HELP: Fresh MTL RTA build - dry hit

[Ludovicus]

I use a VooPoo Drag X with Cthulhu Artemis MTL RTA

I'm not sure if it's a dry hit but it tastes like cotton. I use coilogy MTL Clapton coil 28/40 2.5mm 0.92 Ohm Ni80 and 50/50 e-liquid. I tried to wick it and change coils (but the same coilogy clapton coil) over 10 times. More wick, less wick, it tastes the same. I get plenty of vapor but it tastes like cotton. When I open it up to see the build it's not burnt.

When I prefire my coil (without wick and e-juice) I noticed there is some smoke coming out of the coil and it smells like what I taste when I vape it. So I tried to prefire it and dip it in water until there is no smoke. Built it again and it's still the same.

I already used 6 out of 10 of my coils. No success.

 

[5150sick]

You may want to try some regular round wire just to see if it's the coil material or something else.
i got some fake cotton bacon once and it tasted horrible.
nothing i tried could make it useable.

 

[Ludovicus]

Thanks! That is my next plan. I'm suspecting the coils since the smoke coming out of it when I prefire it smells like what I'm tasting when I vape.

You may want to try some regular round wire just to see if it's the coil material or something else.
i got some fake cotton bacon once and it tasted horrible.
nothing i tried could make it useable.

 

[Vape Fan]

Could it be that you're not dry firing/cleaning enough to get all the hotspots out?
I've noticed on the cheaper coils I sometimes use, if I let it go till the coil gets gunky they're pretty much shot because of the repeated heating it takes to clean them. Oh, I can clean them, but flavor is lost and just about not worth the effort. Your round wire will let you know.

 

[gbalkam]

Sounds like a "hot leg" or a short in the coil. Usually if the lead of the opposite coil is a bit too long and it touches the opposing coil. Which of course makes it heat and burn the cotton. Also check that the coils are evenly spaced, properly tightened and no leads are shorting.

 

[gsmit1]

Some additional thoughts. What wattage are you running it at?

Make sure you don't accidentally have it in temperature control.

 

[Ludovicus]

Could it be that you're not dry firing/cleaning enough to get all the hotspots out?
I've noticed on the cheaper coils I sometimes use, if I let it go till the coil gets gunky they're pretty much shot because of the repeated heating it takes to clean them. Oh, I can clean them, but flavor is lost and just about not worth the effort. Your round wire will let you know.

Thank you. I don't notice any hotspots. I bought a regular roundwire and managed to get 1ohm out of it. Used a different cotton that came with the packaging with the other wire I bought. No success, it still tastes like cotton

 

[Ludovicus]

Sounds like a "hot leg" or a short in the coil. Usually if the lead of the opposite coil is a bit too long and it touches the opposing coil. Which of course makes it heat and burn the cotton. Also check that the coils are evenly spaced, properly tightened and no leads are shorting.

Thanks. I cut the wires pretty close to the post making sure there is no leads. But again, I'm noob ? so I'm not sure but I follow the steps on YT vids for this RTA step by step. Anything I'm missing that can lead to shorting?

 

[Ludovicus]

Some additional thoughts. What wattage are you running it at?

Make sure you don't accidentally have it in temperature control.

12w-15w at 1ohm. I'm not sure about temparature control. Is the Drag X capable of that?

 

[Ludovicus]

I don't know why it tastes like burnt cotton, when I tear it apart to look at the deck, the cotton is pretty saturated and not burnt.

 

[gsmit1]

I don't know why it tastes like burnt cotton, when I tear it apart to look at the deck, the cotton is pretty saturated and not burnt.

How bout if you build it like you have been and post some pics from a couple different angles?

Don't throw those other coils away btw i don't think there's anything wrong with them.

 

[Ludovicus]

Sounds like a "hot leg" or a short in the coil. Usually if the lead of the opposite coil is a bit too long and it touches the opposing coil. Which of course makes it heat and burn the cotton. Also check that the coils are evenly spaced, properly tightened and no leads are shorting.

What causes hot leg?

 

[Ludovicus]

How bout if you build it like you have been and post some pics from a couple different angles?

Don't throw those other coils away btw i don't think there's anything wrong with them.

I tried to use more cotton with this build. The build before this one with little less cotton they taste the same.

