Fine tuning a recipe...

[bzar]

Hey everybody...

Short Intro: I bought a Cigalike many years ago. It worked great for about a month, but in the end its performance declined and i was back to smoking. This time around (several years later) i decided to come at it full force, get better equipment and try to make the vapor an easy and sustainable alternative to smoking. (Which i fell short of the firs time).
I now have several mech mods and Kayfuns in service as my ADV's. I also have a few RDA‘s and have spent my time getting the coiling & wicking down, using pre-made e-liquid. Now that i have come this far i am trying to get into diy'ing, but i am stumbling a little and could use a few pointers.

I have read the entire "Flavourart club"-thread and on the basis of this bought around 20 Flavourart flavours and a few TPA. I have also found that i enjoy mainly high VG mixes.

Everyone keeps talking about finding my own preferred flavourstrength for all my flavours, but i am unsure if im doing it the "long way round".
I make 5 ml of Fuji apple (for example) using 5 % flavouring. Then i steep it for a couple of days, vape it all, make corrections in my notes, make a new batvh (v.2) and repeat process until satisfied. This takes several weeks and by the time i get to v.3 i have mostly forgotten v.1.
The same problem arises when mixing more complex recipes. Does anyone do these things in one sitting, or is that simply not an option?

I thought about sitting down with all my flavors, make a 5 ml batch, use my RDA for testing 10 drops of liquid, add flavor or base, repeat until satisfied, but doing it "on the fly" messes up my math and the result wont be reproduceable. 5 drops of flavor + 95 drops of vg = 5 % mix. Vape 10 drops, add 3 drops of flavor = Im lost...!! Are anybody doing it like this or is there a better way...?

Im sorry for the long post and any confusion/misspellings... english is not my native language.

B.

 

[JXN]

I start a new flavor at 2% of a 3mL bottle. I note whether it is stong or weak. Whether I like it or not. What it tastes like and what I think might go good with it. I taste mostly now by using 1 mL in my dripper and often go ahead and combine the remaing 2 mL with another flavor I think might go good with it, or split the remaing 2mL in half if I have a couple ideas. Taking notes is the main thing, But I usually go through the process in a day. With Flavor Art I rarely go above 2%. I've got well over 100 flavors with many yet to be tested standalone but by using recipes here and experimenting I have a good feel for most of my flavors.

Edit to add: Each drop is equal to about 1% in 3 mL

 

[Time]

For single flavors I look up the flavor percentage recommendations and start on the high side because I prefer stronger flavor. I usually don't even have to adjust. I'm a big fan of leaning on those that have already gone through the process and were kind enough to share. The other thing I do is the same. I use other people recipes for more complex juices.

In short, I'm untalented and lazy. I do my juice like I cook food. I use other peoples recipes and percentages.

 

[OBDave]

I usually only continue tweaking a juice after I've started vaping if the flavor is really weak or there's something I'm hell-bent on adding...and you're right @bzar, at that point it's not an exact science but more of a guesstimated starting point for the next batch. I usually make 10-12 ml batches of recipes I'm still working on and spend a few days with each batch, trying a few ml fresh and then after light steeping (I do the lazy man's hot water steep as well, usually once and sometimes twice).

It's not uncommon for me to go through 3, 4, even 5 or 6 test runs before I've got something I'm excited enough to fill a 50 ml bottle with, but as long as it's vapeable I'll use a piece of painter's tape on the bottle to jot down ingredients and percentages to remind me what I'm working with at any given time.

 

[Larry J]

Keep notes on everything you mix, bzar. I use the ejuicemeup calculator, print them all out and then take notes on the bottom of the page of any corrections I think I need to make.

 

[Zortec2112]

I agree about keeping notes. I'm fairly new to DIY. I made a lychee juice from scratch and didn't keep any notes, nor did I save the initial recipe in my calculator. The juice was ok, but not what I was hoping for. It was sitting on the counter for weeks and one day I mistakenly grabbed that bottle and put some in my RDA. It was really good! Not 100% what I was after, but getting close. Due to my lack of notes I have no clue what flavors/percentages I used. Starting all over again...keeping notes this time!

