Just a few newbie questions.

[riverdan]

I'll start off by saying sorry if this has been posted before.

I just started messing around with an RDA recently and I have a few Q's.

I'm a MTL vapor so I'm trying to build with that and flavour in mind.

I read a lot of stuff that says "if you're X vapor, you need Y set up" however theirs
rarely an explanation why, and sometimes, at least for a newbie like myself, the answer isn't always obvious.


For simplicity sake, let's just say I'm using kanthal only (eventually I'll move on once, I'm comfortable with what I have.

So, a side from being a cooler vape, why do MTL vapors prefer higher ohms?

If I'm trying to build somewhere in the 1.5-2ohm range, what is the ultimate goal outside what can fit the space.
Eg, Is my goal to have as many or as few wraps as I can? Should I have the biggest coil diameter as I can fit?


My personal preference (I think) is a slightly warm vape that has a sharp heating curve.
What I'm having a hard time with is, either I have to hold the button for a second or two before It gets to the temp/vape I want, or I up the wattage and it's too hot.

Right now I'm using a VTC mini, and prefer around 4.3v

Lastly, I know it's old but does anyone still use nichrome 80? I came across a few threads where people liked it for it's lower resistance, heats up quicker and the ability to use more wraps.

 

[SgtRock]

I use either Ni80 or 316L stainless in most of my builds...and have been since switching from Kanthal last year.

You have to build what YOU like and not what the "experts" recommend.

 

[Neunerball]

I'll start off by saying sorry if this has been posted before.

I just started messing around with an RDA recently and I have a few Q's.

I'm a MTL vapor so I'm trying to build with that and flavour in mind.

I read a lot of stuff that says "if you're X vapor, you need Y set up" however theirs
rarely an explanation why, and sometimes, at least for a newbie like myself, the answer isn't always obvious.


For simplicity sake, let's just say I'm using kanthal only (eventually I'll move on once, I'm comfortable with what I have.

So, a side from being a cooler vape, why do MTL vapors prefer higher ohms?

If I'm trying to build somewhere in the 1.5-2ohm range, what is the ultimate goal outside what can fit the space.
Eg, Is my goal to have as many or as few wraps as I can? Should I have the biggest coil diameter as I can fit?


My personal preference (I think) is a slightly warm vape that has a sharp heating curve.
What I'm having a hard time with is, either I have to hold the button for a second or two before It gets to the temp/vape I want, or I up the wattage and it's too hot.

Right now I'm using a VTC mini, and prefer around 4.3v

Lastly, I know it's old but does anyone still use nichrome 80? I came across a few threads where people liked it for it's lower resistance, heats up quicker and the ability to use more wraps.

For the higher Ohm coils, usually a thinner wire is used (28 - 32 gauge). The higher resistance is preferred by MTL hitters, due to the lower power needed, in order to heat up the coil. Therefore, the coil, and vapor doesn't get as hot either (compared to a 0.3Ohm dual coil w/ 24 gauge Kanthal).
Your "hard time" issue probably is due to the wire being too thick. Therefore, it takes either more time, or power to heat up the coil properly.
In an RDA, I personally prefer a 3 mm ID coil, which also prevents wicking issues / dry hits. In addition, staying within 7-10 wraps, depending on the wire. For your builds, refer to http://www.steam-engine.org/coil.asp as a guideline.

 

[HondaDavidson]

So, a side from being a cooler vape, why do MTL vapors prefer higher ohms? Less air being drawn in at a time. Less air means you don't need as much heat in the coil to make vapor. I prefer higher ohms, more than 1, because I don't as much vapor or to use as much juice as does less than 1 ohm. MTL don't always like a cooler vape. I'm a combo hitter, I call it MTNTL, I tend to draw into mouth and start releasing through nose while finishing the pull with a straight lung draw. Or flip it and start with the lung and finish with mouth and nose. I also like a warmish but not hot vape. I like the coil to be fats to heatup also as I take short 1-2second pulls.

If I'm trying to build somewhere in the 1.5-2ohm range, what is the ultimate goal outside what can fit the space. For me it would be Flavor first, followed by FEEL, then Vapor..

