Here's an idea that might stifle the regularity of mass death in America...

[The Vape Crusader]

And it won't infringe upon anyone's rights to gun ownership.

Mass shootings are unpredictable, and never will be predictable. People who have a sudden change in mental status don't go to their psychiatrists (if they even have one) and describe the details of their nefarious plans. Neither do they go to Thanksgiving dinner and say, "Hey, my life stinks, guess what I'm gonna do next week!" Nonsense... they carry out those plans. And to demonize inadequate mental health care is pitifully short sighted, ignorant, and frankly insulting to the social workers, psychologists, and case managers that comprise the mental health care system. That argument is dead in the water the moment you raise it. People who are this mentally ill don't think they need help.

But, sometimes they have moments of clarity amongst the insanity. Still, I can only ascertain that most perpetrators see themselves at a "point of no return," because they're afraid they're going to get into trouble if they confess to their plans...

Here's an idea:

If you have a plan, and even if you have illegally obtained weapons, call the police, check into a hospital, or call a mental health professional if you have access to one. The police may take away your weapons, but you won't be charged with anything, rather be thanked for doing the right thing by getting help. Mandatory rehabilitation within our mental healthcare system (likely inpatient) would also be a part of it, which will allow our excellent healthcare providers to actually get to the psychological root of why the person came to such a diabolical conclusion in the first place.

See? No rights violated, and a release valve that may prevent some people from killing a whole bunch of innocent victims. It's not a be-all-end-all idea, but it's a start, the way I see it.

 

[HAZZA1962]

I've just finished watching a Pro Gun Lobbyist on UK breakfast TV!!! He made a statement that made me realise just how different the attitudes of our Two countries are when he said that if the College wasn't a Gun Free Zone and the other students had been allowed to bear arms it wouldn't have happened!!! I'm still speechless!!!

 

[Petyr]

I don't think that if you are planning a mass murder you will give up. Look at that guy Breivik in Norway he is still proud of killing all those kids and thinks that he has done the right thing.

 

[The Vape Crusader]

I don't think that if you are planning a mass murder you will give up. Look at that guy Breivik in Norway he is still proud of killing all those kids and thinks that he has done the right thing.

This is exactly why I said it's not a be-all-end-all idea. But it can be part of a number of measures that can perhaps prevent some mass shootings by appealing to compassion. Yes, a plan for mass murder may be so ingrained in the heads of some, that there's no turning back. So I do support stronger gun control measures (And apparently, so do a significant portion of gun owners), but anything that goes up that alley runs right into the wall of Wayne LaPierre and his magical fantasy land where citizens are a hidden army of trained vigilantes, ready to strike down terror at every turn.

Meanwhile, About 10,000 people have been killed in acts of gun violence in 2015, and we still got three months to go. The ability of the gun lobby to continue to delude themselves, and fabricate alternative scenarios where guns save the day, are disturbing, and allow this kind of death to continue... unchanged.

 

[kwtony]

The power of entertainment tellavision is really strong these days. seems like anything they put up on that box, people just believe with out question. We are living a life of constant dissonance our whole lives.


Sandy hook was an interesting one too. Hell they are all are shrouded with whole lies and half truths. , even tho, there is zero proof anyone actually died. Only thing that was found was proof that they couldn't prove anything. Kinda like the moon landings lo. Hence the reason they tore the school down and shipped the rubble to a different country, kinda like world trade center office building and that other towers they brought down after wards. once the thermite put itself out of course.

When the 001 official story doesn't even resemble official story 015, you really need to start trying to think for yourself. Its all part of a much bigger plan. Obama talked about change, he wasn't lying(even tho he was)...itll happen soon. Heres an idea, turn off your tell a vision and go outside, you might not have that freedom soon. Plus you'll see the 'boogie man' of the week the 'news' puts out...goes away...

 

[The Vape Crusader]

^ Please remove your tin foil hat, and follow these nice men in white coats who are here to help you. That is such ridiculously farfetched, radical nonsense, it doesn't deserve the dignity of a retort.

 

[Myk]

The problem with your solution is the anti-gun side twists that into banning guns from everyone who seeks any mental healthcare at all. Their goal isn't to fix the problem, it's to ban guns from the law abiding.
And that problem is at the top with our anti-gun politicians who live by the moto to never let a tragedy go to waste.

The last two have told you why they did it. The media takes someone who feels like nobody and makes them a star. The racist church shooter knew the media would get his race war message out there, and they're surely responsible for the rash of church burnings that followed.
There is no reason I need to hear about a shooting in Oregon. Are you hearing about the 50 or so shootings every weekend in Chicago?
Nobody heard about the 8 murders in a week here but the media sure did push the guy with a BB gun in a theater at the same time.
In doing this the media is also telling the insane that this is how they should deal with their problems, all the crazy kids are doing it.



