Doomsday has come- Storing nicotine, and testing?

[conanthewarrior]

Hello everyone.

Today is the day that the TPD comes into force in the UK.

I have a few litres of Nicotine in the freezer, and am ordering another litre right now, and understand keeping it in the freezer will be best as this will be lasting me for a good few years.

I saw an old thread on here, this one to be exact http://vapingunderground.com/threads/best-way-to-freeze-nicotine-liquid.17640/

In the thread, there is talks of a test kit from somewhere called WL? I would like to know if it is possible to still buy these test kits, as it would be good to know in a few years if my 72MG nicotine is still the same strength.

At the moment, the bottle I use for mixing is out in the open, just kept in a cool area, but for long term storage it would be nice to know it is still as strong as it should be, and if not I could change the amount I use in my mixes to achieve the strength I want.

Thank you all for your help, Conan.

 

[PuffOn]

WL is most likely refering to Wizard Labs
https://wizardlabs.us/index.php?route=product/category&path=84
Still available. Not sure if they ship internationally tho.

 

[Huckleberried]

Yep, Wizard Labs, but since they're in the states, you might consider searching the individual chemicals used, then order those, if you can't find a nicotine test kit closer to you. As cheap as the kits are, I'd hate to see you pay the shipping from the US.

 

[AndriaD]

I agree, it would be far cheaper to get the individual chemicals -- .12N Sulfuric Acid, and Bromothymol Blue - plus also distilled water.

I got the test kit from ECX; I scanned the instruction pages -- as follows:




Hope that helps!

Andria

ETA: if you right-click on the images, you can "view image" to see them full size.

 

[Jim_MDP]

Hello everyone.

Today is the day that the TPD comes into force in the UK.

...

Wow... I can't be the only US American, caught up in our own FDA woes, who lost track of the impending EU TPD (and never did get straight on its' provisions).

And so it begins... my condolences.

First... yeah, WL is Florida's Wizard Labs. Good company, but can you source a kit domestically? Or is that TPD'd out of reach as well?

You raise a good question as well (for me at least)... does age diminish nic strength? Or just cause settling/hot spots, change in taste or harshness, oxidization etc?

 

[freemind]

Yep, Wizard Labs, but since they're in the states, you might consider searching the individual chemicals used, then order those, if you can't find a nicotine test kit closer to you. As cheap as the kits are, I'd hate to see you pay the shipping from the US.

Funny side note. Everything I order from China cost less (very few times the same as ordering in the US).

Anything I have ordered from the UK/EU costs double what it does in the US.

Maybe a Chinese website carries the nicotine test kits?

 

[Jim_MDP]

Funny side note. Everything I order from China cost less (very few times the same as ordering in the US).

Anything I have ordered from the UK/EU costs double what it does in the US.

Maybe a Chinese website carries the nicotine test kits?

The EU has some unique universal consumer protections that surely add to retail cost.
Just the way it is.

 

[freemind]

The EU has some unique universal consumer protections that surely add to retail cost.
Just the way it is.

I was referring to shipping costs. I know they have a VAT tax over there, and I'm sure other hidden taxes.

 

[Jim_MDP]

I was referring to shipping costs. I know they have a VAT tax over there, and I'm sure other hidden taxes.

Ah, gotcha.
Yeah, I was thinking purchase pricing.
eg: I doubt you'd be offered an EU "extended warranty" (2-3 years) on electronics or appliances, the way we do here in the US... it's built-in to the price

 

[Huckleberried]

does age diminish nic strength?

It can, yes. Over the last couple years, mine have not, but over an extended period of time, would be different. Even at that, I've read that it's not a huge amount.

 

[conanthewarrior]

Thank you all for your replies- it seems Wizard labs is the one, and they do offer international shipping which is great! @AndriaD brings up a good point though, in that it may be easier for me to get these chemicals on their own.
Hopefully you do not need a license or anything for them, and also I hope they are not used for anything bad, I would not want to be raided by the counter terrorism squad for testing my nicotine lol!

Wow... I can't be the only US American, caught up in our own FDA woes, who lost track of the impending EU TPD (and never did get straight on its' provisions).

And so it begins... my condolences.

First... yeah, WL is Florida's Wizard Labs. Good company, but can you source a kit domestically? Or is that TPD'd out of reach as well?

You raise a good question as well (for me at least)... does age diminish nic strength? Or just cause settling/hot spots, change in taste or harshness, oxidization etc?