Eg, Is my goal to have as many or as few wraps as I can? The goal is to have enough. I find that number to be between 5-8 for the builds I do. (1-1.5ohm and 28awg and thinner Kanthal, Starting to use more Nichrome. I do alot of twisted wire building Should I have the biggest coil diameter as I can fit? IDK, I like them sized to work the way you want/need it to. In your case that's minimize heating time and maximize juice flavor, within the space available. These can be competing intrests. For coils in the 1.5-2.5ohm range I prefer 1.5-2.5mm ID, from 1-1.8ohm I use 2mm-3mm, below 1ohm I use 3mm or 1/8". Oh I use cotton balls for wick and vape unregulated. I size the coil so that the wick keeps the coil wet at all times but not too wet or dry at any time.

 

[riverdan]

Thanks guys, lots of good info here so far. There's lots of info out there for "what" but It's nice to know "why".

I think where I got confused the most is how you can come up with the same ohm's and number of wraps using different combinations of gauge and ID, and how they perform.

 

[HondaDavidson]

Yeah, the math and sciencey stuff does get confusing. Allot of the why's, I leave to the big brains to figure out.... Good thing there are Juice and build calculators and people out there testing battery safety and stuff. The rest is really simple common sense.

Take the limits or ranges of operation of my device and/or batteries. Plug those numbers into steam-engine and try stuff.

 

[riverdan]

Hate when I miss good threads like THIS before asking dumb questions. gaahh there is so much to the hobbyist side of vaping and I want to know it allll now! I should just start with making my own juice and look at all the shiny stuff later.

Focus Dan, Focus!

 

[pulsevape]

It's all trial and error..you just have to build stuff and see how you like it...don't listen to people who tell you what a "great" vape is..listen to everybody, but decide for yourself....alot of times you find something you thought wasn't your cup of tea to be a real great vape.it's al personal..just give yourself the premission to explore....there is no "advanced" vape or "best" vape anybody that tells you there is ,is full of shit.
'

 

[Lost]

@riverdan
Suggested order. Which partially matches what you just said.

1. Get two mods/setups, so in case something dies, you have a backup.
2. DIY Juice.
3. Acquire tools, a few gauges of wire. Ohm meter. Spare batts.
4. DIY coils
5. Shop for shiny stuff.

I can't tell you how many times I tried to play with coils and had to stop because I didn't have the necessary items. Building is way less of a headache now that I have "everything."

You do juice first, but not just to save money. It simply makes life so much easier.
Example: I'm down to two mods, and one of them is a 30-watt (don't ask.) That will lead to a higher-ohm coil for the tank. I just grab some of my 3mg/ml juice out of the fridge, add nic to make 6mg/ml, no shopping/thought required.

Final thought:
The reason some people get nervous/frustrated with starting juice is because they're trying to juggle all those recipes/flavorings along with it. Learn to make unflavored with nic/VG/PG. Think of it as a base. You can be overwhelmed with the other crap later. It's like a home cook learning to make stock before trying to make good soups.

 

[riverdan]

@riverdan
Suggested order. Which partially matches what you just said.

1. Get two mods/setups, so in case something dies, you have a backup.
2. DIY Juice.
3. Acquire tools, a few gauges of wire. Ohm meter. Spare batts.
4. DIY coils
5. Shop for shiny stuff.

I can't tell you how many times I tried to play with coils and had to stop because I didn't have the necessary items. Building is way less of a headache now that I have "everything."

You do juice first, but not just to save money. It simply makes life so much easier.
Example: I'm down to two mods, and one of them is a 30-watt (don't ask.) That will lead to a higher-ohm coil for the tank. I just grab some of my 3mg/ml juice out of the fridge, add nic to make 6mg/ml, no shopping/thought required.

Final thought:
The reason some people get nervous/frustrated with starting juice is because they're trying to juggle all those recipes/flavorings along with it. Learn to make unflavored with nic/VG/PG. Think of it as a base. You can be overwhelmed with the other crap later. It's like a home cook learning to make stock before trying to make good soups.

1. Check
2. working on it, I'm going to put in an order today or tomorrow.
3. Check. coilmaster v3 showed up in the mail yesterday. I started messing around with 29 and 32 gauge kanthal a week or so ago when they came in. so far a 29g single parallel seems to work best. 32g is kinda a pain but I'll get the hang of it. I used the coilmaster diy kit as an example so I think I have just about everything I need. I think the only other thing I'll probably want is a torch. This was all mainly a platform to test juices when I start making my own, but it's turned into it's own beast.
4. Patiently working at it. I refuse to let coil spaghetti get the better of me.
5a. Practice self control
5b. Buy allllll the shiny things.

