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Is the Phenotype L good if you don't make crazy builds?

EquivalentExchange

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So I'm currently pretty new to RDAs I've been using an RDA for about a month and a half and I've only been able to build my own coils and such for the past two weeks. I'm running a 200w Sigelie Fuchai on a Velocity Clone RDA but I'm ready for my first Authentic RDA.

I really love clouds, and I had my eye on the Phenotype L. It's not too expensive for me but it's about where I want to draw the line at for now (70$). It's also really nice looking to me. However, I keep reading it's not worth it unless you do crazy builds and right now I'm only running 11 wraps of 22 gauge kanthal so nothing impressive. Would I be wasting money grabbing this RDA with my current wraps? Any other suggestions or tips are welcome!
 

Scratch88683

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So I'm currently pretty new to RDAs I've been using an RDA for about a month and a half and I've only been able to build my own coils and such for the past two weeks. I'm running a 200w Sigelie Fuchai on a Velocity Clone RDA but I'm ready for my first Authentic RDA.

I really love clouds, and I had my eye on the Phenotype L. It's not too expensive for me but it's about where I want to draw the line at for now (70$). It's also really nice looking to me. However, I keep reading it's not worth it unless you do crazy builds and right now I'm only running 11 wraps of 22 gauge kanthal so nothing impressive. Would I be wasting money grabbing this RDA with my current wraps? Any other suggestions or tips are welcome!
The phenotype has ridiculous airflow I don't own one but I've used one. That's the reason why it works better with the more complicated builds because they get hotter the massive airflow helps with that. If your gonna build normal micro/macro coils then I wouldn't recommend the phenotype I probably wouldn't recommend it in general. I'd recommend the rda you have if it's the tobeco clone of the velocity it's exactly the same. If your insistent on getting an authentic for below $70 then I would probably recommend either of the twisted messes rda's, the tsunami(I never used one but is basically an improved Kennedy which I do own) or the indestructible rda
 

Mikhail Naumov

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The Phenotype and Phenotype-L are both fairly easy to build on, but I will admit, if you're not one who uses specialty builds (claptons, staples, twisted, etc.) or massive coil builds (4mm round wire builds would still do very good in here) there's not a lot this RDA would offer you. It has a TON of airflow, especially if you put a chuff cap on it. It's like just inhaling air out of the room around you. This RDA is for clouds, tons of airflow and massive, crazy builds. If you're looking for a flavor atomizer (I'd give the flavor on the Phenotype and Phenotype L a solid 2/10, it's barely even there due to the airflow) or just a simple cloud chasing atomizer, the Phenotype RDA's aren't for you.

Check out the Goon RDA. Has the most amazing build deck I've ever seen, and has fully adjustable airflow. You can have it restricted, or in full blown cl0udz br0 mode. There's no post holes, just a four-screw positive and negative clamp block. You just pinch your wire under these massive clamps, it's literally the easiest build deck I've used, works with small flavor builds and huge cloud chucking builds. It is a bit pricey though.
 

Zamazam

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Look at the Hannya postless RDA.

AT300-L11.jpg
 

jhhollier

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The Phenotype and Phenotype-L are both fairly easy to build on, but I will admit, if you're not one who uses specialty builds (claptons, staples, twisted, etc.) or massive coil builds (4mm round wire builds would still do very good in here) there's not a lot this RDA would offer you. It has a TON of airflow, especially if you put a chuff cap on it. It's like just inhaling air out of the room around you. This RDA is for clouds, tons of airflow and massive, crazy builds. If you're looking for a flavor atomizer (I'd give the flavor on the Phenotype and Phenotype L a solid 2/10, it's barely even there due to the airflow) or just a simple cloud chasing atomizer, the Phenotype RDA's aren't for you.

Check out the Goon RDA. Has the most amazing build deck I've ever seen, and has fully adjustable airflow. You can have it restricted, or in full blown cl0udz br0 mode. There's no post holes, just a four-screw positive and negative clamp block. You just pinch your wire under these massive clamps, it's literally the easiest build deck I've used, works with small flavor builds and huge cloud chucking builds. It is a bit pricey though.
I've been looking at the Goon but I was concerned that more conservative builds wouldn't work well. I use single core Claptons but would like it if single strand Kanthal builds worked well.
 

raymo2u

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I would pass on the Goon unless your gettin the SS edition...and even then your dealing with something that will fail after a few builds..Im not the only one with bent bar clamps, loose insulator/posts and having to refinish the base and topcap every 2-3 days..I feel like it should have been alot better for its cost. The Twisted Messes Squared is the opposite story..
I suggest looking into the Stro Mini V1, Baal V3, Velocity, Double Vision, Magma Reborn, Tsunami and others first...
 

