Pure Nicotine

[Laughmore]

I think the point is that Joe Jr is going to mix pure nic whether you like it or not so sweeping it under the rug is like refusing to let your kids hear about sex.

Much better to be honest and open about it and teach Joe Jr to wear protection. Telling him his wiener will fall off or the mailman will die just isn't credible in either case and won't make anyone more safe.

Honestly I think it's outside of the scope of DIY. To get reliable info on that it won't be in a forum of hobbyists, nor would it belong there. What belongs in hobbyist forums are warnings to stay away imho.

I appreciate the spirit of DIY means doing much as independently as possible in many cases, but here the risk/reward is upside down.

 

[Smoky Blue]

Honestly I think it's outside of the scope of DIY. To get reliable info on that it won't be in a forum of hobbyists, nor would it belong there. What belongs in hobbyist forums are warnings to stay away imho.

there are 2 camps for this.. sad to say..
those in favor, and those not..

i have seen new mixers buy pure.. yes.. brand new ones.. talk about scary.
but they do.. i had one, when i first started to mix, show up at my local b&m, when i threw meets..
and tell me all about how they bought pure nic, even showed me the bottle..
and i did research.. the guy was proud he got a hold of pure nic, and wanted help in mixing it into his juice..
i had to go over it with him on the safety, and i was less than a month into vaping..
this was just a bit shy, of 2 years ago.. it happens.

hobbyist are the ones that do mess with higher nic.. because they mix so much, it is a hobby to them..
i know, i consider myself one. I am a mixer.. i play with my juice.. i design recipes, and yes, i go thru a shi-ton of juice..
it pays to put all info out, for i would hate to turn into any other place, and feel we can not talk about safety..

unless again, we aim for population control..
pure nic will screw a person up, if used wrong.
we need the facts, not keep it hushed up..
because i do not want to see anyone die over this.

 

[Laughmore]

...the guy was proud he got a hold of pure nic ...
unless again, we aim for population control..
pure nic will screw a person up, if used wrong.
we need the facts, not keep it hushed up..
because i do not want to see anyone die over this.

I think both camps would agree that we don't want anyone to die, the question is what's the best way to do that.

I'll bet he was proud of that vial, sh*t was hard to get in 2012. That boogie-man phenomenon makes the stuff appealing just because communities try to protect the public from it (and in turn, protect the community from more regulation). Just hoping that anyone buying it truly understands WTF they're doing, and that occurrences of it falling into ignorant hands is minimal.

What terrifies me is a "bro I got this" vibe... the people for whom safety is generally regarded as lame or something "other people do." They're out there...

 

[Smoky Blue]

I think both camps would agree that we don't want anyone to die, the question is what's the best way to do that.

I'll bet he was proud of that vial, sh*t was hard to get in 2012. That boogie-man phenomenon makes the stuff appealing just because communities try to protect the public from it (and in turn, protect the community from more regulation). Just hoping that anyone buying it truly understands WTF they're doing, and that occurrences of it falling into ignorant hands is minimal.

What terrifies me is a "bro I got this" vibe... the people for whom safety is generally regarded as lame or something "other people do." They're out there...

I totally agree.. and the more we can spread info on it, the safer we can keep every body..

 

[Vaperstek]

I have ordered pure nicotine from many different places this last year., Some put on the package that it is a hazardous chemical. ( as they should) and some put nothing on the box.. Time, the fact that

I think the point is that Joe Jr is going to mix pure nic whether you like it or not so sweeping it under the rug is like refusing to let your kids hear about sex.

Much better to be honest and open about it and teach Joe Jr to wear protection. Telling him his wiener will fall off or the mailman will die just isn't credible in either case and won't make anyone more safe.

Personally, I think most people will pass on the pure nic just because because of the extra work. If I didn't think it is going to be harder to get in the near future, I wouldn't bother with it at all. It just adds more work to making juice.

This is ignorance full blown. If you are not worried about the mailman dying due to handling pure nicotine then you my friend are compelling people to think that somehow sending pure nic through the mail is somehow OK... To say it is anything less than dealing with something which is as deadly or deadlier than cyanide is plain stupid.,.. I have received nicotine pure nicotine from vendors which say nothing on the box and it scares the crap out of me that they would send it like that... It is NOT EASY TO WORK WITH, IT CAUSES A HORRIBLE DEATH, AND AT THE LEAST WILL PUT YOU IN THE HOSPITAL IF MISHANDLED.

