Confused about Local Shop / B&Ms in General

[Jake8fc]

Ok.. so, I'm very new to vaping and finally found what I believed to be a good B&M in the area. Excellent attitude, nice place, seems genuinely interested in helping, good e-juice, reasonably priced. However, some things still bother me, as an example: He stated he only sold clones (we were talking about Vision Spinner II's) Says he's never heard of the scratch off code nor do any of his Spinners come with one. Other little things bother me, some of the information just he provides just doesn't check out online, so while I've got no issues just going there for the e-liquid and such. I was hoping for a place where I could also get reasonable advice without needing google to double check everything. This shop just opened, the only other one in my area is known for extremely high prices.

Anybody have any guidelines as to what makes a good B&M for noobs? Am I being too critical of a new shop?

 

[InMyImage]

Nope you are trusting your gut. I found a good shop of people who helped me pick my first kit and juices but they were a bit of a drive away so it was sort of a one time visit after they spent some time on the phone talking to me as if I was in their store. There were closer shops that I could have bought from, but I had to reward their customer service.

After that, I found VU and the people here answer any questions that come up.

Welcome to the site, and take a peek at the new members area and don't be afraid to ask any questions that you have. People here will steer you right, and you'll get several bits of advice from different perspective with very little posturing.

 

[InMyImage]

Oh, and definitely pay more attention to a B&M with a good selection of juices to try for free. Tastes vary wildly and being able to taste the flavors is HUGE when starting out.

If possible use your battery or mod so you have a better idea of how it will taste with your equipment. You won't be able to use your tank, but at least you'll get a feel for the right volts and/or watts.

 

[VapedCrusader]

google the stuff he tells you right there in front of him and see if it checks out.. a lot of B&M's are used to people just taking them at their word.. call him out if you need to.. or just order stuff online like most of us do anyways.. ejuice is way cheaper online anyways - I'm always for supporting local businesses but only the ones who are honest and provide decent prices..

 

[UncleRJ]

Glad you found us.

And there is absolutly nothing wrong with well built clone. I have a few of them and they work well for me.

And actually it is a plus for the B&M you are talking about. There are some stores that sell clones as originals.

 

[Jake8fc]

Glad you found us.
And there is absolutly nothing wrong with well built clone. I have a few of them and they work well for me.
And actually it is a plus for the B&M you are talking about. There are some stores that sell clones as originals.

Actually bought a cloned spinner II online, it was advertised as an original and it's horrible .. I'm sure there are well built ones, however this was not one of them. Attempting to return it now, though I have my doubts the seller will take it back...

 

[InMyImage]

Actually bought a cloned spinner II online, it was advertised as an original and it's horrible .. I'm sure there are well built ones, however this was not one of them. Attempting to return it now, though I have my doubts the seller will take it back...

What kind of budget do you have and what are your primary goals right now?

My wife loves her Spinner II and at it's 4.8v setting it vapes pretty nice but not quite as well as my ZNA 30 at an equivlent wattage setting with an 18650 battery. Plus I can drive pretty much any tank or rebuildable that I want even if I can't push the mega wattages used by sub-ohm'ers which are the group that live for really thick vapor.

 

[Lefty]

Helpful, reasonably priced, good juice and is up front about selling only clones. I'm not sure what he might of said that didn't check out from whatever online source but the rest of it sounds pretty reasonable. If something seems off about the guy you just have to trust your gut. Googling and double checking for other viewpoints is not a bad habit to have. I hope not anyway since I do it all the time.

 

[Jake8fc]

What kind of budget do you have and what are your primary goals right now?

Actually my budget is about done.. I got a mvp 2 as my device, some tanks & spare parts.. the spinner was an impulse buy..but other than juice I think I'm about tapped.. My goal is to transition off smoking .. so far so good.. the mvp is nice because i can use it all day w/o worrying about recharging it and it's easy enough to carry around with me... down to less than a pack per day from 3+ packs a day though I'll bet those last 15 cigs a day are gonna be a pain to quit..

 

[Browncoat]

And actually it is a plus for the B&M you are talking about. There are some stores that sell clones as originals.

I agree. I have 2 (with a 3rd opening soon) dedicated B&Ms nearby, and at one of them, I had to poke and prod about some of their offerings being clones. Not that there's anything wrong with a clone, they're often just as good and cheaper, but buyers should not be confused about what they're paying for. The other shop has clearly marked which products are clones and are up front about it. This is the shop that gets my business.

