Same thing under intent.
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It's not intent until one can prove that that's what it is.
Mooch has his opinion however the FDA is under court order to enforce.
They do not have the option to delay enforcement for 1 year without court approval.
I expect enforcement to begin in 90 days from what the FDA has released. will it all suddenly end in 90 days? nope but enforcement will begin and continue.
enforcement has already happened with puff bars.
Mooch is the great vape battery god and I honor him for that.
Mooch is one of my fav vape related Youtube types.
Kind of a kindred spirit with my being an electronics tech. I actually understand all he says excpet for some of the internal chemical battery processes. But on batteries I take his word as gospel.
Overall on the Deeming Regs no so much.
However we all have our opinions.
They do not have the option to delay enforcement for 1 year without court approval.
I expect enforcement to begin in 90 days from what the FDA has released. will it all suddenly end in 90 days? nope but enforcement will begin and continue.
enforcement has already happened with puff bars.
Mooch is the great vape battery god and I honor him for that.
Mooch is one of my fav vape related Youtube types.
Kind of a kindred spirit with my being an electronics tech. I actually understand all he says excpet for some of the internal chemical battery processes. But on batteries I take his word as gospel.
Overall on the Deeming Regs no so much.
However we all have our opinions.
well, add another to the list:
https://www.ahlusion.us/blog/important-update-regarding-ahlusion-llc.html
Interesting, he says "hope to see you on the flavoring side!"
https://www.ahlusion.us/blog/important-update-regarding-ahlusion-llc.html
Interesting, he says "hope to see you on the flavoring side!"
"In the letter, the FDA acknowledges something that many trade associations and cigar industry advocates have argued since the Deeming Rule was first introduced–the FDA currently lacks the manpower and resources to effectively handle the influx of Premarket Tobacco Product Applications (PMTA) and enforcement."
Source: https://tobaccobusiness.com/fda-reevaluating-premium-cigar-regulation-and-substantial-equivalence/
Hence the point I was making previously in the thread in my replies to @The Cromwell about proving intent.
Countrypami
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We're working hard to submit all required documents to the FDA to be able to continue serving you. We've been at this for over 9 years, and we don't plan on going anywhere anytime soon. Below, please find a link to a survey. All responses will be sent to the FDA with our applications. The survey only takes about one minute to complete, but it would be tremendously helpful if you would fill it out. 
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LiteCigUSA.net closed back in March. They said it was due to the fact that he 40% PA Vapor tax making them barely profitable and COVID19 mandatory closures pu tthe nail in the coffin. But I suspect they woul dhave closed down due to PMTA anyhow. They've bee around a LOOOOOOOONG time.
IMHO, Eleaf, Joyetech and Wismec US stores be added o the list because they did close their USA shops, which was more convenient for Americans than ordering from their global shops. JMHO. Perhaps put a note next to it that the global stores are open.
On that note, Kangertech closed their USA store too. Kangertechus.com
On that note, Kangertech closed their USA store too. Kangertechus.com
Used to order from them way back in my 808 days.
Countrypami
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Vapro Supply .. site is blank 
Hmm companies have taken the intent thing seriously.
Lightning vapes changed their name and so did Bull City Vapors for this reason.
Lightning vapes changed their name and so did Bull City Vapors for this reason.
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US stores...
Countrypami
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Oh yeah, I've been seeing a lot of name changes.
A lot of the shops still open will give you something like this when you try to order:
Due to recent Government Restriction, items on this order are unable to ship to the USA.
I actually got that msg from Halo with only a blanket in my cart. Won't let me checkout.
Guess you need a PMTA for fleece blankets too.
Due to recent Government Restriction, items on this order are unable to ship to the USA.
I actually got that msg from Halo with only a blanket in my cart. Won't let me checkout.
Guess you need a PMTA for fleece blankets too.
But fleece wicking works so well with mesh?A lot of the shops still open will give you something like this when you try to order:
Due to recent Government Restriction, items on this order are unable to ship to the USA.
I actually got that msg from Halo with only a blanket in my cart. Won't let me checkout.
Guess you need a PMTA for fleece blankets too.
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May depend on what state is shipping to?A lot of the shops still open will give you something like this when you try to order:
Due to recent Government Restriction, items on this order are unable to ship to the USA.
I actually got that msg from Halo with only a blanket in my cart. Won't let me checkout.
Guess you need a PMTA for fleece blankets too.