As far as mental healthcare it needs to be more affordable and easier for Dr's, family and police to commit someone. Bring back the state run mental health facilities.
Leave any gun rights removal up to the Dr's (which is there now).

Then there's parenting. I was around guns and never wanted to actually kill anyone. My friend's kids wouldn't even target shoot with me at their house with no parents home. This was not the self-esteem Dr Spock parenting pushed as one size fits all that goes around today.
Of course little Joey who's been told he's special his whole life and never taught how to deal with problems won't be able to deal with it when he gets into the real world and finds he's just another cog in the wheel.

And enforce the gun laws we already have before claiming more that will be ignored will fix anything.

 

[The Vape Crusader]

The problem with your solution is the anti-gun side twists that into banning guns from everyone who seeks any mental healthcare at all. Their goal isn't to fix the problem, it's to ban guns from the law abiding.

And enforce the gun laws we already have before claiming more that will be ignored will fix anything.

That is a very careless logical leap with no basis in reality. Look at the OP, I'm not even talking about banning guns. I'm talking about common sense safety. And besides, are you REALLY suggesting that the severely mentally ill should have access to firearms? Should severe Alzheimer's patients be able to drive too? How about giving pipe bombs to infants? They haven't broken the law, why not give them explosives?

That said, your post does imply the intractability of our politicians, which I do agree with. One side wants to just wipe guns off the map, the other wants more guns. Both are ridiculous premises. That's why my idea is largely centrist.

And yes, I agree with the "social ills" you describe due to a lack of parenting, a lack of access to mental healthcare, as well as the copycat sickness that seems to be spreading in America. But that doesn't make this a mental health issue, it makes it a socio/economic issue. That rhetoric is dead weight to me. We have an excellent healthcare system, and relatively poor access to it. When someone dies of a heart attack because they couldn't get to the hospital due to a lack of healthcare access, that's not the hospital's fault.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

I have an idea. In a country , that happens to now have alot of people entering freak out mode; as well as, looking for fame. Lets air their acts of vile degradation on all forms of media 24 hours straight, giving them the fame they seek. Lets also ignore the fact that they are looney tunes and can purchase a weapon on a street corner through illegal means, as easily as a pack of gum. Because people who want to get a gun to kill people will find a gun, or build something worse.

Instead, lets rope off designated areas telling them where they can go to find people (including security personel) completely unarmed and defenseless.
Oh yeah we'll also take the guns away from the law abiding citizens that want to protect themselves and their families from 'bob' the theiving, crckhead, murdering, rapist; because, people aren't evil, guns are.

-brought to you by common sense.

 

[Zamazam]

If you have a plan, and even if you have illegally obtained weapons, call the police, check into a hospital, or call a mental health professional if you have access to one. The police may take away your weapons, but you won't be charged with anything, rather be thanked for doing the right thing by getting help. Mandatory rehabilitation within our mental healthcare system (likely inpatient) would also be a part of it, which will allow our excellent healthcare providers to actually get to the psychological root of why the person came to such a diabolical conclusion in the first place.

Unfortunately in our society if you call the police and describe your intent, you will be arrested and charged immediately with your face on every TV screen in America that night. The prosecutors and police don't give a rats ass if you are mentally ill, they make money and get power through headlines. This is a sad situation, but it's true. Some teen got busted for having explosive components in a storage locker, didn't make a bomb, nor kill anyone. The police arrested him despite his mental illness (documented) and charged him as a domestic terrorist. Prisons have become a dumping ground for mentally ill people. Talk to your shrink about the fantasy's in your mind and they are legally obligated to report you to to police if those fantasy's are violent or upsetting to the shrink. I can see why people on the fringe of sanity don't want to discuss their violent intent with mental health professionals.

If you want to stop gun violence, make it so disturbed people can get mental health services without becoming national headlines after they are arrested for simply asking for help, or being referred for mental heath care. If a person is mentally ill, don't chuck him/her in prison and prescribe psycho-active drugs, put that person into in-patient treatment. Unfortunately that is a hard thing to accomplish because having a mental illness is not a crime, many lawyers will come to the aid of a person that is going to be committed against their will due to the abuses of the past with federal and state hospitals.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

And lets not forget that disassembling a radio shack clock and putting it in a briefcase gets you dinner at the white house with king Barry and king Michelle

 

[jack]

These are all great ideas ,but the right thing will never happen because there are no votes in that , there is no cash in that and there are no headlines in that .
Instead , our leaders call for giving them space to destroy property or like the Ft. Hood shooting call it work place violence , and not what it really is . Let's face it terrorism works .
Call it a gun control issue , because that way they don't have to act on the real problems .