The TPD is not good, but not as bad as some restrictions, I believe some of the FDA restrictions were very harsh, condolences to you too my friend.
For example, nicotine will still be available- but at a maximum of 20MG strength and in 10ML bottles lol. Shops that have nicotine still have 6 months to sell it, but I have a feeling they will sell out much faster than this. After that, I am unsure what will happen, I may even have to purchase pre made juice in say 5 years! But, at least there is still a way to vape I suppose.

I know our pricing is worked out a bit different to in the USA, I understand in stores the price displayed on the shelf is actually before tax, and when you go to pay it is slightly more? The tax is included in the price displayed here, such as VAT, and there are other taxes on 'luxury items' (There was a recent argument about this, as tampons were included as 'luxury items', something which most people do not class them as). We do sem tog et shafted when it comes to cost though, which is why I do a lot of ordering from overseas.

We do also get offered extended warranties over here too, on things such as washing machines and all sorts of other products. The thing is though, a lot of them already come with a 3-5 year warranty from the manufacturer, so taking out the one with the store is not really needed. On things like computers though they can be handy.
They do try to push them on you though, I think each salesperson that manages to sell one gets commission.

Hearing that even though nicotine can degrade, but as @Huckleberried said over a few years theirs has not makes me feel a bit better.
In a strange way, even if it did degrade it might actually help me out, in that as time goes on I will be vaping weaker and weaker nicotine without realising.
Hopefully then I could vape 0MG when I do run out, as this would be the cheapest option and allow me to continue to vape.

Thank you all .
EDIT: Sorry for the wall of text lol!

 

[Jim_MDP]

... The TPD is not good, but not as bad as some restrictions, I believe some of the FDA restrictions were very harsh, condolences to you too my friend.
For example, nicotine will still be available- but at a maximum of 20MG strength and in 10ML bottles lol. Shops that have nicotine still have 6 months to sell it, but I have a feeling they will sell out much faster than this. After that, I am unsure what will happen, I may even have to purchase pre made juice in say 5 years! But, at least there is still a way to vape I suppose.

I know our pricing is worked out a bit different to in the USA, I understand in stores the price displayed on the shelf is actually before tax, and when you go to pay it is slightly more? The tax is included in the price displayed here, such as VAT, and there are other taxes on 'luxury items' (There was a recent argument about this, as tampons were included as 'luxury items', something which most people do not class them as). We do sem tog et shafted when it comes to cost though, which is why I do a lot of ordering from overseas.

We do also get offered extended warranties over here too, on things such as washing machines and all sorts of other products. The thing is though, a lot of them already come with a 3-5 year warranty from the manufacturer, so taking out the one with the store is not really needed. On things like computers though they can be handy.
They do try to push them on you though, I think each salesperson that manages to sell one gets commission.

...

Despite the FDA regs on hardware, new product approval and retail juice packaging and sales... I haven't heard any screaming about nic being harder to source here nor about any proposed regs to eliminate retail/consumer sales. Which is odd because we being virtually the only retail consumers, it's an obvious point of attack.

Naturally... now that I have a nine year supply.


Taxes... no VAT here (and big ticket "luxury taxes" are an idea that comes and goes... don't know the current situation, I haven't purchased a yacht in dog's years. ), and the sales tax varies by county within each state so there's no consistency. It ranges from zero in a few entire states to eight and change percent in metro counties of California to... I don't know, maybe higher in say NYC.

The warranty comment came from my understanding that the EU enforces an automatic two or three (?) year return for defect guarantee on consumer products. No such thing here. You might get a factory one year, but 90 days or so is far more common (depends on the product type, type of defect fully covered and if a company is using a longer period as a sales /marketing tool).

 

[conanthewarrior]

Despite the FDA regs on hardware, new product approval and retail juice packaging and sales... I haven't heard any screaming about nic being harder to source here nor about any proposed regs to eliminate retail/consumer sales. Which is odd because we being virtually the only retail consumers, it's an obvious point of attack.

Naturally... now that I have a nine year supply.


Taxes... no VAT here (and big ticket "luxury taxes" are an idea that comes and goes... don't know the current situation, I haven't purchased a yacht in dog's years. ), and the sales tax varies by county within each state so there's no consistency. It ranges from zero in a few entire states to eight and change percent in metro counties of California to... I don't know, maybe higher in say NYC.

The warranty comment came from my understanding that the EU enforces an automatic two or three (?) year return for defect guarantee on consumer products. No such thing here. You might get a factory one year, but 90 days or so is far more common (depends on the product type, type of defect fully covered and if a company is using a longer period as a sales /marketing tool).

