I do it sooo wrong, but it works for me

[Ace25]

Been reading quite a few threads on here and wow do I make my juices wrong. I never use distilled water (even though I make 100+ gallons of it a week for my fish tanks), never steep, just fly by the seat of my pants and never had any major issues in the last couple years I have been making my own. Only in the first month did I get some bad tasting mixes due to me going overboard with flavors, or just had some terrible flavorings that no matter what I did tasted like bleh so I tossed those flavors after realizing there was nothing I could do to make them taste better (had some really aweful cherry and rootbeer flavors early on but since found much better ones).

How I do it, usually do a 75/5/20 mix of VG/PG/Flavoring. The PG/Flavoring will vary up to 10% but VG is always 75%. No nicotine for me.

First, I pick out my flavors. At first, I just used the smell test. Shake flavor bottle, open, smell, and just gauge on how strong the smell is to guess what percentage to put in. Things like cherry don't go above 3% because it is so potent, while others I may go as high as 15%. I use the program E-Juice Me Up to get my ratios correct (to what my guesses are). So I mix my VG/PG base, the add flavors counting the drops. I close the bottle, shake it up vigorously for a minute, then vape. I have been going through 30-40ml of juice a day (I use 40ml bottles).

I am thinking that maybe because I vape my juice right away, I have been making my recipes to work for me (maybe adding too much flavors, or too much/not enough of certain types because I don't let it steep). Whatever I am doing wrong though, I don't seem to mind, as I have quite a list of recipes I have come up with that I really enjoy.

Does anyone see any glaring problems with what I am doing? I am aware of the bad flavors/chemicals to look out for and avoid. I am more curious if there are any big negatives to my method (ie. health or equipment).

 

[AmandaD]

You're doing it fine! I rarely steep, never add distilled water (or any other additives), and usually shake and vape also. And as I get through 30mls a day, I make a lot of juice also.

 

[Teresa P]

You aren't using nicotine, so if it works for you there is no wrong.

 

[Ace25]

You aren't using nicotine, so if it works for you there is no wrong.

Wait.. have I misunderstood all this time? Is steeping needed more when using nicotine? I understand why to steep with complex recipes, but I thought nicotine just dulled the flavors and added a harshness to the vape and steeping wouldn't be needed for simple recipes, like single flavors. Can you elaborate?

I spent half the day reading about steeping methods (I think I am going to go with the ultrasonic cleaner method in the future) and learned some interesting information about PG and degradation. I am confused though.. one side says never add heat to PG as it degrades and as it does turns into some nasty things you don't want to vape, while the other side says to heat to make the flavors better. I was thinking of going to non-heated ultrasonic cleaner route because I don't want to vape some similar chemicals that I am trying to avoid in my flavorings just to get a slightly better taste. What are peoples opinions on that topic here?

 

[AmandaD]

Pg has no effect on flavors - most of them are based in pg! (Although a high pg mix can be harsher than a high VG mix, but many people say pg is a better flavor carrier).

Nicotine oxidizes so has more effect on 'steeping.' Without that not a whole lot happens. But, like cooking, you probably could wait a day or two for flavors to settle down.

If you don't have a UC I wouldn't bother buying one. I use a $10 crockpot when I do want to steep something - which is rare. I never heat treat spices (cinammon etc) because heat doesn't treat those kindly.

 

[Ace25]

I do make some juices for my gf's mom with nicotine so if steeping is needed more with nicotine for a reason I would like to do it.

This was one of the videos I watched on the topic today. The guy made some good points I thought.

 

[Teresa P]

What I meant was since you aren't using nicotine, there's no need to be concerned with safety in measurements, handling, etc. But even if you were, not all juices require steeping, even with nicotine. Generally fruity vapes can be enjoyed right away, whereas creams, custards, and tobaccos require a longer time for all fluids in the mix to "get acquainted".

 

[Ace25]

Ah, gotcha! Thanks! I misunderstood the first time I thought there was a correlation between steeping and nicotine (like nicotine needed to be steeped in order to work properly and I missed that part).

 

[AmandaD]

Ah, gotcha! Thanks! I misunderstood the first time I thought there was a correlation between steeping and nicotine (like nicotine needed to be steeped in order to work properly and I missed that part).

There can be a change with steeping nicotine - both good and bad, depending on the juice. Best way to find out is to make a mix and vape it fresh. If it's good, see how it changes depending on how long the mix lasts!

 

[Teresa P]

Sometimes it needs it, sometimes it doesn't. It's up to you, depending on the flavor you're shooting for.

 

[Ace25]

Well, I am shooting for 'as safe as possible' above all else. Flavor takes a back seat to safety. If steeping (leaving cap off/closet for weeks, or adding heat) both degrade PG into bad things according to Dows website I think those are methods I would want to avoid..

http://dowac.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/7485
"Propylene glycols will degrade slowly in the presence of oxygen. Metal contamination, acidic or basic contaminants and higher temperatures all accelerate the degradation reactions. Typical oxidation products are aldehydes, ketones, acids and dioxolanes. A strong odor, higher acidity, higher ultra-violet (UV)-absorption or high color are indicators that a propylene glycol has been not been stored properly and has started to degrade."

 

[Teresa P]

I just let mine sit. Nothing like time to steep juice. I just leave them capped in the desk drawer till I remember they're still in there and voila! Good juice....

 

[AmandaD]

Well, I am shooting for 'as safe as possible' above all else. Flavor takes a back seat to safety. If steeping (leaving cap off/closet for weeks, or adding heat) both degrade PG into bad things according to Dows website I think those are methods I would want to avoid..

http://dowac.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/7485
"Propylene glycols will degrade slowly in the presence of oxygen. Metal contamination, acidic or basic contaminants and higher temperatures all accelerate the degradation reactions. Typical oxidation products are aldehydes, ketones, acids and dioxolanes. A strong odor, higher acidity, higher ultra-violet (UV)-absorption or high color are indicators that a propylene glycol has been not been stored properly and has started to degrade."

Sometimes people get funky tasting PG and it has clearly gone bad. Under general circumstances you're not going to find this in your juice if you start with good PG. Leaving the cap off is not a good idea in any event, but heating in a crockpot at no more than 150 degrees has no ill effect on either nicotine or PG.

 

[Ace25]

Thanks Jim, that was kind of my thinking as well but I wasn't certain about it (no flavor change if only using PG/VG/Flavor).

Also thanks to everyone else who has responded. You have all eased my worries about steeping after feeling a little like a black sheep after reading article after article on the importance of steeping.

 

[Heabob]

You will probably find an equal amount of people that will claim you have to steep everything.
I let everything sit for at least 24hrs just because I'm not in a hurry anymore.

I've mixed up batches that were quite good for the first tank full.
After that the rest was meh! (most likely from not shaking them enough tho).

Allthough I think CAP Vanilla Custard is one of those that should steep for a week min.

But, if they taste good to you, that's all that really matters anyway.