Tight-Draw/Low-Wattage/M2L Vapers Unite!

[picautomaton]

For general vaping I actually prefer my mouth to lung devices (evods and mini protanks). They allow me to vape at home while watching t.v. and at the office.
While I have five sub-ohm tanks / drippers the problem with them is the clouds bro (bother all around me) and they are noisy (crackling juice, darth vapour breathing and whistling).

 

[JuicyLucy]

Upon testing the drawl on the Merlin, it is there...... and I am sure that it will be an excellent MTL tank.......however, it is a tad loose in the drawl dept.....But that, I believe can be remedied.....I will explain......Under the coil there is an air flow control screw which has a 2.5 mm hole in it.....What I will be doing is getting a couple of screws of the same size and length, and then drill a hole through it at 2 mm, then another one at 1.5 mm..... and experiment with them.......This will choke air flow from the internal part of the atty.......The Merlin does also have an air flow ring on the outside of the tank as well, but it doesn't tighten the drawl up quite enough.....Here is an experiment for you to try @JuicyLucy ..... Take a vape band and put it over the air flow slots on the Merlin......Cover them up completely and play with the adjustments......both directions.......You may be surprised at what you discover, and it is kinda mind blowing...... I would love to hear your thoughts.............So with a few workarounds that I have in mind, the Merlin will be a hassle free atty which will have a tight drawl, and with the anticipated performance that people are talking about........

I have a second Merlin I've cleaned but haven't coiled it yet. I hadn't considered trying the center pin airflow like you suggest - I might give that a shot over the weekend if time permits.

You are on your own with drilling out after-market screws though, lol. I'd go that route if desperate, but I like the Merlin so much the way I built the first one I hadn't really thought of ways to improve what I already love

 

[AndriaD]

I'm too lazy to drip on a regular basis

That's why I like the Achilles so much -- 2.5ml. It's necessary with my strawberry & cream because it's so extremely gunky -- got tired of wasting juice in a kayfun when the whole tankful would turn brown from the backwash.

Andria

 

[AndriaD]

Upon testing the drawl on the Merlin, it is there...... and I am sure that it will be an excellent MTL tank.......however, it is a tad loose in the drawl dept.....But that, I believe can be remedied.....I will explain......Under the coil there is an air flow control screw which has a 2.5 mm hole in it.....What I will be doing is getting a couple of screws of the same size and length, and then drill a hole through it at 2 mm, then another one at 1.5 mm..... and experiment with them.......This will choke air flow from the internal part of the atty.......The Merlin does also have an air flow ring on the outside of the tank as well, but it doesn't tighten the drawl up quite enough.....Here is an experiment for you to try @JuicyLucy ..... Take a vape band and put it over the air flow slots on the Merlin......Cover them up completely and play with the adjustments......both directions.......You may be surprised at what you discover, and it is kinda mind blowing...... I would love to hear your thoughts.............So with a few workarounds that I have in mind, the Merlin will be a hassle free atty which will have a tight drawl, and with the anticipated performance that people are talking about........

Well, if the internal airhole is that large, then I probably wouldn't like it. That was the change they made to the Achilles 2 -- the original Achilles has a very small internal airhole, about 1.5 - 2 mm.... the new ones have a 2.5mm internal airhole, and no matter how tightly I close the AFC ring, it's still too airy for me, can't get proper resistance to the draw at all. Fortunately, the new tank ring's threads match the old bases with the smaller internal airhole, so I'm using the Achilles 2's ring and top cap, on an original base. But it kinda burns me, since the Achilles 2 cost $98.

Nobody seems to really get "tight draw" anymore; stuff that people say is a tight draw, often turns out not to be -- Veritas, I'm looking at YOU. Also the Alleria -- much too airy, even with airflow closed almost completely. Magma, for me, is borderline; a little looser than I prefer, but I can tolerate it, because the airflow is DIRECTLY beneath the coil, so the flavor is great. too bad it leaks so much. I've seen pics of the new "Magma Reborn" and while they seem to have addressed the leaking problem by building up the airholes over the surface of the deck, they're much bigger now, so I probably wouldn't like it.

Internal airhole of NO MORE than 2mm, 1.5mm preferred;
airflow DIRECTLY BENEATH the coil;
airholes ABOVE the surface of the deck

Those features are what I'm looking for; no side air, no internal huge airhole, no airhole flush with the deck surface. The only thing I've tried so far that features all that is the original Achilles. Too bad they don't make them anymore, either authentics or clones.

