mate. Yep, they're 0.47 ohm each and it's a dual coil build. Sorry if this is a stupid question but why would it read 0.25 instead of 0.47? I'd be really interested in some links that would give me a better understanding if you could throw them my way.

Think of it like this, you have a water pipe that can pass X amount of water, if you had another identical water pipe running next to it they would pass 2X amount of water.
 

TrackDay

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Think of it like this, you have a water pipe that can pass X amount of water, if you had another identical water pipe running next to it they would pass 2X amount of water.

Great analogy. Makes me understand it that little bit more. Thanks!
 

MannyScoot

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Ah makes sense! Thanks for the link I'll definitely be checking that out.



Thanks for the reply mate. I'm going to check out steam engine and I've just got an app on my phone to help me as well. I'm currently using an IPV6x for my RDA's and the book doesn't specify the lowest ohms it can handle. Will 0.25 be safe with this mod? I'm assuming so as I just read about another guy running 0.16 ohms using the same mod.

Thanks again guys.
Well on wattage power mode you can go .15 to .25 ohms the mod will not let you fire usually below .15

But on TC the mod let's you go down to... .08 ohms and some mods to .05 because the temperature control wire is usually softer and will not burn as hot as Kanthal.

Think of wire as a highway.... Thicker wire 24gauge 22 gauge 20gauge is a thick highway and it allows a lot of cars or in this view electric current.....

Which means lots of power running through the wire.....

Thinner 30gauge to 38 gauge is very thin and only a few cars can travel on that little highway..... Or very little power..... So this thin wire heats up very fast.....

So for more vapor you need thick wire to cover more area on the cotton but you need power to heat it up quickly, this is what heats up your battery, giving too many amps of power for 6 to 10 seconds which is what blows up batteries and mods.....

So the safest is to use builds, mods, and batteries that will not hurt or kill you.... This is what created regulated mods....

They know what wattage, what wire and what batteries your putting in her, and when the mod sees a fail-safe is wrong it will not let you operate it !!!!

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk
 

TrackDay

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Well on wattage power mode you can go .15 to .25 ohms the mod will not let you fire usually below .15

But on TC the mod let's you go down to... .08 ohms and some mods to .05 because the temperature control wire is usually softer and will not burn as hot as Kanthal.

Think of wire as a highway.... Thicker wire 24gauge 22 gauge 20gauge is a thick highway and it allows a lot of cars or in this view electric current.....

Which means lots of power running through the wire.....

Thinner 30gauge to 38 gauge is very thin and only a few cars can travel on that little highway..... Or very little power..... So this thin wire heats up very fast.....

So for more vapor you need thick wire to cover more area on the cotton but you need power to heat it up quickly, this is what heats up your battery, giving too many amps of power for 6 to 10 seconds which is what blows up batteries and mods.....

So the safest is to use builds, mods, and batteries that will not hurt or kill you.... This is what created regulated mods....

They know what wattage, what wire and what batteries your putting in her, and when the mod sees a fail-safe is wrong it will not let you operate it !!!!

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

Awesome! Thanks for that explanation, it definitely helped me understand things a lot better. I'm loving VU so far, everybody is so helpful.
 

MannyScoot

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Awesome! Thanks for that explanation, it definitely helped me understand things a lot better. I'm loving VU so far, everybody is so helpful.
Keep vaping and hope you never touch another fucking cigarette........

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TrackDay

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steamengine.png

Another question if you guys don't mind. With a resistance of 0.53 does steam engine adjust the power to what would be a safe wattage to vape at that resistance?
 

MannyScoot

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You need to click on those little boxes on top where it says, resistance, voltage, current,power.... You always enter (2) numbers ohms, wattage or voltage or watts and ohms.....

The app gives you voltage or amps... That's where you see if your batteries can handle the amp draw or voltage...

But for a regulated mod this should be of no interest to you...

These settings are for series or parallel mods.....

On a series mod you have voltage you know it's 8.4v or 12.1volts and you put (2) coils that's for example .10 and it gives you a wattage of 800 watts you can see there is no way you can vape that high so now you have to make (2) more coils......

Then you enter again (2) coils that together they are 2.0ohms now the wattage might drop to 100 watts....

So now you build (2) coils at .25 ohms and your voltage on your mod is 3.2volts..... The app tells you your wattage of 40.96 watts and your amp pull on your Batts is 12.8 amps.... This means if you have batteries rated at 20amps your good to go...... Batteries less than 15 amps or 10 amps could vent....... This means you will destroy your mod or batteries will leak and blow.

