TFA vs FA

riffminer · Jan 16, 2015

I see recipes that basicaly the same except some say FA and some say TFA. What is the differance between them? An example is "Head in Clouds" use's alot of FA in his recipes. And I see the same or simmaler recipe that use's TFA. Can they be subsitated for each other or combined? Some suppliers offer FA while others TFA.

JXN · Jan 16, 2015

Different companies, different products, FA (Flavor Art) an Italian based company is more concentrated which means stronger so you can use less.

Blewt · Jan 16, 2015

Yeah. Just different manufacturers. I tend to like the FA stuff better than the TFA, but it's personal preference. If a recipe calls for one or the other, it's because that's what the person had lying around or preferred in the mix.

Cramptholomew · Jan 16, 2015

A lot of the time, the same flavor tastes very different depending on the brand. TFA Vanilla Bourbon and FA Vanilla Bourbon don't taste anything alike. TFA Raspberry and FA Raspberry don't taste anything alike. That goes for other manufacturers as well.

acidrain23 · Jan 16, 2015

To me, FA has more useful flavors than TFA. Most of their line is good with a few minor exceptions. In general, FA is more of a cost outlay upfront, but its easier to get good mixes sooner because their concentrations are more consistent across the line- most are usable in the 1-3% range (not to mention, lower percentages mean your bottle lasts longer obviously). Whereas with TFA, their concentrations are all over the place- anywhere from 1-20%. Therefore, you are probably going to spend more time working on single flavor mixes getting those percentages dialed in initially.

While some of TFA flavors are horribad, there are some wonderful indispensible ones too (for example, their green tea is fantastic and no one else makes a good one really)- so don't write them off completely!

Check out the flavor review section here, HIC has some great, very detailed notes particularly in regards to FA's products.

Blewt · Jan 16, 2015

I have to agree. TFA is a lot more hit and miss than FA.

Cramptholomew · Jan 16, 2015

TFA is hit or miss, but there are definitely gems among the detritus.

TheWestPole · Jan 16, 2015

acidrain23 said:
To me, FA has more useful flavors than TFA. Most of their line is good with a few minor exceptions. In general, FA is more of a cost outlay upfront, but its easier to get good mixes sooner because their concentrations are more consistent across the line- most are usable in the 1-3% range (not to mention, lower percentages mean your bottle lasts longer obviously). Whereas with TFA, their concentrations are all over the place- anywhere from 1-20%. Therefore, you are probably going to spend more time working on single flavor mixes getting those percentages dialed in initially.

While some of TFA flavors are horribad, there are some wonderful indispensible ones too (for example, their green tea is fantastic and no one else makes a good one really)- so don't write them off completely!

Check out the flavor review section here, HIC has some great, very detailed notes particularly in regards to FA's products.

Very well put. And for the reasons you stated about more consistent concentrations and percentages, FA is the better of the two for a beginner. I started with TFA, which does indeed have a lot of good flavors, but nonetheless wish I had started with FA.

riffminer · Jan 16, 2015

Great response's everyone, thanks. Now it there a "super store" for FA? I need 12 flavours and I have found most but I have to buy them from 4 different places. I am just getting started mixing my own from the great recipes that I've collected from here. I want to wade in, not dive in over my head. Can you order dirict from the FA home page? Thanks again, everyone.

TheWestPole · Jan 16, 2015

riffminer said:
Great response's everyone, thanks. Now it there a "super store" for FA? I need 12 flavours and I have found most but I have to buy them from 4 different places. I am just getting started mixing my own from the great recipes that I've collected from here. I want to wade in, not dive in over my head. Can you order dirict from the FA home page? Thanks again, everyone.

http://www.purevapes.com
http://www.rtsvapes.com
http://www.eliquidmart.com
http://www.ecigexpress.com

Not necessarily in that order.

Pauly Walnuts · Jan 17, 2015

Dont forget www.bullcityvapor.com
I always had to buy from 2+ places to get everything I need (vg, nic, flavor), since I use caps vanilla custard v1. I found that and everything else I needed (cap egg nog, fa vienna cream, fa catalan cream, fa vanilla classic, fa torrone, nic and vg) at bull city last week. I was beyond impressed, good prices too.

Huckleberried · Jan 17, 2015

Bull city also sells original FA bottles, instead of re-bottling flavors. I enjoy the selection that they carry, too. I've had hit and miss experiences with most vendors. To date, no issues when ordering here.

TheWestPole · Jan 17, 2015

Pauly Walnuts said:
Dont forget www.bullcityvapor.com
I always had to buy from 2+ places to get everything I need (vg, nic, flavor), since I use caps vanilla custard v1. I found that and everything else I needed (cap egg nog, fa vienna cream, fa catalan cream, fa vanilla classic, fa torrone, nic and vg) at bull city last week. I was beyond impressed, good prices too.

My only problem with BCV is whenever I check with them I can only find 10ml or 120ml sizes. I like to buy my favorites in 30ml bottles.