I am glad to hear that Nicotine doesn't seem to be harder to source for you, I hope it stays that way too. It is good you have a 9 year supply just in case though lol.

Regarding the FDA regulations, what actually are they in a nutshell? Is there a waiting period for new mods, similar to the 6 month thing over here?

I didn't realise the tax varied like that, it sounds good living somewhere that has no tax! I wonder if products are actually cheaper there, or they mark them up slightly to be similar to other states that tax more heavily, and they just reap the profits?

Oh I get you, I am not actually up on the consumer rights act which replaced the sales of goods act, but know under the old act you was protected for a 'reasonable time', some people managed to claim for things that were seven years old in the past! This depended on the type of product though, and due to the ambiguous wording could well be why the consumer rights act replaced the sales of goods act.
90 days is not long at all though, are warranties in the USA generally good value for money, or are they similar to over here in that after paying for a few years, you could buy a new one anyway lol?

 

[Jim_MDP]

...
Regarding the FDA regulations, what actually are they in a nutshell? Is there a waiting period for new mods, similar to the 6 month thing over here?

I didn't realise the tax varied like that, it sounds good living somewhere that has no tax! I wonder if products are actually cheaper there, or they mark them up slightly to be similar to other states that tax more heavily, and they just reap the profits?

Oh I get you, I am not actually up on the consumer rights act which replaced the sales of goods act, but know under the old act you was protected for a 'reasonable time', some people managed to claim for things that were seven years old in the past! This depended on the type of product though, and due to the ambiguous wording could well be why the consumer rights act replaced the sales of goods act.
90 days is not long at all though, are warranties in the USA generally good value for money, or are they similar to over here in that after paying for a few years, you could buy a new one anyway lol?

Supposedly... the initial 8/8/16 rollout meant no new products until they had their FDA approval process completed. However, I think in practice they're allowing new items up till the 8/8/18 cutoff.

I actually haven't made a vape purchase since July, so while everyone's talking up new attys and mods, and placing orders, I have to presume they're receiving their orders.
No screams other than the stepped up Customs holds and inspections... some of which I take it do not get passed through. But that seems to even affect established products that predated the 8/8 enactment.

But I wouldn't expect the agent to have an encyclopedic knowledge of which products are which.
It's still shaking out... we'll see what happens.


Taxes etc... only (?) fuel and tobacco type taxes go to the federal gov't, sales taxes go to the respective states... none of it goes to the vendor or manufacturer. So it doesn't affect sale pricing.

Extended warranties are best evaluated on a case by case basis. They're usually fairly inexpensive but don't make a lot of sense for an item that is... inexpensive, semi-disposable or expected to be outdated in less than say two years.

But for a large TV, fridge or washer/dryer etc. it can make sense to pay an extra 5-10% one time for a two or three year warranty if the manufacturer only gives one year. It's like that.

But yeah... there's surely a commission for the salesman, so they can be pretty damn hard sell about it.
I've never bought a new car... they're probably the worst. Lots of little specific coverages that are often overpriced, useless or unneeded. Easy to get taken advantage of as I understand it... and those costs can really add up.

But for day to day items it'll depend. I paid for one for a large TV once, and some other bit of kit a few years back, but I bought an HDD on Amazon just yesterday and declined the offer (I think it was about $8 on a $60 drive).

 

[conanthewarrior]

I see, hopefully you don't see any real issues until 2018, and even then I hope they are not too bad for you all.
It is a shame some people have not received things from customs, although if it happened before too I guess it is just bad luck.

I see, so it doesn't affect product pricing. That is pretty cool if you live in a state that has no tax.

That is fair enough, very similar to over here then, on some products, like say a DVD played which is not very expensive, the warranty would be silly, but for a high end laptop it may be a good idea incase something does go wrong to have the extra support.
I've never purchased a car myself, but understand with a new car extras could add up quickly, and also coverage like you say.

For the TV it was probably worth getting, especially if it was expensive. But for the HDD, which is $60 to buy new and unlikely to fail too quickly, I would of also skipped the extended warranty.

 

[Jim_MDP]

...
It is a shame some people have not received things from customs, although if it happened before too I guess it is just bad luck.
...

No, Customs Inspection and Seizure has changed dramatically since 8/8.

It may have settled down a bit but you can still find posted screen caps of tracking showing lengthy holds at the entry ports. That wasn't happening before, there were no restrictions.