So the most important thing in vaping is safe and good high amp batteries.....

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk
 
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TrackDay

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You need to click on those little boxes on top where it says, resistance, voltage, current,power.... You always enter (2) numbers ohms, wattage or voltage or watts and ohms.....

The app gives you voltage or amps... That's where you see if your batteries can handle the amp draw or voltage...

But for a regulated mod this should be of no interest to you...

These settings are for series or parallel mods.....

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

Thanks for clearing that up for me mate.
 

gbalkam

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Hey guys,

I just put two new prebuilt 23G 0.47 OHM kanthal coils into my flawless we our here doe RDA and I'm getting an OHM reading of 0.25. I've put it on my coil master OHM reader and my mod and they're both reading it at 0.25. My post screws are tight and both coils are firing perfectly, heating from the inside outwards. What have I done wrong to get such a low reading? I've put together 0.36 OHM tiger coils into my Vaperz Cloud X1 Competition RDA which read almost a perfect 0.37 so I'm not really sure what I've done wrong. Any answers or solutions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!
When you use 2 or more coils in series (we'll stick to 2 for this example) the resistance is halved. ( quad (4) coils, resistance would be quartered). Your ohm reader is accurate to 0.04 ohm. Count the 0.47 ohm coils as 0.5 ohm, x2 = 25 ohm (which allows for the 0.04 ohm accuracy)

It sounds to me, like the coil you are using now were sold as individual coils, whereas the tiger coils were sold as a paired set. Resistance has to be the same on each coil so some coils are sold as paired sets. In other words, if you tested only 1 of the tigers, you would find the resistance was double what they said it was for the pair.

steamengine is a great tool. For prebuilding coils on "paper", studying wire/coil theory, testing different coil configurations without scrapping a ton of wire. (LOL.. I have nearly 1000 feet of various wire behind me in my build box)

Your main concern should be keeping your amps above your mod minimum and below its maximum. Then setting up your coils within your mods watt range (up to 200w?) and adjust the watts to get the vape you like.

Now eventually, like most of us, you will feel like tinkering around, and building your own coils. Lots of help for that as well, just ask when you are ready. I'm avoiding that here to keep it simple. :)
 

TrackDay

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When you use 2 or more coils in series (we'll stick to 2 for this example) the resistance is halved. ( quad (4) coils, resistance would be quartered). Your ohm reader is accurate to 0.04 ohm. Count the 0.47 ohm coils as 0.5 ohm, x2 = 25 ohm (which allows for the 0.04 ohm accuracy)

It sounds to me, like the coil you are using now were sold as individual coils, whereas the tiger coils were sold as a paired set. Resistance has to be the same on each coil so some coils are sold as paired sets. In other words, if you tested only 1 of the tigers, you would find the resistance was double what they said it was for the pair.

steamengine is a great tool. For prebuilding coils on "paper", studying wire/coil theory, testing different coil configurations without scrapping a ton of wire. (LOL.. I have nearly 1000 feet of various wire behind me in my build box)

Your main concern should be keeping your amps above your mod minimum and below its maximum. Then setting up your coils within your mods watt range (up to 200w?) and adjust the watts to get the vape you like.

Now eventually, like most of us, you will feel like tinkering around, and building your own coils. Lots of help for that as well, just ask when you are ready. I'm avoiding that here to keep it simple. :)

Thanks for the reply mate and the great info. I'll definitely start building my own coils soon as it's a cheaper option than buying the premades! I'm sure I'll be back here to bug you guys with heaps of questions haha. I've been playing around with steamengine today and from what I can gather 0.25 ohms at 70w brings the amps to 16.73 which is safe to use with my 20amp samsung 18650's. I can't seem to find the safe working amps for my mod in the booklet and after some googling no luck either.

steamengine.png
 

gbalkam

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23g or 24g kanthal is a large diameter for moving a current ... It will ohm low specially when you hit low wraps (4) or (5) or (6) wraps.... To get them to ohm higher you need to go more wraps..... But .25 is correct to be safe on a parallel mod.

I'm not a professional coil Maker but I had problems with 24gauge kanthal when I began vaping.... Getting it to ohm above .20 .....

I needed a lot of wraps and making tigers and other wraps to get it corrected. But using steam engine or a coil app should make it simpler and without less headaches......

