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Molicel batteries

Rooster Cogburn

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I haven’t been paying attention to the battery scene for a little bit and wanted a definitive answer from a trusted member here because I’ve found contradictory information in my search for knowledge. Are Molicel batteries authentic, meaning not rewraps, so can be put on a level with LG, Samsung, Sony, and Sanyo? I’m just looking for an answer from a trustworthy source, VU member, so I know where to put these batteries when comparing cells. Thank you for sharing any information you have on the subject.
 

~Don~

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Member For 4 Years
I haven’t been paying attention to the battery scene for a little bit and wanted a definitive answer from a trusted member here because I’ve found contradictory information in my search for knowledge. Are Molicel batteries authentic, meaning not rewraps, so can be put on a level with LG, Samsung, Sony, and Sanyo? I’m just looking for an answer from a trustworthy source, VU member, so I know where to put these batteries when comparing cells. Thank you for sharing any information you have on the subject.
Yes

Mooch rates then very well, and the P26As are the battery in which I replaced all my Sony VTC5As and don’t regret the change.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Bigrick

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Great question. I eagerly await for a reaponse to your question. I just ordered batteries and Molicel were recommended although after the fact. I ordered Sony vct5a's and 25r's. I have no reservations buying a proven performer even if considered out dated.
 

Wb80

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I run 20700 from them. No complaints at all.
N my next bat purchase will b all molicell
 

Rooster Cogburn

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Wow that’s exactly what I was looking for. Thank you guys, I appreciate the wealth of Information y’all provided me and anyone coming across this thread. With an internet full of suspect information, VU is a shining beacon of knowledge and integrity. I knew y’all would come through for me.
 

Rhianne

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Wow, I need to get a bunch of new batteries after a year of using them, and I’ll get the Molicel’s now. Thanks!
 

bobnat

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I also am using the 18650 & 21700 almost exclusively. I like the Samsung 30 & 40Ts a lot and the Molicells are just as good. I think the 30Ts will hit a bi harder when fully charged by not by much. If all I could get were Molicells I'd be just fine.
 

Rhianne

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Looking at the chart though, it’s strange that Mooch tested 2500 and 2000 mah 18650’s. I always get the green or pink 3000 mahs.
 

gopher_byrd

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Looking at the chart though, it’s strange that Mooch tested 2500 and 2000 mah 18650’s. I always get the green or pink 3000 mahs.
That's the chart for mech's. Here's the chart for regulated mods where the Sony VT6 (green) and Samsung 30Q (pink) show up:
 

nadalama

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I have six or eight Molicel P26As now and I've been very pleased with them. In single-cell mechs I think it's too close to call between them and the Samsung 20S.
 

Carambrda

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Looking at the chart though, it’s strange that Mooch tested 2500 and 2000 mah 18650’s. I always get the green or pink 3000 mahs.
Why is it strange? Despite the fact the LG HG2 is a 3000mAh battery that is rated to 20 amps, at 20 amps continuous discharge down to 3.2V it delivered only 4.93Wh (Watt-hours) worth of energy in Mooch's test results. Whereas the Sony/Murata VTC5A delivered 5.4Wh. Granted, at 15 amps the LG HG2 delivered 5.87Wh, the Samsung 30Q delivered 6.31Wh, and the Sony/Murata VTC6 delivered 6.5Wh. But that's only at 15 amps, and, at 15 amps the Molicel P26A delivers about 7Wh. So the reality is that you'd need to stay at several amps below 15 amps, before ANY of the 3000mAh 18650s can give you more vaping time than the P26A, and that is despite the latter being only 2600mAh. How is it possible? Watch this:


That said, aside from availability and price, battery aging also plays a part in buying decisions. The slower a battery heats up internally, the slower it will age, as the main enemy when it comes to cycle life is battery temperature. Above 45 degrees Celsius is where a battery starts aging faster than what's considered to be normal aging, or aging resulting typically from normal use. What some tend to forget is that batteries also heat up more if you charge them faster, especially if the charger itself is getting a tad warm underneath the batteries charging, in which case a non negligible amout of heat gets transferred from the charger into the batteries. So charging at half an amp is better for cycle life than charging at one amp, but charging at something maybe halfway in between these two different rates is a better tradeoff between improved cycle life and faster charging, and, charging these batteries even slower than half an amp is not going to improve the cycle life by any significant amount. Now, because charging a 3000mAh battery at 750 milli-amps takes quite a bit of time, and because it is recommended to stay in range of your charger where you can see it (and awake), a lot of people prefer charging at one amp. But charging a 2600mAh battery at one amp takes less time than charging a 3000mAh battery at one amp.