 

[HAZZA1962]

I don't often agree with Piers Morgan, But on this occasion!!! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-actually-good-business-bow-deviants-NRA.html

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Yeah well, eventually they are going to be faced without a choice but to face it. People are pretty pissed off these days about a lot of things and I would like to think we are still the same country with the same people and the same mindset that got pissed off enough about a tax on a breakfast beverage that we rose up and took out the biggest military in its day as well as telling king George to suck it.

 

[mgmrick]

Guns don't kill..... people kill

 

[The Vape Crusader]

Unfortunately in our society if you call the police and describe your intent, you will be arrested and charged immediately with your face on every TV screen in America that night. The prosecutors and police don't give a rats ass if you are mentally ill, they make money and get power through headlines. This is a sad situation, but it's true. Some teen got busted for having explosive components in a storage locker, didn't make a bomb, nor kill anyone. The police arrested him despite his mental illness (documented) and charged him as a domestic terrorist. Prisons have become a dumping ground for mentally ill people. Talk to your shrink about the fantasy's in your mind and they are legally obligated to report you to to police if those fantasy's are violent or upsetting to the shrink. I can see why people on the fringe of sanity don't want to discuss their violent intent with mental health professionals.

If you want to stop gun violence, make it so disturbed people can get mental health services without becoming national headlines after they are arrested for simply asking for help, or being referred for mental heath care. If a person is mentally ill, don't chuck him/her in prison and prescribe psycho-active drugs, put that person into in-patient treatment. Unfortunately that is a hard thing to accomplish because having a mental illness is not a crime, many lawyers will come to the aid of a person that is going to be committed against their will due to the abuses of the past with federal and state hospitals.

This is exactly the problem my idea seeks to solve. Being compassionate towards non-criminals who would become criminals if not for someone to go to for help. It would save lives and have a more realistic attitude towards the fact that some people just freakin' lose their shit. The current environment of scare tactics, power structure in law enforcement, and media glorification of violence has to stop. A law like this would help.

 

[The Vape Crusader]

Guns don't kill..... people kill

Wow, there's a new and fresh line of thinking in the gun debate. Thanks for your unique and constructive contribution to the conversation.

 

[The Vape Crusader]

I have an idea. In a country , that happens to now have alot of people entering freak out mode; as well as, looking for fame. Lets air their acts of vile degradation on all forms of media 24 hours straight, giving them the fame they seek. Lets also ignore the fact that they are looney tunes and can purchase a weapon on a street corner through illegal means, as easily as a pack of gum. Because people who want to get a gun to kill people will find a gun, or build something worse.

Instead, lets rope off designated areas telling them where they can go to find people (including security personel) completely unarmed and defenseless.
Oh yeah we'll also take the guns away from the law abiding citizens that want to protect themselves and their families from 'bob' the theiving, crckhead, murdering, rapist; because, people aren't evil, guns are.

-brought to you by common sense.

Not only is this line of rhetoric completely irrelevant to the conversation, it's also been nonsense since the day it was conceived. "Criminals are still going to get guns, but we're going to take them away from the good guys."

First of all, I never said that. I don't hope for infringement on the Second Amendment. Second of all, by your logic, why have any laws at all? People are gonna speed, why have speed limits? People are gonna drive drunk, why have DUI laws? People are going to want to murder each other, so let's just let people murder each other without fear of retribution.

Criminals are gonna get guns anyway, so why even try to make laws that ensure they stay in the right hands and not the wrong ones, even if they're not perfectly effective? It is this deliberately defeatist attitude that drives the NRA and the pro-gun lobby to madness.

This message sponsored by human reasoning.

 

[The Vape Crusader]

Yeah well, eventually they are going to be faced without a choice but to face it. People are pretty pissed off these days about a lot of things and I would like to think we are still the same country with the same people and the same mindset that got pissed off enough about a tax on a breakfast beverage that we rose up and took out the biggest military in its day as well as telling king George to suck it.

And now you're not so subtly implying that you're going to be part of an uprising that forcibly takes over the US Government.

An armchair Rebel General in the making. Impressive. Good luck with that.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

And now you're not so subtly implying that you're going to be part of an uprising that forcibly takes over the US Government.

An armchair Rebel General in the making. Impressive. Good luck with that.