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

Not quite as stupid a question as it might sound at first but... are you sure you were using 24ga kanthal? It only takes 5 wraps for dual coil (5 wraps per coil, 2.5mm core) to hit 0.20+ ohm. Now, stainless steel.. THAT would be a total bugger.
 

gbalkam

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Thanks for the reply mate and the great info. I'll definitely start building my own coils soon as it's a cheaper option than buying the premades! I'm sure I'll be back here to bug you guys with heaps of questions haha. I've been playing around with steamengine today and from what I can gather 0.25 ohms at 70w brings the amps to 16.73 which is safe to use with my 20amp samsung 18650's. I can't seem to find the safe working amps for my mod in the booklet and after some googling no luck either.

View attachment 65823

I get my wire from http://www.kidneypuncher.com/ I buy in 100ft or 250 ft spools. 30ft spool costs me $8 at the local shop.. 250ft cost me $18 at kidney puncher... and especially if you do claptons, you will want the larger spools. 30ft of 30ga isnt much wire.
 

TrackDay

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I get my wire from http://www.kidneypuncher.com/ I buy in 100ft or 250 ft spools. 30ft spool costs me $8 at the local shop.. 250ft cost me $18 at kidney puncher... and especially if you do claptons, you will want the larger spools. 30ft of 30ga isnt much wire.

Cheers for the link, I'll definitely be getting on that. I've got a spool of 24g kanthal that came with my coil master kit but I doubt that will be enough once I start building coils because I'll surely make mistakes and it will take me a bit of wire to get things perfect.
 

gbalkam

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I always had problems with 24g Kanthal......

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk
Might just be the coil build. I build for clouds, straight single wire staple coil. No fancy twists or wraps. Building a fancy coil with 24ga would be a bugger though, 3 strands for example, would give the same resistance as 22g kanthal. I think I have to order a couple 26g spools, Im kind of interested in making some of the fancy coils now.. just as a hobby. By the way, vaping and coil building as a hobby is a great way to get off ciggies.. If you spend 8 hours building a coil, you aren't thinking about lighting a smoke.. or vaping.. lol.
 

TrackDay

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Just had another look through the book and I found the input and output amp levels for my mod. Output current: 1.0A - 45.0A - Input current: 1.3A - 45.0A.
 

gbalkam

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Cheers for the link, I'll definitely be getting on that. I've got a spool of 24g kanthal that came with my coil master kit but I doubt that will be enough once I start building coils because I'll surely make mistakes and it will take me a bit of wire to get things perfect.
And get some 3 x reading glasses from the dollar store.. Mine cost $1.50 and saved my sanity. Very handy if you forget how many wraps you did.. I ended up with 1 coil having 7 wraps, the other having 8.. and having to count the coils on the mod.. thank God for the dollar store. LOL

Keep your coils simple to start with. Once you get good at building simple coils, it will help when you go to build fancy ones.

I found a neat little trick to use when wrapping 2 strands of wire for making a clapton.. I made a "spring" from some wire. Put the spring on top of my 2 core wires to seperate them, and pushed a round toothpick inside the spring and under the wires.. and just kept moving it back as I wrapped the wire. (It helps keep the core from twisting...)
 

gbalkam

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Just had another look through the book and I found the input and output amp levels for my mod. Output current: 1.0A - 45.0A - Input current: 1.3A - 45.0A.
Sounds about right for a dual cell mod. (series battery set up)

Your mods software will keep you within those limits, so nothing to really worry about. Regulated mods are great for learning. The only thing you need to worry about is having good batteries and a very good quality charger.
 

gbalkam

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Another question if you guys don't mind. With a resistance of 0.53 does steam engine adjust the power to what would be a safe wattage to vape at that resistance?

One MAJOR thing here.. for your voltage value.. always use 4.2v as that value. Or multiple of 4.2 according to your number of batteries and set up. (2 batteries in series use 8.4v) This is essential. Mostly that ohms law calc is for use with mechanical mods. A fully charged single cell is 4.2V, not 3.7 as printed on the label. If you do your calculations for a super sub ohm coil, using 3.5V and your battery is actually 4.2V you could have big trouble. To see what i mean, change the V from 3.5 to 4.2 and note how the other values change. I mention this, since the ohms law calc is mostly used for mechanical mods, since on a regulated mod, like you have, the software handles all that.
 

