Resistance wire safety guide

Discussion in 'General Rebuildable Discussion (RTA/RBA/RDA)' started by 5150sick, Feb 28, 2016.

  1. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Yep I stick with SS and Kanthal, my favorite is SS 317L. Wrapping my own fused Clapton with 28x2 371L and 32 304 wrapper. I can't seem to find any gauge smaller than 32 in 304 and 28 with 316 or 317. So the deck I'm building for determines if I'm using SS or Kanthal.

    Best source of SS wire I've found is from Unkamen supply on Esty, very clean and quality SS wire. I think I last paid $10 for 40ft of 317L 28 gauge.
    I also tried the 430 SS (nickel free), jury is still out on that so far (I'm still trying it out).

    What I like about SS is that the flavor is cleaner and more crisp, it does have a little bit of a break in period though. Which as suggested in earlier post that torching the coils helps allot with that. I always torch my wire and coils prior though, serves both to anneal the wire to shape them just right.
     
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  2. boygood

    boygood New Member

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    thank you very much. I learn
     
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  3. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Seems it would be easier if companies sold it tempered or annealed already right? I am curious if the 430 gives the same break in metal taste by itself without the 316 or 17???
    The metal taste issues really make me less thrilled about having fresh coils(which was previously a highlight), and have to admit a bit nervous. I feel like vaping shouldnt be about fighting through a bad taste to enjoy it. Just my opinion so dont feel like Im ragging on any type of wire in particular, I went to T/C from Kanthal b/c I just hated burnin the coils and how horrible the taste was. I also think it made me cough quite a bit which is not in the direction I wanna go either lol. At least with the stainless I will be able to dry burn instead of waiting as long for the break in. With Ti I was juicing the coils and just holding the button and blowing the vapor off instead of inhaling it to help break it in, I normally dont waste but that taste is not pleasant :confused:
     
  4. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Last edited: Mar 12, 2016
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  5. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Been vaping for a bit over a week with 430 on one of my RDA's and one of my Tank's, not really liking it. Maybe it's just me but not enjoying the flavor. I like 316L and 317L much better.

    How I build I use a torch to anneal and then shape my coils before installing. This allows also to break the coils in.

    Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
     
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  6. 5150sick

    5150sick Under Ground Hustler Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee

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    I think the reason NI200 was deemed "safe" to vape by elvolv was because they weren't expecting anyone to vape it above 550 degrees.
    I usually set them at around 450 - 480.
    The melting point of Nickel is well over 600 degrees which is the max any TC mods will let it go.

    There are people that I heard who vape it in power mode but I think that is a really, really bad idea.

    I ordered some stock kanger subtank coils that were 1.5 ohms off of eBay to use with my mini volt figuring that vaping at 15 to 20 watts will have better battery life than vaping at 0.5 ohms.

    The asshole that I bought them from sent me 0.15 ohm Ni200 coils.

    I loaded the coil up in the subtank, fired it in power mode at 20 watts and took a vape before knowing that the coils were wrong.....

    Worst Vaping Experience EVER!!!


    I will never make that mistake again.

    The crazy part was the coils had the red ring on the bottom so I never bothered to check the ohms.
    I had never seen a stock kanger subtank NI200 coil that didn't have a blue ring instead
    They are probably shitty clones but they could have still sprung for the blue fucking grommet so no one would make that mistake
     
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  7. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Definitely know the feeling of doing something dumb like that with nickel. I think all wires let you know when they've had enough, but I blame myself for pushing the limits and playing with the device/features too often:p......
    Just got my 28 ga 316L in the mail today and gotta wait til Monday for the 32 ga so gonna try some twisted 28 for now and have already used the torching tips! First thoughts are very good after torching(turned it kind of gold color) and dry burn a tad(turned dk blue) and barely any metal taste at all. Break in even after pre-coil torching with Ti was tough to deal with. I found a link to a site that sold Ti that says its got a bright shiny surface finish. Anyone elses Ti like that? If so I may be sending this wire back......Edit:getting better at pre-torching and no problems now!!
    Anyways SS seems similar to kanthal in ramp up and flavor and wow this resistance is really high compared to my previous builds:eek:! I thought previously that lower resistance had to be better ramp up but with Ti it seemed to be the opposite. It also seems like the TCR has to be a bit more accurate with ss than with other wires? Im having a hard time finding a sweet spot.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2016
  8. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    What TCR anyone using on 316L? Just wondering the general range people are using.....Also had some problems burning and drying the wick on T/C mode and I am thinking SS must be wicked loosely like nickel where Ti and Kanthal I kind of found the opposite works better. Wanting to know if that was the general suggestion on wicking SS??
     