No, you misunderstand what I'm saying... and I am not implying anything, I am flat out saying that if shit in that shithole over there doesn't start making sense soon, something will change.
The number of people sick and tired of the bullshit, far outnumber the people cowtowing and making bullshit.
Let them try and initiate the type of gun control they want, they would be seriously close to a major issue.
The government we have now, left and right, has slowly become as tyrannical as the government we broke away from.
The revolution was only backed by 35% of the population at that time.

Not only is this line of rhetoric completely irrelevant to the conversation, it's also been nonsense since the day it was conceived. "Criminals are still going to get guns, but we're going to take them away from the good guys."

First of all, I never said that. I don't hope for infringement on the Second Amendment. Second of all, by your logic, why have any laws at all? People are gonna speed, why have speed limits? People are gonna drive drunk, why have DUI laws? People are going to want to murder each other, so let's just let people murder each other without fear of retribution.

Criminals are gonna get guns anyway, so why even try to make laws that ensure they stay in the right hands and not the wrong ones, even if they're not perfectly effective? It is this deliberately defeatist attitude that drives the NRA and the pro-gun lobby to madness.

This message sponsored by human reasoning.

It is completely relevant to the conversation. You can't put it on any news station right now without seeing some jackass talking about how we need gun control. King Barry walks out of the bathroom stall and the asswipe who can't come out and say something about an American prisoner in Iran, immediately barks into control. c'mon it was already a gun free zone proofing that all gun control does is create available law abiding victims,. If one person there (ie the vet who easy wounded saving peoples lives) if he were armed perhaps at least some of the 13deceased and 20 winded would not be today

 

[The Vape Crusader]

It's not relevant to the conversation because I'm not talking about gun control. You are. You're the one invoking Obama into the conversation and your snarky, petulant hatred for him. You're also changing the angle of the conversation by invoking the "gun free zone" part of the massacre, which I happen to agree with you on. I don't care what TV bloviators say, because I don't watch it... I don't even have cable. What about my suggestion infringes on gun rights in general? Answer: nothing.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

It's not relevant to the conversation because I'm not talking about gun control. You are. You're the one invoking Obama into the conversation and your snarky, petulant hatred for him. You're also changing the angle of the conversation by invoking the "gun free zone" part of the massacre, which I happen to agree with you on. I don't care what TV bloviators say, because I don't watch it... I don't even have cable. What about my suggestion infringes on gun rights in general? Answer: nothing.

Correct nothing you said infringes on gunrights. I've been watching the news all day and in on sentence I hear mandatory looney bin checkups, and the other gun rights. I also got a call today from my insurance telling me they want to send someone to my house for a 'mandatory' wellness check.
Thank you Obamacare!
So yes, you mention mandatory looney bin and got pissed off all over again. Sorry
And yes I hate Obama. I hate all career politicians. I just hate him more.
where's my beverage
“They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”
Ben Franklin

 

[mgmrick]

How's gun control working in chicago?

Guns are a right not to be infringed on.... look it up

 

[Myk]

That is a very careless logical leap with no basis in reality. Look at the OP, I'm not even talking about banning guns. I'm talking about common sense safety. And besides, are you REALLY suggesting that the severely mentally ill should have access to firearms? Should severe Alzheimer's patients be able to drive too? How about giving pipe bombs to infants? They haven't broken the law, why not give them explosives?

That said, your post does imply the intractability of our politicians, which I do agree with. One side wants to just wipe guns off the map, the other wants more guns. Both are ridiculous premises. That's why my idea is largely centrist.

And yes, I agree with the "social ills" you describe due to a lack of parenting, a lack of access to mental healthcare, as well as the copycat sickness that seems to be spreading in America. But that doesn't make this a mental health issue, it makes it a socio/economic issue. That rhetoric is dead weight to me. We have an excellent healthcare system, and relatively poor access to it. When someone dies of a heart attack because they couldn't get to the hospital due to a lack of healthcare access, that's not the hospital's fault.

Generally if you have to delete a bunch of stuff in the middle to claim that was a huge leap and then you ask if the person said stuff you know they didn't say you are practicing the art of strawman arguments.

 

[Myk]

I don't often agree with Piers Morgan, But on this occasion!!! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-actually-good-business-bow-deviants-NRA.html

I love the big evil NRA claims. 5,000,000 US citizens in a grassroots lobby group are too powerful and only represents gun manufacturers not themselves.

I bet that fills you with warm and fuzzies knowing if so many are willing to silence and demonize 5,000,000 US citizens you'll surely be listened to with 1% that number in CASAA.

