Sx mini m class questions

[Mroutlaw]

Can anyone tell me how the joules mode works in temperature control mode? What does it mean?

One the dna40, you can set your watts and that is what u vape at but I doesn't let you get past the set temperature. Does he joules setting do the same thing? If so, what would be the comparison? I use the Dna at 420-450 degrees set at 14-18 watts occasionally going to 24 watts when dripping. What do I set the sxmini to get similar experience.

Also, can someone please explain the soft, standard powerful modes.

And, can you turn gravity off, that thing is annoying?

Sorry if this was asked here, but I could find the answers anywhere and who knows how long it will take busardo to have a video on this

 

[Oggy]

Well I can help with a couple of the questions. All the features are the same on the SX mini and the M class except the temp control mode. At least this is what all the reviews say. I havent had the chance to play with the M class so cant help on the temp control side.

As to the soft, standard, and powerful modes. The soft mode starts out below the set wattage and moves up to your setting, like a slow ramp up. the standard setting will give you the power the device is set at. Powerful setting will start out at a higher power setting to get a fast ramp up then drop to your power setting. I think the powerful mode was kind of designed with drippers in mind.

Hope this helps

 

[Mroutlaw]

Helps a little, but the m class now has a powerful plus, so I wonder what that is. I really want more info on the temp. Everyone keeps saying they are having better experience than with dna40 and so far, I'm getting better hits on the Dna 40

 

[TheVapingDevil]

I can't technically explain joules mode but are a few threads about it here at VU. What I do is use it like a watts setting. If I normally vape at 25 watts then I adjust joules to 25j. You can then tweak it up or down as you see fit. I believe the powerful + mode boost the powerful mode by 10% for a faster ramp up. So far mine has been awesome

 

[Mroutlaw]

I can't technically explain joules mode but are a few threads about it here at VU. What I do is use it like a watts setting. If I normally vape at 25 watts then I adjust joules to 25j. You can then tweak it up or down as you see fit. I believe the powerful + mode boost the powerful mode by 10% for a faster ramp up. So far mine has been awesome

I have 2 marquis clones. Maybe I'll set them up with identical coils and out one on my Hana and one one the Sx mini. Then try to adjust the Sx mini to hit the same as the DNA

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Powerful plus gives you 10 percent higher than your desired wattage for 2 seconds.
Powerful gives you the ten percent higher for 1
Ita basically like the boost modes on the p3.

As to the gyro sensor if you hold it vertical to make adjustments and use the buttons it doesn't change anything. That was annoying at first and my reason for not getting the s class.
The joules - two possibilities... A joule is a unit of measurement equal to watts /time so 1 joule a second is equal to 1 watt.
Or
They divided 60/50 and came up with an arbitrary number of 1.2 and called it a joule.
I think its the latter to better avoid patent infringement.

 

[Mroutlaw]

Powerful plus gives you 10 percent higher than your desired wattage for 2 seconds.
Powerful gives you the ten percent higher for 1
Ita basically like the boost modes on the p3.

As to the gyro sensor if you hold it vertical to make adjustments and use the buttons it doesn't change anything. That was annoying at first and my reason for not getting the s class.
The joules - two possibilities... A joule is a unit of measurement equal to watts /time so 1 joule a second is equal to 1 watt.
Or
They divided 60/50 and came up with an arbitrary number of 1.2 and called it a joule.
I think its the latter to better avoid patent infringement.

Yeah, I understand the definition of joules and that we can see how many joules are used used on a battery charge.

I just can for the life of me figure out the best setting in temp mode. I've put it at 25 joules 420 degrees in powerful mode and it doesn't seem to hit as hard or as fast as on my Hana or vaporshark. And I have those set to 18 watts 420 degrees

Guess we'll have to wait for busardos 2 hour in depth video on it. Lol


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[TheVapingDevil]

I have 2 marquis clones. Maybe I'll set them up with identical coils and out one on my Hana and one one the Sx mini. Then try to adjust the Sx mini to hit the same as the DNA

That is probably a good plan. I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on that experiment.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Yeah, I understand the definition of joules and that we can see how many joules are used used on a battery charge.