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  9. 5150sick

    5150sick Under Ground Hustler Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee

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    I'm having some pretty good luck with a TCR value of 150 for 316L Stainless.
    This chart gave me a pretty good idea where to start then it was trial and error from there:
     

    Attached Files:

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  10. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Perfect.....I didnt even know they released a pdf for the rx. I also didnt know there was such a wide TCR range for SS:cool:THANKS!
     
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  11. Wingsfan0310

    Wingsfan0310 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I've been using SS430 from Unkamen Supplies for awhile now. I really like it in TC since it's TCR is ~50% higher than 316 and 317. I get no off taste from it and it's much less finicky in TC because of it's higher TCR. It's all I use now.

    Cheers,
    Steve
     
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  12. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Thanks steve I will have to give this a shot when my 316 runs out! I heard it was tough to get the 32 ga portion of it to make claptons but I am sure itll be easier soon enough. I am having issues with getting it just right and have burned a few coils already. I like being able to torch them back but it seems like that taste doesnt quite completely go away even after torching and new cotton.
     
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  13. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    EDIT:UPDATE: I think I was definitely incorrect about wicks and started wicking coils very tightly instead of lightly. It has helped keep them from burning as much as they were before. I thought I wasnt wicking loose enough but seems to work better the opposite way.
     
  14. Wingsfan0310

    Wingsfan0310 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Here's a chart that might come in handy.
    [​IMG]

    Cheers,
    Steve
     
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  15. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Been on a mission to find small gauge SS, found it here and they ship to the US.

    I got a bunch, including 32 & 34 gauge.

    http://www.wireandstuff.co.uk/products/Stainless


    Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
     
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  16. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Those resistances were not a good starting point to me...Im not sure if the rx is off but 92 was way too low for 316 even twisted it seemed like it was barely working and hits the temp control wall quickly and stopped heating up. I am finding a sweet spot of resistance around .4 on SS316L and a TCR around 125 to work best. Ti has been around .2 ohms and 400 TCR for me anyways. Even store bought coils I never got goin good with the ranges they gave us on those charts......Im guessing they were meant for much higher resistances that you would not see in vaping??:confused:

    That link was broken but I checked out the site....Is the wire clean? I saw they have 31ga SS430 I guess thats close enough to 32ga. Might be trying 430 claptons next as I like SS but seems to be too easy to burn in t/c mode at times and the resistance keeps changing by like .01 and next thing you know it taste bad.....After the coil broke in on the SS builds I have done so far, I have had to re-tighten leads and the resistance changes a bit......I hope thats common and im not just losin it!! Probably normal things I can get custom to if using SS for a while, but its really throwin me for a loop starting off not knowing much about it and I HATE burning claptons! I take pride in making them and enjoying them so if I burn one shortly after putting it in I get really upset:mad:. I do like that with SS the coil isnt completely gone but re-wicking and all is just an extra unnecessary headache...
     
  17. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Not sure yet on the wire, this is my first order.

    As for TC, I've had decent luck except fused Clapton's don't seem to work as well. But haven't been messing around with it for some time now, I've currently been on a Mech Mod kick. Pending Vape Apocalypse has got me prepping for it.

    Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
     
  18. SgtRock

    SgtRock Bronze Contributor ECF Refugee

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  19. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Great news I was waiting on them to carry SS..........I love Temco wire!! Wish I hadnt bought a roll somewhere else before you posted though....

    Sent from my LGMS345 using Tapatalk
     
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  20. raymo2u

    raymo2u VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    There are much cheaper wire out there with the same quality as Temco..

