FDA Threatens to Pull E-Cigarettes to Fight the Rise of Kids Vaping

[SteveS45]

While at this point I could care less about some the products targeted in this, it is upsetting because a few of them helped me quit smoking.

A few excepts...............

The FDA told five major e-cigarette manufacturers on Wednesday to come up with ways to address youth use in 60 days or the agency could require them to stop selling flavored products that appeal to children. The warning is part of regulators’ effort to limit sales to minors of flavored alternative tobacco products, which they say could lead more young users to eventually begin smoking cigarettes.

The products being targeted are: Juul, Altria Group Inc.’s MarkTen, Fontem Ventures BV’s blu, British American Tobacco Plc’s Vuse and Logic.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...ll-e-cigarettes-to-fight-rise-of-youth-vaping

 

["11"]

I hear you. Long time vapers don't typically use cigalikes but what's really annoying is the FDAs ignorant insistence that non-tobacco flavors are marketed to kids, or intended for kids. As if adults only eat tobacco-flavored food. Everyone (generally speaking) likes fruit, candy, chocolate, pie, etc... Especially since good tobacco flavors are hard to find for many, (unless an extract). I like the flavor of tobacco but tried dozens of tobacco flavors and none tasted like tobacco to me. So prefer caramel, myself.

Luckily for me I make my own juice with bakery flavoring, so whatever the FDA does, it won't affect my ability to make the juice I want. But that's not the point. Certainly marketing should not be directed at kids, so that's a given. But flavors are not age-specific and eliminating them will not stop kids from vaping who want to vape. It has always been illegal for minors to buy cigarettes and let's face it... they still get them and always will, and those taste horrible to kids but they smoke them anyway. (I'd argue NO cigarette tastes good to a child who puffs one for the first time.) Point is, they will smoke/vape something even if it tastes BAD. So eliminating fruity or sweet cigalikes is not going to stop kids. It will only limit the product for adults. Who might just give up and buy cigarettes instead.

Well done, FDA. (Not.)

 

[SteveS45]

Especially since good tobacco flavors are hard to find for many, (unless an extract). I like the flavor of tobacco but tried dozens of tobacco flavors and none tasted like tobacco to me.

Luckily for me I make my own juice with bakery flavoring, so whatever the FDA does, it won't affect my ability to make the juice I want.

I totally agree with this because when I first quit, my Tobacco DIY was the closet I ever found but now I have found some so close I don't like them. The point of the post to bring attention to how Fucked Up the FDA is and how they think~! Again I agree 100% with what you say...............

 

["11"]

The only tobacco flavor I ever found that I liked was the one I made myself from expressing Captain Black pipe tobacco. But it's so sugary it fouls the coil after 7mls or so... so I rarely vape it.

IAC one of the draws of vaping is the variety of flavors. They strip the flavors away and they reduce the number of ADULTS who might switch to vaping, as it's tough to go from real tobacco to flavoring that's supposed to mimic tobacco (if that's all that's available). It just doesn't measure up for most folks. But switching to a completely different flavor... a food or candy... they might try that for the sake of kicking the habit. And if it tastes good... that's another person off tobacco.

 

[SteveS45]

I spent so long searching for something that tasted like a Marlboro until after trying over 100 flavors I found a fruit I could actually vape! That was a coil killer but damn was it good. Now I make most of my own Tobacco Blends but I found many that I truly enjoy. Most people I try to convert are looking for the cigarette taste. Some of the ones the FDA wants to remove from the market can stop people from quitting smoking but BT has paid them off IMO. For the sake of the children~~! I got sick a few times I smoked when I was 13-14 but they think they know..............

 

["11"]

You got that right!

I know this is the wrong thread (and you can PM me if you prefer) but I'd be curious what flavors you found that compare to a Marlboro or any good tobacco flavor. The ones I tried tasted like nuts or worse.

 

[SteveS45]

You got that right!
I know this is the wrong thread (and you can PM me if you prefer) but I'd be curious what flavors you found that compare to a Marlboro or any good tobacco flavor. The ones I tried tasted like nuts or worse.

Feel free to stop by the Vaping on the Front or back porch for some pleasant no drama conversation and of course a vape~!

 

[bobnat]

I'm not picking on anyone specifically here, but I'm getting tired of seeing the same response of "I diy so it's not my problem." The FDA is everyone's problem here.


First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Martin Niemoller

 

[SteveS45]

Since many of the products targeted by the FDA are owned by BT I think they have enough money and enough lawyers to stop the FDA from removing the products from the market. But if they do then people using them will either go back to smoking or graduate/upgrade to a real vaping device like a MOD Kit.