Claims that NRA is ________ are the same BS propaganda as the claims that CASAA is ________. Learn to spot it.

 

[HAZZA1962]

Sorry mate, I just don't understand the Americans Love affair with Guns and I never will. 3380 US citizens killed by Terrorists since 2001 and 406,496 killed by Guns. As for the Call for armed security at Colleges, what a sad Indictment of the State of the Country that it's needed in the first place.

 

[Myk]

Sorry mate, I just don't understand the Americans Love affair with Guns and I never will. 3380 US citizens killed by Terrorists since 2001 and 406,496 killed by Guns. As for the Call for armed security at Colleges, what a sad Indictment of the State of the Country that it's needed in the first place.

So we were lied to about a terrorist threat and signed away our right to be secure in our papers, our right to trial, our right to due process. Turns out there wasn't really a threat.
Now violent crime is lower than it was in the 1970's, both in total and per-capita, a time when people felt safe enough to leave their doors unlocked. http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/uscrime.htm
You want the media spin that violent crime is at an all time high to get us to sign away our Second Amendment rights too?
That makes sense.
Do you also trust the media spin on ecigs?

You're right, you don't understand and never will. You're in a different culture. We have a right to own firearms. If you remove that right it will mean civil war and death will increase.
Comparing different countries is a slight of hand. Different countries have different reporting methods. Claiming the US has the highest firearm murder rate is an outright lie. Claiming the US has the highest firearm death rate in advanced countries is a conditional lie.
The fact is the countries to the south of the US have the highest firearm murder rates and they tend to have strict gun control. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate
If the US banned guns they would simply be flown across the border just like illegal drugs are. The criminals would still have them, the innocent who want to protect themselves would not.

Guns and gunpowder are very old technology. Machine guns were invented in the late 1800's. The most popular semi-auto pistol is from 1911.
My lathe from the 1960's cost me $300, the dreaded AR15 was invented in 1959. Do you honestly believe that we can DIY ecig technology that is 12 years old but we can't DIY guns that are over 100 years old? Even if you could snap your fingers and magically stop guns from being manufactured the people that wanted them would still be able to make them. You can't ban knowledge.
But you can't snap your fingers and make magic happen, war is big business. Those war machines will always find their way to the black market.

If you want to stop violent crime you look at the cause not the tool.
Comparing countries to themselves violent crime has increased after countries banned guns, at least for a while. Sure gun violence goes down but all they did was change the tool because they didn't address the problem.
In the US as more states allowed concealed carry crime rates have gone down in spite of predictions from anti-gun that there would be blood in the streets. If you look at our cities with the worst gun violence they also have the strictest gun control. You may not be able to understand that but it is how it works here.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

One of my professors when I was in college used to always say, 'we were founded through the barrel of a gun.'. if you think about it he has a point.
The fact of the matter is most of us who are ardent defenders of the 2md amendment are either in a rural area or spend alot of time in rural areas(me), or live in major cities and just want to protect our families and property from those getting guns through the black market, and the like. I'm in New Orleans, right on the gulf coast where I spend my summers fishing for tuna; and, winters hunting for dear on a 180 acre plot of land set up specifically for that purpose. When I'm not exploring those hobbies I live in a major city that has an extremely high rate of violent crime with a lot of drug use, break ins, car jacking, and rape. there was just a story here where the cops were looking for a group of three guys on an armed robbery spree holding up restaurants. We also have one of the highest murder rates in the nation- most drug related. to live here and not be prepared to protect your home and family is irresponsible. sad but true story,
If the criminals have easy access to them, you better believe that myself who is trained to use them, and licensed to carry, will do just that.
The fact is the three most important rights in the constitution were written first: freedom of speech(say what you want about the king) freedom of religion (worship what you want how you want-even pizza) and freedom to carry a gun. Part of that second amendment right is that it is not right it is a duty and it shall not be infringed upon to protect the security of a free state. It is essentially alowing the states to protect against overpowering federal governance, our founders knew the dangers of over governance and feared that we would go back to what we broke from and left several doors open to help prevent that. That's why our founding document was written to limit federal powers not give them powers.