TrackDay

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Sounds about right for a dual cell mod. (series battery set up)

Your mods software will keep you within those limits, so nothing to really worry about. Regulated mods are great for learning. The only thing you need to worry about is having good batteries and a very good quality charger.

Sounds good! I'm using samsung 18650's and an efest charger. Unfortunately the first efest charger I bought from my local vape shop stopped working after 2 days. I ended up taking it back to the shop and they gave me a new one which has been working great.
 

MannyScoot

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I make coils with 8 wraps and the second with six .... They don't have to be the same.....

If one coil is a 6 wrap it will heat up first the the second coil kicks in a second later.... It might increase flavor or a cooler vape or bigger clouds.....

Vaping is about experiments !!!!

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk
 

TrackDay

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One MAJOR thing here.. for your voltage value.. always use 4.2v as that value. Or multiple of 4.2 according to your number of batteries and set up. (2 batteries in series use 8.4v) This is essential. Mostly that ohms law calc is for use with mechanical mods. A fully charged single cell is 4.2V, not 3.7 as printed on the label. If you do your calculations for a super sub ohm coil, using 3.5V and your battery is actually 4.2V you could have big trouble. To see what i mean, change the V from 3.5 to 4.2 and note how the other values change. I mention this, since the ohms law calc is mostly used for mechanical mods, since on a regulated mod, like you have, the software handles all that.

Ah more great info! Thanks for being so helpful.
 

gbalkam

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Im using the same efest charger. It is one of the highest rated, most widely used chargers. Efest batteries... not so much. Stick to Sony, LG or Samsung. They cost a dollar or 2 more, but you know exactly what you are getting and their quality control is outstanding. Efest are actually factory 2nds from samsung, lg or sony. Factory 2nds did not pass the quality control to let them be sold under the brand names. And for my money, with the builds I work with.. knowing exactly what that batterys specs are is vital. I was using a 0.07 ohm build on a mechanical mod. Not for beginners. So top quality batteries are a must. Right now, im only using a 0.19 dual coil build, just for vaping while i type on here. Saves me some battery time as well. lol
I figure, start buying top end batteries, right from the start, so you get used to only using top end batteries.. best way to go.
 

TrackDay

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Im using the same efest charger. It is one of the highest rated, most widely used chargers. Efest batteries... not so much. Stick to Sony, LG or Samsung. They cost a dollar or 2 more, but you know exactly what you are getting and their quality control is outstanding. Efest are actually factory 2nds from samsung, lg or sony. Factory 2nds did not pass the quality control to let them be sold under the brand names. And for my money, with the builds I work with.. knowing exactly what that batterys specs are is vital. I was using a 0.07 ohm build on a mechanical mod. Not for beginners. So top quality batteries are a must. Right now, im only using a 0.19 dual coil build, just for vaping while i type on here. Saves me some battery time as well. lol
I figure, start buying top end batteries, right from the start, so you get used to only using top end batteries.. best way to go.

Yeah, I actually found that out after watching a battery safety video yesterday. I wouldn't dare buy them. Lucky my local vape shop is the best in the country ( Australia ) and they only carry high quality authentic products with awesome prices and they're super knowledgeable. They even quiz you before they will sell you a mech mod!
 

gbalkam

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I make coils with 8 wraps and the second with six .... They don't have to be the same.....

If one coil is a 6 wrap it will heat up first the the second coil kicks in a second later.... It might increase flavor or a cooler vape or bigger clouds.....

Vaping is about experiments !!!!

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk
Well if that is what you like. Not something I would recommend. You can get the same result with dual 7 wraps and lowering the wattage a bit. This will do 2 things.. you will get a cooler vape from the start (more uniform) and both wicks will draw evenly, You might notice, the 6 coil wick is burning more than the 8 wrap, so needs to be changed more often to maintain peak flavor. Or if you like the vape you get toward the end of the draw, try dual 8 wrap coils. Just something to try out and see if you like the results.
LOL.. i build a L O T of coils. I have a half 200g tobacco can half full of old coils and wire bits. Sad part is, i build a quad coil yesterday, ohms came out way lower than expected, so i had to trash the whole set. Well.. i split the set into 2 dual coils.. but same result.

OH.. btw.. you would get bigger clouds from 2x 8 wrap coils and more wattage. You have to play with the airflow a bit as well. To much air, your clouds will be thing, to little and they will be smaller (your draw will be to long).
 