    Here ya go:
    LINK for SS bundle
    LINK for N80 Lower/Mid Gauges Bundle, Link for High Gauges Bundle
    LINK for KA1 Bundle

    This should set you up for anything..
     
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  21. SgtRock

    SgtRock Bronze Contributor ECF Refugee

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    I'm sure that vendor is fine and of course everyone is free to shop wherever they please but personally I'm not interested in bundles --and for me 13 bucks for 500 feet of exactly what I'm looking for is just fine.

    Maybe some would rather shop Ebay but Temco has always treated me right so I will keep supporting them.
     
  22. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    I bought SS wire from kbee vapes, wiped it with an alcohol soaked paper towel and there was a slight grey residue. I wont buy any more wire from them personally, they didnt even care to offer a replacement. The other wire I just recieved was from "Master of Clouds" and is clean as a whistle around the same price as kbee vapes if you only want a small amount.....also they offer full warranty on everything" no questions asked" return policy. I am also a fan of Temco as I never had any issues with them or their products either. I bought all my Temco wire on Ebay through @SgtRock ;)
     
  23. raymo2u

    raymo2u VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    Could be why its cheaper, maybe QC isnt as high but if your washing your coils before use like you should then it shouldnt be a problem. If quality is something your worried about then I would go with Kidney Puncher wire (Sandvik Wire).
     
  24. SgtRock

    SgtRock Bronze Contributor ECF Refugee

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    I use Temco and have never had to wash any wire coming from them.

    To each his own...
     
  25. raymo2u

    raymo2u VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    Whether its clean when you get it or not you should still wash your coils if you made them with your hands, if you used a macro lens to see whats left on them afterwards you'd understand why...
     
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  26. Ryedan

    Ryedan Silver Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    The first thought I had when I read this was that SS also has chromium in it. That's what gives it its stainless quality :). Googled and found it's around 16-20% for the typical wires we use.

    Another interesting thing is there's between 8-14% nickel in it.

    I don't worry about the chrome in Kanthal or SS. I just don't heat up my wires past a dull glow when dry burning. Takes a bit longer to get them clean, but it's still so fast it's for all intents irrelevant.
     
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  27. SgtRock

    SgtRock Bronze Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Red hot cures what ails them IMO...I burn them to make sure they have no hot spots after rolling them and if there's anything left after that I'd be amazed.
     
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  28. raymo2u

    raymo2u VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    True but some metals you shouldnt glow, its just good practice. You wouldnt want to eat something that someone made with their hands working in a restaurant...well most of us wouldnt.

    The concept of clean wire when coming from a supplier isnt being white glove clean, its how it was stored, what materials the wire may have touched, were the same machines milling lead or other toxic metals around the same time? Was it cleaned after being stored near other metals? This is why most people dont buy wire from China and companies like KP offer higher standards...if you want cheap wire like I posted before the conditions of storing and machining are in question while places like KidneyPuncher charge a bit more.
     
  29. SgtRock

    SgtRock Bronze Contributor ECF Refugee

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    I hear what you are saying @raymo2u but I've yet to get any "dirty" wire from Temco which is one reason among several that I will continue to buy wire from them. The 500 feet of 316 I just got from them is spotless and according to them they take particular care to keep it clean during processing.
     
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  30. Ding

    Ding VU Donator Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    temco is my goto also,for a few years but have ordered from kbee.just got a large roll of master of clouds 316l yesterday,it was clean plus organic cotton..as for clean,hell,I can can walk by a bunch of bugs and they'll drop over dead from all the chems that my body has been exposed to.
    I just clean my wire in a couple stages then roll it.
    just tryin to find a sweet spot for SS and a nice coil to work.
     
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  31. SgtRock

    SgtRock Bronze Contributor ECF Refugee

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    @Ding I've settled on dual parallel 26 ga SS316s for my velocity attys.

    7 or 8 wraps @3mm works like a charm on my new rx200S
     
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  32. Ding

    Ding VU Donator Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    thanks sarge,waiting on my 200S to get here.gonna start rippin into it right now and dodge KP lol.got a segelei 150 tc to play with
     
  33. SgtRock

    SgtRock Bronze Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Hope you enjoy!
     