I just can for the life of me figure out the best setting in temp mode. I've put it at 25 joules 420 degrees in powerful mode and it doesn't seem to hit as hard or as fast as on my Hana or vaporshark. And I have those set to 18 watts 420 degrees

Guess we'll have to wait for busardos 2 hour in depth video on it. Lol


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It did take a little playing around for me to find the combination I like best
But I
For the life of me I can't get the same builds to vape well on any of my dna40s

My aqua v2 has 28g dual coil at o.07 and lemo I'm single coil 26g at a 0.07
Both builds are on fire at 45j and 460 degrees

What I don't understand is ny definition dual coil and single coil at the same power should not vape this similarly at all. Not with such differs.t power requirements

 

[ButtKickers]

To get this device to operate at its fullest; forget what you know about the DNA 40

Target your nickel build to as close as .065 as possible for optimum accuracy (which is nice because you don't need 30 wrap coils)

Acclimate the attie to the device for a solid 20-30 minutes before locking in your resistance (familiar to DNA guys)

Set your temp FIRST, then gradually raise the joulesfrom the lowest setting; whilst firing an unwicked coil, until the temp barely overshoots target (Max of 5-10* F) before temp correction kicks in..

Joules is putting out MUCH more power than you realize. Set it up like this, and you'll be a happy camper, with a perfectly performing device. If you want more heat; raise the temperature first, then only adjust the joules upward as necessary.

(Sidebar: it does work fine with standard .1-.15 nickel builds, and premade coils, but not as good as with a .05-.08 build)

Hope this helps

 

[Mroutlaw]

To get this device to operate at its fullest; forget what you know about the DNA 40

Target your nickel build to as close as .065 as possible for optimum accuracy (which is nice because you don't need 30 wrap coils)

Acclimate the attie to the device for a solid 20-30 minutes before locking in your resistance (familiar to DNA guys)

Set your temp FIRST, then gradually raise the joulesfrom the lowest setting; whilst firing an unwicked coil, until the temp barely overshoots target (Max of 5-10* F) before temp correction kicks in..

Joules is putting out MUCH more power than you realize. Set it up like this, and you'll be a happy camper, with a perfectly performing device. If you want more heat; raise the temperature first, then only adjust the joules upward as necessary.

(Sidebar: it does work fine with standard .1-.15 nickel builds, and premade coils, but not as good as with a .05-.08 build)

Hope this helps

I'll try that. I was hoping to be able to keep my coils close in ohms so I can freely switch between the Dna and sx mini. I've already tossed my pro air because I don't want to have to bother with remembering what has kanthal and what has ni200

Right now, I have a marquis clone that was on my Dna. It's in single coil with a 28ni200/30kanthal twist. 9 spaced wraps on 3mm at .13ohms. I have it set at 430degrres and 25J in the powerful mode and I'm loving it. On my Dna, I was getting the same feeling at about 20 watts and 430 degrees.

I would just like to know the technical mpact that adjusting the joules has on the vape


Buttkickers, Since you own both the Dna and the sx, how does the temp kick in on the sx compared to the Dna? In other words, on the Dna, it ramps down the watts to avoid temp protection, what does the sx do? Is the warning on the sx "dry coil" or is that a different warning?

Thanks for your help.


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[ButtKickers]

I'll try that. I was hoping to be able to keep my coils close in ohms so I can freely switch between the Dna and sx mini. I've already tossed my pro air because I don't want to have to bother with remembering what has kanthal and what has ni200

Right now, I have a marquis clone that was on my Dna. It's in single coil with a 28ni200/30kanthal twist. 9 spaced wraps on 3mm at .13ohms. I have it set at 430degrres and 25J in the powerful mode and I'm loving it. On my Dna, I was getting the same feeling at about 20 watts and 430 degrees.