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gbalkam

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Yeah, I actually found that out after watching a battery safety video yesterday. I wouldn't dare buy them. Lucky my local vape shop is the best in the country ( Australia ) and they only carry high quality authentic products with awesome prices and they're super knowledgeable. They even quiz you before they will sell you a mech mod!
Same as my vape shop guy. Jason is the guy that sells the mechs. I have to pass a quiz before he will sell me a series mech. He knew I know about building so I got my mech without a quiz, but he already knew that I knew the info. He's seen my builds. lol
 

MannyScoot

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Well if that is what you like. Not something I would recommend. You can get the same result with dual 7 wraps and lowering the wattage a bit. This will do 2 things.. you will get a cooler vape from the start (more uniform) and both wicks will draw evenly, You might notice, the 6 coil wick is burning more than the 8 wrap, so needs to be changed more often to maintain peak flavor. Or if you like the vape you get toward the end of the draw, try dual 8 wrap coils. Just something to try out and see if you like the results.
LOL.. i build a L O T of coils. I have a half 200g tobacco can half full of old coils and wire bits. Sad part is, i build a quad coil yesterday, ohms came out way lower than expected, so i had to trash the whole set. Well.. i split the set into 2 dual coils.. but same result.
Here I have coils with different wraps and they fire all immediately and burn the same......
C360_2016-11-02-01-06-01-024.jpg

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gbalkam

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Here I have coils with different wraps and they fire all immediately and burn the same......
View attachment 65853

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Ok there is a reason .. they are different coils. To get the 2 coils with the extra out side wrapping to heat up the same as the ones without, you do need less wraps. This is because the outer wraps act as a heat sink, until they heat up. I think there was some confusion about what I was talking about.. i was referring to identical coils. Nice job though getting those mixed coils to fire in sync. Looks like a nice build. Im just using a simple dual 6 wrap nichrome set up (24ga). Running on a single cell mech. I have my cloud build set aside for now.
 

gbalkam

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Just for fun...
DO NOT try this build unless you are very comfortable building and using a mech mod. There is a lot of math and research involved here, such as how much stress the battery I am using can handle, how long I can pull for, how many pulls I can do, how long between pulls, This is NOT a beginner build. You also need to know what to do if something happens, such as the fire button gets stuck. This build pulls 50A from a single cell, for 2.5 seconds. Cell was stress tested at 70A for 5 seconds.. but that is something you need to find out before hand.


This is not for new vapers but it does show what is possible when you advance.

By the way.. you can do the same build using Kanthal or NiChrome on a 200w regulated mod. It should work pretty good.
8 wraps, 20ga Kanthal comes out to 0.15 ohm and you need to fire at 150W to 180W
 
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TrackDay

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Just for fun...
DO NOT try this build unless you are very comfortable building and using a mech mod. There is a lot of math and research involved here, such as how much stress the battery I am using can handle, how long I can pull for, how many pulls I can do, how long between pulls, This is NOT a beginner build. You also need to know what to do if something happens, such as the fire button gets stuck. This build pulls 50A from a single cell, for 2.5 seconds. Cell was stress tested at 70A for 5 seconds.. but that is something you need to find out before hand.


This is not for new vapers but it does show what is possible when you advance.

By the way.. you can do the same build using Kanthal or NiChrome on a 200w regulated mod. It should work pretty good.
8 wraps, 20ga Kanthal comes out to 0.15 ohm and you need to fire at 150W to 180W

Damn, the vapor production off that build is insane!
 

gbalkam

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Damn, the vapor production off that build is insane!
3.0 mm core, 7 wraps of 20ga stainless steel. The math is insane. 50 amps at 220w on an R25. That's why I say not a build for beginners on a mech. The "Oh if HE can do it, so can I" statement doesn't even come close to applying here. I spent 12 hours of research before firing that. Battery chemistry, quality, stress testing, how long I can fire for and how long it will take the battery to heat. I check my battery temp every 3rd pull. Just in case..
It isn't all about safety either, its also about what to do if something goes wrong, like a bit of wire landing inside the atty and causing a short.. just for example. The battery I use is designed to vent out down to 0 volts in case of a hard short, but again, thats part of what you need to know too.And of course, lots of hole in the mod to allow for venting. Battery venting is kind of redundant if your mod blows up. Mod with no vent holes is a pipe bomb.
 

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