  34. Ding

    Ding VU Donator Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    @SgtRock thanks bud,will try it in my velocity and tsunami decks.

    as I'm stickin with one type SS wire right now,316L, I do wanna expand just to experiment.no Ni in the future though.
     
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  35. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    I have been doing a fused clapton all 316L 28g inner 32g outer....SS coil process for me works best by making coils, torching wire, then putting them on and wicking. I mostly use tweezers to do that part and twisted SS worked great as well but it is not the easiest to work with because its so strong. Once the coils are in place you can pretty much drop the rda on the floor and itll keep shape, for the most part.... I always wick SS TIGHT and burn the coils before installing or the post will leave a bit of an odd taste for a while. Sometimes I still just start at a lower temp like 370 vs norm 470 until its broken in but if I am impatient ill fire it while I blow on it like birthday candles:confetti:(make sure cotton stays soaked tho)
     
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  36. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    I clean the inner core wire with alcohol (100 proof Vodka) before I wrap, what do you recommend how to clean the spool of small gauge wrapping wire?

    Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
     
  37. raymo2u

    raymo2u VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    I use a Ultra sonic cleaner after a Imake the coils, let them go through atleast 2 runs. If you dont have a USC I would suggest scrubbing your coils with a toothbrush and some Dawn soap then rinse them in warm water.
     
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  38. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    MMMMM sounds good, I've been using my ultrasonic after I pulse clean my coils when rewicking, makes common sense to do this after wrapping new coils.... Lol don't know why I didn't think of that earlier.....

    Thanks raymo!

    Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
     
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  39. NGAHaze

    NGAHaze Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I've never done that with my kanthal coils ... is this something you do specific to SS or complex coil builds? I always figured pulsing them prior to use should suffice but now I'm not so sure, lol.
     
  40. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Also I picked up some non toxic jewelry cleaner, works excellent! It's safe to use for vape gear (they list it as safe for dentures).

    It's Katzco jewelry cleaner, got it from Amazon

    Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
     
  41. raymo2u

    raymo2u VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    You will notice your coil can color better if you dont pulse to orange, pulse just right before orange for N80 or bright orange for Kanthal...when they are dirty is doesnt color well also!

    I would do it for anything your hands touch...Here's a shot under a standard 10x Macro lens...it gets worse when magnified even more and I BARELY put my hands on this wire...Look all over it you can see skin flakes/matter all over it, even where I havent put my fingers on it...

    Macro Framed Staple.png
     
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  42. NGAHaze

    NGAHaze Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Thanks, I see what you mean and really it does make sense ... better safe than sorry, right? :)
     
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  43. raymo2u

    raymo2u VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 2 Years Unlisted Vendor

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    You ever notice when you first go to dryburn your coils and there are little gases/smoke that comes off of it? Thats what is burning off at first ;)
     
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  44. advancedvapesupply

    advancedvapesupply Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year Unlisted Vendor

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    You already know what I'm gonna say.... :D

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
     
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  45. advancedvapesupply

    advancedvapesupply Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year Unlisted Vendor

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    You really don't want to torch 316L to a hard glowing point, it can damage the metal / release potentially harmful compounds

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
     
  46. advancedvapesupply

    advancedvapesupply Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year Unlisted Vendor

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    We've had customers claim it was our wire doing that...I had to explain...no man...that's oils from your fingers....

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
     
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  47. Ding

    Ding VU Donator Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    been watching your SS builds on the tube,go figure,was actually gonna post a vid elsewhere for a build.
     
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  48. advancedvapesupply

    advancedvapesupply Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year Unlisted Vendor

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    :D

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
     
  49. Ding

    Ding VU Donator Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    I can't get past the 100 proof for my inner core.I wake up and have to start over.:D
    I use a ultra sonic cleaner on the spools also
     
  50. VAPESWAPSHOP

    VAPESWAPSHOP VU Donator Bronze Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    I bought a small propane torch and just kind of quickly run it back and forth over it without holding it in one spot too long....If they end up getting too hot they start to bend on me. I am not familiar with dry burning and still have issues when cleaning ss coils.....I can only really tell when the lights are off but that gunk on the last row or two of wraps never gets burned off. What would be the safest compound of SS wire to dry burn?
     

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