jhhollier

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I would pass on the Goon unless your gettin the SS edition...and even then your dealing with something that will fail after a few builds..Im not the only one with bent bar clamps, loose insulator/posts and having to refinish the base and topcap every 2-3 days..I feel like it should have been alot better for its cost. The Twisted Messes Squared is the opposite story..
I suggest looking into the Stro Mini V1, Baal V3, Velocity, Double Vision, Magma Reborn, Tsunami and others first...
I'm interested in the Velocity V2 but I have an El Cabron so essentially I have a Twisted Messes. I know the posts are different now, etc. but it will more than likely vape the same and I found it to be a "meh" vape. I have a Tsunami and enjoy it.
 

VaporCarp

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I would pass on the Goon unless your gettin the SS edition...and even then your dealing with something that will fail after a few builds..Im not the only one with bent bar clamps, loose insulator/posts and having to refinish the base and topcap every 2-3 days..I feel like it should have been alot better for its cost. The Twisted Messes Squared is the opposite story..
I suggest looking into the Stro Mini V1, Baal V3, Velocity, Double Vision, Magma Reborn, Tsunami and others first...
Why not just flip the bar clamps over every now and again?
 

raymo2u

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I'm interested in the Velocity V2 but I have an El Cabron so essentially I have a Twisted Messes. I know the posts are different now, etc. but it will more than likely vape the same and I found it to be a "meh" vape. I have a Tsunami and enjoy it.
The ONLY real different from the Velocity V12 anbd V2 is the Catch Nub is cut for both posts...other then that its just lasered cuts for "lining up things like airflow and topcap/base"...I dont feel its worth the "upgrade" if you have a velocity already.If you bought a V2 topcap you couldnt tell the difference.
 

StereoFreeze

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Check out the Petri V2. There is a group buy going on it and I think the price is $72 shipped. Handles simple builds well and is a really nice vape. Optional cloud caps for more airflow are also available. Another that I've been enjoying is the VPRS Cloud Champ Plus. Can have pretty wide open to more restrictive airflow. It has a 4 post deck and simple builds are not an issue.
 

raymo2u

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Why not just flip the bar clamps over every now and again?
That will weaken the bars over time, it will work but they will fail after a few builds and flipping....They are only made of soft brass...they should of been made of SS or Billet T7 Aluminum. The Topcap should of been Glazed or Coated also, for the money I dont see how it was justified....but I guess since its made in the US thats about the only real reason..

I Agree with @StereoFreeze, the Petri V2 is quite the RDA if you have the cash...no complaints on that one.
 

EquivalentExchange

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I can't seem to find the Petri V2 for less than 90$ it's a really pretty mod though. Don't seethe air holes though...

One of my biggest issues with my current one which I'm almost positive isn't even an RDA issue but maybe it's connected is the fact that I burn through my cotton in like a day. Like it always splits in the middle of the coil. I get no flavor after 2-3 hits and I have to change my cotton often. Not sure if it's my deck or what. Hoping I could fix that with a nice authentic RDA.
 

raymo2u

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I can't seem to find the Petri V2 for less than 90$ it's a really pretty mod though. Don't seethe air holes though...

One of my biggest issues with my current one which I'm almost positive isn't even an RDA issue but maybe it's connected is the fact that I burn through my cotton in like a day. Like it always splits in the middle of the coil. I get no flavor after 2-3 hits and I have to change my cotton often. Not sure if it's my deck or what. Hoping I could fix that with a nice authentic RDA.
http://vapingunderground.com/threads/dotmod-petri-v2-group-buy.223123/
$72 if you jump in the pot...Its a really great deal on them and the best so far. Are you sure your cotton is tight enough in the coil? I use Cotton Bacon V2 so there isnt a break in period and the cotton is heat resistant and seems to live longer. It also depends on your juice, juices with alot of sweeteners can gunk up your wick and coils faster then non sweetened juices.
 

Mikhail Naumov

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I feel I'd just add my Goon is literally in perfect shape, and I've had quite a few builds on it. Though if this is a common problem, I'd likely stay away if you didn't own one to avoid the risk. I paid $70 for mine at a B&M, if it was janky I'd be quite pissed but it's been going strong for almost two weeks.
 

EquivalentExchange

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http://vapingunderground.com/threads/dotmod-petri-v2-group-buy.223123/
$72 if you jump in the pot...Its a really great deal on them and the best so far. Are you sure your cotton is tight enough in the coil? I use Cotton Bacon V2 so there isnt a break in period and the cotton is heat resistant and seems to live longer. It also depends on your juice, juices with alot of sweeteners can gunk up your wick and coils faster then non sweetened juices.

