Help with coiling for beginner

[32bitlord]

I recently had a Rose 3 TPD gifted to me so I figured it was time to brush aside my trusty Kabuki and try to learn how to build my own coils.
Unfortunately my first 2 attempts have resulted in not so great results.
At first I wanted to start close to 1.6 ohm as this was what I'd been used to with my Kabuki. I tried using 26 gauge Kanthal a1 on a 3.5 mm bit and did 10.5 wraps. After fitting the coil and testing it I got around 1.64 ohm which seemed close enough. After adjusting and pulsing it fluctuated a little but only by a couple of points, perhaps 1.67 ohm.
From there I assembled the tank and filled it but the resistance showed as 1.85 ohm which was strange. My resistance meter is spot on and accurate so I figured it must of been something that happened during wicking. For the 1.6 ohm calculation steam engine recommended a 40 watt setting but my mod will not allow me to go over 38 watts on this coil which I'm guessing is a security feature and at this wattage the coil is way to hot and burnt my lips immediately.
The coil looked perfect and had no hot spots so I'm not sure where I've gone wrong but I'm a coil beginner so I'm certain I've cocked up somewhere.
Any help is appreciated, I'm keen to learn but don't want to damage anything in the meantime.



Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

 

[HondaDavidson]

1.6ohms is to high for 26awg wire... what mod do you have can it fire 1.6ohms at that many watts... also that coil is going to be very slow to heat and cool. Will be prone to gunking and burning wicks.

Try a couple fewer wraps get to 1ohm or less with that wire.
I'm currently running 26awg SS wire at 7 wraps 0.6ohms and 20watts.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[HondaDavidson]

Have you tried modeling some build at steam-engine.org. might help guide you some....

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[32bitlord]

I'm using a Yihi SXmini Q mini.
Thanks for the advice, it's new to me so I appreciate any advice. I did use steam engine but only the coil wrapping feature which said 10.5 wraps for a 1.6ohm build. I had no idea that 26 gauge was no good at that resistance so that is something I definitely need to find some information on.


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

 

[KingPin!]

Did you check legs were tight after dry firing? This can affect resistence if not tight

Is the coil in contact with anything other than the post you have the leg attached to?

Also at that sort of resistence such a high wattage might not be needed

Mods and resistence readers do sometimes disagree but rarely buy a factor if 0.2

@AndriaD have tagged someone who regaulrly vapes with higher resistence a lower wattage hope you don't mind Andria you may be able to help on this one as well

 

[32bitlord]

Did you check legs were tight after dry firing? This can affect resistence if not tight

Is the coil in contact with anything other than the post you have the leg attached to?

Also at that sort of resistence such a high wattage might not be needed

Mods and resistence readers do sometimes disagree but rarely buy a factor if 0.2

@AndriaD have tagged someone who regaulrly vapes with higher resistence a lower wattage hope you don't mind Andria you may be able to help on this one as well

Yes I made sure the legs are secure and not in contact with anything. The Rose has no poles so it's fairly simple.


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

 

[HondaDavidson]

I'm using a Yihi SXmini Q mini.
Thanks for the advice, it's new to me so I appreciate any advice. I did use steam engine but only the coil wrapping feature which said 10.5 wraps for a 1.6ohm build. I had no idea that 26 gauge was no good at that resistance so that is something I definitely need to find some information on.


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

It can be good at the resistNce. It just results in a big coil that is going to need lots of voltage to vape..... might be ok on a series mech or regulated with high voltage outputs over 6v.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[HondaDavidson]

Could be the batteries....... If too week mod wont be able to pull enough amps to boost to the 8 or so volts you needed for 1.6 ohms at 40 watts.

 

[32bitlord]

Could be the batteries....... If too week mod wont be able to pull enough amps to boost to the 8 or so volts you needed for 1.6 ohms at 40 watts.

It's a dual battery mod and is currently showing as 7.66v but they were fitted yesterday morning so have already had a good day and a half use.
I'm gonna give your 0.6ohm build a go later and see how that goes for me.