If I have misconstrued your post I apologize.. BUT PURE NICOTINE SHOULD NOT EVER BE HANDLED BY A NOVICE

 

[BigNasty]

BUT PURE NICOTINE SHOULD NOT EVER BE HANDLED BY A NOVICE

This 1000%.
I can see the shit storm with the shit troopers and the media shit buzzards circling some poor schmoe who has a leaky package of nic in a sorting center. Especially if some one dies and a whole bunch of people get sick.
EPIC shit level of the anthrax mailer level panic, federal alphabet agencies doing a federal rectal roto rooter investigation on who was getting the package.
The fall out will be UGLY, expensive and ruin the receiver of the package.
But it will be straw that broke the camel's back, new laws and regulations, and just be shitty for everyone else.

 

[Time]

I have ordered pure nicotine from many different places this last year., Some put on the package that it is a hazardous chemical. ( as they should) and some put nothing on the box.. Time, the fact that



This is ignorance full blown. If you are not worried about the mailman dying due to handling pure nicotine then you my friend are compelling people to think that somehow sending pure nic through the mail is somehow OK... To say it is anything less than dealing with something which is as deadly or deadlier than cyanide is plain stupid.,.. I have received nicotine pure nicotine from vendors which say nothing on the box and it scares the crap out of me that they would send it like that... It is NOT EASY TO WORK WITH, IT CAUSES A HORRIBLE DEATH, AND AT THE LEAST WILL PUT YOU IN THE HOSPITAL IF MISHANDLED.

If I have misconstrued your post I apologize.. BUT PURE NICOTINE SHOULD NOT EVER BE HANDLED BY A NOVICE

Wait. Let me get this right.

You ordered pure nicotine and received it through the mail. If I do it, I'm killing the mailman.

And just for the record. I do sell pure nicotine. I don't sell it to just anyone and if you do contact me to buy some, Be prepared to be "vetted" before I agree to sell to you.

If I passed your vetting, how would I get my nic?

You seem to be a good person and a great vendor. I'm not trying to bust your balls. But, your blanket statements are ill advised. I trust that if I bought pure nic from you, proper labeling and packaging would be included. As a vendor, I don't think you'd care much for blanket statements being applied against all vendors that sell nic, pure or not.

As a consumer, I can only trust that the product I buy from any vendor is packaged and sent with safety in mind. I have no control of that end. The sender is responsible. Can I vet what vendors I will use by reputation of shipping practices? You bet. I have to have that information to do so. Telling me that some packages were not properly packaged and labeled but not which ones doesn't do that. And, I'm inclined to think the post office would be more interested and better suited to address such things. They probably should be reported to the post office for shipping issues to be rectified. Telling the consumer to not buy a product based on the actions of a few is not a realistic solution and hurts the vendors that do things properly.

This why I hate fearmongering tactics. They don't solve any issues. They mostly muddy the water. The fact is, the vendors that sell pure nic have been selling pure nic. They are still in business. Getting a couple people on VU to not buy it under the guise that it will kill the mailman won't change that. I recommend lifting the taboo and openly talking about it so shipping concerns can be met on a vendor by vendor basis. For instance, I'm fairly confident that if I purchased pure nic from you, it would be properly packaged and labeled. I'd be very surprised to learn that you've never mailed pure nic.

 

[Time]

This 1000%.
I can see the shit storm with the shit troopers and the media shit buzzards circling some poor schmoe who has a leaky package of nic in a sorting center. Especially if some one dies and a whole bunch of people get sick.
EPIC shit level of the anthrax mailer level panic, federal alphabet agencies doing a federal rectal roto rooter investigation on who was getting the package.
The fall out will be UGLY, expensive and ruin the receiver of the package.
But it will be straw that broke the camel's back, new laws and regulations, and just be shitty for everyone else.

I don't think so. If a poorly packaged and unlabeled package leaked and caused illness, the sender will be the one held accountable. It makes no sense to confront the individual receiver when the vendor is sending many packages to many individuals.

 

[BigNasty]

I don't think so. If a poorly packaged and unlabeled package leaked and caused illness, the sender will be the one held accountable. It makes no sense to confront the individual receiver when the vendor is sending many packages to many individuals.

Nothing makes sense with the federal government.
They will crawl up your ass and see if you are able to safely handle and dispose of it.. and if not, they will be more than willing to crush your ass in fines.

 

[Time]

Nothing makes sense with the federal government.
They will crawl up your ass and see if you are able to safely handle and dispose of it.. and if not, they will be more than willing to crush your ass in fines.

No. It's legal to have it. It's legal to receive. Once in your possession, you become responsible for it. Packaging and labeling would fall on the packager.