I've never seen a post like that? How does that work? How do you know you're moneys getting used correctly?

Also I've been using cotton bacon v2. I really liked it at first despite my roommate telling me it's garbage and that I should only use Japanese cotton. However it seems to snap in my cotton quicker than Japanese cotton did. I've been mainly using One Hit Wonder Muffin Man and Fryd Oreo ejuices as of late but I feel like I've been doing a good job when changing my cotton. Anything else that could cause this?
 

raymo2u

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I've never seen a post like that? How does that work? How do you know you're moneys getting used correctly?

Also I've been using cotton bacon v2. I really liked it at first despite my roommate telling me it's garbage and that I should only use Japanese cotton. However it seems to snap in my cotton quicker than Japanese cotton did. I've been mainly using One Hit Wonder Muffin Man and Fryd Oreo ejuices as of late but I feel like I've been doing a good job when changing my cotton. Anything else that could cause this?
Theres been a bunch of the group buys on here...all have gone smoothly as there are people that "guard and make sure shit gets done" Search "Group Buy" in the search and you will see how its done and how many times it has been done

Jap cotton is crap compared to CB V2...your roomate doesnt know what the hell hes on about.
 

inspects

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What do mean my snapping your cotton....are you getting dry hits burning the cotton in half?
 

EquivalentExchange

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I feel it's better, the flavor is great, it's easier to use, I don't feel like I'm wasting it as much. The only thing is I feel like I have to change my cotton more often because I burn through it super fast, which is sad. I've definitely given my roommate a tone of slack for dissing it though. He works at a vape shop and thinks he's right about most things. I research things thoroughly before I try them and read great things about CBV2 and I really dig it. I just think Im either doing something horribly wrong or maybe my RDA is just tearing it to pieces.
 

inspects

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http://vapingunderground.com/threads/dotmod-petri-v2-group-buy.223123/
$72 if you jump in the pot...Its a really great deal on them and the best so far. Are you sure your cotton is tight enough in the coil? I use Cotton Bacon V2 so there isnt a break in period and the cotton is heat resistant and seems to live longer. It also depends on your juice, juices with alot of sweeteners can gunk up your wick and coils faster then non sweetened juices.
I have two of the Petri V2's, they are damn good attys. If your into huge airflow, its not for you with the standard cap.
 

EquivalentExchange

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What do mean my snapping your cotton....are you getting dry hits burning the cotton in half?
Yeah, exactly that. I'll get maybe 3 hits before its flavorless completely. Thankfully with Cotton Bacon it's not as dry and harsh, just flavorless. Then I check it and the cotton pulls right off where it split in the middle.
 

StereoFreeze

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Going to have to try that CB. I've seen it at a bunch of the local B&M's, but never thought to grab any.
 

inspects

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Yeah, exactly that. I'll get maybe 3 hits before its flavorless completely. Thankfully with Cotton Bacon it's not as dry and harsh, just flavorless. Then I check it and the cotton pulls right off where it split in the middle.
You sure you don't have a hot spot in the coil burning the cotton? Been using KGD cotton for a year+ and have never burnt the cotton in half, even at crazy watts.
 

raymo2u

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Oh, forgot about the Native wicks, been meaning to order that. Do you have a preference between the two?
So as not to completely hijack the, thread @EquivalentExchange get in on the Petri group buy. Really don't think you can go wrong with that one.
I like CB better...I havent got to try the Platinum blend yet though
 

EquivalentExchange

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So I read a little bit more aboutHotspots and apparently it will make these Ohm trackers go a bit wonky. Mines at .53. So maybe it's not a Hotspot thing. I don't know how to read these so I don't typically build on them. For all I know this .53 could be awful. Figured I'd share it anyways in case it helps.
 

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StereoFreeze

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.53 is just your current resistance and does not indicate any kind of problem. If you put it around and the number was bouncing around you want to check the grub screws were tight. If it didn't read anything at all, that would indicate a short and you would not want to use the atty at all until you found the issue. To find hot put the atty on your mod without any cotton in coils and start heating them up. If there is one spot that heats up before the rest that is your hot spot. I usually use a flat head screwdriver and gently strum the coil to work out the hot spot.
 

StereoFreeze

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Also at the risk of sounding like a dick, if you don't know what that number means or how to use an ohm meter, you should really take a couple steps back and do your homework before continuing with building your own coils. Go to steam-engine.org check out the different calculators and read the descriptions on how they work and do some more forum searches. Some people on here have done some great write ups and that will assist on getting a handle on the basics.
 