Mooch ran a long test to find out if the VTC6 ages faster than the 30Q or HG2. But he forgot to take into account a few key details. For starters, the VTC6 runs at a higher voltage throughout its entire discharge cycle, thereby it causes a regulated mod to draw less amps. Drawing less amps also means getting less voltage sag, which means getting even more volts, thereby causing this decline in amp draw to be even bigger. Further, drawing less amps causes the battery to heat up slower. Granted, the VTC6 heats up slightly faster than the 30Q, if the amp draw is the same. But my point is, the amp draw is NOT the same... it is slightly lower like I just described. Finally, because the VTC6 delivers more Wh, you need to charge it less frequently, which also helps to improve the cycle life. But when Mooch ran his test to find differences in battery aging between these three different 3000mAh batteries, he pushed them to such inane high temperatures continuously, it simply wasn't representative of what happens in the real vaping world, as these temperatures completely wipe out what subtle differences in battery aging may accumulate over a long period when we vape NORMALLY. So the classical-old mantra of the 30Q aging slower than the VTC6 was just a hoax, as nobody who vapes is pushing their batteries that hard, when, if drawing that many amps, the VTC5A (and now also the P26A) will age slower AND perform better AND take less time to be charged. Yea, if the half dollar (or whatever the price gap between the 30Q and the VTC6 was back at the time when they kept burning me at the stake for knocking on the 30Q, lol...) is what forces you to eat Top Ramen for a week, it would make perfect sense to get the 30Q instead of the VTC6, at least if we can assume both of them are available to you due to where you live. It doesn't matter that the difference in performance between the 30Q and the VTC6 is very small, when you already know that you will be enjoying this difference for a very, VERY long time.

So this is why you won't get a lot of unbiased battery advice. Only the nerds are interested in which performs best, and, the nerds get ignored, if not burned at the stake, BECAUSE they are nerds... it keeps happening to me all the time, but it doesn't even bother me at all, because in the end, they're the ones who are sacrificing performance to get nothing in return, not me. :D
 

Rhianne

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Member For 1 Year
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Why is it strange? Despite the fact the LG HG2 is a 3000mAh battery that is rated to 20 amps, at 20 amps continuous discharge down to 3.2V it delivered only 4.93Wh (Watt-hours) worth of energy in Mooch's test results. Whereas the Sony/Murata VTC5A delivered 5.4Wh. Granted, at 15 amps the LG HG2 delivered 5.87Wh, the Samsung 30Q delivered 6.31Wh, and the Sony/Murata VTC6 delivered 6.5Wh. But that's only at 15 amps, and, at 15 amps the Molicel P26A delivers about 7Wh. So the reality is that you'd need to stay at several amps below 15 amps, before ANY of the 3000mAh 18650s can give you more vaping time than the P26A, and that is despite the latter being only 2600mAh. How is it possible? Watch this:


That said, aside from availability and price, battery aging also plays a part in buying decisions. The slower a battery heats up internally, the slower it will age, as the main enemy when it comes to cycle life is battery temperature. Above 45 degrees Celsius is where a battery starts aging faster than what's considered to be normal aging, or aging resulting typically from normal use. What some tend to forget is that batteries also heat up more if you charge them faster, especially if the charger itself is getting a tad warm underneath the batteries charging, in which case a non negligible amout of heat gets transferred from the charger into the batteries. So charging at half an amp is better for cycle life than charging at one amp, but charging at something maybe halfway in between these two different rates is a better tradeoff between improved cycle life and faster charging, and, charging these batteries even slower than half an amp is not going to improve the cycle life by any significant amount. Now, because charging a 3000mAh battery at 750 milli-amps takes quite a bit of time, and because it is recommended to stay in range of your charger where you can see it (and awake), a lot of people prefer charging at one amp. But charging a 2600mAh battery at one amp takes less time than charging a 3000mAh battery at one amp.

Mooch ran a long test to find out if the VTC6 ages faster than the 30Q or HG2. But he forgot to take into account a few key details. For starters, the VTC6 runs at a higher voltage throughout its entire discharge cycle, thereby it causes a regulated mod to draw less amps. Drawing less amps also means getting less voltage sag, which means getting even more volts, thereby causing this decline in amp draw to be even bigger. Further, drawing less amps causes the battery to heat up slower. Granted, the VTC6 heats up slightly faster than the 30Q, if the amp draw is the same. But my point is, the amp draw is NOT the same... it is slightly lower like I just described. Finally, because the VTC6 delivers more Wh, you need to charge it less frequently, which also helps to improve the cycle life. But when Mooch ran his test to find differences in battery aging between these three different 3000mAh batteries, he pushed them to such inane high temperatures continuously, it simply wasn't representative of what happens in the real vaping world, as these temperatures completely wipe out what subtle differences in battery aging may accumulate over a long period when we vape NORMALLY. So the classical-old mantra of the 30Q aging slower than the VTC6 was just a hoax, as nobody who vapes is pushing their batteries that hard, when, if drawing that many amps, the VTC5A (and now also the P26A) will age slower AND perform better AND take less time to be charged. Yea, if the half dollar (or whatever the price gap between the 30Q and the VTC6 was back at the time when they kept burning me at the stake for knocking on the 30Q, lol...) is what forces you to eat Top Ramen for a week, it would make perfect sense to get the 30Q instead of the VTC6, at least if we can assume both of them are available to you due to where you live. It doesn't matter that the difference in performance between the 30Q and the VTC6 is very small, when you already know that you will be enjoying this difference for a very, VERY long time.