Now, if something happens while it is in your possession, you would be responsible. If someone died from it while in your possession, you could be charged with a homicide. That is what people should understand. Shipping,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,not so much,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,unless you were the one that packaged it.

 

[freemind]

That a VENDOR, wants to stir fear mongering, I find it reprehensible. A vendor slinging around A LOT of what if's and making MANY assumptions.

I might suggest, that this vendor back off and stop slinging shit and the name calling. Lots of people read and don't reply. Act hostile and degrading your customers, they will find someplace else to buy supplies.

It's generally a stupid business move, to get into a heated argument.

 

[Time]

That a VENDOR, wants to stir fear mongering, I find it reprehensible. A vendor slinging around A LOT of what if's and making MANY assumptions.

I might suggest, that this vendor back off and stop slinging shit and the name calling. Lots of people read and don't reply. Act hostile and degrading your customers, they will find someplace else to buy supplies.

It's generally a stupid business move, to get into a heated argument.

I don't think he is slinging shit or name calling. I appreciate his input. I think he just misunderstands my position. It's not something to to get upset about. Not for me anyway.

 

[Smoky Blue]

what would consist of "vetting".. when i have a list like alibaba, where i can pick and choose where 999% pure nic comes from?
they wont vett.. they will just take my money and send me a package..
direct from the manufacturer.. the info to buy is out there, but the info to use is not..

trying to scare people away, i can understand those vendors that do sell diluted nic..
it cuts into business.. but if you think about it.. buying it straight, and cutting it yourself..
you have tons more.. more than you will know what to do with..
the point of this is to steer people in the right direction..
not by scare tactics..

if you use protection, in a well vented area, you can do this..
most nic cutters started this way too..

i know one vendor that cut it on his/her front porch, when he/she started out..
guess that is wrong too..

people will do the darndest things.. given an opportunity..

 

[Vaperstek]

Wait. Let me get this right.

You ordered pure nicotine and received it through the mail. If I do it, I'm killing the mailman

My nicotine does not come through the USPS, and it is properly marked and packaged correctly. There are regulations my supplier has to conform to to ship pure nicotine.

 

[Vaperstek]

And as far as scaring people away ( If that's what some think I am doing) so it wont cut into my business you are wrong.. It is about SAFETY!! Period..

 

[Smoky Blue]

my nic came thru ups.. with cool bio hazard stickers..
i still have the box etc.. when i get a chance, will be more than happy to snap some pix..

and yes there are regs, if vendors stick to them..
it is easy to report a faulty package..

 

[Smoky Blue]

i did not call out any vendors, but think on it..
if i can buy pure at a cheaper price than cut nic..
which one would one go with?

 

[Time]

My nicotine does not come through the USPS, and it is properly marked and packaged correctly. There are regulations my supplier has to conform to to ship pure nicotine.

Yes. I'm sure that your nic comes in rather large bulk containers and regulations are met.

I was referring this comment;

I have ordered pure nicotine from many different places this last year., Some put on the package that it is a hazardous chemical. ( as they should) and some put nothing on the box..

I assumed that since the topic was killing the mailman, the implication was that you received nic in the mail that was not properly marked.

You also said this;

This is ignorance full blown. If you are not worried about the mailman dying due to handling pure nicotine then you my friend are compelling people to think that somehow sending pure nic through the mail is somehow OK...

Have you ever shipped and/or received pure nic through USPS?

 

[Vaperstek]

All arguing aside.... If someone wants to work with pure nicotine, You are taking a HUGE RISK.. this is not a bottle of ammonia for cleaning underneath your sink. It is a deadly toxin.

 

[Whiskey]

Update-Post # 54

http://vapingunderground.com/threads/rather-how-not-to.49174/page-2

 

[Pauly Walnuts]

So lets say the super pure nic gets regulated. Whats stopping the regulating agency from limiting average consumers to 10 percent???
Im sure alot of panties would be in a bunch at that point.
What im saying is, dont ever think that our govt will be reasonable with us. They are not vapers, they do not care about our way of life. They are tax farmers, we are their future livestock, and they cant wait to milk us. The less nic they allow to be sold per volume, the more they can tax per volume.
Next, a tax on all pg and vg, ya know, because they are used in eliquid. This shit can go on and on, and theres no reason to believe it wont.
The little guy always gets fucked in these situations.
A couple idiots hurt themselves or others, then millions more have their freedom to choose on the chopping block.
The bigger nic companies and govt will reap the rewards of a more restricted marketplace, and keep telling us:
'ITS FOR YOUR SAFETY!!' laughing all the way to the bank.
The medium to small nic companies will go out of business.

