SS Vs. NI200

Discussion in 'Coil Building' started by GorGon27, Dec 13, 2016.

  1. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I have used Prebuilt coils in a number of Atty's. To me SS simply Sucks! Yet, every company has moved away from NI200. What the hell is up with this? I need a serious tank with NI200 coils. Some are only Kanthal now. On that note what is up with TC now? This is bullshit to me. I had a great vape going until these bastards killed it. I doubt it is health. Do the Chinese care about our health?. Fuck, I would think if it was not for our money they would kiss our asses goodbye.
     
  2. Synphul

    Synphul Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I don't know if it's entirely the reason but ss can be more versatile since it can be used in either power/vw or tc. Other than a few mods most I'm aware of can't do tc properly with kanthal and I don't think nickel works in vw/vv mode. With many mods offering vw and tc, ss coils maybe be more logical since it can be used by a wider variety of devices either way? Just my guess.
     
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  3. HondaDavidson

    HondaDavidson Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I think all wire taste the same. Flavor wise i can't tell the difference. Which wire I use depends on the build I'm doing and how I want to run it. TUBE mech vs Squonker mechs vs TC vs VW vs VV.

    Advantage of SS is it works in all the vaping MODES I use. But i still prefer nichrome for my mechs over SS. TC is very new to me and since I have yet to find a nickel or Ti build I like. I use SS because I do like it for VV/VW even better than kanthal and nich build wise.

    But IMO nichrome on SS mesh wick or silica is still the flavor king.

    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk
     
  4. BreSha6869

    BreSha6869 Member For 3 Years Member For 2 Years Member For 1 Year

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    Nickel is almost impossible to use unless for very very very low resistance vaping.

    My super thin 32g Ni200 still comes in at under 0.1ohms with a ton of wraps but dual coil. So 24-26g Ni200 is almost useless for vaping unless you want a 4mm 30 wrap coil.

    And TC only for Ni200 but SS can do both.
     
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  5. skt239

    skt239 VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    China will make and sell whatever the market in the states will bear. The health concerns come from the US and affect whats manufactured in China, not the other way around. Aside from being a pain in the ass to work with, there are valid concerns regarding the safety of nickle wire. IMO, its a terrible vape and I'm glad they are finally phasing it out.
     
  6. SirRichardRear

    SirRichardRear AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years Reviewer

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    SS is much safer (and better for your health) then Ni200 is. Ni200 is by far the worst vaping wire. super low resistance, really soft, can only be used in TC mode and dangerous if it gets red hot. SS on the other hand is cleaner, can be used in watt mode and TC mode and overall works better.
     
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  7. Jim_MDP

    Jim_MDP Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    You are squarely in the minority.

    TC is vastly superior now to what it was even 16 months ago.
    And despite it's lower TCR (and preferring spaced coils over contact), SS is far more versatile than Ni (or even Ti).
    And most all of the potential health concerns seem to lie with Ni and Ti, not SS.

    Perhaps when you return you'll flesh out your mini-rant (good for the spleen though, innit? ;) ), especially what happened when your TC vape went tits up. o_O
     
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  8. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I only vape TC! DNA250. Perhaps built coils are very good. My experience with prebuilt SS coils is lousy in TC. Perhaps I am killing myself with NI200 though. I will heed this. Especially since I imagine I do get it red hot.
     
  9. SirRichardRear

    SirRichardRear AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years Reviewer

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    Dna250 mods are top 2 in temp control for SS

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
     
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  10. Jim_MDP

    Jim_MDP Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    I've had relatively few factory heads in SS ( I roll my own) so perhaps there are difficulties.

    The only major industry screw-up that comes to mind is the original SS Crown heads when used in TC, and that was at least partially due to an admitted "bad batch" (must have been a big batch).

    Also... they used the old-school technique of nickel legs in a NR-R-NR configuration.
    I don't know how common that is with other heads (I believe the original Notch coils do the same) nor do I know if that had an affect on their TC performance... just sayin'.

    Also... the industry settled on 316 SS (generally) which may be the poorest choice in Stainless for vaping. Good resistance range but low TCR. The most recent DNA/Escribe updates have eliminated that problem with 316... but even they (Evolv) had difficulty with it up to early summer.

    That includes the 250w version, so you shouldn't have problems with all 316 wire heads (again... I don't know about the NR-R-NRs).
     
