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Temp Control Q&A

nicounderground

Member For 2 Years
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Hi All
Thought it would be good to have a dedicated thread for temp control Q & A for newbies (and veterans alike to help us noobs)

I've recently got into building my own coils one of the things I've noticed is how easy it is to get a dry or burnt hit especially when you put in some of those bigger coil builds. Now I know some will say that's a wicking issue or try turning down the wattage.... whilst that is true, in a lot of cases these chunky heaps of coiled madness just can't cool down quick enough!

so I started looking into temp control as a means to maintain the flavour...draw for long periods of time...chain vape like a madman...avoid cremating my cotton...and not mash up my coil that I spent bloody ages building!

What I've learnt so far

There are 4 main things to remember for temp control

1) All metals change resistance when heated, but it's those metals that change more that are the best suited for temp control, and its for this reason most temp control mods have Nickel, Titanium, and Stainless Steel as a default ...imagine a hose pipe fully open, now pinch it (resistence in our case), it's harder for the water (current in our case) to get through... that's exactly what's going on here as the metal is heated.
You will start with a new coil build at say 0.3ohm at room temperature and when heated it goes up to 0.5ohm ...the resistance goes up (some metals change far more than others) this effect is known as Temperature Coefficient of Resistance (TCR*) It's the average amount the resistance changes for every 1 degree Celsius heated

(*note there is a proper temperature curve some devices can utilise which is different to the average linear line that is TCR but for ease of explaination I'll stick to TCR)

note 2, Kanthal is usually out of the question for temp control on most mods as its resistance changes so little when heated
Edit: Hohm wrecker G2 claims to support this metal type thanks @PhantomOp

2) The type of Metal you choose for your coil changes the correct TCR you use on your mod (I believe I've read somewhere you also need to factor in your own mods internal resistance although on most regulated devices I would assume the chip accounts for this?)
I'll post a follow up after this of all the metals common TCRs

3) Temperature - this is what you want your mod to max out at and stay at when it gets there ...meeting all of those things I listed above (avoid cremating cotton etc)... now it's important to note your mod isnt actually detecting the temperature, it's carrying out calculations 1000's times a second based on reading the starting ohm resistance and the resistance while heating this is why TCR is important..(it's also really important you have a good connection on your deck for your coils as well, dodgy ohm readings to start with are bad news, health and safety first people)

Example:
  • A coil is at 0.10Ω at room temperature (20°C / 68°F)
    • You vape and the chip sees its resistance is now 0.22Ω
      • So it knows its resistance rose by 0.12Ω
    • Then it calculates using the TCR you pre set of 0.006 (NI200) thats a resistance rise of 0.12Ω equals a temperature rise of 200°C (392° F)
      • And therefore the coil temperature is now 220°C (428°F)
      • (0.22Ω - 0.10Ω) / (0.006 * 0.1Ω) = 200°C (392°F)
      • + 20°C (68°F) [starting temp] = 220°C (428°F) [coil temp]
4) Wattage - This is serving to only get you to the temperature you set earlier because your mod will maintain temperature when it's peaked (that's why you see that temp message on your mod) it's pulsing here to maintain temp rather than keeping going in power mode, it's not turning off like a lot of people think ....
So set this based on how quickly you want to reach your max temp, if like me your not fussed on the pulsing bit set it lower, if you want it at max level immediately raise it there is no right or wrong

No doubt there are things I've forgotten or don't yet know so Q&A time guys

I'd like to take my hat off to Steve @Wingsfan0310 for helping me complete this picture :)
hi i just bought a TC mod … i have the Kanthal coils as i use the baby beast on my pico so i haven’t been playing with it yet… im new to box mods so its fine.. actually the baby beast is good and really love the coils they dont get very hot… annoyingly hot by any means … im using the Q2 .4 coils and i love them … i will have to start building.. this is expensive … not as bad as the 35 years i spent smoking analog… im smoke free and this is much better sure smells and tastes better.. sorry about the book… :) im new today here and love love this site and thank you for posting this… yes and baby beast says do not use temp control with the Kanthal
 

Mowgli

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Member For 4 Years
TCR of .00138 for zivipf SS430?
Anyone dry burn test it?
24ga if that matters.
Thanks
 