Huckleberried · Jan 17, 2015

TheWestPole said:
My only problem with BCV is whenever I check with them I can only find 10ml or 120ml sizes. I like to buy my favorites in 30ml bottles.

He's getting those back in stock in February. He posted that somewhere here, like yesterday or today.

TheWestPole · Jan 17, 2015

Huckleberried said:
He's getting those back in stock in February. He posted that somewhere here, like yesterday or today.

Hmmm. Will keep them in the inventory search then.

Huckleberried · Jan 17, 2015

Pure Vapes and ECX also have them in 30's. I just picked up Marzipan.

TheWestPole · Jan 17, 2015

Huckleberried said:
Pure Vapes and ECX also have them in 30's. I just picked up Marzipan.

Already on my list: http://vapingunderground.com/threads/tfa-vs-fa.48099/#post-273683

Huckleberried · Jan 17, 2015

LOL, I read that earlier. Big "duh" moment. Carry on

Pauly Walnuts · Jan 17, 2015

Your right, only 10ml and 120ml. Its the difference between buying a cheeseburger, or buying enough cheeseburgers for a month.

Zamazam · Jan 17, 2015

Over all I've had more WTF moments with TFA then FA flavors.

wally · Jan 17, 2015

JXN said:
Different companies, different products, FA (Flavor Art) an Italian based company is more concentrated which means stronger so you can use less.

If you are referring to FA being more concentrated than TFA then you are very wrong I have been using both flavor's for years now for myself and friends and Tfa by a long shot is more concentrated that is just a fact.

JXN · Jan 17, 2015

I simply disagree. I think most would reccomend starting percentages for TFA well above 5%. Not so for Flavor Art, but whatever works for you is great.

wally · Jan 17, 2015

LOL most all TFa is .25 to 2% with a few at 3 to 4 % then more is less.

Zamazam · Jan 17, 2015

Huckleberried said:
Pure Vapes and ECX also have them in 30's. I just picked up Marzipan.

OOOh, one of my favorite flavors! Let me know what you think of it...

JXN · Jan 17, 2015

wally said:
LOL most all TFa is .25 to 2% with a few at 3 to 4 % then more is less.

That's good news for my Vanilla Custard currently at 10%. Thanks for the headsup!

wally · Jan 17, 2015

What don't people understand less is More. It has been mentioned many times and is so very true especially with Vanilla custard. I bet you have to steep it a month to get the best flavor now don't you. Try 2 or 3% let sit three days try it then let sit for few more days try it will be even stronger.

JXN · Jan 17, 2015

Thanks, but no thanks.

Huckleberried · Jan 17, 2015

Zamazam said:
OOOh, one of my favorite flavors! Let me know what you think of it...

Oh, this was a replacement bottle, lol. Yep, it's very good. A wonderful addition to many recipes.

wally · Jan 17, 2015

Huckleberried said:
Oh, this was a replacement bottle, lol. Yep, it's very good. A wonderful addition to many recipes.

Is marzipan good on it's own or better as a mixer?

misswish · Jan 17, 2015

Huckleberried said:
Oh, this was a replacement bottle, lol. Yep, it's very good. A wonderful addition to many recipes.

Good to know! I'm on a hunt to find Lots of uses for it - I mistakenly ordered 60mls! of it, lol.

Huckleberried · Jan 17, 2015

wally said:
Is marzipan good on it's own or better as a mixer?

I'm sure that's more personal opinion for whoever is mixing. For my taste, I use it mainly as a mixer.

misswish said:
Good to know! I'm on a hunt to find Lots of uses for it - I mistakenly ordered 60mls! of it, lol.

LOL, that's a lot! I think @RyGon really likes it, HIC uses it in several mixes, and I think @Sully uses it. too. My fave use for it, so far was in HIC's Macaroon Bars. I really like it with the orange, cranberry and coconut.

misswish · Jan 17, 2015

I do have some recipes for it, but good grief! I only vape about 3-4 mls a day! OooH, his macaroon is wonderful.

TheWestPole · Jan 17, 2015

TheWestPole said:
Very well put. And for the reasons you stated about more consistent concentrations and percentages, FA is the better of the two for a beginner. I started with TFA, which does indeed have a lot of good flavors, but nonetheless wish I had started with FA.

Regarding TFA flavor percentages, this chart is by no means the final authority, but I have found it to be a useful guideline. In my own experience, for example with tobaccos, I use between .25% (M-type) and 15% (RY4 Double). Many have reported using up to 20% with some flavors. That's way outside the general range of FA percentages. FA's narrower range is what makes for a shorter learning curve for the beginner.

http://www.v-ecigs.com/tfa-flavor-percentage-recommendations/

Huckleberried · Jan 17, 2015

I can't say I've ever gone over 4 or 5% on a TFA flavor and enjoyed it. I typically used them much lower than the average that I see.

RyGon · Jan 17, 2015

Huckleberried said:
I'm sure that's more personal opinion for whoever is mixing. For my taste, I use it mainly as a mixer.

LOL, that's a lot! I think @RyGon really likes it, HIC uses it in several mixes, and I think @Sully uses it. too. My fave use for it, so far was in HIC's Macaroon Bars. I really like it with the orange, cranberry and coconut.