  11. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Thank you. You see it was not a stupid rant. it was a rant i will give you that. The thing is Uwel is on the Third heads and for many, such as myself they still suck. the Crown II is arguably the best tank overall so WTF. I am not a lazy ass. I sustained injuries to my hands. I am physically unable to build. I know damn well how in my mind though. I used to be highly skilled with electronics. way beyond building coils. On the other hand I do apologize that I thought it was SS's fault. It is Uwell's fault in fact. I think the issue is because of the NI legs you should set it for NI and not SS. When set in SS there is almost no vapor production. I mean like a a early 2000's Disposable Clearo. On the other hand their NI200 coils will blow clouds as good as say a Kayfun. I know that is a low bar to set but after all it is a tank and not an RBA. You guy's got me worried now though. I have probably getting NI200 coils red hot for the Two years they have had them prebuilt. I am not sure what to do. I could use my TFV8 in non TC but I heard Kanthal is not great either. I can no longer pay for an RBA deck due to the new rules. Actually the rules say nothing about that but the stores are scared stiff of liability now. I don't mean to rant there is a dilemma. Anyone know a good SS tank? That would solve my problem!
     
  12. Neunerball

    Neunerball Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee

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    I've been using the Crown (V1) SS coils on my DNA200 and DNA75 mods for a long time, without any issues. You might just need a different TCR file to upload to your mod, in order to get a satisfying vape. You could check Evolve's forum for a different file. There are plenty of files available for download.
    Personally, I prefer using SS316L wire, occasionally Kanthal A1. I don't trust using any wire that contains Nickel, or Titanium.
    BTW, there are mods, that are able to do TC with Kanthal wire, made by HohmTech, e.g. Hohm Wrecker, and Hohm Slice (I have three of those). The Hohm Slice is the reason, I'm using Kanthal A1 wire again! Although, I have to admit, any of my newly built coil(s) do require some short break in, before getting rid of a certain metallic flavor.
     
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  13. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Thank you. That may indeed be the issue. I am using the "UD" TCR. I will try some different ones. Now, After probably getting NI200 red hot for 2 Years I am concerned I may have damaged myself. Would I go to the Lung DR. or is it some other damage that it does? Like do I need a blood panel or something? Now I am worried.
     
  14. Neunerball

    Neunerball Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee

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    I would have to look at my PC, in order to give you the name of the TCR file, I've been using. However, I'm way overdue for getting some sleep.
    Regarding your concerns about NI200. If you have been smoking, I'd be more concerned about the damage IT has/had been doing. However, I'm not a doctor, but according to my research, you shouldn't worry too much. I'd just recommend using SS, or Kanthal in the future.
     
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  15. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Okay, Thank you. I will just ask my regular Doctor when I see him if I should have any tests from inhaling toxic metals. This will probably piss him off because he believes in Ecigs. You are probably right though. I did way worse than cigarettes. I smoked Cigars, Chewed and smoked a Hookah. At the time I never really considered the health implications. I was paid back with Cancer. I have been Cancer free for 7 years. That may not be tobacco since everyone in my family has had cancer. I am sure it did not help. I bet that TCR provides a big role in it's performance. Now that I think about it there is no way it could perform this poorly or Uwell would be hearing about it. I have the newest coils. I will try out some different TCR's. There are many of them. All this time I was scrambling to get NI200 coils. Glad I did not. I wish I could build. I know it in my mind. It is not Rocket Science. My hands are just of little use for fine motor now. I honestly could not even screw the posts. Obviously a built deck is better but I am not expecting that. It has to be my TCR. There is no way it performs this poorly. Unless you would in fact use the NI TCR since it has NI legs. I don't know. I switched it to the NI and it was way too hot. With that I would have to lower it to like 420F. I would normally use 480-500F. I also think SS takes a lot more wattage. I was at 90 I think. I am sure it could handle 120 or more. NI200 is so soft it is like 60. I can see the issue for health now though. I know it becomes toxic at some Temp. That is why it is only used in TC, but you know this.

    I hardly sleep.
     
  16. Neunerball

    Neunerball Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee

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    I'm using my Crown (V1) coils with a SS TCR file (UD-SS 316L DJaquith V3 CROWN), I downloaded from Evolve's forum. My TC setting is for 480F, 60W, pre-heat 75W, pre-heat punch 5, time 2.5 seconds.
    I like to fine tune my settings, utilizing the Device Monitor in Escribe by looking at the temperature curve, while taking 3-4 drags, making sure the curve is as close to the desired temperature.
     
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  17. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Yes, I am using the same "UD" file. I will try adjusting as you have it. I think part of the issue is there is NI in the legs of these coils?
     
  18. Jim_MDP

    Jim_MDP Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Odd that I hit on the Crown as an example. :rolleyes: :D

    NR-R-NR is very old-school... like BCC Clearo head days.

