Here's an idea that might stifle the regularity of mass death in America...

[The Vape Crusader]

Uhh, the media doesn't tell us that. The politicians who want to take them have no problem telling us that.
Your concept of what goes on is far from reality.

People who need mental help have problems getting it. It is not affordable. People who have family members, and cops with people who need committed can't commit them for the simple fact that there's no place to commit them to since Reagan shut down the state mental hospitals. Anti-gun has proposed anyone with any mental illness be deprived of their rights no matter whether they're a threat or not and I'm pretty sure they've enacted that on some of our veterans.
You can't have a viable solution unless you know the facts of the problem. It's not that our mental health workers suck, it's the accessibility sucks for anyone who needs it. Sure if you're a rich housewife of some CEO it's great for you but not if your someone who can't hold a job and are quickly alienating everyone you know because your violent thoughts are taking over your life.

I still think you're arguing against the wrong thing, because I don't really stand against anything you've said. I agree, we have an excellent healthcare system, and very poor access to it. I won't even get into the details of that debate, because we both know them. I also agree that we have intractable politicians who want tons of guns or no guns. And as evidenced by many of the past posts, much of the public is sadly not willing to have constructive discussion about it. Just vapid platitudes and insults.

But sometimes it takes a little inspiration and blind faith to find a middle ground... Like you, I am pessimistic about congress's ability to find it, I mean heck, they have a lower approval rating than root canals. But there's a difference between pessimism and outright defeatism. I think your current stance crosses that line.

 

[HAZZA1962]

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Oh damn I've been looking for something like that! thanks you!!!

 

[pulsevape]

I don't often agree with Piers Morgan, But on this occasion!!! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-actually-good-business-bow-deviants-NRA.html

Piers Morgan is a simpering metrosexual asshole......he is a POS that earns his bread and butter by being a mouth piece for the status quo, and renforcing the idea of slavery to the elite.

 

[pulsevape]

There is a massive conspiracy to silince or ignore the role that psycotropic drugs are playing in these shootings...almost all these idiots were taking anti-depressant or similar mood altering popcorn...the number of people on these drugs in America is enormous and big Pharma is making a boatlod of money selling this shit as "medicine" it's easier to get these drugs than illegal yet harmless drugs.....
I find it revealing that the same people who get outraged by these killings horrible as they are don't find the fact that cities like Chicago, Detroit, DC have more shooting deaths than this on the average weekend...but somehow it's just considered just fine...Obama is not on the streets of Chicago holding any prayer meetings and singing amazing grace.
Of course the elite want to take guns from the citizens look around the world all goverment fear the people..no goverment wants an armed population...that is just common sense......Obama is giving guns to Mexican drug cartels,ISIS and Al-queda...and yet he wants to take them from the common citizen....and you think he does it cause he doesn't want to see the innocent die...pull your head out the fucker is resposible for more innocent deaths than all the school shooters in the history of the planet....what do you think all those drone strikes he orders do...drop confetti...

 

[HAZZA1962]

I totally agree with you!!! Which is why I prefaced my post with the word's "I don't often agree with"!!! as I said I'll never understand the need for ordinary people to own an Arsenal of Weapons!!! A handgun for personal protection, Fair enough, a couple of rifles if you go Hunting, but this young man had fourteen legally bought Firearms!!!

 

[pulsevape]

I totally agree with you!!! Which is why I prefaced my post with the word's "I don't often agree with"!!! as I said I'll never understand the need for ordinary people to own an Arsenal of Weapons!!! A handgun for personal protection, Fair enough, a couple of rifles if you go Hunting, but this young man had fourteen legally bought Firearms!!!

let's deal with reality...if you take the cities of Chicago, Detroit,DC, and New Orleans out of the mix just those four cities.....America would have the same gun homcieds per 100,000 than most european countries...it's not the guns it's the assholes using them.