 

[wllmc]

here is my rule of thumb for FA. If it has a normal name like peach, start at 2% if its has,a crazy name like bread crust use it around 0.0025% tobsccos id start around a,half percent. I find normally i like them at 2 or 3 %... 5 % is really alot in my opinion. When mixing multiple flavors its all game of what taste best to you. Most are usable as low as 0.25 % and up. Keep your mixes around 5 or 6 total flavoring and you should be good to go.

 

[wllmc]

my best tips are here if you have a few minutes of your life you want to waste lol. http://vapingunderground.com/threads/my-best-tips-to-diy-ejuice.2636/

 

[wllmc]

well , 10 minutes ago on the cracked screen of my phone I read this a little differently but my reply is still ok so we will leave it. ha. my 2nd reply is better. just try to have fun with it. you have a lot of mixing to do. make 5 or 10mls , save it in a calculator. vape it up and next time you make it start a new recipe with your new idea from the last one. eventually over time you will have made the same recipe 50 times and worked out all the kinks. the more complicated that you make the more complicated it will be throw some tunes on and mix away.

 

[Professor Snape]

@bzar, check this out: http://vapingunderground.com/threads/how-to-mix-small-batches-of-complex-recipes.1980/
It really helped me.

 

[bzar]

@JXN : the "1 drop = 1% in 3 ml" is a good way to make small batches fairly easy... i will keep this in mind. Also im glad to read that you can do it one day. Do you use any type of speed steeping or is it all shake n' vape?

@Time : i agree that we dont have to invent the wheel every time... Also i read the last part of your post as : im short, im untalented and lazy.

@OBDave : It seems like we're doing things almost the same way, except the steeping. I will keep tweaking my recipes (and everyone elses) until i get that "full body vapor feeling" from it. Most single flavor recipes seem very bland to me, except single flavours that are supposed to have various different notes. Spurred on by my own questions and your post about guesstimates i spent some time yesterday & figured out the math for "on the fly"-mixing.

@Larry J , @Zortec2112 : i agree on keeping notes and i am trying to become better and more thorough at it. I've downloaded an app called "eLiquid Recipe Manager" that suits most of my needs.

@wllmc : If i take into account how many minutes i have already spent reading your posts in the "Flavourart Club"-thread, im sure i can squeeze a few more in. Thank you for your advice - i am a nerd by heart and often find myself contemplating the almost nonsensical details of something. I will try to keep it fun and playful like you sugested.
On the other hand i cant turn off my inner cheapskate, so flinging stuff at the wall and see what sticks is not likely to happen. (I know you didnt say that it should. )

@Professor Snape : i agree that the thread you pointed to is helpful when making smaller amount of anything (especially FA), but i also feel like it is more useable when i have an acual recipe to follow.

B.

 

[JXN]

@JXN : the "1 drop = 1% in 3 ml" is a good way to make small batches fairly easy... i will keep this in mind. Also im glad to read that you can do it one day. Do you use any type of speed steeping or is it all shake n' vape?

@Time : i agree that we dont have to invent the wheel every time... Also i read the last part of your post as : im short, im untalented and lazy.

@OBDave : It seems like we're doing things almost the same way, except the steeping. I will keep tweaking my recipes (and everyone elses) until i get that "full body vapor feeling" from it. Most single flavor recipes seem very bland to me, except single flavours that are supposed to have various different notes. Spurred on by my own questions and your post about guesstimates i spent some time yesterday & figured out the math for "on the fly"-mixing.

@Larry J , @Zortec2112 : i agree on keeping notes and i am trying to become better and more thorough at it. I've downloaded an app called "eLiquid Recipe Manager" that suits most of my needs.

@wllmc : If i take into account how many minutes i have already spent reading your posts in the "Flavourart Club"-thread, im sure i can squeeze a few more in. Thank you for your advice - i am a nerd by heart and often find myself contemplating the almost nonsensical details of something. I will try to keep it fun and playful like you sugested.
On the other hand i cant turn off my inner cheapskate, so flinging stuff at the wall and see what sticks is not likely to happen. (I know you didnt say that it should. )

@Professor Snape : i agree that the thread you pointed to is helpful when making smaller amount of anything (especially FA), but i also feel like it is more useable when i have an acual recipe to follow.

B.

