Orchid V4, short wick life.

[Citizen]

So, if need be, move this to the Orchid Modification Thread that Westpole has so kindly put together. So I've tried everything. Lots of wick, little wick, tucking, no tuck, high coils, low coils and still... after a tank or two I'm getting my juice being tainted by visibly darker juice leaking out of one or more of the juice channels back into the tank. Flavor goes out the window and it becomes unbearable. I can't re-wick twice a day. Here's my current deets:

26 ga around a 2.4 mm dual coil. . 5 ohm. wicked somewhat loose. No cotton in the channels. Flush with the deck. Panzer blackhawk running sony vtc3 18650.

What the effinzinger am I doing wrong guys? I know these tanks are great,I'm just not getting what I feel I can achieve. Should I try to build higher resistance?

Anyways, thanks in advance. Looking forward to hearing from you guys and I will keep you posted.

 

[Eric DeCastro]

I have had the same wick and coils since I first built it maybe a month or two ago. Sorry I can't help mine have been perfect. Super wicking yet to flooding. Flavor is good. I replaced it today just to switch to a new cotton and the cotton was still white not burnt at all.

 

[fq06]

I have to swap out about once every couple days vaping desert juices with Japanese cotton. Fruits I'm sure would go longer but i usually only vape those for a day so my taste buds don't get bored.

CelluCotton goes about twice as long.

I'm not really building any different than you... not much help but my frequency is not too much different. But twice a day is excessive.
I recoil about once a week, just like fresh wires.

Wonder if both wick tails are touching the deck. I have a 2 piece chimney now so i can see what's going on in there but before that i would stick the tails against the posts with juice the best I could so they didn't get pulled by the chimneys threads. Still do I guess but i also adjust the wicks after i screw on the chimney base now.

 

[Citizen]

I mean...Shall I build and post a pic?

 

[fq06]

Yep

 

[fq06]

You are using cotton balls? That may be the only difference. JC and cellucotton last longer than balls (for me).

 

[Citizen]

I should mention.High vg juice. Still, I will build and post.

 

[Citizen]

You are using cotton balls? That may be the only difference. JC and cellucotton last longer than balls.

Yes. The balls sir.

 

[fq06]

Stop playing with balls lol.
If you haven't tried cellucotton, pm your address to me and I'll mail some to you... and some JC if you haven't tried that either.

Is usually use 60% VG.

 

[Citizen]

Well, here goes...Lengthy.

Here's the difference in juice in about two tanks...


This is what I'm left with after less than 24 hours. And that's with ripping on the dripper and kayfun in the mix.


They look like those caterpillars you find in the fall.Cute, if it's a catarpillar. Not so much if it's your wick.


Coilage.


Fromadaside.


Evenglow. Clouds arrive like butterflies.


Wicked.


Eddie wetter.


So there it is. Let me know what I can improve. I'm not bashing this tank, because I love it. I just know it's capable of much more than I'm allowing it to do.

 

[fq06]

Wow, that is nasty. That juice in the bottle doesn't even look like a dark, gunky, sugary wick killer either. What flavor is it? Desert? Drink?

Coils look good, good height and centering. Wicking dry looks good for cotton, wet it looks like the coil isn't filled enough anymore, sagging at the ends of the coil. But a phone camera for micro images is not the best and I haven't used balls in months... half a year so I'm not the best judge of that
Insulator looks burnt but that's on a side note and has nothing to do with the wick getting nasty so quick. Probably dry burns cooking it.

It gets that nasty with all juices? Lite fruits too?

How often do you replace the coils? To me fresh coils just plain work better. I do dry burn them between every wick change but between just liking fresh wire and also trying new wire gauge and resistance and coil styles... always fussing with it, my coils are always fresh.

 

[Citizen]

Wow, that is nasty. That juice in the bottle doesn't even look like a dark, gunky, sugary wick killer either. What flavor is it? Desert? Drink?

Blueberry Vanilla Cake.

Insulator looks burnt but that's on a side note and has nothing to do with the wick getting nasty so quick. Probably dry burns cooking it.

Aah. It is indeed black, but it's because I fried the originals. I work at a machine shop and made some new ones out of delrin. That's what's in there now.

It gets that nasty with all juices? Lite fruits too?

Giving a lighter fruit a shot now. Less VG also.