 

[Ludovicus]

Here's what it looks like without wick

 

[CaFF]

Try evening that out, electricy seeks the easiest path...

https://vapingunderground.com/attachments/140999783_3701993326546204_7578079596507706933_n-jpg.176766/

Ya see that gap? Either do a contact coil, or dont...I also see nicks in the wire..

 

[CaFF]

Could it be that you're not dry firing/cleaning enough to get all the hotspots out?
I've noticed on the cheaper coils I sometimes use, if I let it go till the coil gets gunky they're pretty much shot because of the repeated heating it takes to clean them. Oh, I can clean them, but flavor is lost and just about not worth the effort. Your round wire will let you know.

Also, that smoke could just be oils or such burning off the wire. Which will not taste good.

What I do is dry burn, (if it is the appropiate wire type for that), Then take a small water-moistened brush and clean the residue off the coil, before I wick it. Or, it can may left there for you to taste.

If you want good clean wire, try https://temcoindustrial.com/product...ccessories/resistance-and-non-resistance-wire

 

[Ludovicus]

Try evening that out, electricy seeks the easiest path...

https://vapingunderground.com/attachments/140999783_3701993326546204_7578079596507706933_n-jpg.176766/

Ya see that gap? Either do a contact coil, or dont...I also see nicks in the wire..

I did this exactly while I'm waiting for a reply since I also noticed it up close when I took the picture. I cut the leads as close as I can then even out the spacing. Still, no good

Here's how it looks like now.

 

[Ludovicus]

Is it possible that this RTA is defective? Is there such a thing?

 

[CaFF]

IDK, I'm not familiar with that atty, some have quirks on how they have to be built and/or wicked.
Is your air flow open? Too much air, lotta cloud but no flavor, too little air and ya get great flavor until it burns...

It looks ok to me in your last pics though. Unless the wick is blocking airflow?

It's a balance of juice being sucked up by the wick, being vaporized off, and it being replenished before the cotton burns. AF just cools and affects your draw.

IMO, cotton usually takes a bit to break in, it will have a slight cotton taste for a bit. But it goes away.

Perfection in vaping is nearly impossible, just too many variables.

As he said, Can't assume the mod knows what it is doing....Ni80 can't be run in TC mode...but some mods auto-detect and mistake it for SS316 though and try...I'd say 12-16W in Wattage mode should do ya...can always raise later as it breaks in. I'm running a 3mm Kanthal 0.89 coil in an RTA now at 19.5W, but I had to work up to it. I also don't do MTL...more of a Restricted Direct Lung or R-DL vape.

 

[Ludovicus]

IDK, I'm not familiar with that atty, some have quirks on how they have to be built and/or wicked.
Is your air flow open? Too much air, lotta cloud but no flavor, too little air and ya get great flavor until it burns...

It looks ok to me in your last pics though. Unless the wick is blocking airflow?

It's a balance of juice being sucked up by the wick, being vaporized off, and it being replenished before the cotton burns. AF just cools and affects your draw.

IMO, cotton usually takes a bit to break in, it will have a slight cotton taste for a bit. But it goes away.

Perfection in vaping is nearly impossible, just too many variables.

As he said, Can't assume the mod knows what it is doing....Ni80 can't be run in TC mode...but some mods auto-detect and mistake it for SS316 though and try...I'd say 12-16W in Wattage mode should do ya...can always raise later as it breaks in. I'm running a 3mm Kanthal 0.89 coil in an RTA now at 19.5W, but I had to work up to it. I also don't do MTL...more of a Restricted Direct Lung or R-DL vape.

Thanks man. I am aiming to use the tightest airflow. But I tested both, no success.

When I fire it out of the tank (usually when firing it after priming) it smells weird. It smells like what I taste when I vape it. I tested 3 different cotton now and they all look pretty saturated when I open the tank. So I think it's not a cotton or wicking issue.

The coil looks okay. No smoke coming out of it now when pre-firing (with the regular round coil build). I re-wicked it now and tried to use different juice 70/30. The taste is different but it is still pretty dry. Almost no flavor and tastes like cotton. Nowhere near my Caliburn G or the stock pod of this Drag X.

AFAIK Drag X is not capable of TC mode. I'm going to let it sit and take a break. I will see later.

Man, I was so excited to try this RTA. It's only my 21st day of vaping. I quit smoking Dec 31 last year. I miss the tightness and the hit of cigarettes that's why I'm looking to have a tight MTL build.