 

["11"]

I'm not picking on anyone specifically here, but I'm getting tired of seeing the same response of "I diy so it's not my problem." The FDA is everyone's problem here.

And I think that was exactly Steve's point and mine as well. And we said as much. So... agreed!

 

[Pony Tail]

Since many of the products targeted by the FDA are owned by BT I think they have enough money and enough lawyers to stop the FDA from removing the products from the market. But if they do then people using them will either go back to smoking or graduate/upgrade to a real vaping device like a MOD Kit.

Greed. Plain and simple. Insatiable greed. The ones that have too much incessantly want more and the ones whose pockets they pad want to be where they are.

 

[5150sick]

Since many of the products targeted by the FDA are owned by BT I think they have enough money and enough lawyers to stop the FDA from removing the products from the market. But if they do then people using them will either go back to smoking or graduate/upgrade to a real vaping device like a MOD Kit.

Does BT necessarily care in flavors stay on the market?
I'd say not only would it be easier for them to just make tobacco and menthol ecigs but it will also get vapers back to their flagship product.
The tobacco cigarette.

This is a gift to BT for sending those MSA checks and not complaining when the cash goes in a slush fund and NOT paying for tobacco use prevention.

Teen tobacco use prevention was the whole reason for the fucking master settlement agreement to begin with.

If the Government successfully made Joe Camel (who's face looks like a 90 year old mans nut sack and cock) out to be a "child friendly carton character" then what do you think they are going to say about 95%+ of the eliquid labels on the market?

 

[5150sick]

It's downright underhanded and shitty when the whole industry is relying on 5 big tobacco companies to save something they have literally no market share over.

It would be like if the FDA got the top 5 alcohol companies together to decide on MJ laws.
If it's cutting in to their bottom line it can't be nothing but a gift to let them decide.

 

[Pony Tail]

I've only been vaping since March of 2017. I'm learning something new every day so correct me if I'm wrong. These giant conglomerates, or whatever someone chooses to call them, didn't get where they are by being lacking in intelligence, and i'm not implying anyone thinks or suggested that. They have scores of people with slide rules and calculators doing a lot of math figuring out which route to take for the most profitable bottom line. Having said that it occurs to me that the bulk of the vapers that I know personally are saving money by vaping instead of smoking. I'm a hobbyist in the making and I am NOT saving money by vaping. I'm certain the people in the upper echelons and the people in their employ know this. This may be blatantly obvious to some people so this may just be a longwinded rant. The REALLY obvious point that I don't understand how people can ignore is just outright redundant. And that is as they say ... follow the money.

 

[Pony Tail]

Since many of the products targeted by the FDA are owned by BT I think they have enough money and enough lawyers to stop the FDA from removing the products from the market. But if they do then people using them will either go back to smoking or graduate/upgrade to a real vaping device like a MOD Kit.

But does BT want to stop the FDA? Why is the FDA doing what they're doing? We all know this is not a utopian society, but there are people that can't accept reality. They want to eradicate smoking, vaping, alcohol, drugs, jaywalking and spitting on the sidewalk. That is impossible. Logical reasoning and reality is not part of their vision or agenda. They just want to get their way at all costs no matter the consequences to anyone else. With the tools at their disposal it is a hard fought battle. Why isn't there some way for the vaping community as a whole to put out large scale national or global information to get the actual true facts about how vaping is saving lives? I read about the restrictions put on the vaping industry in the link posted by 5150sick and it thoroughly pissed me off. How do we get past that? The only thing I can think of is discerning who specifically do those "government" restrictions apply to and find a way to work around it. How? Good question.

 

[jwill]

This is BT playing both sides again as it is a no lose scenario for them. If vaping gets shit canned they get more smokers, if they pull out the file for this scenario and cover the FDA with lawyers and introduce "common sense vape regulations to save children" it makes you wonder who those will favor?

If I had to guess, it would be their interests.

 

[Pony Tail]

This is BT playing both sides again as it is a no lose scenario for them. If vaping gets shit canned they get more smokers, if they pull out the file for this scenario and cover the FDA with lawyers and introduce "common sense vape regulations to save children" it makes you wonder who those will favor?

If I had to guess, it would be their interests.

Without question. I 100% agree. It's win win for them. I believe the only thing that will tip the scale one way or the other is profits.

 

[jwill]

Without question. I 100% agree. It's win win for them. I believe the only thing that will tip the scale one way or the other is profits.