How often do you replace the coils? To me fresh coils just plain work better. I do dry burn them between every wick change but between just liking fresh wire and also trying new wire gauge and resistance and coil styles... always fussing with it, my coils are always fresh.

I'm going about a week between coils as it stands right now. The coils pictured were also less than 24 hours old. I will keep you posted as to how this new juice trial goes as well as when I have wicked with the soon to be had generosity.

 

[fq06]

Yeah, the vanilla, cake, custard, caramel and so on are hard on wicks compared to fruits. But still, that's just too much in that short of a time.

Hope your wife's JC works better till the cellucotton arrives

 

[msgnyc]

Try making the tails of your wicks a bit longer and tapered at the ends then tuck them into the juice channels. It will aid with pulling the juice to the coil but the big benefit is that it fills the space in the channels reducing liquid leaking back out minimizing contamination of the rest of the tank.

Some juices are just wick destroyers tho.
I've a couple of them myself. XD

 

[nodor]

@Citizen
My build specs are about the same as yours. I vape custard most of the time and had the same problem.
Here what I have demised.
If you don't get enough juice to the coil you vaporize all available juice and burn the wick. Result---- tastes shitty
If you get way to much juice to the coil it drains out the airholes and makes a mess. Result ---------unvapeable
If you get just a little to much juice to the coil it slows down the coil heatup at first and heats the juice to hot discoloring it but vapes good and tastes good once it get rid of the excess.( about the fist 1.5 seconds of vape)
If you get the right amount of juice to the coil it vaporizes quickly and vapes perfect.
The orchid has been the best tank I have used but also is hardest to wick perfect.
A couple of options are to plug the channels a bit to reduce flow but hard to get perfect to avoid dry hit.
What I have had the best success with is reducing the amount of cotton thru the coil but leaving lots on the deck. Wick lasts way longer. Vape tastes better and problem solved for me. YMMV

 

[rjmara]

this is how I wick mine and it has been doing well so far.I was wicking it like a Fogger when I first got it and was getting dry hits.
I re-done it like the video and the initial leaking in the beginning is worth it,as stated in the vid.

 

[rjmara]

also my set up is 7 wraps of 28g dual coil, Japanese cotton wicks.comes in at .7 ohms

 

[Citizen]

Alright, so here's an update. Switched to a 50/50 juice. Re-wicked with cotton just touching the deck. Hitting great. Second day on the same cotton. I went to my local shop and grabbed another jug of 50/50 juice and some straight vg. I'm going to slowly work up to see what I can get away with. Can't wait till the Japanese cotton arrives. I thank you guys all so much for your help. Does anybody run 24 ga for coils on these? Just interested on your specs. Thinking I'd like to build around .8 setup. I don't know if I have the room though. I'm so happy I bought another orchid and stuck with it instead of just switching to a billow.

Hope your wife's JC works better till the cellucotton arrives

...there was none to be had. I searched. However, the look on her face as she caught me rummaging through her makeup at 3am, was priceless.

 

[fq06]

From memory 0.8 will need 28g... maybe even 30g. I am running 24g 8 wrap on a 2.5mm bit and it's 0.32ohms.
I have some 25g arriving today and that should get me to the 0.4ohms that I want to hit with one more wrap.
0.32 does not dry hit and it's not too hot but I lost more flavor than I wanted to coming from 26g at about 0.5ohms.

I have your envelope all packaged up but I'm going to redo it and send tomorrow so I can throw some 25g in with the wick stuff. I have some 24 & 27 gauge wire in there already, not sure what wires you have besides 26g and those are the common orchid gauges... I think 25g will be optimal with a mechanical and I just like working with the thicker wires so much more. They don't get cut by the screw and don't budge while installing and rewicking.

 

[Citizen]

From memory 0.8 will need 28g... maybe even 30g. I am running 24g 8 wrap on a 2.5mm bit and it's 0.32ohms.
I have some 25g arriving today and that should get me to the 0.4ohms that I want to hit with one more wrap.
0.32 does not dry hit and it's not too hot but I lost more flavor than I wanted to coming from 26g at about 0.5ohms.

I have your envelope all packaged up but I'm going to redo it and send tomorrow so I can throw some 25g in with the wick stuff. I have some 24 & 27 gauge wire in there already, not sure what wires you have besides 26g and those are the common orchid gauges... I think 25g will be optimal with a mechanical and I just like working with the thicker wires so much more. They don't get cut by the screw and don't budge while installing and rewicking.