I would just like to know the technical mpact that adjusting the joules has on the vape


Buttkickers, Since you own both the Dna and the sx, how does the temp kick in on the sx compared to the Dna? In other words, on the Dna, it ramps down the watts to avoid temp protection, what does the sx do? Is the warning on the sx "dry coil" or is that a different warning?

Thanks for your help.


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It will operate perfectly fine with your DNA builds, but .065 is just YIHI's sweet spot, and you will notice a subtle improvement. I just felt the need to add that for the sake of being as informative as possible.

The most important thing is simply that you set it up as I described in 'standard' mode; then if you decide to use 'soft', 'powerful', 'powerful +' etc; it's merely to tailor it to your taste after the fact.

As far as the function of joules is concerned, I'm a structural engineer by trade; not an electrical engineer, so yea.. Lol

You will get a 'dry coil' message, but it seems to take a bit longer to get to that point in my experience, but that's a good thing; since the overall experience seems to be much more 'accurate' for lack of a better term. The biggest thing to remember with this device is NOT to crank the joules to the moon as if it were the wattage setting on your DNA. What I DO know is that you are getting an insane amount of power for your given joules/temp setting, and when you increase the joules too far; you're getting far more 'wattage' than you'd expect. 25 joules seems the soft max for most single coil builds, and I believe the only way you'd be able to go much higher in joules, and stay within the limits of temp control; is if you were doing a dual/ quad coil build with the obligatory LARGE surface area.

I know I'm doing a terrible job at explaining this, but even at 25 joules; you're still getting probably 40-60 watts. At least that's what it 'feels' like to me

 

[Mroutlaw]

Is it me, or does the unit get warm, even when it's just sitting? That worries me a little


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[f1r3b1rd]

Haven't noticed any heat issue

 

[ButtKickers]

I forgot to mention; I'm also currently using a combination of 28 gauge NI200 annealed, and 28 gauge kanthal twisted at the moment

 

[ButtKickers]

Is it me, or does the unit get warm, even when it's just sitting? That worries me a little


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ive noticed that as well, but it's no hotter than a mech with a non wreckless build after chain vaping, or any of my other single 18650 devices with the wattage cranked up.

As I said; with joules you're getting FULL power even at 25 joules (at least it seems), and joules 'seems' to be functioning in a different manner than wattage. From what I was told (and this could be complete BS) Joules regulates the amperage; not the wattage. I know that the official definition of the word 'joules' is 'wattage per second', but I don't believe that definition has anything to do with the temp control function here. It's merely a word they decided to use

 

[Mroutlaw]

It will operate perfectly fine with your DNA builds, but .065 is just YIHI's sweet spot, and you will notice a subtle improvement. I just felt the need to add that for the sake of being as informative as possible.

The most important thing is simply that you set it up as I described in 'standard' mode; then if you decide to use 'soft', 'powerful', 'powerful +' etc; it's merely to tailor it to your taste after the fact.

As far as the function of joules is concerned, I'm a structural engineer by trade; not an electrical engineer, so yea.. Lol

You will get a 'dry coil' message, but it seems to take a bit longer to get to that point in my experience, but that's a good thing; since the overall experience seems to be much more 'accurate' for lack of a better term. The biggest thing to remember with this device is NOT to crank the joules to the moon as if it were the wattage setting on your DNA. What I DO know is that you are getting an insane amount of power for your given joules/temp setting, and when you increase the joules too far; you're getting far more 'wattage' than you'd expect. 25 joules seems the soft max for most single coil builds, and I believe the only way you'd be able to go much higher in joules, and stay within the limits of temp control; is if you were doing a dual/ quad coil build with the obligatory LARGE surface area.

I know I'm doing a terrible job at explaining this, but even at 25 joules; you're still getting probably 40-60 watts. At least that's what it 'feels' like to me

You're actually a big help, so was your video. Not much info out there on this device. I do videos too, but they don't go into the technical details as much. Usually just overall reviews and comparisons.

Seems like a lot is going to be trial and error.