So this is why you won't get a lot of unbiased battery advice. Only the nerds are interested in which performs best, and, the nerds get ignored, if not burned at the stake, BECAUSE they are nerds... it keeps happening to me all the time, but it doesn't even bother me at all, because in the end, they're the ones who are sacrificing performance to get nothing in return, not me. :D
I’ll check out the VT6 cells. I’d like to stock up a bit now, while companies have them. Thanks, good info.
 

Rooster Cogburn

Memento Mori
VU Donator
Gold Contributor
Member For 2 Years
ECF Refugee
Reddit Exile
VU SWAT
Why is it strange? Despite the fact the LG HG2 is a 3000mAh battery that is rated to 20 amps, at 20 amps continuous discharge down to 3.2V it delivered only 4.93Wh (Watt-hours) worth of energy in Mooch's test results. Whereas the Sony/Murata VTC5A delivered 5.4Wh. Granted, at 15 amps the LG HG2 delivered 5.87Wh, the Samsung 30Q delivered 6.31Wh, and the Sony/Murata VTC6 delivered 6.5Wh. But that's only at 15 amps, and, at 15 amps the Molicel P26A delivers about 7Wh. So the reality is that you'd need to stay at several amps below 15 amps, before ANY of the 3000mAh 18650s can give you more vaping time than the P26A, and that is despite the latter being only 2600mAh. How is it possible? Watch this:


That said, aside from availability and price, battery aging also plays a part in buying decisions. The slower a battery heats up internally, the slower it will age, as the main enemy when it comes to cycle life is battery temperature. Above 45 degrees Celsius is where a battery starts aging faster than what's considered to be normal aging, or aging resulting typically from normal use. What some tend to forget is that batteries also heat up more if you charge them faster, especially if the charger itself is getting a tad warm underneath the batteries charging, in which case a non negligible amout of heat gets transferred from the charger into the batteries. So charging at half an amp is better for cycle life than charging at one amp, but charging at something maybe halfway in between these two different rates is a better tradeoff between improved cycle life and faster charging, and, charging these batteries even slower than half an amp is not going to improve the cycle life by any significant amount. Now, because charging a 3000mAh battery at 750 milli-amps takes quite a bit of time, and because it is recommended to stay in range of your charger where you can see it (and awake), a lot of people prefer charging at one amp. But charging a 2600mAh battery at one amp takes less time than charging a 3000mAh battery at one amp.

Mooch ran a long test to find out if the VTC6 ages faster than the 30Q or HG2. But he forgot to take into account a few key details. For starters, the VTC6 runs at a higher voltage throughout its entire discharge cycle, thereby it causes a regulated mod to draw less amps. Drawing less amps also means getting less voltage sag, which means getting even more volts, thereby causing this decline in amp draw to be even bigger. Further, drawing less amps causes the battery to heat up slower. Granted, the VTC6 heats up slightly faster than the 30Q, if the amp draw is the same. But my point is, the amp draw is NOT the same... it is slightly lower like I just described. Finally, because the VTC6 delivers more Wh, you need to charge it less frequently, which also helps to improve the cycle life. But when Mooch ran his test to find differences in battery aging between these three different 3000mAh batteries, he pushed them to such inane high temperatures continuously, it simply wasn't representative of what happens in the real vaping world, as these temperatures completely wipe out what subtle differences in battery aging may accumulate over a long period when we vape NORMALLY. So the classical-old mantra of the 30Q aging slower than the VTC6 was just a hoax, as nobody who vapes is pushing their batteries that hard, when, if drawing that many amps, the VTC5A (and now also the P26A) will age slower AND perform better AND take less time to be charged. Yea, if the half dollar (or whatever the price gap between the 30Q and the VTC6 was back at the time when they kept burning me at the stake for knocking on the 30Q, lol...) is what forces you to eat Top Ramen for a week, it would make perfect sense to get the 30Q instead of the VTC6, at least if we can assume both of them are available to you due to where you live. It doesn't matter that the difference in performance between the 30Q and the VTC6 is very small, when you already know that you will be enjoying this difference for a very, VERY long time.

So this is why you won't get a lot of unbiased battery advice. Only the nerds are interested in which performs best, and, the nerds get ignored, if not burned at the stake, BECAUSE they are nerds... it keeps happening to me all the time, but it doesn't even bother me at all, because in the end, they're the ones who are sacrificing performance to get nothing in return, not me. :D
Great post, lots of concise information. Interesting information that people should read in order to get a better idea of how to treat their batteries and more importantly why...NERD:giggle:
 
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