Yep will be an ongoing transition problem like with fleece blanket. Web site updates required.
LightFire (aka KangerWholesaleUSA) isn't and never was owned by or affiliated with Kangertech.
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I am well aware of that, thank you. However, they are listed on Kangertech's site as a global distributor.
But that's just because these company names in question were such a dead giveaway that the intent was obvious from the fact... I mean, why can't websites show external links that point to other websites without constantly checking the content of these same other websites? AFAIK hyperlinking is legal if the website owner doesn't know the content of the actual linked webpage/document.
"Warning: This product contains nicotine" LMFAOGuess you need a PMTA for fleece blankets too.
I dunno, Joe/VU will likely find out.
The intent thing is if an item is marketed, labelled or sold for use in vaping it is subject to the deeming regs.
Being sold by a vape retailer is kind of a dead give away if it can possible be used in vaping.
ie flavoring yes intent.
Resistance wire yes intent.
18650 batteries probably especially if named Vapcell, etc.
Fuzzy slippers no intent.
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intent is also if sold with hardware that falls within there policy... the trick will be having vendors whjo only sell non vape hardware but sell all the flavorings then going to another vendor for your bottles and other supply's (lap supplies) Nic maybe exempt for School address delivery. then finding your hardware and batteries from yet other vendors... you end up paying more for shipping but there will be no intent since those separate vendors wont sell Vape gear besides the few who might have a pmta for it. (pipe dream) since most hardware pmta falls on the manafactuer... or finding vendors who sell is has aromatherapy
Resistance wire I mostly buy from TEMco. They been around since 1968 and based in California, and none of their products are marked as vaping stuff. Better quality too.
Electrical - Wire - Resistance Wire - Page 1 - TEMCo Industrial
temcoindustrial.com
The 18650's, and etc...they were not made for vaping, but they certainly won't go away because of it. The flashlight market alone is huge. Hell, you can still buy a 20600 battery to replace the one used in several built-in battery mods.
These are just specialized electrical devices. You can build or refurbish a mod with parts from any online electronics store like DIgiKey, Mouser, etc.
I do wonder about Evolv though...
They are likely doomed.
Ya'll act as if not having any shops with the name 'vape' in the name mean the end of vaping or something.
I think it's a new era, that's all. The wild 'n free days are over and always were going to be.
Very well stated.
And aside from obvious vape hardware how I have done it for years.
PG/VG mostly from amazon.
Flavorings from BCF
Wire was from lightning vapes/Amazon but have not bought any for a few years, well stocked.
Nic was from a vape vendor MFS also bought my last, last year. also well stocked.
Batteries mostly from Illumn supply, even without PMTA just a cheaper source than vape vendors.
On wire I have around 750' of 26 ga SS 316L which is all I use and at my consumption it will last till I am 100Resistance wire I mostly buy from TEMco. They been around since 1968 and based in California, and none of their products are marked as vaping stuff. Better quality too.
Electrical - Wire - Resistance Wire - Page 1 - TEMCo Industrial
The 18650's, and etc...they were not made for vaping, but they certainly won't go away because of it. The flashlight market alone is huge. Hell, you can still buy a 20600 battery to replace the one used in several built-in battery mods.
These are just specialized electrical devices. You can build or refurbish a mod with parts from any online electronics store like DIgiKey, Mouser, etc.
I do wonder about Evolv though...
They are likely doomed.
Ya'll act as if not having any shops with the name 'vape' in the name mean the end of vaping or something.
I think it's a new era, that's all. The wild 'n free days are over and always were going to be.
I only do roundwire builds.I do have around a thousand feet or more total of other gauges of SS and Kanthal wire as well.
Buy on sale and stock up.
Amazon used to have really good deals on Lightning vapes wire.
I think I do have a spool or 3 of Temco as well.
And as I have said I have bought very little from any place with vape in their name for a couple of years or so.
Vapor beast was one of the few I bought much from and they sold out to someone and went to crap.
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Ditto! I have a 2nd ltr of nic from River Supply.
Flavorings I've gotten from all over... One Stop DIY, Flavor Jungle, MFS, Heartland, BCF, RTS, Essential Depot, High Dessert, Wizard, Real Flavors.
PG/VG I get from Bulk Apothocary
Hardware/juice vendors... good lord I could never begin to name them all... but my most frequent I'd say was ...
MFS, Vapor Beast, 101, Wet Vapes, Breazy, Fast Tech, Eight Vape, Vape NW, Venerable Vaping, Sourcemore, Ecig City, Eciggity, VaporDNA.
