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First commercial sale?

PuffPuffPass

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I've had two request for a recipe or juice purchase this month so far. Both from B&M.

If you had to sell a recipe. How much would you sell it for? I'm thinking a high number, knowing that once it's out there, it's gone forever.

But just the juice. Meh, I have no real interest in becoming a vendor.

Your input please.
 

martnargh

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Recipes would be something like thousands of dollars.
Figure something like cuttwoods unicorn milk, how much have they made on that juice alone in profits? Millions? Probably.
Good recipes shouldnt be cheap.

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AnthonyLouis

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I've had two request for a recipe or juice purchase this month so far. Both from B&M.

If you had to sell a recipe. How much would you sell it for? I'm thinking a high number, knowing that once it's out there, it's gone forever.

But just the juice. Meh, I have no real interest in becoming a vendor.

Your input please.
I'm currently in talks with a few shops where I was in the same position as you. Long story short, I wouldn't just sell the recipe. I'm currently producing the flavor line on my own and just selling it in bulk. If you only have one recipe they want, this shouldn't be to time consuming to do..

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James

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well now , I would sugest asking HIC . Or just contract a bulk juice maker to supply the shop with your blend . Under your label .
 

Sir2fyablyNutz

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Just mix up a large batch of the flavorings... sell this quantity (as a 1 flavor recipe) to them (I would at least double your costs) with instructions to shake/mix and put in recipes at X percent. They have all the leg work, less risk on their end, and you make a few dollars for about an hours work (if that). Think how much you can make of the recipe (precombined flavors) with buying 120 ml bottles of flavoring. This would be easy money, little risk.
 

PuffPuffPass

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Just mix up a large batch of the flavorings... sell this quantity (as a 1 flavor recipe) to them (I would at least double your costs) with instructions to shake/mix and put in recipes at X percent. They have all the leg work, less risk on their end, and you make a few dollars for about an hours work (if that). Think how much you can make of the recipe (precombined flavors) with buying 120 ml bottles of flavoring. This would be easy money, little risk.

This is what I'm leaning toward. It allows me to make a few $. And allows them to do the same.

I've sold just over 5 liter in the past month, to one B&M. I really don't have the time to deal with it. And providing a base for them to work with, would be much better.
 

MikeSully

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I know someone who made a deal for 2 dollars on every 30ml sold. He required access to the online inventory system to monitor sales, and meets monthly or so to settle up. He is 1099 for taxes and is on payroll. The vendor lowered prices and renegotiated for 1.50 per 30.
 

PuffPuffPass

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I know someone who made a deal for 2 dollars on every 30ml sold. He required access to the online inventory system to monitor sales, and meets monthly or so to settle up. He is 1099 for taxes and is on payroll. The vendor lowered prices and renegotiated for 1.50 per 30.

Haha Just nope. I won't be producing squat for less than $3 per 30mil. And that will be a bulk price. I won't nickel and dime myself for no one.

I have a job, and don't need the money
 

Chrispdx

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Member For 4 Years
Hmmm. This is a tough one, if it's connected to your name, for quality purposes it may be better to supply the juice mixed yourself without the nic.

However, without the industrial tools managing consistent "perfect" results gets tougher the more you mix at one time. This will result in a capital investment. This also will open the door all the way to meeting and exceeding guidelines in place by your local county, city, and state too help avoid/mitigate liability down the road.

Yet having a distributor manage the process with the tools may net you results but my increase the price point for the end user. It also opens the door to those occasional one of bottles of ejuice because the kid with monkey hands bumped the wrong switch...we have all been there..:it's what push many of us into DIY....consistent perfect results (or its out darn fault for too much marshmallow).

So since you are doing this for fun, and not for money as the top priority...I would recommend making the base and agreeing to supply once a month. Tell the b'&'m to advertize it as the monthly special delivery. Charge a fair price (or whatever price) but make it known as a craft juice only delivered once a month.

There are tons of other options. But those require more work.

Please note the above is random brief brain storm typed on my phone. Done "tinking " a'boot business. I could go for hours, but that's my day job.
 

AnthonyLouis

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@MikeSully that's HORRIBLE. The deal I'm working out isn't FANTASTIC, but it's definitely worth the extra scratch in my pocket. 50x 30ml at a time - $6.50-$7.50 per 30ml - 30ml Glass Droppers. Working on the design for my labels now. Mind you I only use high quality flavoring, no TFA FW.

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RonJS

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Your input please.

I'm not a lawyer (or ever played on on TV), but it seems that whenever I read a thread on the internet regarding selling commercially, the subjects of forming an LLC and getting liability insurance arise.

To me, that would be something to look into. (Especially the costs...)

Ron
---
"If it doesn't make sense, you should find for the defense."- Johnnie Cochran
 

PuffPuffPass

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@MikeSully that's HORRIBLE. The deal I'm working out isn't FANTASTIC, but it's definitely worth the extra scratch in my pocket. 50x 30ml at a time - $6.50-$7.50 per 30ml - 30ml Glass Droppers. Working on the design for my labels now. Mind you I only use high quality flavoring, no TFA FW.

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I'm still seeing $45 per 30ml bottles in B&M. They can share, cut prices, or get put out of business are my thoughts.
 

Squonk

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My thoughts. Ask them what they're thinking, come back at double, meet somewhere in the middle. It's only a good deal if all parties are happy.
 

zaroba

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I would offer to mix the concentrate in bulk and sell that to them to dilute, add nic, and resell.
 