 

[The Vape Crusader]

let's deal with reality...if you take the cities of Chicago, Detroit,DC, and New Orleans out of the mix just those four cities.....America would have the same gun homcieds per 100,000 than most european countries...it's not the guns it's the assholes using them.

Yes, if you cherry pick four large cities to ignore, three of which are the piss-poorest cities in the country, and blindly analyze the remaining data without any account for poverty or law enforcement funding, then the numbers look great for America!

"It's not the guns it's the assholes using them." Here we go again, bifurcating the argument, operating on the premise that there are only two possibilities in the gun debate.... either the guns are to blame, or the people using them. Frankly, that is obtuse and deconstructive. The problem is far more complex than that, possessing social, psychological, economic, and political factors. When we start realizing that, maybe progress can occur.

 

[pulsevape]

you are so full of shit it's amazing you can walk....you muddy the waters with beuracratic claptrap speak that is suppoesd to make people believe your some deep thinking brilliant fuck...when in reality your just run of mill......there is no great well thought our problems we have to anylize ...all of Americas problems have nothing to do with complexity...they all have to do with we don't have the courage to take our medicine and change our ways...whose gonna tell the american public the don't get their cake and eat it to...so we have cheezy little political hacks delikver a line of snake oil like you just did and tell everybody that yeah sure the check is in the mail and everything will be just right.......
What the fuck does blindly analyze the data mean....fact are facts...they may not be facts that fit your agenda but there they are.....we have heard the idiotic claptrap like
"The problem is far more complex than that, possessing social, psychological, economic, and political factors" since the creation of the Great Society scam of LBJ and he has accomplished nothing worse than nothing.......

The point of picking those four cities is to demonstrate that the great vast huge majority of gun owners and Americans are by nature peaceful and law abiding, and more than fit to own whatever fucking gun they want...I grew up dirt poor in a barrio, and we beat the hell out of each other occasionally , but we didn't go around shooting each other.......hell most of the shooting are over drug turff but nobody in ameriuca is going to say it because most of our political class are taking money from the cartels.

 

[The Vape Crusader]

you are so full of shit it's amazing you can walk....you muddy the waters with beuracratic claptrap speak that is suppoesd to make people believe your some deep thinking brilliant fuck...when in reality your just run of mill......there is no great well thought our problems we have to anylize ...all of Americas problems have nothing to do with complexity...they all have to do with we don't have the courage to take our medicine and change our ways...whose gonna tell the american public the don't get their cake and eat it to...so we have cheezy little political hacks delikver a line of snake oil like you just did and tell everybody that yeah sure the check is in the mail and everything will be just right.......
What the fuck does blindly analyze the data mean....fact are facts...they may not be facts that fit your agenda but there they are.....we have heard the idiotic claptrap like
"The problem is far more complex than that, possessing social, psychological, economic, and political factors" since the creation of the Great Society scam of LBJ and he has accomplished nothing worse than nothing.......

The point of picking those four cities is to demonstrate that the great vast huge majority of gun owners and Americans are by nature peaceful and law abiding, and more than fit to own whatever fucking gun they want...I grew up dirt poor in a barrio, and we beat the hell out of each other occasionally , but we didn't go around shooting each other.......hell most of the shooting are over drug turff but nobody in ameriuca is going to say it because most of our political class are taking money from the cartels.

Woah, Captain Zoloft... You call me "full of shit," and then break out into a spree of profanity-laden ad hominem nonsense about my command of the English language (thanks for the compliment). Pot call the kettle black much?

What does "blindly analyze the data" mean? Exactly what I said before. Cherry picking numbers without taking into account all the factors that cause them. Are you really going to sit there with a straight face and tell me that poverty has NOTHING to do with gun violence? That's just fucking retarded. Gun violence happens in piss poor urban slums AND whitetrash trailer parks, and everywhere in between.

It's time for your Zoloft.

