Clapton Coils and Wire Matching

[PhantomOp]

OK master coil builders. Got a few questions for ya.

First, I'm not necessarily "new" to coil building, however I am no where near an advanced/expert level like some of you. I've been doing really good at Clapton and Fused Clapton builds and can spin and coil them up pretty nicely, to the point I'm ready to tackle the Alien Coil builds.

I've been digging through the coil threads and haven't come up with a "spot on" idea/knowledge of what good wire matches should be used. Example: When using a 26g core, is it better to use a 32g wrap or a 38g wrap?

Currently, my wire inventory consists of:
KA-1 : 24,26,28,36g
Ni80 : 24,26,32g
SS316L : 22,24,26,32,36g

So, in leads the questions:
Kanthal -- What matches (in your opinion) to what cores best? ie. 26g/32g 26g/36g 28g/38g 28g/40g etc...
Kanthal / Nichrome -- What is the exact benefit of wrapping a Kanthal core with a Ni80 wrap?
SS316L -- Should you only wrap with SS wire?
When should I invest in some ribbon wire? Sizes?

I'm getting ready to go pound out some YouTube videos on Alien builds (I've watched a couple now, but need to watch more). Recommendations?

I realize these are very opinionated questions, but that is OK. I'm trying to glean ideas, not look for the "perfect" build according to one person. I test and I play to find what I like best. So, I'm looking for good starting points and more knowledge.

Thanks guys!

 

[Paratech]

I'm no builder but for some reason I have watched just about all of this guys vids.

 

[PhantomOp]

I'm no builder but for some reason I have watched just about all of this guys vids.

I'm almost done with his entire video list! I've sub'd him.

 

[PhantomOp]

I think what has me perplexed the most, is when to use what wire with what sizes?

 

[Brad Mitchell]

From what I gather 36 and up is what you want for the outer. 32 and down (thicker) tends to be too much metal. I don't think that the cores vs outer matter. Granted if you jump right into 40+ gauge people might call the priest for an exorcism or something.

 

[Eskie]

I know 32G is probably not the best choice for a wrap, but as I'm new to spinning up my coils, it's way easier to use than say 36. I guess as I get better at it I can use a finer wire. 40G is beyond the resolution of my eyes even with reading glasses, and I'm not building under some giant magnifying glass. Besides, I doubt I could even hold the wire properly as it spun on.

 

[nightshard]

The core(s) diameter would greatly influence the resistance of the coil, while the outer wire diameter would mostly effect the performance.
For outer wire thinner is better but harder to work with since first it's harder to build a perfect Clapton with a thinner wire and second it would require a lot more wraps.
32 is good to start with, but you should aim to gradually go thinner up to 40.

 

[whiteowl84]

We use what ever alloy. on whatever core for the color shot.
The size of the wrap is up to your skill level. It gets to the point where 36g feels massive and the coils look bulky with it. Usually I just use it when I want a full stagger but I still want to see the n80 strips in my ssfc's.

If I did that with my 38G KD you wouldn't really be able to see the stripes as well.


There's no right or wrong answer to any of this. We're just doing what we want.

 

[PhantomOp]

We use what ever alloy. on whatever core for the color shot.
The size of the wrap is up to your skill level. It gets to the point where 36g feels massive and the coils look bulky with it. Usually I just use it when I want a full stagger but I still want to see the n80 strips in my ssfc's.

If I did that with my 38G KD you wouldn't really be able to see the stripes as well.

There's no right or wrong answer to any of this. We're just doing what we want.

That's kind of the conclusion that I was coming up with, is that the outside wrap really doesn't matter as it had very little effect on the final resistance of the coil.

32 is good to start with, but you should aim to gradually go thinner up to 40.

Ya, 32g is where I started ... to me that was very simple. I've been using all 36g now and it is really simple to me as well. So it's looking like I just need to step up my game and get some 38 and 40g next.

 

[whiteowl84]

The wrap has nothing to do with the resistance of the coil.
Smaller wire means a faster ramp up and more crevices.
You'd be surprised how many drops the coil with no wick can hold on to.