Great tip on doing a few practice runs without flavour. It'll probably save a lot of flavours from hitting the bin.

It's all trial and error..you just have to build stuff and see how you like it...don't listen to people who tell you what a "great" vape is..listen to everybody, but decide for yourself....alot of times you find something you thought wasn't your cup of tea to be a real great vape.it's al personal..just give yourself the premission to explore....there is no "advanced" vape or "best" vape anybody that tells you there is ,is full of shit.
'

I hear ya man. I tend to over think these things before I even have the stuff in my hands. It doesn't help and im sure it's true for most people that most things take 2-4 weeks to get here by mail. I just have to remind myself that only practice makes perfect.

Six months from now I'll look back at these threads all enlightened and ish, and it'll all make sense. Hopefully I'll have something to give back to this awesome community by then.

 

[AndriaD]

So, a side from being a cooler vape, why do MTL vapors prefer higher ohms?

If I'm trying to build somewhere in the 1.5-2ohm range, what is the ultimate goal outside what can fit the space.
Eg, Is my goal to have as many or as few wraps as I can? Should I have the biggest coil diameter as I can fit?

I'm also a MtL vaper; I used 1-6-1.7 ohm coils for quite a while, but lately started building in the 2 ohm region. At first, the main reason was because I didn't know the iPV Mini that I got for xmas would "step down" -- until someone told me about shifting it to PWM mode -- so I built to higher resistance to give me a vape similar to what I was getting at 1.6-1.7 ohms at 9w. But, even when I discovered that it could step down just fine in PWM mode, I've stuck with my 2+ ohm coils, for 2 reasons -- the battery life is better, at higher resistance, and with 2 extra wraps, I get just a smidge more vapor. It's not a huge difference, I can't handle much vapor anyway, but 9 wraps 29ga around 3/32 fired at 9.5-10w does give me just a smidge more vapor than 7 wraps 29ga around 3/32 fired at 9w, yet the vapor *feels* no hotter.

Bigger coil diameter isn't necessarily better; it can be more difficult to wick, just because it needs more. But really, the main thing about coil inner diameter is *what you get used to* -- I've used 3/32 for well over a year, so it's the diameter I'm best at wicking; I can get *just* the right amount pretty much every single time, because I've done it so much.

More wraps typically means more vapor, because there is more surface area, but it also takes more power, because of more metal involved -- mine is a small diff, just 2 wraps, so it's only about a half watt to a full watt difference.

Andria

 

[Lost]

Great tip on doing a few practice runs without flavour. It'll probably save a lot of flavours from hitting the bin.

On the day I made my first quart, I had an idea of what I might be ordering for flavorings, and they were suggesting 10%. So I made a couple 27-mil batches in 30 mil bottles. Added 3ml of flavoring later. Shake. Done.

 

[riverdan]

I really appreciate the help. I don't know anyone else that vapes around me and sometimes talking/typing something out is what I need to get back on track. I do apologize for being all over the place. I'm a bit of a scatter brain. Especially since vaping has so many fun aspects to it.

 

[AndriaD]

I really appreciate the help. I don't know anyone else that vapes around me and sometimes talking/typing something out is what I need to get back on track. I do apologize for being all over the place. I'm a bit of a scatter brain. Especially since vaping has so many fun aspects to it.

I have the same problem -- if not for vape forums, I'd still be smoking because those drugstore cigalikes SUCK!

Andria

 

[Lost]

I do apologize for being all over the place.

The difference between a disposable cig-alike and DIY is insane. Batteries, coils, mods, tanks, wire, wicking, tools, juice, calculators, temperatures. It can be difficult to focus on one thing, and then finding the time it takes to narrow that one thing down to something digestible.

Examples:

Batteries. I picked Samsung 25r's, bought plenty at the best price, and now I don't have to think about them anymore.

Juice. I don't have to think about making it anymore. I have the process down, and have plenty of product in the freezer.

Wire. I was on the Post Your Builds thread until I figured out what gauges to buy. I have more than a year's worth of wire for my wife, and a few years for myself.

The thing that finally calmed me down was getting every tool I needed. It's just the way my brain works. Needed to have everything available.

 

[riverdan]

The thing that finally calmed me down was getting every tool I needed. It's just the way my brain works. Needed to have everything available.

Sounds about right