 

[pulsevape]

yeah asswipe I'm gonna tell you poverty has little to do with gun violence don't pretend to lecture me about poverty...I grew up in it and the huuuuuge majority of poor don't go around killing people...in fact as I said before probablly most gun violence revolves around very very rich drug lords killing each other over turf...that's like saying that poverty caused the Mafia..no greed by rich men caused the Mafia.you're fucking retarded or you either know nothing about the poor or you are just some paternalistic twit.
I don't share your prudish anal retentive use of the english language and you trying to imply it is in some way a sign of mental abberations is simpely fucking stupid.

 

[Zamazam]

Considering the general nature of the thread and how it's degraded into a pissing match, the thread will now reside in the mudpit.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

 

[The Vape Crusader]

Considering the general nature of the thread and how it's degraded into a pissing match, the thread will now reside in the mudpit.

The general nature of the thread: Common sense, bipartisan solutions to gun violence
Pissing match: Assholes who get their panties in a bunch over gun control and completely change the frame of reference that the conversation was based on.

Thanks for shooting this in the foot, everyone. Play on words intended.

Actually, go ahead staff, lock the thread...

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Why should they do that? It was interesting.

#proudsicilian

 

[pulsevape]

The general nature of the thread: Common sense, bipartisan solutions to gun violence
Pissing match: Assholes who get their panties in a bunch over gun control and completely change the frame of reference that the conversation was based on.

Thanks for shooting this in the foot, everyone. Play on words intended.

Actually, go ahead staff, lock the thread...

are you living in reality...our goverment has just given guns to mexican drug cartels,Al-queda in Libya, and ISIS in Syria...and the same goverment tells me ...the constitutional rights of my nieghbor and I have to be taken from us because we can't be trusted.....Molon Labe.
Yeah people get their panties in a bunch when their constitutional rights are stripped....every crime the goverments have committed against their populations were"common sense" and for the "common good" there has never been a goverment that stripped their population of their rights and said to the population....."we can cause we have more guns than you "....
So tell me is the goverment gonna be as effective eliminating gun violence than they are at elimnating poverty? We have spent more money on the War on Poverty than on all our military wars combined trillions of dollars...and after 50 years and trillions of dollars we have the same levels of poverty now as we did when the war on poverty was declared. a total abject failure
One of things I really love is when people like you see a social trend or a social unraveling you mindlessly turn to the "goverment" for a solution.....why...what have they ever done right.

Look at this latest shooting...the father of this nutter goes on televison and blames the GUNs for the shooting...he doesn't take any resposiblity for the fact he left his own kid, and played almost no role in raising the kid...when we have parents that treat their responsiblity to their own childeren like they are goldfishto be flushed down the toilet, we are going to continue to have disturbed and mentaly unbalnced adults.

 

[Hypnophone]

Gunz, Gunz, Gunz.....

It's not the fault of the tool. It's fault of the crazy bastard. If someone was armed, then were not not be such a high body count.

I carry every day, all the time. ...and so do most of my friends. We're ready for some asshole to fuck up.
God bless the sheepdogs.

 

[exodus]

Be careful who you attempt to mug in my state ,70% CCW and no permit required ,we don't have many gun related problems either

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Be careful who you attempt to mug in my state ,70% CCW and no permit required ,we don't have many gun related problems either

Texas Arizona or Montana?

 

[Hypnophone]

Everyone should be armed at all times. We would have a more polite society.
It works where I live.
Carry a pistol in yer britches and a rifle in the backseat.
...don't be a pussy.

Society is breaking down. Don't be a victim. ...or a pussy.

 

[exodus]

Texas Arizona or Montana?

nope,nope & nope

 

[Hypnophone]

Be careful who you attempt to mug in my state ,70% CCW and no permit required ,we don't have many gun related problems either

Gotta be VT, AK, or AZ.

Folks think that TX is liberal with the CCW, Nope.

 

[Hypnophone]

Gotta be VT, AK, or AZ.

Folks think that TX is liberal with the CCW, Nope.