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

 

[HondaDavidson]

It's a dual battery mod and is currently showing as 7.66v but they were fitted yesterday morning so have already had a good day and a half use.
I'm gonna give your 0.6ohm build a go later and see how that goes for me.


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

Just remember My .6ohm coil is 316L wire. With Kanthal I'd do about 1ohm or 7-8 wraps on 3-3.5mm. and run it at around 25watts. OR go smaller and twisted wire.


Yeah I dont know anything about the mod but I saw it was 2 batts... The 1.6 shouldn't be a voltage issue. and that build isn't really that big considering the output of the mod.. I originally though it was a 60watt unit.... But i see it 200watts.. which is true.. If 60 then 40watts may be over the output ability at that ohm. Or close enough to trigger protection under fire. IF 200 what is max volt output? Many of the high wattage mods are really only high wattage at less than 1ohm it seem. There are alot of series regulated mods that only output 6v max. Even a 200plus watt mod cant fire 1.6ohm at 40watt, because of the voltage limit.

 

[32bitlord]

Probably just down to a crappy build. I'm gonna try a 1ohm build tonight, about 7.5 3mm wraps at about 20-23 watts with 26 gauge KA1. That's sounds a little more suitable.


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

 

[AndriaD]

Hmm.... did you prime the wick with ejuice before assembling it all? The wicking is where I would look for the difference too. Possibly you used too much wick, and when you pulled it thru, it somewhat deformed the coil? which would take some real doing, with 26ga wire, but I guess it's possible especially if you're using rayon, which needs a LOT of wick. Check that the mounting screws are tight, naturally; it's easy for them to wiggle free, especially with wire that fat.

Speaking as a high-resistance vaper, I would never use wire that fat for resistance that high -- I'd use 29ga personally, or 28ga might suffice. I used to aim for about 1.7 ohms, which was 7 wraps of 29ga around a 3/32 drillbit. About the only thing I'd use 26ga for would be if I needed to make a coathanger from scratch, or roast some marshmallows.

There can be a good deal of variance between ohm meters and mods, but yeah, .2 ohms is a good bit; I'm thinking there probably wouldn't be more than .1 ohm variance between mods or mod and ohm meter, though more likely, .01 to .09.

Andria

Also -- if your 510 pin has a screw in it, check that it's tight too -- some attys can be disassembled by loosening that screw in the 510, which will allow the mounting block to wiggle around, drastically affecting resistance.

 

[32bitlord]

Hmm.... did you prime the wick with ejuice before assembling it all? The wicking is where I would look for the difference too. Possibly you used too much wick, and when you pulled it thru, it somewhat deformed the coil? which would take some real doing, with 26ga wire, but I guess it's possible especially if you're using rayon, which needs a LOT of wick. Check that the mounting screws are tight, naturally; it's easy for them to wiggle free, especially with wire that fat.

Speaking as a high-resistance vaper, I would never use wire that fat for resistance that high -- I'd use 29ga personally, or 28ga might suffice. I used to aim for about 1.7 ohms, which was 7 wraps of 29ga around a 3/32 drillbit. About the only thing I'd use 26ga for would be if I needed to make a coathanger from scratch, or roast some marshmallows.

There can be a good deal of variance between ohm meters and mods, but yeah, .2 ohms is a good bit; I'm thinking there probably wouldn't be more than .1 ohm variance between mods or mod and ohm meter, though more likely, .01 to .09.

Andria

Thanks. I think this is my issue, I'm not 100% on what gauge wire to use for specific resistances. Do you know any links where I could read up on this?


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

 

[AndriaD]

Thanks. I think this is my issue, I'm not 100% on what gauge wire to use for specific resistances. Do you know any links where I could read up on this?


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

Don't know any links, no, but the thing to keep in mind is that the lower the number, the fatter the wire, and the fatter the wire (or the more wraps), the more power you will need to make it vape well. It's all about the mass of the metal being used; thicker wire, or more wraps, means more mass, so it requires more power -- which *can* mean more heat, so you'd then need more airflow, too. It's a balancing act: metal mass/power/airflow.