Mm, marzipan good.

wally · Jan 17, 2015

TFA ry4 double Very nice mellow vape at 2% At 7% Strong vape any stronger than 7% we decided up to 15% no change in flavor. The more % = less. Came into range some where after 7%. This was with five of us tasting.

TheWestPole · Jan 17, 2015

wally said:
TFA ry4 double Very nice mellow vape at 2% At 7% Strong vape any stronger than 7% we decided up to 15% no change in flavor. The more % = less. Came into range some where after 7%. This was with five of us tasting.

Hmmm. You're right, there can be a lot of wasted flavoring in some of those published percentages. Early on I wasted a lot too. After trying flavorless and very minimal flavors in an effort to come up with satisfying odorless vapes (in the interest of sociability) I came to appreciate much lower flavor levels. That's probably true of a lot of DIYers as they gain experience with their recipes and refine their palates.

BTW, I don't use TFA RY4 Double by itself any more but as a base at 6%, to which I add a dash of Desert Ship, M-type, Tobacco Absolute, liquor flavors or whatever. But 2%? Not for me with that one.

BigNasty · Jan 18, 2015

TheWestPole said:
Hmmm. You're right, there can be a lot of wasted flavoring in some of those published percentages. Early on I wasted a lot too. After trying flavorless and very minimal flavors in an effort to come up with satisfying odorless vapes (in the interest of sociability) I came to appreciate much lower flavor levels. That's probably true of a lot of DIYers as they gain experience with their recipes and refine their palates.

BTW, I don't use TFA RY4 Double by itself any more but as a base at 6%, to which I add a dash of Desert Ship, M-type, Tobacco Absolute, liquor flavors or whatever. But 2%? Not for me with that one.

TFA double is strong.
That chart is wonky at some % one I read a while ago said kona at 15%... not a chance you can vape kona in anything.

wally · Jan 18, 2015

BigNasty said:
TFA double is strong.
That chart is wonky at some % one I read a while ago said kona at 15%... not a chance you can vape kona in anything.

I don't go by any chart I use my nose it tells me what I need know but a few times I did go % listings on the ratings but it only took a couple times to learn a good lesson lol , I have a friend that smokes a lot of skunk and he requires strong tasting flavors to kind of sickening flavors so maybe when some write the percentages on the ratings this is why for the crazy percentages.

BigNasty · Jan 18, 2015

wally said:
I don't go by any chart I use my nose it tells me what I need know but a few times I did go % listings on the ratings but it only took a couple times to learn a good lesson lol , I have a friend that smokes a lot of skunk and he requires strong tasting flavors to kind of sickening flavors so maybe when some write the percentages on the ratings this is why for the crazy percentages.

Kona is the sickest flavor out there.
If he is a skunky user zen garden at 15% would make em gag.

wally · Jan 18, 2015

lol maybe but he must have a thick coating in mouth and lungs to vape some of the flavors he does. He vapes a strawberry/banana that makes me want to puke every time I get into his car at work.

BigNasty · Jan 18, 2015

wally said:
lol maybe but he must have a thick coating in mouth and lungs to vape some of the flavors he does. He vapes a strawberry/banana that makes me want to puke every time I get into his car at work.

Zen garden tastes like pine needles and dirt from a grow field.

wally · Jan 18, 2015

I have seen it and wondered thanks for the info, prolly a Chinese type vape lol.

wally · Jan 18, 2015

You know I love Chinese foods but when it comes to juice and flavors they suck to high heaven. And nothing you can do to improve them oh and don't spill a drop the smell will never go away.

Smoky Blue · Jan 18, 2015

BigNasty said:
Zen garden tastes like pine needles and dirt from a grow field.

hey now.. I like zen garden... at like .5% and under

wally · Jan 18, 2015

I like red heads

wally · Jan 18, 2015

wally said:
You know I love Chinese foods but when it comes to juice and flavors they suck to high heaven. And nothing you can do to improve them oh and don't spill a drop the smell will never go away.

No, I like pretty red heads who vape and make a lot of good juice

Smoky Blue · Jan 18, 2015

wally said:
No, I like pretty red heads who vape and make a lot of good juice

lol

BigNasty · Jan 18, 2015

wally said:
I have seen it and wondered thanks for the info, prolly a Chinese type vape lol.

A dirty mj type vape.. reminds me of mexican skunk you buy by the garbage sack full.

Sully · Jan 18, 2015

Huckleberried said:
I'm sure that's more personal opinion for whoever is mixing. For my taste, I use it mainly as a mixer.

LOL, that's a lot! I think @RyGon really likes it, HIC uses it in several mixes, and I think @Sully uses it. too. My fave use for it, so far was in HIC's Macaroon Bars. I really like it with the orange, cranberry and coconut.

Marzipan is very good. Prob one of the sweetest FA flavors. Goes well with almost anything you want to sweeten up with some almond notes included. One of my simple favs is FA Marzipan and FA Strawberry (1:4 ratio)

TFA vs FA

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