 

[exodus]

nothing more then bandaids so far

when i was growing up nobody needed a gun ,just some fists and a willingness to get a little dirty and you were fine ,,and much better for it
well i am one of the "Gen X's" kids ,students going mass murderer in their own school ?? that was quite literally unthinkable back then !!!!!

so what happened\changed ??

simple,parents starting losing the right to discipline their kids ,yea that means good ol ass whoopins !! people had to start getting in touch with their feminine side and all touchy feely with their emotions
kids no longer know there are consequences for their actions ,only sympathy afterwards

 

[BoomStick]

Here's an idea:

If you have a plan, and even if you have illegally obtained weapons, call the police, check into a hospital, or call a mental health professional if you have access to one. The police may take away your weapons, but you won't be charged with anything, rather be thanked for doing the right thing by getting help. Mandatory rehabilitation within our mental healthcare system (likely inpatient) would also be a part of it, which will allow our excellent healthcare providers to actually get to the psychological root of why the person came to such a diabolical conclusion in the first place.

So we tell the psychopaths with murderess tendencies to turn themselves in before they actually murder someone and then we provide them with some kind of better health care..... That's your plan huh?

 

[Myk]

nothing more then bandaids so far

when i was growing up nobody needed a gun ,just some fists and a willingness to get a little dirty and you were fine ,,and much better for it
well i am one of the "Gen X's" kids ,students going mass murderer in their own school ?? that was quite literally unthinkable back then !!!!!

so what happened\changed ??

simple,parents starting losing the right to discipline their kids ,yea that means good ol ass whoopins !! people had to start getting in touch with their feminine side and all touchy feely with their emotions
kids no longer know there are consequences for their actions ,only sympathy afterwards

Strange as it sounds, we didn't go in and get our parents' guns, go out and shoot people because we knew we'd get beat if we did. No gun safes or gun locks needed.
Kids are not one size fits all. Some need spanked. Some spanking doesn't do anything. Some need to be yelled at. Some need talked to. But we've been getting fed a line that some percentage of kids respond best to this way so that is what everyone should do. Even if that percentage is 95% that leaves 5% who don't respond to that way. 5% is a huge number when you're talking the population of the US, and I guarantee that it's not 95% who respond best to time outs and whatever other BS they've come up with.

It's also the self-esteem crap. Being told they're worth more than they are makes them think others are worth less. Everyone cannot be winners.
They don't value the lives of others because they're too busy valuing their own. Most kids grow up good in spite of this, just like most kids grew up good being seen and not heard. Most aren't the problem, it's the insane minority that did better with the old way and the new way teaches them it's OK to kill strangers because you feel you aren't getting the attention you deserve.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

All I know is my mommy spanked the shit out of me and other than my affinity for S&M I turned out just fine

 

[exodus]

I got the living shit whooped outta me all the time growing up bt the time i was 9,i got get the crap whooped outta me so often it no longer hurt yea i was a hell raiser growing up

i never felt the need to go kill my classmates ,even tho i wished most of them would die

and to think,,i had my very own rifle from the time i was 12,and i got to keep it in my room all the time ,

 

[f1r3b1rd]

I got the living shit whooped outta me all the time growing up bt the time i was 9,i got get the crap whooped outta me and it no longer hurt yea i was a hell raiser growing up

i never felt the need to go kill my classmates ,even tho i wished most of them would die

and to think,,i had my very own rifle from the time i was 12,and i got to keep it in my room all the time ,

I wasn't allowed to have my own firearm until I could drive. So that was when I was 15. and pop gave me a snubnose .38 to keep under the drivers seat

 

[Myk]

I was beat to the point of abuse. Mental abusive mother would push physical abusive father to it. Never had my own gun other than BB gun, wasn't allowed to hunt, only shot parents' guns with them but from a very young age.
I'd be afraid to discipline kids (brother didn't, handed that job off to his wife) but never wanted to kill strangers.

What's more scary to me isn't the shooters but the people who claim these desires aren't insanity. Robin Williams kills himself, half the internet is condoning suicide as acceptable, even psychologists.
My sister teeters on the edge of anti-gun. I got her to realize I don't think of shooting someone who pisses me off in daily interactions, I'm OK with guns. She does think of shooting someone who cuts her off while driving, she should avoid guns. I think anti-gun all think like that and they project that onto everyone else. They think it's normal to want to kill people they don't agree with so their solution is to remove the temptation instead of fix their screwed up desires.
Some people's concept of when to shoot is way out of whack. It's not the gun that's the problem, it's the screwed up thinking.

 

[Bacong]

The power of entertainment tellavision is really strong these days. seems like anything they put up on that box, people just believe with out question. We are living a life of constant dissonance our whole lives.


Sandy hook was an interesting one too. Hell they are all are shrouded with whole lies and half truths. , even tho, there is zero proof anyone actually died. Only thing that was found was proof that they couldn't prove anything. Kinda like the moon landings lo. Hence the reason they tore the school down and shipped the rubble to a different country, kinda like world trade center office building and that other towers they brought down after wards. once the thermite put itself out of course.