I have a lot of 3 and 6 mL bottles that sit in a shotgun shell case. I use a marker to put numbers on the bottom of the 6's and Letters on the bottom of the 3's and wriite down what they are elsewhere. The amount of time it takes me to get to the next one is my steeping time. I try to warm them up to blend easier sometimes but just make sure you give them a good shaking.

 

[purevapor1]

Hey everybody...

Short Intro: I bought a Cigalike many years ago. It worked great for about a month, but in the end its performance declined and i was back to smoking. This time around (several years later) i decided to come at it full force, get better equipment and try to make the vapor an easy and sustainable alternative to smoking. (Which i fell short of the firs time).
I now have several mech mods and Kayfuns in service as my ADV's. I also have a few RDA‘s and have spent my time getting the coiling & wicking down, using pre-made e-liquid. Now that i have come this far i am trying to get into diy'ing, but i am stumbling a little and could use a few pointers.

I have read the entire "Flavourart club"-thread and on the basis of this bought around 20 Flavourart flavours and a few TPA. I have also found that i enjoy mainly high VG mixes.

Everyone keeps talking about finding my own preferred flavourstrength for all my flavours, but i am unsure if im doing it the "long way round".
I make 5 ml of Fuji apple (for example) using 5 % flavouring. Then i steep it for a couple of days, vape it all, make corrections in my notes, make a new batvh (v.2) and repeat process until satisfied. This takes several weeks and by the time i get to v.3 i have mostly forgotten v.1.
The same problem arises when mixing more complex recipes. Does anyone do these things in one sitting, or is that simply not an option?

I thought about sitting down with all my flavors, make a 5 ml batch, use my RDA for testing 10 drops of liquid, add flavor or base, repeat until satisfied, but doing it "on the fly" messes up my math and the result wont be reproduceable. 5 drops of flavor + 95 drops of vg = 5 % mix. Vape 10 drops, add 3 drops of flavor = Im lost...!! Are anybody doing it like this or is there a better way...?

Im sorry for the long post and any confusion/misspellings... english is not my native language.

B.

I use 90 test tube with rack and a roll of painters tape and a pen style sharpie.. i do quite a few different %'s then go from there

 

[earlw]

I use 90 test tube with rack and a roll of painters tape and a pen style sharpie.. i do quite a few different %'s then go from there

I think the test-tubes and rack are a brilliant idea. So many little bottles on my desk... I just ordered the 10ml plastic tubes ones with the screw-on top and a 50-tube rack from amazon. Thank you for sharing the idea.

 

[bzar]

The more i get into all of this, the more i fell like a backyard chemist... small vials, measuring glasses and 1ml syringes. All i need now is the labcoat and some safety goggles.
Very good idea about the test tubes, @purevapor1 .

 

[bzar]

I feel pretty sure that youre far from the only one, @Shark Vape .

Yesterday i sat down and tried to do the "on the fly"-mixing while following along with my calculations. It worked just fine, but... i went from 1% to 8% with FA's 7 leaves before it tasted good. This seems abnormally high and im certain that it has to do with the lack of steeping.

Does anyone have any speed steeping advice and maybe a percentage guestimate as to how much of the steeping can be accomplished this way...? I would especially love to hear from anyone using the microwave-process succesfully.

B.

 

[Smoky Blue]

I dont micro nothing.. I dont use a sonic..
I do seed steeping.. taking around 10% of a finished juice and adding it to a new juice..
provided it is the same everything in that juice.. from nic on down to flavors..
then a 3 day wait and full steep ahead..

i sometimes use a frother, a rather large one lol.. for larger batches, but!! you can push a juice too far past the steep point..
get to know your flavors and end product before doing anything else..

 

[Smoky Blue]

I haven't had a good frothin' in way too long...

Me either.. and wish someone would do me..

 

[Heabob]

 

[FL_David]

I use the ejuicemeup calculator

I use this too and make notes in the note area, but don't print out anything.
If I'm not scanning through VU looking for flavor ideas to copy or tweak, then it will take me hours if not days to make a new flavor.

I start with a mental idea of a type of flavor, then smell a bunch of flavors to get a better idea of the flavor. I load the flavors in the ejuicemeup calculator with a rough guess on percentages. I may go through many changes before I mix anything. I keep the percentages on the low side to leave room for tiny tweaking if needed.
Should I come up with something pretty good I try to think of a cleaver or a goofy name and then share it.