I am of the opinion they couldn't care less if vaping survives, thrives or otherwise. If it fails they get smokers back. If it survives they will see it regulated to their favor. If it thrives they have the pockets to sew up the market openly or from three shell companies deep.

 

[r055co]

This is BT playing both sides again as it is a no lose scenario for them. If vaping gets shit canned they get more smokers, if they pull out the file for this scenario and cover the FDA with lawyers and introduce "common sense vape regulations to save children" it makes you wonder who those will favor?

If I had to guess, it would be their interests.

Big Tobacco has a dog in the race but don't fool yourself, this is being driven by Big Pharma

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

 

[jwill]

Big Tobacco has a dog in the race but don't fool yourself, this is being driven by Big Pharma

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

I use those two interchangeably (probably incorrectly). Their interests are one in the same. Keep 'em hooked, keep 'em buying, keep 'em sick.

 

[r055co]

I use those two interchangeably (probably incorrectly). Their interests are one in the same. Keep 'em hooked, keep 'em buying, keep 'em sick.

Big Tobacco is invested in Vaping, what they want is Pods and closed systems, Big Pharma are the ones who want an all out ban.

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

 

[jwill]

Big Tobacco is invested in Vaping, what they want is Pods and closed systems, Big Pharma are the ones who want an all out ban.

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

BT is playing both sides of the game. I think they are indifferent if it gets banned or survives and is regulated heavily. They win either way. This of course is literally just my opinion. I have no way of knowing this to be 100% accurate other than what I read.

 

[Irked Particle]

As if vaping hasn't gotten enough bad publicity lately, the show Family Guy on Fox aired an episode Sunday night, 10/7/2018, titled "Dead Dog Walking," where they address vaping in what I would describe as a negative way.
The subplot has infant Stewie discover vaping at a high school party. A kid who's vaping with a group of other teenagers tells Stewie, "Smoking is for losers; vaping is for douchebags."
Later, Stewie introduces his older brother Chris to vaping. Chris infers that because what Stewie gives him is a raspberry flavor, it must be for kids.
Stewie and Chris joke later that when a person doesn't vape for three hours, they go through nicotine withdrawal & begin shaking.
Here's a shot from the party scene:


Later, when their mother Lois realizes Stewie is vaping, she takes his vape pen away. Stewie is "jonesing" so badly that he actually fights Chris for Chris's pen.
Near the end of the episode, Chris catches Lois in their yard smoking a cigarette. Lois says vaping is just as bad for you as smoking & calls Chris a douchebag for vaping. She takes a picture of him & posts it on social media describing him as such.

I just thought some of you might want to know this is out there. A lot of people will likely see this, & because of the timing with the FDA investigation, I believe it has the potential to do even more harm to the vaping industry.
I like Family Guy--I only saw this episode because I DVR the show--& I realize they say they make fun of everyone equally. But material like this is unfortunate to see for those of us who don't want to see a flavor ban, or any other kind of ban.

What are your thoughts?

 

[obijuan77]

As if vaping hasn't gotten enough bad publicity lately, the show Family Guy on Fox aired an episode Sunday night, 10/7/2018, titled "Dead Dog Walking," where they address vaping in what I would describe as a negative way.
The subplot has infant Stewie discover vaping at a high school party. A kid who's vaping with a group of other teenagers tells Stewie, "Smoking is for losers; vaping is for douchebags."
Later, Stewie introduces his older brother Chris to vaping. Chris infers that because what Stewie gives him is a raspberry flavor, it must be for kids.
Stewie and Chris joke later that when a person doesn't vape for three hours, they go through nicotine withdrawal & begin shaking.
Here's a shot from the party scene:
View attachment 121526

Later, when their mother Lois realizes Stewie is vaping, she takes his vape pen away. Stewie is "jonesing" so badly that he actually fights Chris for Chris's pen.
Near the end of the episode, Chris catches Lois in their yard smoking a cigarette. Lois says vaping is just as bad for you as smoking & calls Chris a douchebag for vaping. She takes a picture of him & posts it on social media describing him as such.

I just thought some of you might want to know this is out there. A lot of people will likely see this, & because of the timing with the FDA investigation, I believe it has the potential to do even more harm to the vaping industry.
I like Family Guy--I only saw this episode because I DVR the show--& I realize they say they make fun of everyone equally. But material like this is unfortunate to see for those of us who don't want to see a flavor ban, or any other kind of ban.

What are your thoughts?

wow & I used to like that show. oh well