You aren't Jesus, are you?

 

[fq06]

Ha ha! No and my wife keeps telling me that no matter how many times I insist I can... I can't actually walk on water lol.

 

[MKPM]

Try making the tails of your wicks a bit longer and tapered at the ends then tuck them into the juice channels. It will aid with pulling the juice to the coil but the big benefit is that it fills the space in the channels reducing liquid leaking back out minimizing contamination of the rest of the tank.

Some juices are just wick destroyers tho.
I've a couple of them myself. XD

I could not disagree more....sorry.

 

[MKPM]

PROVEN and used by many:
http://vapingunderground.com/thread...famous-mickey-mouse-ears-orchid-builds.32290/

There are two reasons why I set my coils so high.
1. Clearance issues do to building @ .19ohms with heavier gauge wire.
2. Decrease of heat directly on the tails of the cotton, which reduces caramelisation of the juice.

I normally vape dessert and bakery flavours in my Orchids and SquapeR's.

 

[sohkis]

haha, loving the pearl jam references..

i run 100% vg in my orchid courtesy of open source vapors and my rayon/cellucotton wicks last weeks.

i'm thinking it may have more to do w/the juice you're using as opposed to the ratio of pg/vg. i usually change my wicks out before they actually need it just b/c i wanna build a new set of coils or changing flavors when i refill.

 

[Citizen]

See, I started with the wick inside the channel. Got dry hits. Cut level with the deck, no dry hits. However, I went to a thinner juice at the same time. So I can't personally say why it stopped, I just know that so far it has been much better. Just got some juice today that is a bit thicker so we will see what happens.

 

[msgnyc]

I could not disagree more....sorry.

Fine by me. It was mearly a suggestion for a method that continues to work for me without issues.

 

[Citizen]

Well guys, this is after three days. That wick color is about the color of the liquid I was using too. Big improvement. Thanks everybody so much for helping me out on this. Just had another orchid arrive today, going to try the mickey ears on that one. Can't wait till the Segeili arrives to really start getting after some flavor.

 

[rjmara]

Well guys, this is after three days. That wick color is about the color of the liquid I was using too. Big improvement. Thanks everybody so much for helping me out on this. Just had another orchid arrive today, going to try the mickey ears on that one. Can't wait till the Segeili arrives to really start getting after some flavor.

I'm using a .7 build in mine,I run it at 25 watts on the Sigelei Plus and it's perfect for me.

 

[Citizen]

I'm using a .7 build in mine,I run it at 25 watts on the Sigelei Plus and it's perfect for me.

What ga wire/size coil are you running if I may ask? Also, how is your battery life with this build?

 

[rjmara]

What ga wire/size coil are you running if I may ask? Also, how is your battery life with this build?

I have dual coils,28g Kanthal,7 wraps around a 1/16" punch.I put two fresh VTC4 batteries in this morning at 10am , been vaping all day on it and my box says I still have 67% left.But I did bump it back down to 21watts,says I'm running 4.0 volts.

 

[Citizen]

I have dual coils,28g Kanthal,7 wraps around a 1/16" punch.I put two fresh VTC4 batteries in this morning at 10am , been vaping all day on it and my box says I still have 67% left.But I did bump it back down to 21watts,says I'm running 4.0 volts.

Hey thanks for the reply. I'm thinking that running anything at 50 watts I'm screwed as far as an adv without a battery swap.

 

[InMyImage]

I find @franciscan's mickey mouse ears to be the method that has been most successful for me. Plus it give the ability to really easily center the coils between the channels and fiddle with the wicks to get them laying properly on the deck.

I do get a wee bit of leakage after fresh fill, but it stops pretty quickly after a few pulls.

Interested in seeing more about the v6 that someone is coming out with that will have a raised lip around the airflow holes. Should cut down on the leaking a lot (hopefully).

 

[MKPM]

I find @franciscan's mickey mouse ears to be the method that has been most successful for me. Plus it give the ability to really easily center the coils between the channels and fiddle with the wicks to get them laying properly on the deck.

I do get a wee bit of leakage after fresh fill, but it stops pretty quickly after a few pulls.

Interested in seeing more about the v6 that someone is coming out with that will have a raised lip around the airflow holes. Should cut down on the leaking a lot (hopefully).