There is probably more room for a local shop to make a profit on clones, so I imagine that most B&Ms sell them. When you sell "official" products, you often run into a lot of issues: price suggestions, purchasing limits/requirements, contracts, etc. Sometimes that business model doesn't jive well with a mom and pop sized store.

 

[BoomStick]

Many b&m employees and even owners are clueless. This forum is a much better source of info. I know exactly what I'm looking for before I step foot inside any of my local stores. Sometimes they have what I need at a decent price, sometimes I end up ordering online. This forum is a great tool. It helps me make informed, confident decisions about purchases instead of guessing and gambling.

 

[InMyImage]

Actually my budget is about done.. I got a mvp 2 as my device, some tanks & spare parts.. the spinner was an impulse buy..but other than juice I think I'm about tapped.. My goal is to transition off smoking .. so far so good.. the mvp is nice because i can use it all day w/o worrying about recharging it and it's easy enough to carry around with me... down to less than a pack per day from 3+ packs a day though I'll bet those last 15 cigs a day are gonna be a pain to quit..

The MVP is a good start. Especially since you can charge it and use it at the same time which is a lifesaver!

As for quitting, you may want to look for a really high nic juice, possibly even DIY to sate your nicotine addiction. Once you get off the need for the cigs, you will probably be able to start bringing down the nic level gradually because the habit will be more of a psychological activity addiction at that point and it is easy to get the exact same juices in lower nic blends which taste pretty much the same unlike moving from a regular cig to a light or worse yet, ultra light.

 

[Heather]

I don't have a brick and motor anywhere near me that has educated employees. I live in a very rural area though. I use the forum and research on line too. Most of my gear comes from the internet because I have been burnt by the B&M too many times. If its a real pinch and I am waiting on vape mail I will buy coils there but that is about it. I found that if I travel to other cities or states it is fun to check out a vape shop just to see what they have. I try new juices etc.

 

[vaperature]

Many b&m employees and even owners are clueless. This forum is a much better source of info. I know exactly what I'm looking for before I step foot inside any of my local stores. Sometimes they have what I need at a decent price, sometimes I end up ordering online. This forum is a great tool. It helps me make informed, confident decisions about purchases instead of guessing and gambling.

I agree there. I went into a B&M just to get a drip tip and I told him anything that fits a 510 tank will do and he looked at me as if he hadn't a clue what 510 meant.

 

[VH fan]

Be very cautious with B&M's you don't know well , there are a ton of them that will try to get over on you if you let them , sad but true . There are some that are very good and really try to help but those are not as common as some think.


The worst ones will try and pass off clones as legit authentic's , happens way more than you think.

 

[Galaxyrider]

Ok.. so, I'm very new to vaping and finally found what I believed to be a good B&M in the area. Excellent attitude, nice place, seems genuinely interested in helping, good e-juice, reasonably priced. However, some things still bother me, as an example: He stated he only sold clones (we were talking about Vision Spinner II's) Says he's never heard of the scratch off code nor do any of his Spinners come with one. Other little things bother me, some of the information just he provides just doesn't check out online, so while I've got no issues just going there for the e-liquid and such. I was hoping for a place where I could also get reasonable advice without needing google to double check everything. This shop just opened, the only other one in my area is known for extremely high prices.

Anybody have any guidelines as to what makes a good B&M for noobs? Am I being too critical of a new shop?

I've been vaping for almost a year, I've made dozens of mistakes, I've had dozens of disappointments, the worst, being in the hardware area.
If you have deep pockets, B&M's might be the thing. I have a very good friend that owns a B&M, but I buy very little from him, just for moneys sake. I do buy juice from him, as I haven't really gotten the hang of making it myself yet.
My biggest disappointment comes in QUALITY. My first mod was a vv (variable voltage) Lava Tube, made of plastic, but it got me started and did me well, the next was an aluminum M-16. (What a piece of junk) Don't ever buy something with an aluminum top cap. I'd do my best to warn you away from E bay, or Amazon for mods and attys... Tools, Kanthal, and things like that are ok, but finding QUALITY mods and attys are (IMHO) realative to a quality vendor, and a quality manufacturer. The first tank I ever had was made by HCigar, It was a KayFun Lite I bought it in a B&M, and he told me it was a clone. However, I've come to know HCigar as a high quality manufacturer. That Kayfun Lite, was as good, as my M-16 was bad. I learned a lot there

Some of the other Mfg. names I would say to look for, are: Tobeco, EHPro, and Infinite,. One name I have come to avoid like the plague.. is Tesla. I have bought "No Name" attys. ie. a Big Block 454, and a Plume Veil, both were great at first, but shoddy construction led then the way of the M-16.. into the trash. As I do with Mods, I do the same with attys, if a vendor tells me he doesn't know who made a particular piece, I feel like hes probably lying so as not to have to tell me the name of the cheapest supplier he can find. A reputable shop will be very open with you about this For me, its really not ALL about money, I just think if I can get a quality piece, and spend a little more for it, thats so much better than paying 1/2 the price, and having to replace it when it breaks.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to IM me.

