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Can a triple 18650 mod load with LG HB6's be safe enough?

NickyGiaccone

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So I'll be using my Koopor Primus, which is great-a triple 18650-and I'm okay with it until it breaks since it works well, but I have a safety concern. If I put 3 LG HB6 (pink) 18650's, and use a Horizon Arctic V12 .1ohm 12xClapton coil at 220W or possible higher, Ohm's law states that 30amps...even at 4.2V per each battery in series, isn't enough for that kinda vaping. The calc says 43.4 amps or something similar. If the youtube testers and people who recommended it to me haven't had issues (and those people likely didn't use LG HB6's because many don't know it's the most powerful cell for the short 1500mAH it has, but...) would I be okay? I'll probably prefer the .3ohm coil which is the other clapton option but still it's about 190-200W. I don't think triple batteries helps with this issue only perhaps a tiny bit longer battery time? I'm worried because I'm sticking to the Cleito 120 and Arctic V8 Dual Klapton (V2-series of coils) which is .2ohms but not to be used at wattages higher than 140W. I eventually want to get this Arctic V12 since I love the brand and that line of products (arctic). I cloud chase without nicotine these days because I can't help but crave a small corona Rocky Patel cigar a few times daily as well and I chain vape while I'm busy indoors so this is a hobby that became serious part of my life as of this month and I wanna be safe. Help? I use the Sigelei J150 2-cell Lipo 2000mAH 35amp beast of a small thing but it's not gonna cut it since it's definitely a 150W 35amp vaporizer but I just don't wanna be trapped and not move on to the cloud chaser's new generation. Thanks in advance.
 

Jim_MDP

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Member For 4 Years
Ohm's law states

There's your mistake.
It's a regulated mod. The circuitry acts as a firewall between the battery and the coil, so traditional Ohm's Law doesn't apply as it does with a mechanical mod.

What matters is watts requested, resistance doesn't enter into it.
"A = W / V"... that's it.

Calculate the highest load on the battery, which is at its' lowest charge state (opposite of a mech) and use a low value for safety, say 3 volts, and you get... 60 watts per cell is 20 amps max. At the battery. Dual cell is good for 120w, triple gets you 180w. With standard 20A high drain cells.

Calculate for your 30A cells from there. Pretty simple math actually. Like most everything vaping... this ain't rocket surgery. ;)
And try to stay a tad low... we're dealing with some substantial energy potential, right next to your face. :eek:

:D
 
Last edited:

nightshard

It's VG/PG not PG/VG
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You can safely use a 3 battery regulated mod with HB6s up to 260W with any resistance that your mods allows.
180W with 3X20A
220W witg 3X25A
 

Jim_MDP

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Member For 4 Years
Done with 3.2V cutoff and 90% efficiency.

(260/3/3.2)/90% = 30.09A
(220/3/3.2)/90% = 25.4A
(180/3/3.2)/90% = 20.8A

See... it's your rounding off the resultant amps that throws it off. :D
You can't do that with differing orders of magnitude.

I was just now calculating to see if you used a different voltage for the odd two (your 20A @ 180W agreed with my use of 3.0v instead of an efficiency factor).

:D
 

NickyGiaccone

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It's a regulated mod, the Chipset will regulate the batteries.

That and I'm very skeptical that it can actually do 300W
I never needed to test 300W on anything. It does 240 I'll tell you that much. But uh thanks for the input. It should do 300W for a few puffs then cease. But that's my guess. It's a different animal. Do you have one?
 

NickyGiaccone

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You can safely use a 3 battery regulated mod with HB6s up to 260W with any resistance that your mods allows.
180W with 3X20A
220W witg 3X25A
Yes, I don't know about your mathematically method, not even if it's wrong, just don't understand because I used the ohms calculator. I charge my batteries to 4.2V like the booklets say for devices and the charger I had and need to rebuy-XTAR VC4. But okay. So I would be getting a Horizon Arctic V12 with a pre-installed .1ohm (12X or 12 wrapped?) Clapton coil for 260W max but a 220W average for most users. The mod only reads resistances high as .1ohms ironically, but many or most regulated VW TC mods do until some new ones I've seen. Thanks so much guys I appreciate it. the .3ohm secondary coil included vapes at 180W max I think so that could be okay for the Alien 220 or the upcoming Sigelei 214 Godzilla.
 

NickyGiaccone

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wait so 4.2V is too much? I'm reading booklets in my lap that say to stop charging at 4.2V per cell. I'm confused? I remember people telling me cuttoff voltage is in the low 3Vish range but Cutoff means when the batteries are done working well enough and need charging/swapping out?
 