 

[CaFF]

Thanks man. I am aiming to use the tightest airflow. But I tested both, no success.

When I fire it out of the tank (usually when firing it after priming) it smells weird. It smells like what I taste when I vape it. I tested 3 different cotton now and they all look pretty saturated when I open the tank. So I think it's not a cotton or wicking issue.

The coil looks okay. No smoke coming out of it now when pre-firing (with the regular round coil build). I re-wicked it now and tried to use different juice 70/30. The taste is different but it is still pretty dry. Almost no flavor and tastes like cotton. Nowhere near my Caliburn G or the stock pod of this Drag X.

AFAIK Drag X is not capable of TC mode. I'm going to let it sit and take a break. I will see later.

Man, I was so excited to try this RTA. It's only my 21st day of vaping. I quit smoking Dec 31 last year. I miss the tightness and the hit of cigarettes that's why I'm looking to have a tight MTL build.

Did you wash it before using it? Most Chinese gear comes with free machine oil included.

I wash EVERY new atomiser in a 50/50 solution of white vinegar and water before using it. It's non-toxic and rinses well with warm water. Let it air-dry completely before using...water and electricy = bad.

You don't have to re-build to do it, but you will need to remove the wick and re-do it afterwards. A quick burst of firing (not glowing, just until ya see a wisp of steam evaporating) , then blowing on it to cool it will dry the coil before wicking it.

 

[Ludovicus]

If it is a tank atty, did you wash it before using it? Most Chinese gear comes with free machine oil included.

I wash EVERY new atomiser in a 50/50 solution of white vinegar and water before using it. It's non-toxic and rinses well.

Really? Is that pretty common? OMG. It did come from China and I didn't wash it.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Not sure if it was mentioned or not. Some mtl attys really prefer 50:50 juice or 60:40.
Could also be that you’re using to much wick. Back in the day we used to say “less is more” when wicking tanks.

 

[CaFF]

Really? Is that pretty common? OMG. It did come from China and I didn't wash it.

Not just common, it is the norm. Smell the atty when ya unbox it, I bet it'll smell like machine oil.
Also, could be metal bits in the screw holes, etc. It's all CNC machined....with a lot of oil for lube.

I just bought a Griffin RTA that had stuff stuck in the AF and screw holes...easy to clean but would not have vaped well.

Now, oil doesn't tase like cotton though...be sure to prime the wick with a few drops of juice before filling the tank. If it gets fired before it has a chance to soak up enough juice...hot cotton taste...or burnt.

 

[Ludovicus]

Not sure if it was mentioned or not. Some mtl attys really prefer 50:50 juice or 60:40.
Could also be that you’re using to much wick. Back in the day we used to say “less is more” when wicking tanks.

That's what I thought. I read everywhere that 5/50 is good for MTL and pod use but I nearly emptied my 50/50 with dealing with this problem. ?

After wicking it over 10 times, I tried light to heavy and anywhere in between. Nothing works

 

[Ludovicus]

Not just common, it is the norm. Smell the atty when ya unbox it, I bet it'll smell like machine oil.
Also, could be metal bits in the screw holes, etc. It's all CNC machined....with a lot of oil for lube.

I just bought a Griffin RTA that had stuff stuck in the AF and screw holes...easy to clean but would not have vaped well.

Now, oil doesn't tase like cotton though...be sure to prime the wick with a few drops of juice before filling the tank. If it gets fired before it has a chance to soak up enough juice...hot cotton taste...or burnt.

Daaaaamn. After watching all the reviews and build tutorials on YT no one mentioned this? ? It always looks like they build the damn thing right after unboxing.

This might be the culprit then. Maybe not the oil but something I don't know. I'm not sure how that oil will taste like, I'm not even sure what cotton tastes like but I judge it by smell. I smell the cotton and I imagine the taste lol.

I do always prime the wick and the coil before putting the tank. After wicking so many times, I think I lost 15ml of juice on priming alone ??

 

[Vape Fan]

It does, look like a lot of wick. Thin the tails.
IK you said you've tried all wicking, but being new, have you had it leak from not enough wick in the ports? Knowing that amount is helpful since you'll want just a little more than that and not so much that it chokes it out. Wick can be wet but still not feeding properly.

Some cotton wick tastes more like cotton for longer that others. I use cotton bacon prime and for me the break in is short. Maybe you need to give your cotton taste more time to go away.