The 25j can be close to 40watts though, because I generally can't handle anything over 25 watts. I put my Hana to 30 watts on a video and I kicked my ass. I'm not a high wattage cloud chaser. My happy medium is generally 12-15 watts on kanthal and 15-22 on ni200. I don't like super hot vapes either. In fact, my all day vape is home made menthol/peppermint/spearmint. I like a cool throat hit. When I diy my menthol blend, I put 10% of A 10%menthol flavor, it's like an altoid on steroids if I go over 13watts.

In messing with this I pumped it up to 50j on the same coil and it was so hot, it knocked me on my ass. I have no ideas of how people vape that high. But then again, I've been vaping since using a 2ohm coil at4.8 watts on an ego twist was extreme.


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[ButtKickers]

That's all I got man. This is all going off what I've been told, and what I've figured out myself over the past week.. I'm just a guy Vapes, and reviews stuff.

I will say that I'm thrilled with how rock solid, and glitch free the operation of this thing has been thus far, and I'm THRILLED they stalled the release like Eh did, and didn't use us end users as guinnea pigs

 

[ButtKickers]

You're actually a big help, so was your video. Not much info out there on this device. I do videos too, but they don't go into the technical details as much. Usually just overall reviews and comparisons.

Seems like a lot is going to be trial and error.

The 25j can be close to 40watts though, because I generally can't handle anything over 25 watts. I put my Hana to 30 watts on a video and I kicked my ass. I'm not a high wattage cloud chaser. My happy medium is generally 12-15 watts on kanthal and 15-22 on ni200. I don't like super hot vapes either. In fact, my all day vape is home made menthol/peppermint/spearmint. I like a cool throat hit. When I diy my menthol blend, I put 10% of A 10%menthol flavor, it's like an altoid on steroids if I go over 13watts.

In messing with this I pumped it up to 50j on the same coil and it was so hot, it knocked me on my ass. I have no ideas of how people vape that high. But then again, I've been vaping since using a 2ohm coil at4.8 watts on an ego twist was extreme.


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I'm glad to have been of some help man. All I can say so far is that as long as you adjust it using the temp first, then gradually adjust the joules upward; there 'seems' to be no black art to using this device. Hopefully it doesn't toss us a curveball moving forward lol

 

[Mroutlaw]

I forgot to mention; I'm also currently using a combination of 28 gauge NI200 annealed, and 28 gauge kanthal twisted at the moment

I do something similar. I twist 30gauge kanthal with 28gauge ni200. I have a lot of 30gauge kanthal that I don't use and I also figure the higher resistance kanthal will make it less likely that current will travel through it instead of the ni200.. I was thinking of getting some 32gauge ni200 for less wraps on a dual coil.

I've found with ni200, simple is best and usually only do single coil. but I want to use my mad hatter rda and that can only be built in dual coil


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[ButtKickers]

I do something similar. I twist 30gauge kanthal with 28gauge ni200. I have a lot of 30gauge kanthal that I don't use and I also figure the higher resistance kanthal will make it less likely that current will travel through it instead of the ni200.. I was thinking of getting some 32gauge ni200 for less wraps on a dual coil.

I've found with ni200, simple is best and usually only do single coil. but I want to use my mad hatter rda and that can only be built in dual coil


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We're definetly operating on the same wavelength here all around; though I suspect (and I may eat these words) that this thing may do better in dual coil mode than we think..

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Ummmm it does great in dual coil!
I use my mako and a freakshowmini both with dual coil builds between a 0.7 and 0.8 and it does fantastic.

 

[Mroutlaw]

Only reason I haven't messed with dual coil is because of the number of wraps it takes to get there, but the sx can go down to .05, its more viable now. I've been using my mad hatter in dual coil on the RDNA and its been awesome. But it took 11 wraps of 28gauge ni on a 3.5mm rod to get to .09. Thats a lot to fit into that rda, and even harder to get it to a center coil build.

Most people don't realize the DNA can go down to .06ohm, but you won't get all the features since it has to step down.