Lizzardking

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Dumb question lookin for dumb answer trying to find what s comfortable runnin a dual quad parallel ss316 28 g ohm .14 rx300 mod in tc mode 97w at 420° n from readin if I lower the watts will take longer to get to temp before cuts off ? Higher the watts quicker it gets to temp n why does it reset to power mode randomly. I like a warm dense vape but not too hot. For shits n giggles should I try extreme wattage like above 200w this mod max is 300w
 

conanthewarrior

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Dumb question lookin for dumb answer trying to find what s comfortable runnin a dual quad parallel ss316 28 g ohm .14 rx300 mod in tc mode 97w at 420° n from readin if I lower the watts will take longer to get to temp before cuts off ? Higher the watts quicker it gets to temp n why does it reset to power mode randomly. I like a warm dense vape but not too hot. For shits n giggles should I try extreme wattage like above 200w this mod max is 300w

If you lower the watts, it will take longer for the coils to ramp up and reach your set temperature, once this happens power is reduced accordingly to try to keep around your chosen temperature.

Resetting into power mode can be an issue with SS316/L, always make sure before you put the new build on, to press fire with the atty off so when you put the new one on the mod can read the cold resistance.
This is always done at room temperature, so if you have been using the mod, take off the atty and let sit for long enough to cool before doing this.

You can try that high wattage if you want to assuming you have at least 20A batteries, but in TC mode it will result in the power being throttled back near immediately.
 

KingPin!

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Dumb question lookin for dumb answer trying to find what s comfortable runnin a dual quad parallel ss316 28 g ohm .14 rx300 mod in tc mode 97w at 420° n from readin if I lower the watts will take longer to get to temp before cuts off ? Higher the watts quicker it gets to temp n why does it reset to power mode randomly. I like a warm dense vape but not too hot. For shits n giggles should I try extreme wattage like above 200w this mod max is 300w

Not familiar with the RX300 if it's anything like the RX200S then you have only access to control TCR in a 4 digit way so normally it's 0.00092 for SS316 but you use 0092 for the manual TCR (although a mate of mine had better results with a higher TCR than that)

Wattage is only serving to get you to the temp you set would say 40-60w is ample if everything else is working ...remember spacing coils and closing air vents more than power mode, taking longer draws all helps with temp control

Could try upping that temp a bit as well to closer to 480-500F

If I were to guess It's going to power mode likely because the resistence isn't changing enough thinks it powering kanthal

or could be how you have set the settings on the mod it isn't happy hitting the 420F to quickly maybe wrong material selected so switching to power mode when it cant maintain it
 

Lizzardking

Member For 2 Years
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Thanks I got about 4-5 puffs set it down picked it up went to puff again it kicked back to power mode at 20w major disappointment esp since my coils are at .14 n inhaled air lol 20w ain't strong enough to power these up lol
 

KingPin!

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Starting resistence at room temp is really important as Conan said your coils can't be heated in anyway before you start temp control or the whole thing craps out

Might be worth going through the menu options you've selected and steps taken so far can help you more then :)
 

Lizzardking

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Not familiar with the RX300 if it's anything like the RX200S then you have only access to control TCR in a 4 digit way so normally it's 0.00092 for SS316 but you use 0092 for the manual TCR (although a mate of mine had better results with a higher TCR than that)

Wattage is only serving to get you to the temp you set would say 40-60w is ample if everything else is working ...remember spacing coils and closing air vents more than power mode, taking longer draws all helps with temp control

Could try upping that temp a bit as well to closer to 480-500F

If I were to guess It's going to power mode likely because the resistence isn't changing enough thinks it powering kanthal

or could be how you have set the settings on the mod it isn't happy hitting the 420F to quickly maybe wrong material selected so switching to power mode when it cant maintain it
The rx300 has 4 tc modes ti ss ni tcr 1,2,3 I'll take all advice n tinker around with diff temps n watts I know under 300° it goes to protect state
 

Lizzardking

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If you lower the watts, it will take longer for the coils to ramp up and reach your set temperature, once this happens power is reduced accordingly to try to keep around your chosen temperature.

Resetting into power mode can be an issue with SS316/L, always make sure before you put the new build on, to press fire with the atty off so when you put the new one on the mod can read the cold resistance.
This is always done at room temperature, so if you have been using the mod, take off the atty and let sit for long enough to cool before doing this.