A great deal of leaking issues comes from over-priming the coil and wick prior to assembly and tank fill. What happens is, juice gets on the deck around the air holes and creates a puddle. Think of raindrops upon a car's windscreen.....they attract each other and eventually form a rivulet that flows in whatever direction the wind dictates. This is what happens on the deck. Juice that collects on the deck from the vacuum joins up with the wick ends...but also with the juice puddle around the air holes...causing leakage. Only use enough juice when priming to MOISTEN the wick and coil....let the channels do the rest.

Pax Et Bonum

 

[Citizen]

I find @franciscan

I do get a wee bit of leakage after fresh fill, but it stops pretty quickly after a few pulls.

I've noticed that if I fill or refill with the Orchid tilted a bit and the fill hole at the lowest possible position (if that makes any sense)I won't get a stitch of leakage. And Franciscan, you're right. I get my wicks just wet enough to prime it. I have had zero leaking since I've stuck to these two methods.

 

[InMyImage]

A great deal of leaking issues comes from over-priming the coil and wick prior to assembly and tank fill. What happens is, juice gets on the deck around the air holes and creates a puddle. Think of raindrops upon a car's windscreen.....they attract each other and eventually form a rivulet that flows in whatever direction the wind dictates. This is what happens on the deck. Juice that collects on the deck from the vacuum joins up with the wick ends...but also with the juice puddle around the air holes...causing leakage. Only use enough juice when priming to MOISTEN the wick and coil....let the channels do the rest.

Pax Et Bonum

That makes sense. I have been saturating the wicks and know that juice is getting in the air holes as I arrange them because it has been easier for me to work with them wet. After I put it together I blow through the air inlet holes but it still leaks for about the first 3-5 pulls. So as I think about what you said it definitely makes sense and I'll try to remember it next time I build one of em.

Although I have to be honest... I think I like my KFL+ v2 better and am thinking about selling the 2 Orchid v4's that I have by Tobeco and get another Kayfun. I simply don't use the Orchids very often and the KFL is just a lot easier for me. I use PG/VG blends at 60/40 to 50/50 so the KFL wicks them fine and the single coil just seems more to my liking.

 

[Oggy]

That makes sense. I have been saturating the wicks and know that juice is getting in the air holes as I arrange them because it has been easier for me to work with them wet. After I put it together I blow through the air inlet holes but it still leaks for about the first 3-5 pulls. So as I think about what you said it definitely makes sense and I'll try to remember it next time I build one of em.

Although I have to be honest... I think I like my KFL+ v2 better and am thinking about selling the 2 Orchid v4's that I have by Tobeco and get another Kayfun. I simply don't use the Orchids very often and the KFL is just a lot easier for me. I use PG/VG blends at 60/40 to 50/50 so the KFL wicks them fine and the single coil just seems more to my liking.

This is why I got into rebuildables. I can build to the way I vape. I love the Kayfun but they just dont have enough airflow now that I have started dripping. I use Orchids for out and about and If I am doing something and dont want to have to drip constantly.

 

[InMyImage]

This is why I got into rebuildables. I can build to the way I vape. I love the Kayfun but they just dont have enough airflow now that I have started dripping. I use Orchids for out and about and If I am doing something and dont want to have to drip constantly.

Yep, it's all about options. I like the airflow of the KFL+. I'm thinking about trying the updated v2 with 2 air intakes, but like I said right now I like the single hole airflow. It's one of the reason I'm not sure I like the Orchid v4 because it just seems to airy for the way I vape and the juice PG/VG ratios I like.

 

[Gage Westerhouse]

I just started getting into vaping and I've got the v4 too. I've noticed how insanely difficult it is to wick right. In the past two days I've rewicked it 5 times, but it just won't stop burning cotton. I switched to japanese cotton and I thought that maybe I wasn't cutting the wicked short enough, so I just tried cutting it as short as I could. It seemed to work for a few minutes. But then after 6 hits, it's starting to burn cotton again!! I don't know what I'm doing wrong. Am I cutting it so short that it's not getting quite enough juice? Am I packing the wicks too tightly? One thing I have noticed though; whenever I have a wicked that is going to start to burn, I hear it 'sizzling' after I release the trigger. And when I have a wicked that doesn't burn, it never sizzles after I take a hit.