And it seems to have spooked the Canukistanians as well.
They had some lengthy holds before.. they're apparently much worse now.
I don't know what new regs they've passed but it seems they're looking out for their people from the ebul American products (as always... I'm actually banned from entry under penalty of incarceration, and I've never even gotten around to killing anyone. )

 

[RonJS]

I was referring to shipping costs. I know they have a VAT tax over there, and I'm sure other hidden taxes.

Shipping costs?

A while back I had been wondering how some Chinese sellers can offer free shipping to the USA. Seems there is a treaty or other postal agreement between the two countries that give the Chinese dirt cheap rates. USA based Firms that sell a bunch on eBay howl about this. Unfair they say. Plus USA folks who want to return the item they bought from the Chinese based eBay seller might be in for quite a shock when they learn what return postage might cost them.

Ron

 

[freemind]

Shipping costs?

A while back I had been wondering how some Chinese sellers can offer free shipping to the USA. Seems there is a treaty or other postal agreement between the two countries that give the Chinese dirt cheap rates. USA based Firms that sell a bunch on eBay howl about this. Unfair they say. Plus USA folks who want to return the item they bought from the Chinese based eBay seller might be in for quite a shock when they learn what return postage might cost them.

Ron

When it comes to fleabay, I generally only buy from US sellers. Most of the stuff coming from China, has someone in the US selling it. I get it from a US seller in a week, as opposed to waiting a MONTH from a China vendor.

 

[AndriaD]

Thank you all for your replies- it seems Wizard labs is the one, and they do offer international shipping which is great! @AndriaD brings up a good point though, in that it may be easier for me to get these chemicals on their own.
Hopefully you do not need a license or anything for them, and also I hope they are not used for anything bad, I would not want to be raided by the counter terrorism squad for testing my nicotine lol!

In those instructions, it mentions that the chemicals are readily available; I gather than they or something along their lines are used in pool testing, for chlorine and what-have-you.

Andria

 

[conanthewarrior]

No, Customs Inspection and Seizure has changed dramatically since 8/8.

It may have settled down a bit but you can still find posted screen caps of tracking showing lengthy holds at the entry ports. That wasn't happening before, there were no restrictions.

And it seems to have spooked the Canukistanians as well.
They had some lengthy holds before.. they're apparently much worse now.
I don't know what new regs they've passed but it seems they're looking out for their people from the ebul American products (as always... I'm actually banned from entry under penalty of incarceration, and I've never even gotten around to killing anyone. )

Ahh, sorry I misunderstood, in that case it is a shame things have changed for the worse since the 8/8.

I will not lie, I had to look up what a Canukistanian was lol.
Are you really banned from entering the USA? Doesn't sound good if you could go to jail for simply crossing the border!

 

[Jim_MDP]

Ahh, sorry I misunderstood, in that case it is a shame things have changed for the worse since the 8/8.

I will not lie, I had to look up what a Canukistanian was lol.
Are you really banned from entering the USA? Doesn't sound good if you could go to jail for simply crossing the border!

No... I'm a US American banned from entering Canadania.

Far from the only one I'm sure. I think they got a bit testy (understandably) when a common perception was that some of the 9/11 terrorists came in through Canada.. Oops.

And no, I'm not an ASBO candidate. A silly misdemeanor Nunchacku charge at age 20, a dismissed locked and cased handgun in transit 20 years ago... and two DUIs a few years apart a quarter century ago. Real bad ass huh?

I suspect it's the old DUIs (though guns are almost the same no-no there as for you in GB) but they wouldn't say. Just "Sign these papers so you can't say we didn't warn you, then get out of our country."

Not that I'm still pissed about it or anything (it's been ~8 years).

 

[conanthewarrior]

Oh Haha, I see. Sorry for the misunderstanding there.

It is understandable security may of got a bit more heavy handed after what happened on 9/11- I am not a US citizen, but remember exactly where I was when it happened. I was in the Kitchen with my family, shocked at what was going on. At first we thought it was a terrible accident, but then the second one hit and it was pretty obvious it was no accident.

I didn't think you was an ASBO candidate, far from it! Do you get ASBO's in the USA too? We have all done silly things in the past, myself included. Nothing terrible, I think they would of fallen into the misdemeanour category in the US.

Guns are a lot less popular than they are in the USA over here, I believe it was after the Dunblane massacre that handguns got very heavily restricted- now only very few people can actually own a handgun. We can have things like shotguns and rifles though, these are more common for people like farmers and hunters though.
I own a rifle myself, but only a .22 air rifle lol.

It could well be the old DUI's or the gun charge, I am glad though it isn't a big concern or annoyance to you though not being able to go there.