You can try that high wattage if you want to assuming you have at least 20A batteries, but in TC mode it will result in the power being throttled back near immediately.
I'm runnin 4 married Sony vt6
 

KingPin!

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First thing to do is set manual TCR vales against M1, M2 M3

In a powered off state keep pressing the fire button and right regulatory button together (up button) until you are presented with the TCR menu

You can use the left and right (up and down buttons to cycle through the TCR 1,2,3)

press fire to select one of them

Press up or down button to adjust the TCR manually

Against M1 set it to 0092
Against M2 set it to 0088
Against M3 set it to 0130

Now M1 is the right one for 316,
M2 for 316L and
M3 is the mess about one you might want to try moving about to dial it in as I said my mate tried 130 for some reason worked for him lolon SS coil

Now you have set TCR press fire button 5 times or leave standing for 10'secsnto leave interface

Now that's done you'll be in normal screen mode press for button three times to enter options mode press up button to select TCR mode

While it's still flashing press left button (down button) to choose M1 (or M2 or M3) press fire button to confirm

Now you get to choose the normal supplementary settings i.e. wattage and temp in the normal way try 480F and 60w piss around with these and cycle through the M modes until you find one that suits ...remember to lock in cold resistence as well take off atty and reattach it and select yes to a new coil ....all of these ....see how you get on

If the mod detects resistence goes over 1.5ohms it will switch to power mode automatically by the way so ensure you are getting stable resistence readings from the coil before you lock it in
 

KingPin!

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Failing this pages 4,5,6,7,8 of the wisemec RX300 manual are relevant to what I'm trying to convey in the post above

Could also try the preheat function set this higher than the temp control wattage and lower the other one to maintain it in the supplementary menu
 

Lizzardking

Member For 2 Years
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First thing to do is set manual TCR vales against M1, M2 M3

In a powered off state keep pressing the fire button and right regulatory button together (up button) until you are presented with the TCR menu

You can use the left and right (up and down buttons to cycle through the TCR 1,2,3)

press fire to select one of them

Press up or down button to adjust the TCR manually

Against M1 set it to 0092
Against M2 set it to 0088
Against M3 set it to 0130

Now M1 is the right one for 316,
M2 for 316L and
M3 is the mess about one you might want to try moving about to dial it in as I said my mate tried 130 for some reason worked for him lolon SS coil

Now you have set TCR press fire button 5 times or leave standing for 10'secsnto leave interface

Now that's done you'll be in normal screen mode press for button three times to enter options mode press up button to select TCR mode

While it's still flashing press left button (down button) to choose M1 (or M2 or M3) press fire button to confirm

Now you get to choose the normal supplementary settings i.e. wattage and temp in the normal way try 480F and 60w piss around with these and cycle through the M modes until you find one that suits ...remember to lock in cold resistence as well take off atty and reattach it and select yes to a new coil ....all of these ....see how you get on

If the mod detects resistence goes over 1.5ohms it will switch to power mode automatically by the way so ensure you are getting stable resistence readings from the coil before you lock it in
If my ohm meter detects 1.5 ohm with the .14 build I got than something seriously wrong
 

Lizzardking

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If it has preset ti ni ss setting would not the tcr settings matter ? Like questions n answers better than reading a manual
 

KingPin!

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If my ohm meter detects 1.5 ohm with the .14 build I got than something seriously wrong

Yes you have lol however resistence of SS does change (increases) when heated not that much though just going back to what you asked earlier about jumping out into power mode as another reason ...
 

KingPin!

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If it has preset ti ni ss setting would not the tcr settings matter ? Like questions n answers better than reading a manual

Can try SS and muck around in there with the supplementary details why not if it works it works doesn't matter how it works right :)

I don't know how it's preset though so gave you what I know to be the normal TCRs used for SS316 ....most mods like your one use SS304 I always choose to set my own TCR settings but that's just me
 

Lizzardking

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Can try SS and muck around in there with the supplementary details why not if it works it works doesn't matter how it works right :)

I don't know how it's preset though so gave you what I know to be the normal TCRs used for SS316 ....most mods like your one use SS304 I always choose to set my own TCR settings but that's just me
It weird I can go into temp mod n change between ti ss ni n tcr I. Attemptin to set the tcr now but might just use the preset time will tell
 