Andria

 

[darkangel07760]

MTL vaper here too All mine have the Eleaf GS tanks with the 1.5 coils , I vape at about 11 watts

what are the tanks? The stick pico looks pretty small, I like the small size!

 

[Whiskey]

Those are Eleaf GS tanks and the other is a Triton mini

 

[darkangel07760]

Those are Eleaf GS tanks and the other is a Triton mini

Thanks! I might have to pick up pa pico

 

[Whiskey]

Great little mods, have to say one of my favorites

 

[Flavor Alchemist]

Well, if the internal airhole is that large, then I probably wouldn't like it. That was the change they made to the Achilles 2 -- the original Achilles has a very small internal airhole, about 1.5 - 2 mm.... the new ones have a 2.5mm internal airhole, and no matter how tightly I close the AFC ring, it's still too airy for me, can't get proper resistance to the draw at all. Fortunately, the new tank ring's threads match the old bases with the smaller internal airhole, so I'm using the Achilles 2's ring and top cap, on an original base. But it kinda burns me, since the Achilles 2 cost $98.

Nobody seems to really get "tight draw" anymore; stuff that people say is a tight draw, often turns out not to be -- Veritas, I'm looking at YOU. Also the Alleria -- much too airy, even with airflow closed almost completely. Magma, for me, is borderline; a little looser than I prefer, but I can tolerate it, because the airflow is DIRECTLY beneath the coil, so the flavor is great. too bad it leaks so much. I've seen pics of the new "Magma Reborn" and while they seem to have addressed the leaking problem by building up the airholes over the surface of the deck, they're much bigger now, so I probably wouldn't like it.

Internal airhole of NO MORE than 2mm, 1.5mm preferred;
airflow DIRECTLY BENEATH the coil;
airholes ABOVE the surface of the deck

Those features are what I'm looking for; no side air, no internal huge airhole, no airhole flush with the deck surface. The only thing I've tried so far that features all that is the original Achilles. Too bad they don't make them anymore, either authentics or clones.

Andria

Andria....I have an appreciation for your study and knowledge of the Anatomy of the RTA.....Your observations are spot on, and I concur with you wholeheartedly........The thing that IS attractive about the Merlin is the build deck......The concept of that tank is that there is an original air hole in center, under coil and above juice level and it meets MOST of your specs for a good MTL atty......They included that screw insert that I mentioned in my above post, however it is still 2.5 mm.....That is why I will be researching some screws, and perhaps have a machinist friend of mine drill some 1.5 mm and 2 mm holes to tighten up the air flow.........I seek a tighter drawl, which also affords a good amount a vapor.......Sounds like one must compromise one for the other....but my Goblin Mini disproves that Idea......It is achievable, though.......Another observation about the Merlin is this: The outside air flow control ring does not mate perfectly with the inner air slots.....so no matter how closed one shuts it down, there will always be air seeping between the surface of the inner and outer rings.....rendering a "not so tight drawl"......A vape band can do the job, and ironically it is at its' best with the vape band covering the slots AND having the outer air flow ring completely OPEN.......I won't go into the physics of this, but suffice it to say that it does produce a very pleasing drawl.......Only this weekend will tell when I get it up and running with some juice.........But not all tight drawl attys produce a good vape, as air flow cannot be arbitrarily controlled from anywhere.....It must be smartly engineered in the device, with a lot of testing.........

I understand that the Kayfun center air flow holes are made at 2 mm as their standard.....so we are thinking in the same ballpark.....Looking forward to testing some machined screws.....

I can also say that I have a LemoDrop.........excellent flavor and when closed down via its' air flow control, makes for an excellent MTL tank, despite its' larger chamber and chimney.......Problem with that one is that one must disassemble the base to get to it in order to adjust the air flow, and it has a tendency to move out of its' position during normal handling, as it is simply a little nut which you turn to close off the air flow......but in the right position, if offers up an excellent combination of flavor and vapor.......Working on a re-design on that one also.....

 

[AndriaD]

They included that screw insert that I mentioned in my above post, however it is still 2.5 mm.....That is why I will be researching some screws, and perhaps have a machinist friend of mine drill some 1.5 mm and 2 mm holes to tighted up the air flow

If that works out well, you ought to speak to the guy that runs LightningVapes; he might be interested in carrying it as one of his "odd accessories and whatnot", for the benefit of that who like tight draw. It's a terrific idea, which I'm not capable of doing or even thinking up, come to that. When I started building coils, my husband was amazed, as I had never previously shown any interest or aptitude for "tinkering with tools".