When the 001 official story doesn't even resemble official story 015, you really need to start trying to think for yourself. Its all part of a much bigger plan. Obama talked about change, he wasn't lying(even tho he was)...itll happen soon. Heres an idea, turn off your tell a vision and go outside, you might not have that freedom soon. Plus you'll see the 'boogie man' of the week the 'news' puts out...goes away...

Please don't do this. I know conspiracy theorists think they're the smartest ones in the room, but they're not.

 

[OneBadWolf]

"Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look
upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest."

Mahatma Mohandas K. Gandhi


"“The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that the supply of arms to the underdogs is a sine qua non for the overthrow of any sovereignty. So let’s not have any native militia or native police. German troops alone will bear the sole responsibility for the maintenance of law and order throughout the occupied Russian territories, and a system of military strong-points must be evolved to cover the entire occupied country.”".

Adolf Hitler


We don't let them have ideas. Why would we let them have guns?

Joseph Stalin

The US needs MUCH tighter gun control.

Perhaps an education program demonstrating that pistol sights are on top for a reason. Stop trying to look "gangsta"

Effective gun control results in a consistant, tight group.

 

[exodus]

"Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look
upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest."

Mahatma Mohandas K. Gandhi


"“The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that the supply of arms to the underdogs is a sine qua non for the overthrow of any sovereignty. So let’s not have any native militia or native police. German troops alone will bear the sole responsibility for the maintenance of law and order throughout the occupied Russian territories, and a system of military strong-points must be evolved to cover the entire occupied country.”".

Adolf Hitler


We don't let them have ideas. Why would we let them have guns?

Joseph Stalin

The US needs MUCH tighter gun control.

Perhaps an education program demonstrating that pistol sights are on top for a reason. Stop trying to look "gangsta"

Effective gun control results in a consistant, tight group.

there's at least one oxy-moron in there !!!

if you want to be a sheeple ,well fine whatever,but if you want to be an idiotic sheeple then you should learn to plant daisies

 

[OneBadWolf]

if you want to be a sheeple ,well fine whatever,but if you want to be an idiotic sheeple then you should learn to plant daisies

A Idiotic Sheeple? Really? Did you actully read the post I made?

Aside from my military training, I trained under and learned fom the likes of Chuck Taylor, American Small Arms Academy. (Pistol Rifle Shotgun), From the late Colonel Jeff Cooper at the Gunsite Academy, Under Massad Ayoob at the Lethal Force Institute, now Defense Associates.
As I recall, daisy planting was nowhere in the syllabus
I have taken numerous other courses, like gunshot wound self treatment, gunfight survival psychology I'm still an Instructor .

Your astute, thoughtfull critisism of my post will be given all due consideration. Now, go pound some sand.

 

[exodus]

A Idiotic Sheeple? Really? Did you actully read the post I made?

Aside from my military training, I trained under and learned fom the likes of Chuck Taylor, American Small Arms Academy. (Pistol Rifle Shotgun), From the late Colonel Jeff Cooper at the Gunsite Academy, Under Massad Ayoob at the Lethal Force Institute, now Defense Associates.
As I recall, daisy planting was nowhere in the syllabus
I have taken numerous other courses, like gunshot wound self treatment, gunfight survival psychology I'm still an Instructor .

Your astute, thoughtfull critisism of my post will be given all due consideration. Now, go pound some sand.

well yay for you,you'll be ready when china comes to collect their debt

all that training ,wasted when the anti-gun activists get what they want

i'll go pound the sand ,so you can plant them daisies in the smooth flat terra firma

 

[tchthsky]

Do you want to take the red pill, or the blue pill?

 

[The Vape Crusader]

Generally if you have to delete a bunch of stuff in the middle to claim that was a huge leap and then you ask if the person said stuff you know they didn't say you are practicing the art of strawman arguments.

Nothing in the middle of your post supports the logical leap you made in assuming that there's a diabolical crusade to take away guns from all people who have been in the mental healthcare system.

Also, if you read my last response, it pretty much does address everything you wrote, from the parenting angle, to how crappy our politicians are. I nevertheless focused on the one part of what you wrote that made little sense to me.

You wanna talk strawman arguments? Focusing on the casual editing of posts and not responding to the actual subject matter, that's one of them too .

 

[Myk]

Nothing in the middle of your post supports the logical leap you made in assuming that there's a diabolical crusade to take away guns from all people who have been in the mental healthcare system.

Also, if you read my last response, it pretty much does address everything you wrote, from the parenting angle, to how crappy our politicians are. I nevertheless focused on the one part of what you wrote that made little sense to me.