Lizzardking

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OK I did the room temp thing locked the ohms set the values for tcr like listed above n second I hit fire button says protect hmm switched to temp ss set to 480 90 watts tweaked my air control on my rta dropped temp to 450 increased my watts to 120 n chucking clouds lol can't tell what cloud/flavor better power or tc lol the tc is warmer n denser tho I'll take to alpaca n see if they can tinker with tcr or figure out why it's going straight protect thanks for the help on side note I'll be attemptin 6strand fishtail braid in 28g ss hopefully the ohms be above .1 for a single . 05 for a double so I can fire in both last attempt in ni80 24g a single ohmed .08 so if did a dual braid be at .4 too low for tc mode n waaaay too low for power lol I'll post pics but can't find my macro lenses
 

KingPin!

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OK I did the room temp thing locked the ohms set the values for tcr like listed above n second I hit fire button says protect hmm switched to temp ss set to 480 90 watts tweaked my air control on my rta dropped temp to 450 increased my watts to 120 n chucking clouds lol can't tell what cloud/flavor better power or tc lol the tc is warmer n denser tho I'll take to alpaca n see if they can tinker with tcr or figure out why it's going straight protect thanks for the help on side note I'll be attemptin 6strand fishtail braid in 28g ss hopefully the ohms be above .1 for a single . 05 for a double so I can fire in both last attempt in ni80 24g a single ohmed .08 so if did a dual braid be at .4 too low for tc mode n waaaay too low for power lol I'll post pics but can't find my macro lenses

Lower the wattage mate serious don't need it so high that's why your getting the message you're instantly heating it, if it's coming out like thin streaky shitty vape you have wrong TCR set

On my DNA
I run my wattage about 40w for TC
preheat for 1.5secs of 70w (work on this one)
Temp of 500F
TCR 0.00088 (316L) ....in your case that was M2 0088 as I posted above

You should not feel it getting warmer than the limit you set even when taking 5s-6s pulls
 

Lizzardking

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Lower the wattage mate serious don't need it so high that's why your getting the message you're instantly heating it, if it's coming out like thin streaky shitty vape you have wrong TCR set

On my DNA
I run my wattage about 40w for TC
preheat for 1.5secs of 70w (work on this one)
Temp of 500F
TCR 0.00088 (316L) ....in your case that was M2 0088 as I posted above

You should not feel it getting warmer than the limit you set even when taking 5s-6s pulls
 

Lizzardking

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I set tcr m1 to them settings had at 60 watts 480 hit fire n says protect tried lowering hiring watts n temp even cycled to m2 m3 still says protect ( the new coil same coil screen never showed) I switched to temp ss mode 60w 480 ran outta lung compacity n was 420 before got a good pull so I increased the watts to 115-120 n dropped the temp gives me good warm dense pull got a good 8-10 pulls set it down went to pull again power mode 20w I am also runnin two quad parallels in power mode 75w a s like a giggling midget runnin thru tall grass cause grass is tickling have balls 75w just tickles these coils at 95-140w <<<< (accidental n about max) 115 is ideal gives that warm dense flavorful vape
 

KingPin!

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Sorry lizard so are you saying you dialled it in ok or not?
 

Lizzardking

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Sorry it's 2am here no glasses on my face and I need punctuation. I set the tcr values like ya said lockeaad in the room temp ohm of .14, set temp to 480° n 65w hit the fire button n "protect" blinking all three tcr modes and jumped to power 20w. So I switched to temp ss mode got a good round at 450° 122w set it down came back to it hit fire n power mode 20w was a pull for a flea lol ready to just fuck temp mode n just use power but like knowledge n wanna learn both modes
 

KingPin!

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TC takes a little time to dial in no matter what mod you use :) it's not an exact science once you have though can be a great vape just take time and patience to start with

According to the wisemec PDF I looked up for you yesterday the TCR values for SS are anywhere between 0088 and 0200 these vary loads though .... from my research between 0088 to 0092 are the correct setting to use that's not say say you can't wiggle them more and why I said use M3 as the one to muck about on...did the 0130 on M3 not work either?

If it was ok using the normal SS mode cool work on that maybe up the temp, lower the wattage and muck about with the preheat setting in the menu bit like what I said above

Need to get away from thinking wattage is acting like power mode in TC it's not you don't need the amount of wattage you normally vape at

One last silly question you are absolutely 100% sure you are using SS316 only?