 

[Hoekakes]

Then well all be vaping glycerin extracted from bacon fat , mmm bacon

 

[evilsorcerer1]

yes i buy 1000mg and i cut it.. i do follow safety precautions.

You said you buy 1000mg and cut it. I just want to confirm that fact before I ask what safety precautions you follow, and if you experienced any dizziness or nausea.

 

[AmandaD]

I've recently been reading about confusion between 100mg nicotine and pure nicotine with people beginning DIY.

Pure Nicotine should be broken down in laboratory like settings with a respirator, fume hood, chemical resistant gloves and gear. It is not just dangerous; the fumes alone are deadly.

Pure nicotine is as dangerous as cyanide, and purchasing it puts anyone who comes in contact with it in danger, including mail carriers and anyone who collects your mail.

fyi

 

[evilsorcerer1]

Yes, I have read some about pure nicotine dangers. But I've also heard conflicting stories. In "E-cigarettes: an evidence update A report commissioned by Public Health England" it is stated-"Where adults drank up to 1,500mg of nicotine in e-liquid, the result was vomiting and recovery within a few hours. One fatal outcome was recorded with 3,950mg of nicotine found in gastric content. The victim seems to have drunk three vials of e-liquid totaling over 10,000mg of nicotine. An intravenous injection of unknown quantity of e-liquid also resulted in death." I'm sure there are many factors that can affect the outcome of these results, such as the concentration of the nicotine. The person that drank the e-liquid that contained 1500 mg of nicotine vomited. I don't know what the factor vomiting played in survival, but if 1500 mg of pure nicotine entered into the bloodstream, I don't think vomiting would help. And I'm sure vomiting wouldn't help if nicotine fumes were inhaled. I also know that the higher estimate of 1500 mg is only 1.5 ml of pure nicotine, so yes it is extremely dangerous regardless. A mini liquor bottle contains 50 ml to give a comparison. 1 ml of nicotine takes up 1 cubic centimeter of space. Which is why I was wondering what safety precautions I should take. I was planning building something like in the pictures I attached, an airtight enclosure made from plexiglass with a ventilation hose at the top to carry the fumes far from me. I would drill two holes in the enclosure and fasten some thick chemical resistant gloves to the enclosure so I could do all the work without inhaling the fumes. I would seal it with silicone, but since the front plate would have to be removable it would have a rubber seal. I would still wear chemical resistant clothing and a mask, but I'd like to know what someone has who has already dealt with 99% nicotine has used exactly so I could eliminate much of the danger.

 

[outwest]

unless you're going to be selling to manufacturers and shops that use the 100mg base, there's no reason to be handling pure nic. Even then you could still wholesale to shops simply by buying the 100mg by the barrel (like heartland sells) and breaking it down into smaller containers for resale.

 

[evilsorcerer1]

I was thinking about doing something like that. What's the highest concentration you've personally dealt with?

 

[outwest]

I was thinking about doing something like that. What's the highest concentration you've personally dealt with?

The highest I've personally dealt with is 100mg. I have no reason to risk my life with the pure. I don't know if it's true, for I have no desire to find out the hard way, but was taught in chemistry class that one fleck of the pure powder on your skin will kill you. So, I would presume that the 1000mg in PG would have similar risks, even though it would most likely absorb more slowly than the powder.

 

[evilsorcerer1]

It's so tough to estimate which is why it would be nice to hear from someone who has dealt with it. According to Wikipedia, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_lethal_dose, the median lethal dose of nicotine in a human is 6.5–13.0 mg/kg. I estimate I weigh about 60 kg. So for myself the lower estimate would be 390 mg. I also know that 1 ml of nicotine takes up 1 cubic centimeter of space, So by that information I would have to ingest approximately 10 cubic millimeters to die which is quite a bit more than a drop. I attached a picture of what 10 mm looks like on a ruler. Of course l have no idea how much nicotine could be be inhaled from fumes.

 

[outwest]

It's so tough to estimate which is why it would be nice to hear from someone who has dealt with it. According to Wikipedia, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_lethal_dose, the median lethal dose of nicotine in a human is 6.5–13.0 mg/kg. I estimate I weigh about 60 kg. So for myself the lower estimate would be 390 mg. I also know that 1 ml of nicotine takes up 1 cubic centimeter of space, So by that information I would have to ingest approximately 10 cubic millimeters to die which is quite a bit more than a drop. I attached a picture of what 10 mm looks like on a ruler. Of course l have no idea how much nicotine could be be inhaled from fumes.

Yeah, I hear ya. And there's so much conflicting info out there. Part of it might be the difference between different people's reaction to nic. Dunno.