"we don't have many gun related problems either" Hmmmmmm....
See how that works? Armed citizens=less crime.
We have almost zero break-in/burglary type crime here in the woods.
We do have the "castle law" here in TX.
Everyone should be able to carry without going through the gov...

 

[HAZZA1962]

 

[pulsevape]

View attachment 30371

The American left says grabbing people's guns make us safer.....then why is Detorit with the most repressive gun control laws in America the gun murder capital of the United States

 

[John Q Public]

View attachment 30371

Well that should tell you something right there. That the problem goes well beyond guns/no guns. It's the pathos of this country now. The cheapening of life. The culture of death.
Liberals have changed the thinking and behavior in this country in a fundamental [and not good] way.

By the way...Switzerland is gun crazy at a U.S. level and their violent crime rate is extremely low.


http://world.time.com/2012/12/20/the-swiss-difference-a-gun-culture-that-works/

 

[pulsevape]

maybe one of the reason crazy people are shooting people up. From an article by ann coulter.


"Since the deinstitutionalization movement of the 1960s, civil commitment in the United States almost always requires a finding of dangerousness -- both imminent and physical -- as determined by a judge. Most of the rest of the world has more reasonable standards -- you might almost call them "common sense" -- allowing family, friends and even acquaintances to petition for involuntarily commitment, with the final decision made by doctors.

The result of our laissez-faire approach to dangerous psychotics is visible in the swarms of homeless people on our streets, crazy people in our prison populations and the prevalence of mass shootings.

According to a 2002 report by Central Institute of Mental Health for the European Union, the number of involuntarily detained mental patients, per 100,000 people, in other countries looks like this:

-- Austria, 175

-- Finland, 218

-- Germany, 175

-- Sweden, 114

-- England, 93

The absolute maximum number of mental patients per 100,000 people who could possibly be institutionalized by the state in the U.S. -- voluntarily or involuntarily -- is: 17. Yes, according to the Treatment Advocacy Center, there are a grand total of 17 psychiatric beds even available, not necessarily being used. In 1955, there were 340. "

 

[pulsevape]

Well that should tell you something right there. That the problem goes well beyond guns/no guns. It's the pathos of this country now. The cheapening of life. The culture of death.
Liberals have changed the thinking and behavior in this country in a fundamental [and not good] way.

By the way...Switzerland is gun crazy at a U.S. level and their violent crime rate is extremely low.


http://world.time.com/2012/12/20/the-swiss-difference-a-gun-culture-that-works/

I think our media has meshed violence and eroticisim together......it feeds the population on the lower levels of human conciousness.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

I like eroticism

 

[pulsevape]

I like eroticism

I do too...but I prefer black leather to gunpowder.

 

[Whiskey]

View attachment 30275

Cool , a bag for my mod collection, even places there for my juice and batteries!!

 

[jack]

Got to be kidding me ! This is in the Mud Pit ! Really ............. someone brings up health care or mental health care in the U.S. , and it ends up here !

 

[jack]

Just thought I would put this here .

 

[pulsevape]

Just thought I would put this here .

this guy offered no data to shore up his asserttionshe merely shows headlines from newspaper clippings....he also brings up mental health care and ignores the mass drugging of people with mental health issues and the violent side effects many of these psycotropic drugs as seron inhibiting drugs can have profound effects on people..suicidal thoughts,viloent outburst,psycotic episodes....and these drugs are what big Pharma, and the goverment pushes as mental health care.

 

[Myk]

I totally agree with you!!! Which is why I prefaced my post with the word's "I don't often agree with"!!! as I said I'll never understand the need for ordinary people to own an Arsenal of Weapons!!! A handgun for personal protection, Fair enough, a couple of rifles if you go Hunting, but this young man had fourteen legally bought Firearms!!!

You don't want to know how many I have if you think 14 is a lot.
Why do you need so many mods? Why do you need so many liquids? (Assuming you're an average internet vaper.)
Why do women need so many shoes? Why does anyone who collects anything need them?
I don't see the word "need" attached to anything else.
Why does anyone need more than one hammer? Or even one hammer for that matter, they can use a rock.
Just like I have at least 6 hammers for specific reasons I have a lot more than 14 guns for specific reasons.