I almost always waited for new devices to go on clearance... I never pay new/full price for anything. I think I've paid full price for maybe 3 mods in 8 years. I don't mind waiting for the price to come down and pay $20 rather than $60-70.
Yep the way I worked it too. Except for Pico Squeezes fro FT when they were around $17. Price went up a few bucks and not a problem.
all of my nic came from MFS but I was fully stocked up on that over a year ago... maybe 2 years.
I was buying from Amazon for PG/VG until essential depot went wild on prices.
Since bought elsewhere but now with 1 more gal of VG good for around 5 years on that.
Over the years flavorings came from pretty much the same sources as you while I was in DIY mania and trying to find flavorings that did not hit my serious allergy.
For the last 3 years though only BCV/BCF for flavorings.
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I know I paid full price for these two... just because of the color, I had to have them
Most I ever paid for a mod was $45.
I think the most I ever paid for a Kbox mini was $24?
I got 3 I think with STM for $24. I did pay around $20 for I think 3 of my STM's but got most as V1's on clearance for $10 then got V2 RBA's for them.
My color is white mods with SS tanks/RDA's.
Wound up with 2 white STM's though and piffed them out.
good guys vape white
black Kbox minis are ok if not for the red buttons....
I think the most I ever paid for a Kbox mini was $24?
I got 3 I think with STM for $24. I did pay around $20 for I think 3 of my STM's but got most as V1's on clearance for $10 then got V2 RBA's for them.
My color is white mods with SS tanks/RDA's.
Wound up with 2 white STM's though and piffed them out.
good guys vape white
black Kbox minis are ok if not for the red buttons....
I do not think there will be enough flavoring business to keep too many former juice shops in business.
those who DIY are in the minority and will remain so.
But we will keep on vapin
Bought by Turning Point Brands in 2016, which is owned by RJ Reynolds.
Well-Known Online Vape Company Purchased for $27 Million
VaporBeast, an online vaping retailer and wholesale distributor, was acquired for $27 million by Turning Point Brands, a publicly traded tobacco company.
vaping360.com
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Me too. Besides saving money, I don't like being the guinea pig of the vape industry. It seems very common that version 1 is always fraught with problems and defects and then version 2 comes out about a month or so later. What a racket. I want nothing to do with it. Let others be guinea pics. Money doesn't grow on any of my trees.
Yep date sounds about right. do not think I bought anything from them after the buyout.
Maybe 1 order? Not sure.
I do not think there will be enough flavoring business to keep too many former juice shops in business.
those who DIY are in the minority and will remain so.
But we will keep on vapin
I don't know about that. If the flavorings they sell can be used to cook with, they can try to get a piece of that market. But no doubt they will have to branch out into other products, most likely cooking related, not just flavorings. But that's not an easy market. Very saturated with HUGE corporate global names. Nothing like the vape market.
More likely CBD and flavorings.
Aroma Therapy crap?
I think the flavorings for cooking market is pretty saturated and will not expand much...
Amazon has plenty of flavorings...
They're not going after the flavoring business AFAIK. That would be like going after the big food industry, and, many of lauded culinary masters love to use flavorings too.I do not think there will be enough flavoring business to keep too many former juice shops in business.
those who DIY are in the minority and will remain so.
But we will keep on vapin
Never said they were unless it is marketed for use in vaping.
ie a place named vape wildebeest selling it.
Agreed though I think the intent thing will be at the end of PMTA enforcement efforts.
Essentially, good flavorings don't need any marketing. They follow the mousetrap theory... if you put strong enough cheese in, eventually someone is going to bite.
And the flavoring is the same at amazon of a vape flavoring supply. At least the ones not marketed for vaping is.Essentially, good flavorings don't need any marketing. They follow the mousetrap theory... if you put strong enough cheese in, eventually someone is going to bite.
Capela is Capela no matter where.
I have only bought from BCF for around 4 years now. Early on I bought from several places, but grew tired of that. Would buy from Amazon but like to give BCF my business.
Yes and no. Not too long ago I was prescribed D-Cure (vitamin D) capsules for a few weeks, and, I know for a fact that many people die without medicines so I most certainly do have some idea what I'm buying...
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someone is touchy about ... it seems...
after all it is not like PMTA enforcement and vape shops carrying ... are not related...
after all it is not like PMTA enforcement and vape shops carrying ... are not related...
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