I have bought a lot of things from there, Some really cool finds too
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Age verifications
- Thread starter Whitesoxfan2579
- Start date
What I don't understand is this....
Say you're a vendor. I fil out an attestation form and prepare my dl for a photo shoot... Ok they're both in the email and I send them... There we go, boom I'm 27...there it is.
So why am I not stored as being over the "legal age"? It's having to repeat the damn process over and over again with the same company that has me crying jalapenos!
Oh and the whole last 4 of my social doesn't even work. When a window popped up I was all like ok...mine isn't working and why?
I call the number up and am told I may have to repeat the process of filling out a form and sending that copy of my dl every single time I place an order.
Here's the kicker... I was only purchasing a few drip tips.
The guy was friendlyand helpful so I dont blame him. But these regulations and all the red tape is crap.
Say you're a vendor. I fil out an attestation form and prepare my dl for a photo shoot... Ok they're both in the email and I send them... There we go, boom I'm 27...there it is.
So why am I not stored as being over the "legal age"? It's having to repeat the damn process over and over again with the same company that has me crying jalapenos!
Oh and the whole last 4 of my social doesn't even work. When a window popped up I was all like ok...mine isn't working and why?
I call the number up and am told I may have to repeat the process of filling out a form and sending that copy of my dl every single time I place an order.
Here's the kicker... I was only purchasing a few drip tips.
The guy was friendlyand helpful so I dont blame him. But these regulations and all the red tape is crap.
Besides age verification I am now scanning vendors for SSL and malware. I was playing on a different forum and was enlightened.
My ex-favorite vendor got a "F". Look here...
https://www.ssllabs.com/ssltest/analyze.html?d=sweet-vapes.com
No malware detected though.
https://sitecheck.sucuri.net/results/sweet-vapes.com
This is just a example of what to look for.
My ex-favorite vendor got a "F". Look here...
https://www.ssllabs.com/ssltest/analyze.html?d=sweet-vapes.com
No malware detected though.
https://sitecheck.sucuri.net/results/sweet-vapes.com
This is just a example of what to look for.
I look at all of this from the perspective that the fda is forcing these vendors to verify. So far all the vendors I've shopped have treated me well, and as long as I can conceal the sensitive info on my dl then I don't mind emailing them a copy. However, my ssn is out of the question. Thus far, my dl has done the trick.
I get to thinking of them too, and it all boils down to hard times for vendors and vapers alike. It isn't the vendors fault.
I get to thinking of them too, and it all boils down to hard times for vendors and vapers alike.
It isn't the vendors fault.
Very true C&C. Stupid government
And I wonder what they do. It's known that many of them smoke fancy cigars and drink.
I guess their lungs and livers are magically lined with gold? So it certainly isn't for our healths. It's all about the money and power.
They sure aren't giving up their pleasures.
I guess their lungs and livers are magically lined with gold? So it certainly isn't for our healths. It's all about the money and power.
They sure aren't giving up their pleasures.
Some politicians have been known to do worse with cigars than smoke them.. (coff coff, slick willy). lmao. Very true though. I'm sure there are a few concerned about health but most are out for a money grab. Our 'health' is just an easy pass to get it approved because who's going to vote against 'health preservation' right? It doesn't help that the fda passes the ball to the equally crooked healthcare system who 'studies' and 'researches' everything to death without actually producing results or cures so long as the grant money keeps rolling in. That's what happens when you're paid by the hour and get away with 'looking busy'.
Oh my gosh, I'm lovin you for this one.
He didn't get that name for smoking em huh? Rofl... 
Oh, he smoked 'em. They were just 'pre-treated'.Oh my gosh, I'm lovin you for this one.
Lmao.
JuicyLucy
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FDA fires its first round in age-verification compliance checks.
Some of these are cigar products, most are looking to make retailers look bad as the FDA purchased mainly "flavors that appeal to children"
The article doesn't say the method used to purchase the products illegally or how many retailers complied and didn't get notices.
http://www.fda.gov/downloads/Tobacc...nceRegulatoryInformation/Retail/UCM520813.pdf
Some of these are cigar products, most are looking to make retailers look bad as the FDA purchased mainly "flavors that appeal to children"
The article doesn't say the method used to purchase the products illegally or how many retailers complied and didn't get notices.
http://www.fda.gov/downloads/Tobacc...nceRegulatoryInformation/Retail/UCM520813.pdf
Hey Lucy, so I checked this out, but I'm not sure what this means? It says some of these products have ended, so does that mean they are being ripped from the shelves?
Appealing to children or not, I still like fruity flavors and as an adult should be able to vape them if I choose. All this fda bullshit is so frustrating.
I am more intrigued by this statement in the warning statement sent to Azure (the only etailer I recognized):
"...No retailer may sell covered tobacco products, including e-liquid, cigar, pipe tobacco, waterpipe tobacco, and dissolvable tobacco products, as well as electronic nicotine delivery system (ENDS) products that contain any tobacco derivative, to a person younger than 18 years of age..."
