Extension request for Sept. 9 PMTA deadline

[JuicyLucy]

I think we have time, as long as it is purchased before Sept 9th. maybe?
Does anyone know?

I think we have to wait and see how it shakes out

As far as I can tell, it isn't illegal to possess for personal use or to buy - it is illegal to sell non-PMTA "stuff"

 

[Smoky Blue]

I think we have to wait and see how it shakes out

As far as I can tell, it isn't illegal to possess for personal use or to buy - it is illegal to sell non-PMTA "stuff"

I hate wait and see games. No one ever wins.

 

[The Cromwell]

I think we have time, as long as it is purchased before Sept 9th. maybe?
Does anyone know?

From reading the latest FDA doc on the subject it sounds like maybe 90 days after Sept 9 for any form of full crackdown on vaping using the Deeming regs and PMTA process.

But.... As this has been all along nothing is certain.

 

[The Cromwell]

I think we have to wait and see how it shakes out

As far as I can tell, it isn't illegal to possess for personal use or to buy - it is illegal to sell non-PMTA "stuff"

Yep not illegal to buy just to sell. But then no importing of unapproved vape stuff....

I do expect that Credit Card companies will start denying vape purchases at some point.

 

[Smoky Blue]

I think you might be right... 90 days from the pmta date.. but again.. time will tell

 

[The Cromwell]

I think you might be right... 90 days from the pmta date.. but again.. time will tell

yeah something about getting the final PMTA applications submitted before Sept 9 straightened out and making a list of those products with accepted PMTA applications that can still be sold, etc...

Of course any PMTA app submitted AFTER Sept 9 must get approval/passed BEFORE the associated product can be sold.

And this includes ALL vape products sold in the US. None meet the grandfather date of Feb 15, 2006 or 07 I can never remember which

Quite a few out there think the grandfather date is 8-8-2016, it is not.

 

[Smoky Blue]

None meet the grandfather date of Feb 15, 2006 or 07

That damn smoking everywhere... I can promise will.. but you will have to add a crap ton of flavor and deal with coffee for a fake coffee like taste.. not so yummy. SE was back in 2004

I did hear there are 7 manufactures (hardware) I think Smok is one. not sure what is listed but they have done a pmta on some things.

 

[BobsHere]

That damn smoking everywhere... I can promise will.. but you will have to add a crap ton of flavor and deal with coffee for a fake coffee like taste.. not so yummy. SE was back in 2004

I did hear there are 7 manufactures (hardware) I think Smok is one. not sure what is listed but they have done a pmta on some things.

Saw this on Reddit
(Edit, the link blew up...)
Ugh, google: pmta megathread reddit
There is a link at the top of post.

 

[The Cromwell]

That damn smoking everywhere... I can promise will.. but you will have to add a crap ton of flavor and deal with coffee for a fake coffee like taste.. not so yummy. SE was back in 2004

I did hear there are 7 manufactures (hardware) I think Smok is one. not sure what is listed but they have done a pmta on some things.

Only ones I am pretty certain of filing PMTA applications and them being accepted are some tobacco company owned vapes. Cigalikes and sealed pod systems I think.
I do not expect over 20 items tops to meet the Dept ( filing deadline.

 

[gsmit1]

Smok is a business. A smart one. They are big enough to stay on the market because their business decisions have made them that big.

Interestingly, though I have never been convinced that their products are nearly as bad nearly as often as they have been many times accused of, there's no doubt that they have upped their game about the last year and a half. Genuinely good stuff.

As far as it's possible for a big name vape outfit, they are well positioned for this disaster. Far better than anybody else. If things go their way, they may find themselves almost the only game in town. They donated a half million dollars in one shot to U.S. pro-vaping causes last fall without even missing it at all.

If they were to maintain, or even further improve their products, I would be happy to see them prosper and go on providing equipment to help people get off the tobacco.

If on the other hand, they were to use this position to cut production costs and let quality slip, because they can, that would be an enormous bummer.

We'll have to see what happens with all this.

 

[The Cromwell]

There is a reason for the invasion of the sealed pod systems lately...
PMTA.

 

[gsmit1]

There is a reason for the invasion of the sealed pod systems lately...
PMTA.

Oh I agree.

If that was all there was, I would just stop vaping. What a boring waste of my time.

 

[Smoky Blue]

Only ones I am pretty certain of filing PMTA applications and them being accepted are some tobacco company owned vapes. Cigalikes and sealed pod systems I think.
I do not expect over 20 items tops to meet the Dept ( filing deadline.