 

[BAREFOOTJUNKER]

Pricing will always be higher in the b&m's, overhead is a bitch when owning one, why i choose currently not to. As for knowledge it is why I am here learning. I don't want to be left standing there with my pants down at a show from a question...lol Sucks when that happens.

But even for me, overhead can be pretty high. There are places I go where you need to turn a couple grand in sales just to break even. And it has to be done in 1, 2, or 3 days. I beat most B&M's in pricing, but still cant compete with the online guys. This isn't even with vape gear yet as this coming season is when I will have it at shows with me.

I think any of the B&M's will have at least one person there that has a decent knowledge of what is going on. Problem is that these places need to be staffed, and a lot of the staff just has no clue nor cares to at all. It's easy to spot them. A lot of the online places are staffed by people that are hardcore vapers, follow the trends, know the product, use the product. To those like that the business is like a hobby, they enjoy it and take pride in learning what they can. Customer service is harder over the phone then standing face to face.

Myself, any venture I do is like a hobby for me, if i don't like and believe in the product I wont deal with it. It is why I spend time here reading what all of you have to say about all the devices. I buy them for myself and play with them to better understand what is being said. A lot of them I buy from B&M's as I am working on a network of shops that carry what I sell to be able to point my customers to for parts and liquids once the show is gone.

 

[aikanae]

There's some very good b&m's in my area with knowledgable people. The issue I run into is they don't carry what I want. I'm not into building or mech's (I have them) but I like easy, simple, no brainer convience. That leaves me nothing but beginner stuff. Example, none of them carry istick or nautilus. My fav's right now. Only one (out of 11) carry provari and that's another fav of mine. They leave me (vapers like me) out.

 

[OB61887]

Sounds like your issues have been addressed already, but I like to give my opinion so yea....

I love my B&M. Here are the things I look for with a B&M:

1) If they sell clones, they let you know up front. Nothing wrong with clones as long as they don't try to pass them off as the real thing.
2) If they let you sample at least some of the juice they have. My local B&M lets you sample about 50 different flavors they have. As far as I am concerned, there is no reason not to.
3) The mark up is reasonable. I know at my local B&M a tank like that Atlantis will be $10-$15 more than I can find online. I pay that for the instant gratification and the ability to exchange it if there is a defect. I know their mechs have a much higher mark up and thus avoid buying mechs from them, but they don't hide it.
4) The most important for me is that they try to help you instead of just pushing you out with a starter kit. Frankly, I know more about vaping than everyone at my local B&M but that is because I spend a bunch of time online reading vaping stuff. You will find more information and if you look in the right places more accurate information online that at most B&M stores. I don't believe it is fair to expect them to be better informed than the internet. As long as they try to help you with what they know, I am satisfied.

With that said, I don't take anybody's word as fact, at a B&M or here. Always verify. There is no reason not to.

 

[Browncoat]

With that said, I don't take anybody's word as fact, at a B&M or here. Always verify. There is no reason not to.

Words of wisdom, right there.

In photography, we have this "guru" Ken Rockwell. He is a blogger/marketer who is the #1 search result for newbie photography advice and reviews. The only problem is, the guy is a quack. He is pretty much laughed at by everyone else in the industry who knows anything about a camera. But he has legions of hardcore fans who don't know or don't care that they're getting lame advice.

Always, always check with multiple sources. With the entire world at your fingertips, there's no reason to bank anything on a single review/opinion.

 

[Rin Vapes]

I had the same issue with the first B&M (and last) I entered. They were friendly but their items were way overpriced and never did he mention the RDA he recommended (and I purchased) was a clone. It's my mistake for making an impulse purchase and not picking up on the signs. He had mentioned the device he was vaping on was a clone he got from Fast Tech and how much he loved that site. Now I thought that was for his personal stuff, not that he got his devices/etc from there. Now, there is nothing wrong with clones (IMO) but if it is one, it should be clearly indicated. It was not. It was $6 on the FT site (same exact item) and they charged $25 for it. That's a bit of a mark up.
Anyway... the best thing to do is educate yourself. This forum and others are the best and have any information you could ever possibly need to know. YouTube can also be a good resource. The only way you can protect yourself from ignorance is to be knowledgeable enough about the topic to detect it. I mean that sincerely and not in a snide way.