F1r3b1rd, if you haven't tried the mad hatter, give it a go. Similar to the freakshow and the freakshow mini, but holds a lot more juice and gives even better flavor and vapor than the freakshow mini. Plus, its not as prone to leaking and you don't have to take the whole top sleeve off to fill it. When you flip the top, it gives you access to the coils, and center (which is where I drip on the freakshow) but the air holes are recessed to the side and you can't possible drip into them, unless of course you overfill it.

When I say simple is better with Ni200, I'm referring more to all these exotic builds people are into, like clapton, zipper and other stuff.

In all my testing with Ni200, simple spaced wraps are giving wonderful flavor and vapor.

 

[Mroutlaw]

Powerful plus gives you 10 percent higher than your desired wattage for 2 seconds.
Powerful gives you the ten percent higher for 1
Ita basically like the boost modes on the p3.

As to the gyro sensor if you hold it vertical to make adjustments and use the buttons it doesn't change anything. That was annoying at first and my reason for not getting the s class.
The joules - two possibilities... A joule is a unit of measurement equal to watts /time so 1 joule a second is equal to 1 watt.
Or
They divided 60/50 and came up with an arbitrary number of 1.2 and called it a joule.
I think its the latter to better avoid patent infringement.

So I have a lot more testing to do, but the few hours Ive been testing and experimenting, I think your onto something here with the 60/50 thing.

It seems that 1 watt is equal to about .83 joules. I put a .13 coil in a marquis rda on my VS RDNA40 and set it to 20 watts and 430degrees, The I put an identical coil on a second marquis and set my SX mini to 16.6joules and 430degrees and setting it to powerful (which is to accommodate for the the ramp up thats in the DNA chip)

They seem to hit identical vaping them side by side. Of course, this is going totally by feel and I don't have the proper equipment to actually test this with meters.

 

[ButtKickers]

Ummmm it does great in dual coil!
I use my mako and a freakshowmini both with dual coil builds between a 0.7 and 0.8 and it does fantastic.

That's the best news I've heard all day!! I'm going to go build the goblin, or one of my orchids next.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

So I have a lot more testing to do, but the few hours Ive been testing and experimenting, I think your onto something here with the 60/50 thing.

It seems that 1 watt is equal to about .83 joules. I put a .13 coil in a marquis rda on my VS RDNA40 and set it to 20 watts and 430degrees, The I put an identical coil on a second marquis and set my SX mini to 16.6joules and 430degrees and setting it to powerful (which is to accommodate for the the ramp up thats in the DNA chip)

They seem to hit identical vaping them side by side. Of course, this is going totally by feel and I don't have the proper equipment to actually test this with meters.

That's the only way I can tell right now, myself. All my test gear and lab is at my hunting camp 3 hours away and I haven't had time to get it.
Supposedly busardos numbers will be available this week or next so there's not much point in a 6 hour round trip run to get my scope.
But.... The math all works and it's the simplest possibility; which is normally the answer.
Glad someone else is seeing what I am.

 

[Vlad1]

Powerful plus gives you 10 percent higher than your desired wattage for 2 seconds.
Powerful gives you the ten percent higher for 1
Ita basically like the boost modes on the p3.

As to the gyro sensor if you hold it vertical to make adjustments and use the buttons it doesn't change anything. That was annoying at first and my reason for not getting the s class.
The joules - two possibilities... A joule is a unit of measurement equal to watts /time so 1 joule a second is equal to 1 watt.
Or
They divided 60/50 and came up with an arbitrary number of 1.2 and called it a joule.
I think its the latter to better avoid patent infringement.

I hadn't really looked at the modes very closely so after reading your comment decided to take a look. What I'm seeing is for each of the modes the period is 2 seconds soft through powerful+ excluding standard of course. My calculations may be off a little but it's not time they're using to increase / decrease power it's the amplitude of the voltage for that 2 seconds. I may have been reaching device or battery limits on the output of Powerful+ so that may actually be a bit higher.