Whenever someone starts claiming "need" it tells me they know nothing about guns other than they don't like them.
Just like with ecigs, why is it people who know nothing about them think they should have any say?

 

[pulsevape]

You don't want to know how many I have if you think 14 is a lot.
Why do you need so many mods? Why do you need so many liquids? (Assuming you're an average internet vaper.)
Why do women need so many shoes? Why does anyone who collects anything need them?
I don't see the word "need" attached to anything else.
Why does anyone need more than one hammer? Or even one hammer for that matter, they can use a rock.
Just like I have at least 6 hammers for specific reasons I have a lot more than 14 guns for specific reasons.

Whenever someone starts claiming "need" it tells me they know nothing about guns other than they don't like them.
Just like with ecigs, why is it people who know nothing about them think they should have any say?[/QUOTE

 

[jack]

this guy offered no data to shore up his asserttionshe merely shows headlines from newspaper clippings....he also brings up mental health care and ignores the mass drugging of people with mental health issues and the violent side effects many of these psycotropic drugs as seron inhibiting drugs can have profound effects on people..suicidal thoughts,viloent outburst,psycotic episodes....and these drugs are what big Pharma, and the goverment pushes as mental health care.

YES , I am with you , but it seems ( I AM NO EXPERT ) , but it seems as though mental health care in this country is like a tabo subject . Treat it with drugs and have a nice day . Oh .....and here is my bill .

 

[HAZZA1962]

Your right @Myk I don't know anything about Guns, Having never owned one or even known someone who owns one!!! I do know however that E cigs haven't caused the Deaths of Hundreds of Thousands of People!!! I also didn't know that you had to be an expert on a subject to have an opinion!!!

 

[pulsevape]

YES , I am with you , but it seems ( I AM NO EXPERT ) , but it seems as though mental health care in this country is like a tabo subject . Treat it with drugs and have a nice day . Oh .....and here is my bill .

tru dat..mental health is like health care in general...treat it with drugs, and attack anything that offers a drug free solution.

 

[pulsevape]

Your right @Myk I don't know anything about Guns, Having never owned one or even known someone who owns one!!! I do know however that E cigs haven't caused the Deaths of Hundreds of Thousands of People!!! I also didn't know that you had to be an expert on a subject to have an opinion!!!

Well, for Christsakes you don't see how ridiculous it is to offer an opinion on something you know nothing about? You don't seem very motivated to learn much about the subject other than at the most superfical level of bumpersticker rhetoric.......especailly when you are promoting the curtailing of the American peoples civil liberties.
how many traffic deaths are there a year...should we curtail cars.
knife deaths?....curtail kitchenware.
illegal aliens kill 13 americans daily in drunk driving accidents far far excedding their % in the population and yet we have a political party pushing for giving them drivers licenses.
should we outlaw fattening foods. alcohol?
I'd like to see your statistics for that "hundreds of thousands of deaths...where does that come from are we talking since thei nvention of gunpowder, does that indlude wars ...what...
from what I've read it's

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, in 2013, firearms (excluding BB and pellet guns) were used in 84,258 nonfatal injuries (26.65 per 100,000 U.S. citizens) [2] and 11,208 deaths by homicide (3.5 per 100,000),[3]21,175 by suicide with a firearm,[4] 505 deaths due to accidental discharge of a firearm,[4] and 281 deaths due to firearms-use with "undetermined intent"[5] for a total of 33,169 deaths related to firearms (excluding firearm deaths due to legal intervention). 1.3% of all deaths in the country were related to firearms


so 1.3% of all deaths and that includes suicides and accidents.....but saying "Hundereds of thousands of deaths "sounds far more scary....even though it's totally meaningless....are we talking about since the creation of America what?