Anybody have any guidelines as to what makes a good B&M for noobs? Am I being too critical of a new shop?

 

[Zamazam]

I look at this way, if a B&M shop tries to sell a new vaper a full mech rig with a dripper, I'd call them out on the forums. I've seen a young woman at a local B&M told that she has to jump in to a mech rig, with 3 $15 Vamped batteries, a Vulcan RDA clone ,a 4 bay charger, Kanthal, Cotton, and a coil jig for $250.

The young woman asked me if I thought it was a good deal and I told her no. She said she was just starting vaping and wanted a simple kit. I pointed to the Kanger EMOW kit and told her that that was a good starter kit, without all the unneeded accessories. She bought if for $55 and a couple bottles of ejuice. We traded texts and email addresses. She pack up her gear and left.

After that the store employee got really verbally abusive. He's a real asshole. I had a conversation about the employee with the Vape store owner, he owns 5 stores in the city where I live. Turns out the asshole employee is the guys son. The owner moved his kid to a shipping/receiving position on the wholesale side of the business to keep him away from customers.

Melanie, the young woman still emails me and we chat every two weeks or so. She gave her EMOW kit to her boyfriend and bought a Joyetech eCom Mega kit with the Delta atomizer, she love's it. I turned her on to Yaeliq (Israeli eliquid vendor) and she buys 10 100 ml bottles every 3 months when they are on sale (usually $10 for 100ml).

 

[aikanae]

It was a customer that sold me my first kit, not the employee (who had given me the impression they were working on comission). I ran into a vendor online (another forum) complaining about customers who acted like employess. Nothing is as simple as it seems. The customers could be picking up the slack. Look again for the source of the problem.

 

[Zamazam]

Those customers who educate and help out new vapers should be encouraged rather than vilified by the B&M's.

 

[InMyImage]

Those customers who educate and help out new vapers should be encouraged rather than vilified by the B&M's.

And the employees should pay attention so that customer's don't need to help out as much in the future

 

[OB61887]

Ideally yes, but I don't blame them if they don't know much about vaping. My local B&M has a few people that know their stuff and a few that don't. For some it is just a job that I doubt pays well.

 

[InMyImage]

Ideally yes, but I don't blame them if they don't know much about vaping. My local B&M has a few people that know their stuff and a few that don't. For some it is just a job that I doubt pays well.

That is probably true. But as a manager/business owner I expect my employees to learn.

I've fired more people for just earning a paycheck than people who didn't know anything about their job but made an effort to learn the job.

I was always upfront during their interviews by telling them that I'm more likely to fire them if they are not asking me questions or discussing their progress/issues with me than if they sit in a cubicle and punch code all day.

 

[Jake8fc]

Wow.. sorry, been busy and have not had the time to see all the great advice until now.. thank you to everyone for the helpful comments

As an update: Overall the shop is pretty good, however after some online research I will probably use them for liquid only and that even sparingly .. i do want to support them as they are a good local shop but they only offer nicotine liquid that is too low for me right now (12mg)... mainly i've been purchasing online as it's easier on the wallet and such and I can get a higher level of nicotine.

 

[MD_Boater]

Actually my budget is about done.. I got a mvp 2 as my device, some tanks & spare parts.. the spinner was an impulse buy..but other than juice I think I'm about tapped.. My goal is to transition off smoking .. so far so good.. the mvp is nice because i can use it all day w/o worrying about recharging it and it's easy enough to carry around with me... down to less than a pack per day from 3+ packs a day though I'll bet those last 15 cigs a day are gonna be a pain to quit..

That is awesome! Congratulations!

Don't worry about those last 15. They won't be too difficult to kick. I kicked them by using a simple rule. Whenever I felt like I wanted a cigarette, I made myself vape first. If, after 6 or 7 puffs I still wanted a cigarette, I would smoke it. One day, you will light a stinky and say to yourself, "These things taste like shit. I like vaping better.", and then you will just stop smoking. Don't force it, just let it happen on its own. And don't drop your nic level until after you no longer like cigarettes.