My rough calculations, could be off by a few percentage due to my measuring equipment and my math skills. But if they are they will still scale the same in regard to each other. Which I'm thinking its probably -10%, +10% then +15% in power output. It just seems more of a standard than -13, 13, 18.

Soft: -13% decrease for 2 sec
Powerful: 13% increase for 2 sec
Powerful+ 18% increase for 2 sec

 

[f1r3b1rd]

I hadn't really looked at the modes very closely so after reading your comment decided to take a look. What I'm seeing is for each of the modes the period is 2 seconds soft through powerful+ excluding standard of course. My calculations may be off a little but it's not time they're using to increase / decrease power it's the amplitude of the voltage for that 2 seconds. I may have been reaching device or battery limits on the output of Powerful+ so that may actually be a bit higher.

My rough calculations, could be off by a few percentage due to my measuring equipment and my math skills. But if they are they will still scale the same in regard to each other. Which I'm thinking its probably -10%, +10% then +15% in power output. It just seems more of a standard than -13, 13, 18.

Soft: -13% decrease for 2 sec
Powerful: 13% increase for 2 sec
Powerful+ 18% increase for 2 sec

grazi vlad!!! You right!!!

 

[TheVapeApe]

I have a quick question based on my sx mini m class, recently I have had my resistance jumping by .01 increments, for instance I build a regular twisted kanthal build, sync at .477, screen reads .47, now I have the resistance jump between .47 and .48 almost every single time I press the fire button... So before I called this an issue I did throw on 3 other RDA/RBA's, all of which have the same thing happen, Even a kangertech pre-built coil is doing this. I am hoping to determine if this is a defect or not very soon as I am within warranty and would like to get it replaced as quickly as possible if it is an issue

 

[fq06]

Have you tried it with nickel wire? Unless you are twisting kanthal with nickel, that may be an issue. It won't TC with kanthal.
Sub tank coil is nickel?

The only time I saw resistance move on me is when the wire loosened up and tightening the screw was all that was needed.

Also, not sure if this is what your seeing but the resistance will go higher as you vape. Higher temps, higher wire resistance. Thats how the mod calculates the temp, by the change in resistance.

 

[TheVapeApe]

My build is just a regular twisted kenthal build in regular power mode all post are fully tightened, this is happening on three different rdas I own

 

[fq06]

The resistance will change when you fire the mod in temp or power mode. The main thing to look at is if it can settle back down to the same resistance if you let it sit for a minute or two to let the coil get back to room temperature where you checked the resistance at the first time.

If it isn't settling into the same resistance (or really close) I guess there may be an issue it needs to be sent in for... but a 0.01 variance is not very big. You can easily get that if the coil is not the same standing temp as where you checked it at.

 

[Vlad1]

I have a quick question based on my sx mini m class, recently I have had my resistance jumping by .01 increments, for instance I build a regular twisted kanthal build, sync at .477, screen reads .47, now I have the resistance jump between .47 and .48 almost every single time I press the fire button... So before I called this an issue I did throw on 3 other RDA/RBA's, all of which have the same thing happen, Even a kangertech pre-built coil is doing this. I am hoping to determine if this is a defect or not very soon as I am within warranty and would like to get it replaced as quickly as possible if it is an issue

I don't have any Kanthal builds to test with but as has been stated the resistance will rise even with Kanthal just not as much as say Ni200 or Ti. And what your talking about is a very small change which I would expect with Kanthal. You're talking about .003Ω difference between .477Ω to .48Ω when you fire it. Sounds reasonable to me.

 

[Johnny Hotsauce]

Question on the firmware. I have 2.23 installed in mine and max watts I can do in ECO mode is 40W however I saw a screenshot elsewhere where someone was also on 2.23 (so they claimed) but was able to go to 75W in ECO mode. Am I missing something or was that possibly some good photo shopping?

 

[AmandaD]

Question on the firmware. I have 2.23 installed in mine and max watts I can do in ECO mode is 40W however I saw a screenshot elsewhere where someone was also on 2.23 (so they claimed) but was able to go to 75W in ECO mode. Am I missing something or was that possibly some good photo shopping?