NickyGiaccone

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I HAVE vaped at 240W for 45% of 3 HB4 30 amp 1500mah batteries on the Primus I can swear on that. That's all I'll use for the next 5 months Im more than certain and only with certain setups
 

NickyGiaccone

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I take that back, Daniel states it can do 300W.

That's good for me


oh okay. It can handle 240W as long as I want until it's time to swap out batteries. Probably higher wattage. Yep. Great mod.
 

r055co

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I never needed to test 300W on anything. It does 240 I'll tell you that much. But uh thanks for the input. It should do 300W for a few puffs then cease. But that's my guess. It's a different animal. Do you have one?
Nope, not into regulated Mod's any longer. I still have a few in the FDA Apocalypse stash and use my RX200 as a mobile build/wick/pulse platform and to test my builds, that's about it now days.
 

conanthewarrior

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Member For 5 Years
wait so 4.2V is too much? I'm reading booklets in my lap that say to stop charging at 4.2V per cell. I'm confused? I remember people telling me cuttoff voltage is in the low 3Vish range but Cutoff means when the batteries are done working well enough and need charging/swapping out?
Hi mate.

No, 4.2V is fine, this is the point of a fully charged 18650. As long as you are using a charger for Li-Ion type batteries it should cut off charging at 4.2V.

Cut off varies between mods, this is when the battery needs charging, for example my DNA75 which uses a single 18650 is set at 2.75V. It is best to check the datasheet of your specific battery to find out how low it can be taken. I am not sure where the Primus cuts off, but I gather it is somewhere around 3-3.2V a cell.

As has been explained, as you are using a regulated mod, the resistance does not matter, so don't calculate using Ohms laws for amp load on your batteries. @nightshard explained the maximum safe wattage, here are the calculations for you.

You are using 30A batteries with a lower capacity to a 20A battery, which means you can safely use more watts than with a 20A battery.

The calculation is (Watts used/single battery min voltage/number of batteries)/ mod efficiency.

So, if you was to use the maximum 300W, the calculation, assuming a 3.1V cutoff (this will vary from mod to mod), would be-

300/3.1/3=32.25A. Say the mod is 90% efficient, this bumps up the amp load to 35.8A, more than the 30A your battery can safely supply.

At 260W, the calculation would be-

260/3.1/3=27.95A. Then factor in 90% efficiency again, and your amp load is 31.06A. If your mod cuts off at a higher voltage, the amp load will be lower, with a regulated device amp load is highest at the minimum input voltage, opposite to a mech where amp load is highest at full charge.
 

nightshard

It's VG/PG not PG/VG
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wait so 4.2V is too much? I'm reading booklets in my lap that say to stop charging at 4.2V per cell. I'm confused? I remember people telling me cuttoff voltage is in the low 3Vish range but Cutoff means when the batteries are done working well enough and need charging/swapping out?
Cutoff means nim value not max.
Your mod or external charger will not charge the batteries above 4.2V and your mod will not discharge them below the cutoff value.
 

IMFire3605

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So I'll be using my Koopor Primus, which is great-a triple 18650-and I'm okay with it until it breaks since it works well, but I have a safety concern. If I put 3 LG HB6 (pink) 18650's, and use a Horizon Arctic V12 .1ohm 12xClapton coil at 220W or possible higher, Ohm's law states that 30amps...even at 4.2V per each battery in series, isn't enough for that kinda vaping. The calc says 43.4 amps or something similar. If the youtube testers and people who recommended it to me haven't had issues (and those people likely didn't use LG HB6's because many don't know it's the most powerful cell for the short 1500mAH it has, but...) would I be okay? I'll probably prefer the .3ohm coil which is the other clapton option but still it's about 190-200W. I don't think triple batteries helps with this issue only perhaps a tiny bit longer battery time? I'm worried because I'm sticking to the Cleito 120 and Arctic V8 Dual Klapton (V2-series of coils) which is .2ohms but not to be used at wattages higher than 140W. I eventually want to get this Arctic V12 since I love the brand and that line of products (arctic). I cloud chase without nicotine these days because I can't help but crave a small corona Rocky Patel cigar a few times daily as well and I chain vape while I'm busy indoors so this is a hobby that became serious part of my life as of this month and I wanna be safe. Help? I use the Sigelei J150 2-cell Lipo 2000mAH 35amp beast of a small thing but it's not gonna cut it since it's definitely a 150W 35amp vaporizer but I just don't wanna be trapped and not move on to the cloud chaser's new generation. Thanks in advance.