MikeSully

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@MikeSully that's HORRIBLE. The deal I'm working out isn't FANTASTIC, but it's definitely worth the extra scratch in my pocket. 50x 30ml at a time - $6.50-$7.50 per 30ml - 30ml Glass Droppers. Working on the design for my labels now. Mind you I only use high quality flavoring, no TFA FW.

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I should clarify. He sold the recipe. He doesnt mix, buy, or do anything. It's totally passive income.
 

MikeSully

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Still a horrible deal? $1-2k per month. For doing nothing after selling the recipe. Its a royalty deal at a big B+M retailer.
 
Unless you want to manufacture for the B&M (and assume all liabilities included with that), the two options I would consider would be a licensing agreement or as a consultant.

With a licensing agreement, the B&M will pay you an amount up front for the recipe & production methods. Dollar wise it's pretty simple - % of projected sales - i.e. They project to sell 500 x 30ml bottles of your recipe per year @ $20 per = $10,000.00. Let's assume they make a 50% profit = $5,000.00. They buy the license from you for $1,000.00 per year. (This is just an example - numbers are all negotiated up front). There are plenty of sample licensing agreements on-line (Food recipe ones would fit this). No need to track sales, etc. Basically pay me up front, use it how you want; however, you can always negotiate in things like your name on the label, exclusive rights etc.

The other is they hire you as a consultant - call it a Flavor Consultant. 1,000 different ways to get paid - up front, monthly, 1099, $ per sale, or even some good ole fashioned horse trading for other premium juices, supplies, etc.

The main question you have to ask yourself is what do you want out of the deal? Do you want to become a e-juice manufacturer? Do you just want your name out there, do you want to invest the time making juice for them or is it just about the money.

I would recommend to start out with what you truly want out of the deal and go from there.
 

MikeSully

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Unless you want to manufacture for the B&M (and assume all liabilities included with that), the two options I would consider would be a licensing agreement or as a consultant.

With a licensing agreement, the B&M will pay you an amount up front for the recipe & production methods. Dollar wise it's pretty simple - % of projected sales - i.e. They project to sell 500 x 30ml bottles of your recipe per year @ $20 per = $10,000.00. Let's assume they make a 50% profit = $5,000.00. They buy the license from you for $1,000.00 per year. (This is just an example - numbers are all negotiated up front). There are plenty of sample licensing agreements on-line (Food recipe ones would fit this). No need to track sales, etc. Basically pay me up front, use it how you want; however, you can always negotiate in things like your name on the label, exclusive rights etc.

The other is they hire you as a consultant - call it a Flavor Consultant. 1,000 different ways to get paid - up front, monthly, 1099, $ per sale, or even some good ole fashioned horse trading for other premium juices, supplies, etc.

The main question you have to ask yourself is what do you want out of the deal? Do you want to become a e-juice manufacturer? Do you just want your name out there, do you want to invest the time making juice for them or is it just about the money.

I would recommend to start out with what you truly want out of the deal and go from there.
This. I forgot, cost on everything in the store and free house juice for life was part of the deal.
 

PuffPuffPass

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Unless you want to manufacture for the B&M (and assume all liabilities included with that), the two options I would consider would be a licensing agreement or as a consultant.

With a licensing agreement, the B&M will pay you an amount up front for the recipe & production methods. Dollar wise it's pretty simple - % of projected sales - i.e. They project to sell 500 x 30ml bottles of your recipe per year @ $20 per = $10,000.00. Let's assume they make a 50% profit = $5,000.00. They buy the license from you for $1,000.00 per year. (This is just an example - numbers are all negotiated up front). There are plenty of sample licensing agreements on-line (Food recipe ones would fit this). No need to track sales, etc. Basically pay me up front, use it how you want; however, you can always negotiate in things like your name on the label, exclusive rights etc.

The other is they hire you as a consultant - call it a Flavor Consultant. 1,000 different ways to get paid - up front, monthly, 1099, $ per sale, or even some good ole fashioned horse trading for other premium juices, supplies, etc.

The main question you have to ask yourself is what do you want out of the deal? Do you want to become a e-juice manufacturer? Do you just want your name out there, do you want to invest the time making juice for them or is it just about the money.

I would recommend to start out with what you truly want out of the deal and go from there.

Excellent reply. And an easy goal for me. I want no name recognition, labeling or otherwise. I just want a fair value for my product.

I don't look to get rich off any recipe I create. But having a few hundred or thousand in the bank annually, never hurt anyone.

The biggest mistake I've seen this year. Someone sent me their wholesale price list, along with expected retail pricing.
 

nameduser

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Canadian juice .
I'm in Canada, and frequent a lot of shops. I have seen 2 juices at 40 plus dollars, phillip rocke special reserve and five pawns special reserve. They only cost that much because of the aging process and quantity available. Neither are worth the money (rocke is tasty though). 25 bucks is the standard for top shelf eliquid otherwise.
 

nameduser

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Excellent reply. And an easy goal for me. I want no name recognition, labeling or otherwise. I just want a fair value for my product.

I don't look to get rich off any recipe I create. But having a few hundred or thousand in the bank annually, never hurt anyone.

The biggest mistake I've seen this year. Someone sent me their wholesale price list, along with expected retail pricing.
Care to elaborate? I think juice is overpriced, but, overhead costs money. Standard retail is 200% profit or more to do 'okay'. Not to mention, (good) vape shops put money into advocacy ( associations, lobbyists, free buses for rallies). Are those prices from a manufacturer who also distributes?
 

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