I just checked mine. I can only go to 40j in eco mode, but 75 in the others.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Eco mode is set up to conserve battery life. It has its own 5presets and by design only goes to 40w it also turns off several background operations.
All of the other fire modes go to 75w.
Additionally ni200 mode maxes out at 50j.

 

[Johnny Hotsauce]

Thanks guys! I'll chalk this up to some fancy photoshop work, just wanted to make sure I wasn't going nuts, LOL. Mine is the same way, up to 75W in all other modes and max 40W in ECO.

 

[TheVapeApe]

I have another question as I have just started going into temp control, I'll do my best to describe the issue and try to show just how random this issue can be... if I set my mod at 20 joules and then put it on eco mode it goes UP to 25 joules everytime, then if I put it to 35 joules and then go to eco mode the joules go down to 15 joules, I then put it to 40 joules and it goes down to 35 joules in eco mode , and if I put it at 38 joules eco mode puts it up to 40 joules... is this normal? this mod has not even had the slightest bump so I am worries it is a defective chip, any answer or insight I can get on this issue will be greatly appreciated as I am tearing my hair out worrying about this

 

[f1r3b1rd]

I have another question as I have just started going into temp control, I'll do my best to describe the issue and try to show just how random this issue can be... if I set my mod at 20 joules and then put it on eco mode it goes UP to 25 joules everytime, then if I put it to 35 joules and then go to eco mode the joules go down to 15 joules, I then put it to 40 joules and it goes down to 35 joules in eco mode , and if I put it at 38 joules eco mode puts it up to 40 joules... is this normal? this mod has not even had the slightest bump so I am worries it is a defective chip, any answer or insight I can get on this issue will be greatly appreciated as I am tearing my hair out worrying about this

Yes that's totally normal, you have multiple things going on. @Vlad1 or @RebelGolfer72 can both explain better than myself, since its Saturday and the bar is having 2 for 1s
eco mode dos have a preheat, just unsure of what it is
Secondly its adjusting power output to match your temperature setting.
The only other thing that would effect output would be the integrity of the metal you're using or the connections not being solid. if those two mechanical issues are non-issues its just the mod trying to regulated temperature.
If you're using a squape, subtank or a kayfun4 the lack of a solid connection is very possible; ive read several people having issues with those atomizers and tc. (more than normal)

 

[TheVapeApe]

thanks a bunch man, that takes a load off my mind, do you have any idea why it would randomly jump from 20 joules to 25 joules in eco mode? just can't seem to justify why the mod would go up in joules to save battery life?

 

[TheVapeApe]

oh and also would this mean it is normal for the mod to go from 30 joules in standard down to 5 joules in eco mode...

 

[f1r3b1rd]

thanks a bunch man, that takes a load off my mind, do you have any idea why it would randomly jump from 20 joules to 25 joules in eco mode? just can't seem to justify why the mod would go up in joules to save battery life?

Its probably preheating the coil, I'm guessing its ramping up then backing down. eco mode is to conserve battery life it does a few things to do so, lessens the backlit on the screen, turns off background operations but try's to keep performance 'similar' to powerful mode.
Try standard mode or try lowering your temp setting

 

[f1r3b1rd]

oh and also would this mean it is normal for the mod to go from 30 joules in standard down to 5 joules in eco mode...

When you leave any of the firing modes and go into eco, it automatically goes to your first eco mode preset.
Eco mode has its own 5preset values than the rest of the mod.
5 normal presets
5 tempo control presets
5 temp control eco mode presets
5 normal mode eco presets

So yes that's normal too. I changed my eco mode position one to my most used wattage,

 

[TheVapeApe]

You my friend are a LIFESAVER!, this is exactly what I needed to hear and is EXACTLY what is happening with my mod. thank you so much!

 

[f1r3b1rd]

You my friend are a LIFESAVER!, this is exactly what I needed to hear and is EXACTLY what is happening with my mod. thank you so much!

No worries dude!