You wanna talk strawman arguments? Focusing on the casual editing of posts and not responding to the actual subject matter, that's one of them too .

You really don't want me to respond to your trying to put words in my mouth. I deleted that for a reason.

A post is not a paragraph that all has to follow along the same line. End thought, end paragraph, double enter.

New paragraph, new thought. No, saying what you actually did is not me misrepresenting your position to tear down. You could claim I did the one where because you were wrong in setting up the strawman to tear down you're wrong on everything except I didn't say that (you would have to again misrepresent my position to make that claim). I simply said if you want to play the strawman game I'm not playing.

 

[tchthsky]

Clearly there is a difference of opinions here. Why not just let it go and find a forum that supports your views. I personally don't believe a word the media reports, nor do I trust the government, and I have my reasons, and I really don't care what anyone thinks about that. But to start a debate about guns, politics, or religion for that matter is asking for it. Not everyone thinks the same as you and you can spew your insults, and belittle people all you want, but it just seems like that's what you wanted in the first place. Which is BS. And here's a smiley because that makes it all right.

 

[jack]

Clearly there is a difference of opinions here. Why not just let it go and find a forum that supports your views. I personally don't believe a word the media reports, nor do I trust the government, and I have my reasons, and I really don't care what anyone thinks about that. But to start a debate about guns, politics, or religion for that matter is asking for it. Not everyone thinks the same as you and you can spew your insults, and belittle people all you want, but it just seems like that's what you wanted in the first place. Which is BS. And here's a smiley because that makes it all right.

Correct 100%, but in all fairness to Crusader folks are looking at the subject from the wrong angle , or reading to much into what he originally posted . The first post here makes a lot of sense. The only flaw I can see (in my opinion) is that crazy people, who are that far out there , do not see themselves as crazy .

 

[The Vape Crusader]

Thank you, sir.

This was not a gun control debate... in fact, the first sentence of the OP makes that abundantly clear. In fact, it was an attempt to appease the pro-gun rights community. But despite those efforts, here comes the neighborhood with their pitchforks and torches, regurgitating the same garbage the media has told them to think, crying "THEY GONNA TERK ER GURNS! DURKA DURRRR!"

[Sorry, South Park moment.]

Anyway, Jack, thanks for attempting to bring the conversation back to reason, and your respectful critique. As I said before, I'm not saying something like this is the be-all-end-all, it's just an idea... for the people who are so crazy they don't think they're ill, our current laws that prevent them from obtaining firearms should be sufficient.

 

[Myk]

Uhh, the media doesn't tell us that. The politicians who want to take them have no problem telling us that.
Your concept of what goes on is far from reality.

People who need mental help have problems getting it. It is not affordable. People who have family members, and cops with people who need committed can't commit them for the simple fact that there's no place to commit them to since Reagan shut down the state mental hospitals. Anti-gun has proposed anyone with any mental illness be deprived of their rights no matter whether they're a threat or not and I'm pretty sure they've enacted that on some of our veterans.
You can't have a viable solution unless you know the facts of the problem. It's not that our mental health workers suck, it's the accessibility sucks for anyone who needs it. Sure if you're a rich housewife of some CEO it's great for you but not if your someone who can't hold a job and are quickly alienating everyone you know because your violent thoughts are taking over your life.

 

[tchthsky]

Thank you, sir.

This was not a gun control debate... in fact, the first sentence of the OP makes that abundantly clear. In fact, it was an attempt to appease the pro-gun rights community. But despite those efforts, here comes the neighborhood with their pitchforks and torches, regurgitating the same garbage the media has told them to think, crying "THEY GONNA TERK ER GURNS! DURKA DURRRR!"

[Sorry, South Park moment.]

Anyway, Jack, thanks for attempting to bring the conversation back to reason, and your respectful critique. As I said before, I'm not saying something like this is the be-all-end-all, it's just an idea... for the people who are so crazy they don't think they're ill, our current laws that prevent them from obtaining firearms should be sufficient.

you're an idiot. [sorry, south park moment]

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Free frontal lobotomy's

 

[The Vape Crusader]

Thank you, sir.

This was not a gun control debate... in fact, the first sentence of the OP makes that abundantly clear. In fact, it was an attempt to appease the pro-gun rights community. But despite those efforts, here comes the neighborhood with their pitchforks and torches, regurgitating the same garbage the media has told them to think, crying "THEY GONNA TERK ER GURNS! DURKA DURRRR!".

Free frontal lobotomy's

you're an idiot. [sorry, south park moment]

I rest my case.