Coil placement matters, and yours looks high. I'd lower it a little.

 

[nadalama]

I agree with the "too much wick" and the need to lower the coil a bit. If air is hitting in the wrong place it will affect flavor. If you're going for tight MTL, you have very little air moving inside that tank anyway.

Also, some juices just don't do well for MTL - higher wattage brings out the flavor. I've had juices that taste great at 40W but taste like basically nothing at below 20W. Can you stand to open your air just a little and raise watts a little? Even 18 or 20W might do better than 12 to 15.

I sometimes see a little smoke and detect a bit of a smell when dry-firing a new coil. As others have said, there's junk on the wire that needs to be burned off. And yes, there can also be machine oil on atty parts. But depending on your cotton, there is going to be some break-in time needed, and the flavor should get better after the first hour or so of vaping, IF the cotton isn't burnt.

And yes, you don't need to throw those coils away unless they are damaged from being installed and tugged around. I really think you just need to get watts, wicking and placement nailed down, and make sure everything is clean.

Just thought of something....the juice you're using isn't nic salts, is it? If it is, that could be a big part of the problem. When I was experimenting with mixing with nic salts, I had to basically double the amount of flavoring in my mixes because, using the customary amount of flavorings, the juice tasted like NOTHING.

 

[Ludovicus]

UPDATE:

So I did what @CaFF said. I washed the entire RTA with 50/50 water and white vinegar. I think it now works perfectly! When I installed the coil and prefire, there is absolutely no smoke coming out of the coil! I used the first coil (the coilogy ones).

Then after wicking and priming it, I fired it outside the tank and just by the smell, I can tell that it solved my problem. When I vaped it, man, for the first time I can now taste the flavor! It wasn't flavorful as I'm expecting it to be but it got better after 20 to 30 puffs.

BIG SHOUTOUT TO @CaFF ❤ I owe you one brother.

THANKS SO MUCH TO EVERYONE WHO HELPED ?

Now off to mastering the art of wicking and trying different coils to get the best flavor I can get out of this RTA! ?

 

[CaFF]

UPDATE:

So I did what @CaFF said. I washed the entire RTA with 50/50 water and white vinegar. I think it now works perfectly! When I installed the coil and prefire, there is absolutely no smoke coming out of the coil! I used the first coil (the coilogy ones).

Then after wicking and priming it, I fired it outside the tank and just by the smell, I can tell that it solved my problem. When I vaped it, man, for the first time I can now taste the flavor! It wasn't flavorful as I'm expecting it to be but it got better after 20 to 30 puffs.

BIG SHOUTOUT TO @CaFF ❤ I owe you one brother.

THANKS SO MUCH TO EVERYONE WHO HELPED ?

Now off to mastering the art of wicking and trying different coils to get the best flavor I can get out of this RTA! ?

Awesome bro! I'm stoked we got your issue solved. ?

Yeah, a LOT of little tricks to vaping that they don't tell ya in most cases starting out. That's what we're here for.

 

[CaFF]

Not sure if it was mentioned or not. Some mtl attys really prefer 50:50 juice or 60:40.
Could also be that you’re using to much wick. Back in the day we used to say “less is more” when wicking tanks.

I agree with the "too much wick" and the need to lower the coil a bit. If air is hitting in the wrong place it will affect flavor. If you're going for tight MTL, you have very little air moving inside that tank anyway.

Agree with both of those comments, esp. for a MTL build/Atty. ?

 

[MyMagicMist]

Perfection in vaping is nearly impossible, just too many variables.

*Jack Webb* "Just the facts, m'am. Just the facts."

After watching all the reviews and build tutorials on YT no one mentioned this? ?

Nah, youtube reviewers are idiots like that. Some even vape Tide pods. It steams my broccoli because I like Tide pods. They keep vaping them I might run out.

I'm not sure how that oil will taste like, I'm not even sure what cotton tastes like but I judge it by smell. I smell the cotton and I imagine the taste lol.

Oil tastes well, oily. *grin*

Coil placement matters, and yours looks high. I'd lower it a little.

Argh, do agree. High riding coils could kill any taste from juice.

I agree with the "too much wick" and the need to lower the coil a bit.

Hm. It probably is too much wick. Not sure if they've Scottish rolled it either.

I really think you just need to get watts, wicking and placement nailed down, and make sure everything is clean.

*nodding*

Huh, well be dag gummed. I got in late, sorry.