Smoking everywhere was the first "big" cigalike that hit Florida in 2004... I do not know if they will file or have filed.. but only company I know of, before the grandfather date.

Oh I agree.

If that was all there was, I would just stop vaping. What a boring waste of my time.

I can say even "some" closed systems can be reopened. What you get tho is limited use of the unit.. and putting good juice on top of bad, in most cases. There is always a way to "jail break"...

 

[The Cromwell]

Smoking everywhere was the first "big" cigalike that hit Florida in 2004... I do not know if they will file or have filed.. but only company I know of, before the grandfather date.

if before grandfather date must be still exactly the same with no modifications to be exempt from PMTA. From all I have read only 2 devices met the date and both were pithy and have not been made in over 10 years.

 

[Smoky Blue]

if before grandfather date must be still exactly the same with no modifications to be exempt from PMTA. From all I have read only 2 devices met the date and both were pithy and have not been made in over 10 years.

You are right on that too.. Only time will tell.. let's see what is left after they are finished with us..
but first.. a cloud before bed..

 

[JuicyLucy]

Interesting thread started by @Countrypami PMTA Shop Closures

 

[BobsHere]

Interesting thread started by @Countrypami PMTA Shop Closures

Watching that one. @Countrypami are you doing a Labor Day sales thread ?

 

[Countrypami]

Watching that one. @Countrypami are you doing a Labor Day sales thread ?

No, sorry I am not.

 

[BobsHere]

No, sorry I am not.

You're still my favorite link ninja..

 

[JuicyLucy]

No, sorry I am not.

You're still my favorite link ninja..

Am supposing because the sales are diddly and weak at best

Anyone who waited till Labor Day Weekend to apocalypse shop is kinda SOL

 

[Smoky Blue]

Yeps, noticed that too.. ooopsie!!

 

[Countrypami]

Am supposing because the sales are diddly and weak at best

Anyone who waited till Labor Day Weekend to apocalypse shop is kinda SOL

Exactly! I did some major shopping about a month or two ago, and in the last few days I've placed about 4-5 more orders from my fav juice vendors.

... I've only seen a handful of sales and they were the BT shops. Not enough to make it worth the hassle. In past years I have 150+ sales come through my box... this year... maybe 20.

 

[ProlineVaper]

Got this from one of the online sources I follow today...

Big Tobacco Is About to Dominate the E-Cig Industry | The Motley Fool

The clock is ticking down for e-cig makers to submit premarket applications to the FDA for approval.

www.fool.com

Kind of sucks, but black market sales are going to skyrocket and we all know where that can lead. Spoke with a few suppliers today that are going to try to keep thier doors open until they are "forced" by the FDA to close them. They are dropping thier juice lines and "ENDS" devices, but keeping other products that were and are manufactured with the label "not intended for use with nicotine products". Kind of like how sellers on eBay can still sell glass pipes as novelties and how head shops can sell bongs and pipes which are intended for "tobacco use only". Makes sense, in a way, and I hope it flies! Regardless of the market, it looks like Mech Mods are going to be the future of vaping for a lot of die hard vapers when circuit boards and components start to fail.

 

[Smoky Blue]

... I've only seen a handful of sales and they were the BT shops. Not enough to make it worth the hassle. In past years I have 150+ sales come through my box... this year... maybe 20.

Same here, @Countrypami of course, with the pmta stating no selling off or clearance sales.. think I saw that somewhere...???? don't quote me, but I wonder... I really don't expect anyone to become stuck with product..

it looks like Mech Mods are going to be the future of vaping for a lot of die hard vapers when circuit boards and components start to fail.

Yeps I agree.. mechs and rebuilds.. might be better off that way, too!

 

[JuicyLucy]

Same here, @Countrypami of course, with the pmta stating no selling off or clearance sales.. think I saw that somewhere...???? don't quote me, but I wonder... I really don't expect anyone to become stuck with product..

That info was included in the letter the FDA sent to that lawyer denying the PMTA extension - they said no sell off will be allowed in one breath, but also stated it would not be possible to fully enforce all the surrounding provisions regarding PMTA right off the bat

 

[Smoky Blue]

That info was included in the letter the FDA sent to that lawyer denying the PMTA extension - they said no sell off will be allowed in one breath, but also stated it would not be possible to fully enforce all the surrounding provisions regarding PMTA right off the bat

I think that is nuts.. no one wants to be left holding the bag after all this.

 

[The Cromwell]

Just heard yet another Magic Vapor Shop commercial on the radio today. A local chain with 5-6 shops around the state.
They were going on about the new tax but not a single word about the PMTA enforcement deadline...