    I suppose it allows the target resistance within those tiny heads, and keeps the heating off the legs... and the insulators trapping them at the 510 pin at the bottom (I don't think PEEK was in use back then).

    What it does for TC is different, but as you noticed... you still use the SS TCR as that's where the heat is, and where the res is fluctuating. Remember, TC = "resistance as thermometer". Wonky, but that's what we have to work with.

    Using a slightly higher manual TCR value is not uncommon, especially with 316, but don't go too far. I've had to go as high as ~120 on some JTech mods, but that's an outlier (nickel is up in the 600s... way to high).
    Glad there's a Crown specific .csv file... give those adjustments a try (I could never get my Crown RBA to not leak, so I retired the tank a looooong time ago. Otherwise I'd have been aware of that curve for the heads I still have sitting around.).

    Sorry about you having to stick with retail heads. The "personalization" (and low cost) have me using RTAs almost exclusively. I haven't kept up with the state of straight tanks and have no suggestions (eg: the SMOK TVF? line has tremendous coil options... at tremendously high prices ;) ).
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2016
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  19. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    It is a Crown II. So similar to the newest tanks, TFV-8 ETC. Perhaps the problem is that TCR is for the original Crown.
     
  20. Jim_MDP

    Jim_MDP Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Is that with the new(er) coned bottom heads?

    Don't know anything about those.
     
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  21. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Indeed. Do not know what the legs are but must be the wrong TCR because I am getting nothing. That is why I said SS sucked. I meant it is sucking for me, not in general.
     
  22. SirRichardRear

    SirRichardRear AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years Reviewer

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    It's because crown coils suck. It's a known issue. Ss itself is overall the best vaping wire. The Aspire SS coils are awesome for the clieto

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
     
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  23. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I was told this. I know this sounds stupid. I have a Clieto and I cannot get the glas off the bottom. So I cannot remove the coil. I know the glas is held with just a friction grommet. It won't budge. If I use a pliers goodbye glass. I could perhaps use the pliers on the coil. However I do not think that is the intended way to use it. Will the Clieto blow clouds and flavor like the Crown II anyways? If anyone can advise me on how to get the glass of that would be great. Thanks
     
  24. SirRichardRear

    SirRichardRear AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years Reviewer

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    It's a tight fit but it pulls right off. Just give it a little elbow grease lol. Don't use pliers just like my golf game, grip and rip. Also you can remove the coil without removing the glass but it's harder lol. The coil stick up just enough out of the top to turn it.

    Also I prefer the clieto to any crown tank.

    [​IMG]

    Clieto with an extended tank

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
     
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  25. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    I've got the Crown, Crown II and the Clieto. Rest assured the Clieto is no match for the Crown, not a bad tank but in terms of build quality and flavor the Clieto isn't even in the same class.
     
  26. SirRichardRear

    SirRichardRear AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years Reviewer

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    To each their own sir ;)
    That's why it's good getting multiple opinions bit often leads people to still not be sure since we all like different stuff lol

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
     
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  27. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Always, vaping like most things in life are subjective and depends on the individual. My favorite saying is -

    "Then Universe is Transformation; Life is Opinion"
     
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  28. SirRichardRear

    SirRichardRear AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years Reviewer

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    yup. there really is no wrong way to do it unless you don't understand battery safety. as long as your happy and off cigs who really cares. there is no "best setup" it's only the one you like best
     
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  29. Fossil

    Fossil Member For 3 Years Member For 2 Years Member For 1 Year

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    SS fused claptons 28 gauge cores wrapped with 38 gauge wrap. best flavour for me..7 wrap around a 3mm driver
     
  30. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Try to do that with ni200 or ti

    Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
     
  31. Angrygod50

    Angrygod50 Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years Member For 3 Years Member For 2 Years

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    Don't know if you have a tank that takes the Atlantis style coils but the Triton SS coils work well in TC mode.
     
  32. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I do somewhere..... These Crown II coils are very strange. I see the issue. They work good. Then they get smoking hot and pretty much shut down until they cool down. It must be the TCR.
     
  33. Eskie

    Eskie Silver Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    If you want control over the metal used in your coils, just buy the wire and build it yourself on an RTA. Never have to worry about whether a factory coil is in stock or not.
     
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  34. GorGon27

    GorGon27 Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Yeah, that's great all you guy's liked that. I am disabled in the hands and cannot build. I have found oddly enough as far as pre-built coils go NI200 is vastly superior. This is a shame. They just need to step up their SS game if they only want to make SS coils. Well I am talking about the Crown I and II at least. The SS to me is like a fizz and the NI200 is like an RBA. I am guessing it is my TCR. I could throw them on like a RX/2 and see what happens.
     

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