Also wisemecs are known to have issues with the 510 connection it might be that the mod is not reading the resistence of the coil properly through the heating process and jumping back into power mode do you have another mod to try TC on as well? See it you can get that one working first?
 
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conanthewarrior

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I'm runnin 4 married Sony vt6
Ok, in that case then you could try 200W, but there really isn't any point running the mod so high in TC mode. Your set power only is used until the coils rise in resistance enough that the mod cuts the power down to try and maintain your chosen temperature.

Where did you get your SS316 from? If it is one of the better companies, they will provide the wires TCR on their web page. Not all SS is equal, even the same grade.

I gather you like a warm, cloudy vape from the coils you are using, and the power you are running them at. 420F is quite low, and will be a pretty cool vape. I use C, and am usually around 230-250C, which is around 450-480F. This is a nice, warm vape, but you may even want to run a higher temp depending what you like.

I wouldn't give up with temp mode just yet, there is likely a simple reason for being kicked out of TC mode, we just need to figure out what exactly :)
 

Lizzardking

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TC takes a little time to dial in no matter what mod you use :) it's not an exact science once you have though can be a great vape just take time and patience to start with

According to the wisemec PDF I looked up for you yesterday the TCR values for SS are anywhere between 0088 and 0200 these vary loads though .... from my research between 0088 to 0092 are the correct setting to use that's not say say you can't wiggle them more and why I said use M3 as the one to muck about on...did the 0130 on M3 not work either?

If it was ok using the normal SS mode cool work on that maybe up the temp, lower the wattage and muck about with the preheat setting in the menu bit like what I said above

Need to get away from thinking wattage is acting like power mode in TC it's not you don't need the amount of wattage you normally vape at

One last silly question you are absolutely 100% sure you are using SS316 only?

Also wisemecs are known to have issues with the 510 connection it might be that the mod is not reading the resistence of the coil properly through the heating process and jumping back into power mode do you have another mod to try TC on as well? See it you can get that one working first?
this what the shop sold me now granted this shop in question didn't realize they were sellin stainless they assumed all the rolls came in were ka1 n were sellin ss thinkin was ka1
 

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shawn.hoefer

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I grant that I only skimmed through, but an atty that is not stable can also be a weak spot. What atty are you using?

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Lizzardking

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Kylin rta is what I'm using attemptin to scan this qr code on this stainless steel spool n see what it reveals I woke up n tried again mad sure my tcr values were set locked in cold resistance set temp n watts like kp said to hit fire in all tcr n ss modes started to heat n kicked over to power this time
 

KingPin!

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Kylin rta is what I'm using attemptin to scan this qr code on this stainless steel spool n see what it reveals I woke up n tried again mad sure my tcr values were set locked in cold resistance set temp n watts like kp said to hit fire in all tcr n ss modes started to heat n kicked over to power this time

Ok go into power mode unlock the resistence first note what it is when cool take a few vapes at your normal power mode wattage check to see if the resistence goes up after you've got it nice and hot if it's still the same i reckon you may have got kanthal and they got the wrong sticker especially if the shop thought it was kanthal :)

When you dry burned that during install did it change colour go a rainbow colour for a bit?
 

Lizzardking

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Ok go into power mode unlock the resistence first note what it is when cool take a few vapes at your normal power mode wattage check to see if the resistence goes up after you've got it nice and hot if it's still the same i reckon you may have got kanthal and they got the wrong sticker especially if the shop thought it was kanthal :)

When you dry burned that during install did it change colour go a rainbow colour for a bit?
It went kinda bluish Lil bit of gold's the ohms did go from .14 to.16
 

KingPin!

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It went kinda bluish Lil bit of gold's the ohms did go from .14 to.16

Ok it's SS then that's good

In all honesty mate I'm out of ideas if you've tried everything above I've said and it's still not right hopefully someone else can chime in
 

conanthewarrior

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this what the shop sold me now granted this shop in question didn't realize they were sellin stainless they assumed all the rolls came in were ka1 n were sellin ss thinkin was ka1

I can't see from that image what type of SS it actually is, but the words stainless steel are pretty big on there, so am a bit confused as to how the shop thought they was selling Kanthal.