First consider how tight or loose a draw you want, because higher heat will mean you need more air; once you nail down just how tight or loose you want the draw to be, then figure out how hot or cool you want it to be, and how long a draw you want to take -- from those preferences, you can then narrow down the best gauge wire to use to make coils that vape the way you want. Fat wire is in fashion nowadays, but that doesn't mean you have to use that, if it doesn't suit your preferred style of vaping.

The 29ga I use is rather fine gauge, so it heats very quickly, which is great since I'm a low-wattage vaper (9.5 to 10 watts), who requires a very tight draw. I've tried 28ga, which isn't a great deal thicker, but it takes too long to ramp up the heat to vaping temp, so I don't prefer it, even though it's more durable. 29ga is a little more durable than 30ga (which is what I started out with), but heats up almost as fast, so it's my preference.

Andria

 

[HondaDavidson]

Thanks. I think this is my issue, I'm not 100% on what gauge wire to use for specific resistances. Do you know any links where I could read up on this?


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

Read all you want but best way is to just buy a few gauges and experiment. Because I dont think there is an actual list of proper ohm based on wire gauge. there is what work best for each individual vaper...... That big a coil I would go a little lower ohm. so I wouldn't need as much voltage to fire. But to go lower will require different wire material and/or heavier guages. Same build you have in Stainless would be about 1/2 the ohm rate, and need less volts to fire at the same wattages. And heated resistance wont climb up to trigger upper output limits.

 

[32bitlord]

Read all you want but best way is to just buy a few gauges and experiment. Because I dont think there is an actual list of proper ohm based on wire gauge. there is what work best for each individual vaper...... That big a coil I would go a little lower ohm. so I wouldn't need as much voltage to fire. But to go lower will require different wire material and/or heavier guages. Same build you have in Stainless would be about 1/2 the ohm rate, and need less volts to fire at the same wattages. And heated resistance wont climb up to trigger upper output limits.

For the resistances I'm targeting I have the wrong gauge wire really. I knocked up a 1.2 ohm coil last night to keep me going that seems to be working well enough but I'm gonna grab some 28awg on my way home as it seems much more useful for the kind of coils I'm looking to build. I'll experiment with that and see how it goes.


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

 

[HondaDavidson]

For the resistances I'm targeting I have the wrong gauge wire really. I knocked up a 1.2 ohm coil last night to keep me going that seems to be working well enough but I'm gonna grab some 28awg on my way home as it seems much more useful for the kind of coils I'm looking to build. I'll experiment with that and see how it goes.


Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

Ok not wrong gauge.... IMO any build that vapes acceptably is a good vape. Not the gauge I might choose doesn't mean it a gauge that is not usable. That's the advantage of a regulated mod...... you can make almost any build vape.



Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[AndriaD]

Ok not wrong gauge.... IMO any build that vapes acceptably is a good vape. Not the gauge I might choose doesn't mean it a gauge that is not usable. That's the advantage of a regulated mod...... you can make almost any build vape.



Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

Maybe so, but not "vape well" -- i.e., 28ga is too thick to warm up fast enough at my low wattage. I'm not going to increase my wattage just so I can use fat wire, that would be stupid. If you use the correct gauge of wire, then finding the right wattage to suit your preferences is very easy.

Andria

 

[HondaDavidson]

Maybe so, but not "vape well" -- i.e., 28ga is too thick to warm up fast enough at my low wattage. I'm not going to increase my wattage just so I can use fat wire, that would be stupid. If you use the correct gauge of wire, then finding the right wattage to suit your preferences is very easy.

Andria

That's what I'm trying to say.. use the wire or combination or orientation of wire that gives the vape you want...

For me that mean I target builds to vape at around 15 watts. That depending on mod and mode set could actually be used from 25watts or less... 26 kanthal is just a little too heavy a wire to do that for me at above 1ohm. In the atomizer I use.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[AndriaD]

That's what I'm trying to say.. use the wire or combination or orientation of wire that gives the vape you want...