Does this mean that it's okay with the FDA if minors buy devices as long as they aren't derived from nicotine? Or is it just in the context of the eliquid sale? I suppose only the FDA knows for sure.
"...No retailer may sell covered tobacco products, including e-liquid, cigar, pipe tobacco, waterpipe tobacco, and dissolvable tobacco products, as well as electronic nicotine delivery system (ENDS) products that contain any tobacco derivative, to a person younger than 18 years of age..."
Does this mean that it's okay with the FDA if minors buy devices as long as they aren't derived from nicotine? Or is it just in the context of the eliquid sale? I suppose only the FDA knows for sure.
Bunch of feckless half wits. They're really reaching now, 'flavors that appeal to kids'. Once you're an adult, that's it. No more fruit for you. Apples and bananas are strictly for kids. I'm wondering, does that mean that 'mikes' branded alcohol is geared towards children as well? I mean there's hard cider and the children love cider. I'm pretty sure kids set up lemonade stands so hard lemonade must be geared toward them as well. Cops better put up the donuts too since those are for children only. Every time I go to a DD that's all I see, children running around in their nappies swiping their gold card to buy more donuts. Not a single adult in sight drinking coffee or anything.
Or better yet 'jazz' cigars. Because so many kids these days are groovin' to the jams of the 40's and 50's. Hell most adults don't like jazz much less kids. If we're going to go back to the days of 'jazz' then I think it's worth doing so truthfully. The likes of Louis Armstrong and Duke Ellington performing in places like the cotton club and speakeasies. Huge icons of the underground for adults who continued to enjoy not only alcohol but illegal alcohol during prohibition. Boy that screams children. Asshats.
Supposedly it was a list of things sold to minors although it's nothing new with the new regulations. It's always been illegal to sell cigs and cigars to minors and yet it's been done since before vaping was even a thing. Big finding - illegal shit happens in this country. That was newsworthy. The FDA needs to get a life, seriously. Much like the above reference to speakeasies, in the end the people will decide. Not some regulatory wannabe.
It means the FDA has no regulatory authority if it doesn't contain nicotine derived from tobacco. Kind of an odd statement from them. I was under the impression they were trying to regulate everything. Guess a zero nic liquid in any device is therefore free from FDA interference......
That's what I was getting at. Is this a statement, by the FDA, that they WON'T try to control non-tobacco derived products if they're not sold in pairing with tobacco derived products? It certainly seems to be. Of course, given their history, they'll likely retract or deny the inferred meaning.
JuicyLucy
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ENDS is their acronym for Electronic Nicotine Delivery System. It is their word for items that aren't tobacco that they "classify" as tobacco. Drip tips, mods and atomizers are examples of ENDS.
Ah, but according to the quote:
"...No retailer may sell covered tobacco products, including e-liquid, cigar, pipe tobacco, waterpipe tobacco, and dissolvable tobacco products, as well as electronic nicotine delivery system (ENDS) products that contain any tobacco derivative, to a person younger than 18 years of age..."
If it doesn't contain a tobacco derivative, it does not fall under their jurisdiction. At least, that how it reads for me..... Kind of like I can sell all the pipes I want, as long as they don't contain the devil's lettuce.
JuicyLucy
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Ah, but according to the quote:
"...No retailer may sell covered tobacco products, including e-liquid, cigar, pipe tobacco, waterpipe tobacco, and dissolvable tobacco products, as well as electronic nicotine delivery system (ENDS) products that contain any tobacco derivative, to a person younger than 18 years of age..."
If it doesn't contain a tobacco derivative, it does not fall under their jurisdiction. At least, that how it reads for me..... Kind of like I can sell all the pipes I want, as long as they don't contain the devil's lettuce.
Do or believe or interpret whatever you want - but the FDA has deemed shit like atomizers and mods (ENDS) as "tobacco products"
jackmormon
Member For 4 Years
This type of thing keeps Attorney's in business. It seems like a lot of laws/legislation are written in such a way that much is left open for interpretation.
I think many of us overestimate the amount of resources that the FDA and others are going to put into enforcement. My guess is that it will mostly be at the local level driven by a politician or government employee trying to make some sort of point rather than broad sweeping enforcement. The general public really doesn't care either way. What would make them care is if they learn an inordinate amount of tax dollars are being spent on enforcement.....
I think many of us overestimate the amount of resources that the FDA and others are going to put into enforcement. My guess is that it will mostly be at the local level driven by a politician or government employee trying to make some sort of point rather than broad sweeping enforcement. The general public really doesn't care either way. What would make them care is if they learn an inordinate amount of tax dollars are being spent on enforcement.....
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Yes I understand that, and it even says it in the original quote that I replied to:
"...No retailer may sell covered tobacco products, including e-liquid, cigar, pipe tobacco, waterpipe tobacco, and dissolvable tobacco products, as well as electronic nicotine delivery system (ENDS) products that contain any tobacco derivative, to a person younger than 18 years of age..."