 

[HondaDavidson]

The wrap has nothing to do with the resistance of the coil.
Smaller wire means a faster ramp up and more crevices.
You'd be surprised how many drops the coil with no wick can hold on to.

Not those of us that used to call these Self Wicking coils...... in the old days the wraps were even removed from the legs... but we figured out that it just didn't affect the vape just the connection. With post hole connection instead of wrap on post.. that's not so much an issue these days....

All these "new" fancy builds are not new.... new tech has just made them usable by newbies and novi.

Don't forget.. it only been a couple years where vaping at over 15watts was really possible without risk of venting.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[BKTOAD]

OK master coil builders. Got a few questions for ya.

First, I'm not necessarily "new" to coil building, however I am no where near an advanced/expert level like some of you. I've been doing really good at Clapton and Fused Clapton builds and can spin and coil them up pretty nicely, to the point I'm ready to tackle the Alien Coil builds.

I've been digging through the coil threads and haven't come up with a "spot on" idea/knowledge of what good wire matches should be used. Example: When using a 26g core, is it better to use a 32g wrap or a 38g wrap?

Currently, my wire inventory consists of:
KA-1 : 24,26,28,36g
Ni80 : 24,26,32g
SS316L : 22,24,26,32,36g

So, in leads the questions:
Kanthal -- What matches (in your opinion) to what cores best? ie. 26g/32g 26g/36g 28g/38g 28g/40g etc...
Kanthal / Nichrome -- What is the exact benefit of wrapping a Kanthal core with a Ni80 wrap?
SS316L -- Should you only wrap with SS wire?
When should I invest in some ribbon wire? Sizes?

I'm getting ready to go pound out some YouTube videos on Alien builds (I've watched a couple now, but need to watch more). Recommendations?

I realize these are very opinionated questions, but that is OK. I'm trying to glean ideas, not look for the "perfect" build according to one person. I test and I play to find what I like best. So, I'm looking for good starting points and more knowledge.

Thanks guys!

No expert. But maybe simply a step or 2 ahead of you in the process. Here is how I got to make aliens possible for me. And hope it works for you.

Kanthal is stiffer (i find) than nichrome. This helps heep the cores in order and behaving better. Staying stacked on eachother in a straight line, rather than collapsing on eachother. SS, imho, is not an option for aliens especially if building dual coils because of it's low resistance. Super low resistance wire with 3 cores and dual coils really add up.

24 gauge is stiffer than 26 gauge (and so on)

So, to practice, I would make a 3x24 kanthal core. Will be easier to work with. I like the vape from 26 or 28 gaugecores better, but this is your training wheels. Work your way down in wire size as proficiency increases. And work your way into nichrome cores if you like, but I would start with the kanthal 24. Simply for practice reasons.

As far as wrap, I started with 32. However, I do not think it realistically helped me one bit. Yes, it wrapped an easy alien. But, I would absolutely not vape that 32g wrapped alien. And the feel of wrapping with 36g is a whole lot different than 32. So I would stick to wrapping with a wire thinner than 32g.

Not sure if you have ribbon wire, but if you do, a slider made by wrapping ribbon around the 3 cores and crimping around the cores helps keep the cores in line. Start with the slider 2" or less from your starting point. And slide it another 2" when your wrap gets to the slider. Plus, hot glue at both ends of the 3 strand cores really helps.

Stretching the decore seems to me difficult to describe. Too understretched, I find it will try to collapse your cores or create a "mowhawk" Overstretched it will have a less pronounced "s" shaped wrap, and not be AS good at wicking.

Imho, it is certainly easier to wrap when a little bit overstretched. So maybe try that to start, and get some confidence, then scale back the stretch from there as much as you can after some practice.

Only thing is, until you do it a few times, you will not know what over or understretched is.

Go slow to medium slow with the drill. Try not to micro-manage your wraps. Just let it flow. Be patient and let the wrap do it's thing. Be prepared to have some (or several in my case) failures.

Good luck. Hope this helps.

 

[PhantomOp]

Very nice BKTOAD! Thank you!

 

[PhantomOp]

I think i've lost count of how many times i've watched his video on the Alien coil build!

 

[BKTOAD]

Good also