For me that mean I target builds to vape at around 15 watts. That depending on mod and mode set could actually be used from 25watts or less... 26 kanthal is just a little too heavy a wire to do that for me at above 1ohm. In the atomizer I use.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

Yeah, you wouldn't think that the MINUSCULE difference between 28ga and 29ga would really be that noticeable... but at 9.5-10 watts, the thing you notice is how much slower the 28ga is, to get to vaping temp, and using MtL draws, there's only so long a draw you can take. When the wattage is very low, any slightest difference becomes more noticeable -- which is why I prefer mods that will let me vary the wattage by .1w rather than jumps of .5w -- at 30 or 40 watts or more, you probably can't tell much diff in .1w or .2w, but at <10w, it makes a big diff!!

Andria

 

[32bitlord]

Maybe so, but not "vape well" -- i.e., 28ga is too thick to warm up fast enough at my low wattage. I'm not going to increase my wattage just so I can use fat wire, that would be stupid. If you use the correct gauge of wire, then finding the right wattage to suit your preferences is very easy.

Andria

Thanks for the replies, I've learned a lot already from this thread.
Before the Rose I used a P3 Kabuki for a couple years and got so used to it that I suppose that it what I'm trying to emulate.
The Kabuki is a tight tank but I like just a little airflow so my eyes don't bulge when I'm trying to get a hit and I don't burn my lips after only 1-2 hits. I always vaped at around 15-16.5 watts usually with a 1.4-1.6ohm coil. I got used to it and learned to love it so I suppose this is the best place to start.
My local shop had ran out of 29 gauge so I'll get some ordered for future experimentation but I grabbed some 28 gauge whilst I was there which I'm hoping should just be able to pull it off.
What do you think?
I'm definitely going to try out your low wattage build which you mentioned previously, I'm so used to pre made coils that I'm like a kid in a sweet shop with no idea where to start, lol.
Thanks again.



Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

 

[AndriaD]

Thanks for the replies, I've learned a lot already from this thread.
Before the Rose I used a P3 Kabuki for a couple years and got so used to it that I suppose that it what I'm trying to emulate.
The Kabuki is a tight tank but I like just a little airflow so my eyes don't bulge when I'm trying to get a hit and I don't burn my lips after only 1-2 hits. I always vaped at around 15-16.5 watts usually with a 1.4-1.6ohm coil. I got used to it and learned to love it so I suppose this is the best place to start.
My local shop had ran out of 29 gauge so I'll get some ordered for future experimentation but I grabbed some 28 gauge whilst I was there which I'm hoping should just be able to pull it off.
What do you think?
I'm definitely going to try out your low wattage build which you mentioned previously, I'm so used to pre made coils that I'm like a kid in a sweet shop with no idea where to start, lol.
Thanks again.



Sent from my ZX Spectrum using Tapatalk Pro

I've tried and tried to get used to an airier draw... 'bout the airiest I can tolerate AT ALL is the original Magma, just one hole, the smallest -- but I managed to tighten up even that, by inserting 13ga blunt needles in the deck airholes and cutting them off with a dremel. Now it's a bit tighter and suits me much better. Really don't understand why former smokers wanna switch to huffing, and I probably never will. I continue to want something that *feels* like a cigarette, even if the taste and form-factor is miles from a cigarette.

Andria

 

[KingPin!]

Awesome hope it works out for you bitlord the guys above gave great advice

 

[Jane808]

Hey, guys, I am looking for some solid coil， since my former purchases were always not that good, could you guys tell me which brand is better?

 

[KingPin!]

Hey, guys, I am looking for some solid coil， since my former purchases were always not that good, could you guys tell me which brand is better?

I've been using crazy wire co for past few months been pretty impressed overall for the price seems pretty decent

Best place uk is sleathvape though the only annoying thing is most of what you want is out of stock as store is so popular

This thread was started a while back great source for info

http://vapingunderground.com/threads/wire-quality-sources.310245/

 

[Jane808]

I've been using crazy wire co for past few months been pretty impressed overall for the price seems pretty decent

Best place uk is sleathvape though the only annoying thing is most of what you want is out of stock as store is so popular

This thread was started a while back great source for info

http://vapingunderground.com/threads/wire-quality-sources.310245/

Thanks! You help a lot