The LG HB6 is the strongest battery on the market and coolest running battery at high amp load, nothing out does its 30amp Continuous Discharge of 30 amps, anything above that is actually a short pulse discharge rating which can be dangerous, you don't know if the pulse 1/2 second or 3 seconds, nor the rest time to recover to do that pulse again under passive cooling conditions, ambient air, which we use, if they are liquid, cryo, or a cooling fan active cooling would be a different issue then. Regulated mods use a different formula of Ohm's Law using watts/lowest battery level before shutoff. Remember that regulated mods when voltage needed is above what is being supplied, pull extra amps from the battery, direct it through a "Boost" circuit that converts them to volts and sends the boost into the actual voltage signal to the coils. This gets more and more seen as the voltage of the batteries lowers, so higher amps are pulled the closer to battery shutoff you get, completely opposite of a Mechanical where the highest amps are pulled at fresh battery charge.

Most regulated mods the cutoff voltage for each battery is at a range of 3.0 to 3.6v depending upon how it is programmed, and on average at 3.0v cutoff the wattage ranges for batteries fall as so, 60watts/3v=20amps, 75watts/3v=25amps, 90watts/3v=30amps (your LG HB6's woudl be 90watts per cell safely at 3v).

These super fancy high powered mods like the Primus rating 300watts are dangerous if you are not paying attention, can it reach these wattages, yes, reach them safely, yes, but the operator needs to be paying attention constantly.

The basic formula is very simple algebra
(Your Watts)/Lowest Battery Charge Before Cutoff)/Mod Chipset Efficiency=Maximum Amps you will pull

Watts setting is pretty simple, you are wanting to know if the mod can do its max 300watts and for how long
Amps we know, you are using 30amp batteries
We are calculating for a triple series mod, so voltage of single battery X 3, giving us a range of 9.0v to 12.6v range (3.0x3, to 4.2x3 volts)
Mod Chipset efficiency, the circuits pull power to function, most this range is for a cheaper chipset about 90% where and Evolve DNA board has about a 98% efficiency, I don't know the chipset on the Primus so I'll take the lowest rating to play it safe, that is 90%

(300watts/Lowest Volts)/90%=30amps

300watts/9.0=33.3333333/.9=37.037amps <- Not going to work
300watts/9.6=31.25/.9=34.7222222amp <- Again not going to work safely
300watts/10.2=29.4117647/.9=32.6197386amps <- Still not safe enough
300watts/10.5=28.5714286/.9=31.7460317 <- Still not safe enough
300watss/10.8=27.7777777/.9=30.8641975 <- Getting closer
300watts/11.1=27.0270270/.9=30.0300300 amps <- Target Zone, 11.1volts which is about 3.7volts per battery on their charge, right at their median rated charge printed on their label, most mods display this at about their half charge level

So can the Primus do 300watts? Yes, in a very narrow, very short charge range 11.1v lowest charge up to 12.6 highest charge.
Is the customer/end user going to be happy with such a narrow range? No.
Is the mod safe for general user? No, just like a person driving a car with a license, the person needs to be paying attention and know the limitations of the equipment they operate.
Would you constantly drive a Ferrari at 200+ MPH? No, for one it is not safe because everyone else is not doing 200+ MPH. Not to mention the Ferrari is not going to last pushing it to its limits everytime, eventually you will blow the motor. Mods are not much different from the Ferrari, more along the lines of a high end gaming computer, push circuits to their limits they heat up, that heat if you can not control it will seperate and break down the circuit boards, eventually you'll destroy it. Just something to think about ;)
 

NickyGiaccone

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Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
wait why must I pay attention again? lol just because of low voltage levels prevent safe very high wattage vaping safely? I know that which is why I have so many darn sets of 30 amp LG HB4 mustards and HB6 pinkies. 25 amp Sony VTC5As are the ones I use now because If I buy the .3ohm coil for Arctic V12, the most wattage it'll need is 160W. There's also a Joytech ORNATE Competition Sub-ohm tank that can reach 230W or 260W with a very impressive .15ohm "MGS" (some exclusive coil type from Joytech probably a way to acknowledge the uniqueness of the tank, if I recall correctly. But there's a very likely more comfortable vapor temp and less of a liquid guzzler coil made as the 2nd option and it's a 200W max recommended and "MGS" SS316S .15ohm wattage mode cloud blaster.
 

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