I am assuming there is a fairly recent state tax on vaping stuff.
But since I have not been in a vape shop for over 5 years....
And have never ordered online from any KY vape place....

 

[JuicyLucy]

Just heard yet another Magic Vapor Shop commercial on the radio today. A local chain with 5-6 shops around the state.
They were going on about the new tax but not a single word about the PMTA enforcement deadline...

I am assuming there is a fairly recent state tax on vaping stuff.
But since I have not been in a vape shop for over 5 years....
And have never ordered online from any KY vape place....

It won't affect you so fuck it

 

[JuicyLucy]

Interesting VU post by Valley Verde Vapes #880

 

[Smoky Blue]

Interesting VU post by Valley Verde Vapes #880

That reminds me, I need to make my berry cotton custard juice.. Thanks JL lol..
Can't help it..

 

[The Cromwell]

It won't affect you so fuck it

Oh that is my attitude on it fer sure.

 

[JuicyLucy]

That reminds me, I need to make my berry cotton custard juice.. Thanks JL lol..
Can't help it..

A great reiteration folks - if you don't DIY you better stock up now and learn quick

 

[Doomsday Vaper]

Just heard yet another Magic Vapor Shop commercial on the radio today. A local chain with 5-6 shops around the state.
They were going on about the new tax but not a single word about the PMTA enforcement deadline...

I am assuming there is a fairly recent state tax on vaping stuff.
But since I have not been in a vape shop for over 5 years....
And have never ordered online from any KY vape place....

Heard from several local b&m's that they are not worried about enforcement, they will continue business as usual until someone comes and boards up the windows.

 

[ProlineVaper]

Heard from several local b&m's that they are not worried about enforcement, they will continue business as usual until someone comes and boards up the windows.

I've heard the same thing from a lot of b&m shops as well. Also heard it from a few online suppliers. I think FDA needs to step back and reassess this whole PMTA bs. I think ALL vape shops, online and b&m alike, should stand as a United front and just say F*ck the FDA by just staying open for business as usual. It should be illegal for them to do what they are doing...basically creating a monopoly for billion dollar companies on any type of alternative nicotine delivery systems. Goes to show you U.S. democracy is being controlled by big corporations (tobacco and pharma in this case) and thier financial influence.

 

[Smoky Blue]

I've heard the same thing from a lot of b&m shops as well. Also heard it from a few online suppliers. I think FDA needs to step back and reassess this whole PMTA bs. I think ALL vape shops, online and b&m alike, should stand as a United front and just say F*ck the FDA by just staying open for business as usual. It should be illegal for them to do what they are doing...basically creating a monopoly for billion dollar companies on any type of alternative nicotine delivery systems. Goes to show you U.S. democracy is being controlled by big corporations (tobacco and pharma in this case) and thier financial influence.

I wonder how all those that are working for "ATF" feel on enforcing this too.. If you or someone you know works for the ATF and can speak up.. love to hear what you think

I had to go there.. yes.

 

[gsmit1]

Heard from several local b&m's that they are not worried about enforcement, they will continue business as usual until someone comes and boards up the windows.

The big local Michigan chain (Wild Bill's with 70 stores) just told me the same thing. They are also a tobacco and "alternative" outfit, but the honchos told all the stores to just carry on vape business as usual until further notice.

I was just in there a couple hours ago.

 

[Ms. Trixy]

Heard from several local b&m's that they are not worried about enforcement, they will continue business as usual until someone comes and boards up the windows.

Not to be Ms. Doom & Gloom, but isn't there a hefty fine for those that are still operating?

 

[The Cromwell]

Heard from several local b&m's that they are not worried about enforcement, they will continue business as usual until someone comes and boards up the windows.

Umm the Deeming regs has financial teeth too. Up to 1 million fines for repeat violators.

But yep I expect that many shops will try this approach.
I figure they will be gone before the first of next year though.
Unless still selling CBD and such and can stay open with alternative products.
.

 

[The Cromwell]

I figure 90 days or less after the 9th the CC companies will cut off vape purchases.
Cash only then.

 

[The Cromwell]

Puffbars distribution in the US has ended per the main man at the Puffbar company.
took place back in July?

FDA is sending letters to all flavored disposable ecig companies.

ie disposables are now included in the flavor ban that hit Juul and such.

Leads me to believe that only tobacco and menthol flavors will get FDA PMTA approval?

 

[cheepshot]

deleted, sorry, I forgot no politics...

 

[MalibuSunset]

can we still purchase hardware from fast tech? thank you

 

[The Cromwell]

can we still purchase hardware from fast tech? thank you

I think so for now. subject to change at any time though.