 

[f1r3b1rd]

 

[HAZZA1962]

I give up, You Win!!! 33,169 is obviously an acceptable amount of needless Deaths to you!!! I also apologise for Drastically under estimating the Death toll in my Post!!!

 

[pulsevape]

I give up, You Win!!! 33,169 is obviously an acceptable amount of needless Deaths to you!!! I also apologise for Drastically under estimating the Death toll in my Post!!!

That include suicides and accidents so that is less than 1.3% of deaths and you make some fantasy induced assumptions that drug gangs are going to turn in their guns at the local red cross and trade them for spitballs....
If deaths is so important to you you may want to concern yourself with...shutting down illegal sanctuary cities..the drug trade...Obama's drone attacks...selling guns to Mexican drug cartels, arming Al-queda in Libya, arming ISIS in Syria. forgien military expeditions....talk about needless deaths......we go around providing arms to lunatics around the globe....and your concern is your nieghbors guns and his right to defend himself against people and the goverment who would rob or kill him..


There are alot of unecessary deaths and suffering in the world that our goverment actively encourages...and yet you don't find it the least bit sinister...nor do you find...that of all the things the goverment could do to prevent suffering, they spend huge amounts of time and effort to take guns from citizens, and you don't find that the least bit sinister.If they spent this much time protecting our borders murders, and rapes would drop so would drug violence.....so why focus on disarming peacefull citizens.unless disarming the citizens is your ture intent.
We leave our communities defensless against a well armed well funded narcoterrorist state on our southeren border....and focus our attention on making sure the mechanic who fixes our cars never gets his hands on a gun......does that seem logical to you.

 

[HAZZA1962]

Don't Shoot!!!

 

[Myk]

Your right @Myk I don't know anything about Guns, Having never owned one or even known someone who owns one!!! I do know however that E cigs haven't caused the Deaths of Hundreds of Thousands of People!!! I also didn't know that you had to be an expert on a subject to have an opinion!!!

How can you have an opinion if you "don't know anything"? Not knowing anything is a far cry from being an expert.

It's not so much you as it is the politicians. With politicians who don't know anything about a topic they're passing laws on you end up with laws like requiring hunters to shoot kangaroos with head shots only (head shots are high risk, high reward but people who think guns are death machines only consider the instant death not the animal with their face blown off but no mortal damage).
It's no different than politicians who don't know anything about ecigs passing regulations on them like "unflavored".

If you want to have an opinion why no learn first and form an educated opinion?
Of course that's not practical for you on guns because your politicians made it so difficult for you to legally shoot. Of course judging from your news if you wanted to be a murderer you can still get a gun for that.

 

[pulsevape]

Our goverment takes a gun puts it to the head of our people and tells them we are going to take money from you...to buy AR-15 with unlimited ammo,gernade launchers,mortars, anti tank weapons, surface to air missles,tanks,airplanes...so that a group of people half way around the world have the ability and right to overthrow and protect themselves from what they deem as a corrupt goverment that is oppressing them....but you don't have the right to have a 10 round clip......or a true vote.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Historically the first thing tyrannical governments do is disarm their citizens.
Ie: True meaning of the 2nd amendment.

 

[Myk]

Our goverment takes a gun puts it to the head of our people and tells them we are going to take money from you...to buy AR-15 with unlimited ammo,gernade launchers,mortars, anti tank weapons, surface to air missles,tanks,airplanes...so that a group of people half way around the world have the ability and right to overthrow and protect themselves from what they deem as a corrupt goverment that is oppressing them....but you don't have the right to have a 10 round clip......or a true vote.

Make that an M16 and give it to our enemies because they sort of don't like someone else who's also our enemy.
Meanwhile blowing up a hospital at the same time they're condemning private gun ownership because some crazy person murdered 10 people.

What's really scary is all the people with an uneducated opinion against guns must believe that if they had a gun sitting next to them the temptation to go out and murder random strangers would be too great for them to resist.

 

[f1r3b1rd]

Oops
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