EquivalentExchange

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Also at the risk of sounding like a dick, if you don't know what that number means or how to use an ohm meter, you should really take a couple steps back and do your homework before continuing with building your own coils. Go to steam-engine.org check out the different calculators and read the descriptions on how they work and do some more forum searches. Some people on here have done some great write ups and that will assist on getting a handle on the basics.
I agree with you, I definitely do. I've looked at the site but I don't really know what all of that stuff means. Like I think that's my biggest issue. If I knew what it meant I think I could use the calculators. I've tried searching these forums on it but it's large and I haven't had any luck finding a good write up of a break down for someone as novice as I am. I'll keep looking though, I really want to be better at building and ensuring I'm doing things the best way possible.
 

Gheed

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I don't use my Phenotype as much as I did but dual 11 wrap 22g is right up its alley.

I'm a major Vaperz Cloud guy so I'll say you should look into these.

Glacier V2
image.jpg
Velocity style deck. (Used my copper so you could see it better)

Mini Temple
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Two post like the Phrnotype. The best adjustable air flow.

Mini Buddha
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3 post T deck.

All run about $50.
In stock here.
http://vhdistro.com/collections/vaperz-cloud
 

Mikhail Naumov

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I agree with you, I definitely do. I've looked at the site but I don't really know what all of that stuff means. Like I think that's my biggest issue. If I knew what it meant I think I could use the calculators. I've tried searching these forums on it but it's large and I haven't had any luck finding a good write up of a break down for someone as novice as I am. I'll keep looking though, I really want to be better at building and ensuring I'm doing things the best way possible.

Resistance (Ohms) is a measurement of the amount of resistance a material gives against an electrical current. In terms of unregulated boxes, in layman's terms, the lower the resistance the more current is going to flow through the coils. On unregulated mods, lower resistance = more power. But make sure you use a calculator, the lower the resistance the more power your coils get, but also the more amperage is drawn from your battery. Batteries have limits, continuous (10s+) and burst/pulse (1-3s). The average (true, mind you. Just because a wrap says it's xA continuous doesn't mean that rating is true.) is 20A cont, 35-40A burst. There is no TRUE 30A cont 18650 battery. The closest would be the LB HB6, bench tests put it at about 28.5A cont. Also, the lower the MaH (capacity of the battery), the less internal resistance a battery will have. On unregulated mods, this means less battery sag usually. Battery sag is not voltage drop, it's how much current is lost from the battery internally. The more a battery is strained (AKA the more power drawn) the more it will sag. Voltage drop is the amount of power (voltage) lost from the batteries to the atomizer. So when you put a 4.2V battery in a mod, don't assume you're getting 4.2 volts. After sag and drop, imagine around the 3.3-3.7V range depending on how much output power the battery is giving. Keep in mind this is just when a battery is fully charged, the voltage drops as the capacity of the cell does.

On regulated mods, which are usually variable wattage, the resistance doesn't play AS BIG of a role but still definitely plays a role. You're now adjusting yourself with buttons in terms of power, not by builds. The higher the resistance on a regulated mod, the higher the output voltage will be at a given wattage setting. This is a much more complicated realm when compared to unregulated mods, but if you need more information I'm willing to give it.

The thicker the wire (the lower the gauge) the less resistance it will have per foot, also, the more wraps, the more resistance your builds will have. Say you have one coil, it's .6 ohms, say you add a second, identical coil. Your resistance will now be .3 ohms. Certain materials are more conductive, and have less resistance per foot. Like Nichrome, Stainless Steel, etc. These all resist a good bit lower than standard kanthal. The inner diameter (mm/in) of your coils also will determine this, the larger the diameter, the more resistance. The bigger the wire, the less it resists current flowing through it. The bigger the coil, the more it resists, because a larger coil equates to a longer path for the electricity to travel.

Look up Ohm's Law if you need a better feel, and some battery safety information.

Key points:

The thicker the wire (the lower the gauge) the easier it is for current to flow through it, so a lower resistance.

The bigger the coil in terms of wraps and diameter, the more resistance it will have, due to the size making the pathway for electricity longer.

Different wires have different conductivity and resist differently, kanthal is the standard but you have many other wires with a lower resistance.

The lower the resistance, the more power it will draw to your build on unregulated mods, but also this will cause a higher amperage draw. Always make sure your amperage draw is in your batteries limitations, otherwise this is highly unsafe.

On regulated mods the lower the resistance the more wattage it will take to get to a given output power. Like on my DNA200, my .55 build hits the maximum power output of 9V at around 145W, but a .15 build could only reach about 5.5 volts at the full power of 200W.

This is just a crash course, not a full lesson.
 
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