Because the shop wasn't even aware they was selling a completely different type of wire, if the grade of SS is not printed on there I would order a roll of SS from a well known, reputable vaping store. Otherwise it will be a bit of a guessing game of which TCR you should really be using for best performance, and also why you are getting kicked out of TC mode.

Not your fault in the slightest that the shop was incompetent, but it will make things easier for you. Also I would question the quality of the wire, it is likely the shop was just going with the cheapest supplier, thinking they was getting Kanthal but ended up getting sent an unknown wire type instead.
 

Just Frank

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Super new at this, if I have SS316L do I use the SS setting in temp mode?

I saw above that you guys were talking about having your watts set at one thing and the temp at another. My watts says 100 and my temp automatically was at 200°C. Is it more common to set it at Fahrenheit? How do I control my wattage in TC mode?

What I got-
Smoant Battlestar 200
Griffin 25 plus
SS316L dual 26g nine wrap, spaced, 3mm inner diameter coils. .3 ohm.

I need to know how to set this up on my mods menu. What temp I should start with. I used the coils in wattage mode and liked it around 45-50W. On the screen I'm only able to adjust the temp not the watts by pushing + & -.

Any help is appreciated.
 

KingPin!

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Celsius or Fahrenheit doesnt matter. I've always run it from Fahrenheit

Here is a conversion guide I'm not familiar with the operations menu on the battlestar

But start out just trying the SS setting
Celcius try it around 230-40 maybe
Wattage around 45-50

TempConversions.jpg


@SirRichardRear you know this mod mate how would frank adjust settings on it? Also can you manually change TCR?
 
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Just Frank

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I saw another post that said if I go past a certain point using + or - it will change from celcius to fahrenheit. I put it on SS and had a couple issues. Like I said while idle the wattage says 100. I watched it while pressing the fire button and it goes to around my desired setting.

The other thing is my mods fault I'm thinking. I'm getting a delay. Its a good second to a second and a half before anything happens. Other than that Im getting the hang of it I think.

Im thinking mods are better than others in TC. Is there a good list of the best ones?
 

Deucesjack

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I saw another post that said if I go past a certain point using + or - it will change from celcius to fahrenheit. I put it on SS and had a couple issues. Like I said while idle the wattage says 100. I watched it while pressing the fire button and it goes to around my desired setting.

The other thing is my mods fault I'm thinking. I'm getting a delay. Its a good second to a second and a half before anything happens. Other than that Im getting the hang of it I think.

Im thinking mods are better than others in TC. Is there a good list of the best ones?
Your getting a delay in TC?

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KingPin!

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Im thinking mods are better than others in TC. Is there a good list of the best ones?

Evolv DNA(these chips are in loads of premium devices)

YiHi (again make chips for others although thier own mods are awesome)

FSK (hohmtech)

Are the market leaders in temp control
 

Deucesjack

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Build, ohms, wattage, temp?

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SirRichardRear

AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube
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I saw another post that said if I go past a certain point using + or - it will change from celcius to fahrenheit. I put it on SS and had a couple issues. Like I said while idle the wattage says 100. I watched it while pressing the fire button and it goes to around my desired setting.

The other thing is my mods fault I'm thinking. I'm getting a delay. Its a good second to a second and a half before anything happens. Other than that Im getting the hang of it I think.

Im thinking mods are better than others in TC. Is there a good list of the best ones?
Put it in SS mode. Set it to 400f and 80 watts. You can adjust watts by pressing the plus or minus (can't remember which one lol) and fire at the same time.

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SirRichardRear

AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube
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40W 400°F, the screen says 100 until the fire button is pressed. When I push to fire it jumps differnt numbers around less than that.
Did you make sure your using all SS wire. When you put it on was the atty at room Temp?

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Deucesjack

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Put it in SS mode. Set it to 400f and 80 watts. You can adjust watts by pressing the plus or minus (can't remember which one lol) and fire at the same time.

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This/\/\.

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Just Frank

Platinum Contributor
Member For 5 Years
That's not normal at all for the battlestar.

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I dont notice it as much amymore, must be getting used to it. Really digging the flavor with SS316L. Is the difference noticable with plain SS? I failed to recognize the "L" at the end when ordering. It's UD wire. Would that be a solid brand? Like my first post said, I'm really green at this new venture.
 

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