But read it again, no retailer may sell covered tobacco products, that contain any tobacco derivative to a minor.
No retailer may sell an (ENDS) that contains a tobacco derivative, this is the key here. Logic would dictate that if it contains a tobacco derivative, it cannot be sold to a minor. Which means the opposite is also true ; If it does not contain a tobacco derivative, it can be sold to a minor. See where I'm going with this? Ergo, there should be no age verification if the product does not contain a tobacco derivative...... I know, probably not that simple, but it does make you wonder at the wording used, does it not?
lordmage
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yes but in the deeming they are classifying anything that can be expected to be used in or with a ENDS to be a tobacco product aka zero nic is a tobacco product
"As it relates to e-liquids that contain zero nicotine, generally, if your zero-nicotine product is not made or derived from tobacco, it may still be a tobacco product subject to FDA regulation if it is intended or reasonably expected to be used with or for the human consumption of a tobacco product; or intended or reasonably expected to alter the performance, composition, constituents, or characteristics of a tobacco product (with certain exceptions relating to controlling moisture or temperature for storage and initiating external heat source), your product is subject to FDA regulation. These products will be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. This applies to closed and open system devices that contain zero-nicotine"
from https://spinfuel.com/zero-nic-game-life-88/
"As it relates to e-liquids that contain zero nicotine, generally, if your zero-nicotine product is not made or derived from tobacco, it may still be a tobacco product subject to FDA regulation if it is intended or reasonably expected to be used with or for the human consumption of a tobacco product; or intended or reasonably expected to alter the performance, composition, constituents, or characteristics of a tobacco product (with certain exceptions relating to controlling moisture or temperature for storage and initiating external heat source), your product is subject to FDA regulation. These products will be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. This applies to closed and open system devices that contain zero-nicotine"
from https://spinfuel.com/zero-nic-game-life-88/
I understand that it is considered a tobacco product. But there are 2 distinctions in the statement. One is a tobacco product, one is a tobacco derivative. A tobacco product may or may not contain a tobacco derivative. I think the problem may lie in the fact that there are hundreds of people whom work for the FDA, one or more wrote the deeming regs, one or more different peoples wrote that letter. I am only speaking strictly of the warning letter where they make this distinction between the two. It may be a left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing, and that may help our cause in litigation.
lordmage
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the letter wording is covering WTA juice as well. mean the juice that was once soaked in tobacco and filtered back out. it also covers nic and no nic since to them all juice is a tobacco product unless they were informed in writing that it is a non tobacco derived juice or nic free and they agreed with you.
Ah ok, was wondering lol. Thanks Lucy. This may be why I had to send a copy of my dl and fill out an attestation form just to buy drip tips. Haha.
JuicyLucy
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It's one of many things that make this FDA thing so screwed. A drip tip is classified as a tobacco product, same as a deadly cigarette
Well that Blue Check crap has screwed me royally. I live in Canada with a US shipping address and I can't register since I have a Canadian SIN(social insurance number) and not a social security number. Its a load of crap but I've already had to send picture proof of age to my nic vendor in Ontario so I'm somewhat glad I did do some minor stockpiling of my fav HS tobac concentrates. My wife goes through @100mls of HS Desert Ship concentrate a year so I do have several years worth for her vaping needs, me on the other hand going to end up vaping NETS once I begin to run out of concentrates if I can't buy from US DIY vendors.
I do have to go down to talk to the border guards to find out how leaf tobacco is taxed and how much I can bring over. I know its handled differently than processed tobacco but still I have to jump through hoops since the CBSA website is a tad confusing to figure out.
I do have to go down to talk to the border guards to find out how leaf tobacco is taxed and how much I can bring over. I know its handled differently than processed tobacco but still I have to jump through hoops since the CBSA website is a tad confusing to figure out.
It's one of many things that make this FDA thing so screwed. A drip tip is classified as a tobacco product, same as a deadly cigarette
Yeah, it is screwed up and frustrating.
Got 60 coils from Vaporbeast today.
Just input my birthday, checked boxes and was good to go.
Also got a pkg from FT yesterday.
Man, sounds like we are all having issues with this verify crap. Sometimes the check system glitches and then it gets even more complicated, or maybe it's rigged that way.
Sometimes the check system glitches and then it gets even more complicated, or maybe it's rigged that way.
You're lucky, had to send them a copy of my dl and email them a hand written attestation form for 4 drip tips.
they are apparently using some behind the scenes verification with me and my credit card or something.
That could be it. Plus, I was a new customer, may not have to do all that when I order again. What I got from them was awesome tho so I didn't mind too bad.
Ahh I have been a customer of theirs for over a year.That could be it. Plus, I was a new customer, may not have to do all that when I order again. What I got from them was awesome tho so I didn't mind too bad.