Let us know how that turns out!!!

Andria

 

[BulletStopper]

If that works out well, you ought to speak to the guy that runs LightningVapes; he might be interested in carrying it as one of his "odd accessories and whatnot", for the benefit of that who like tight draw. It's a terrific idea, which I'm not capable of doing or even thinking up, come to that. When I started building coils, my husband was amazed, as I had never previously shown any interest or aptitude for "tinkering with tools".

Let us know how that turns out!!!

Andria

In the Merlin thread there is the screw size and thread pitch that was asked for to do just that was stated. One user did make a new insert. A couple or us asked making and selling some as a set was possible.

I like my Merlin, but would prefer a smaller air hole, either 2 or 1.5 mm.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

 

[pulsevape]

for MTL ..or restricted lung hits....and great flavor gennys can't be beat.....my favorites are the Pulse G by RM mods( which for several reasons I consider the best genny ever built) and the BMG-22 by Francseco di Marchi of Flow Engineering....

 

[AndriaD]

I did a mod just the other night of my 2 Magmas, to try and 1) stop or massively reduce leakage, and 2) tighten the draw a little more. From what I experienced last night when I finally got one of those modded-Magmas coiled up and vaping, it seems to be a big success. I saw this tip/technique on ECF a while back, and had wanted to get it done, but the 12ga needles that were advised turned out not to be 12ga at all, in fact they were skinnier than my 14ga luer lock needles. I finally get fed up with never getting that mod done, so I had my husband take his dremel cutting wheel to one of my 14ga luer lock needles, and lo and behold, it works!

Here's a pic of what I did:



I left those old coils in while this was going on, so my husband could see that it needed to be shorter on the side with a coil -- I never, EVER use dual coils, on ANYTHING. I had thought that if the draw still wasn't quite tight enough, I might crimp the top of the longer one, on the off side, but that doesn't seem to be necessary; with those 14ga needles inserted in the airholes, it tightens the draw to something pretty close to the Achilles', which to me is the gold standard.

The primary purpose, to stop leakage, also seems to have been addressed very successfully; the mod+atty sat all night last night with some juice in it, after being used enough to have generated some condensate inside the domed cap, and I don't feel any "greasiness" on the mod this morning. YAY!

Andria

 

[Synphul]

As an ex smoker I prefer mtl. One of the first things I noticed was a more airy draw even on cig-a-likes. Makes sense, we're not really pulling the air/vape 'through' anything like the length of a compacted tobacco filled tube which creates the resistance. Carto's on the cig-a-likes have a pretty tiny hole by comparison and as a result of that and the tiny coils inside, the length of time a person can physically draw into their mouth, not much vapor is happening. For me it meant less satisfying sensation. In addition to the tight draw I was also looking for 'volume' of the puff to try and match a cig.

I'm not sure it's possible to duplicate the restriction of a cig along with the vapor cloud equivalent. Sort of have to pick one or the other. Currently vaping on a pen style halo triton which I'm sure like other pen vapes has two tiny airflow holes, a narrow chamber tube and a somewhat restrictive drip tip. Even that seems 'airy' to me. Sometimes I plug off one of those tiny holes around the battery connection so it cuts the airflow in half.

My first rta is in the mail, never used one before so no clue what to expect. I opted for the ehpro bachelor, a lot of reviews said it's good on flavor, it's a single coil postless deck. Just drop the coil legs in and tighten the grub screws from the side. Snip the wicking to the edges of the deck and call it a day. Single coil, less battery consumption and juice consumption, less wire (depending on type of coil made). Airflow hole directly beneath the coil. Unfortunately it doesn't meet you specs, not sure about the inner diameter of the air chamber but I know it's a side air intake near the bottom. Supposedly it can be closed off pretty tight but again no real personal experience so can only pass along what other reviewers have said.

Eventually I think I'll end up replacing the stock drip tip with one more like a kayfun or similar pen style tip.

 

[pulsevape]

After getting my first authentic Kayfun lite plus, I found it hard to go back to DL setups so continued on with looking for atomizers that could produce really good flavor. Vapor production will always come with a good system, so that was never a criteria for a new atty. Eventually, I got into genisis atomizers and have never looked back. I ended up upping my nic from 3-6mg to 12mg, but a 30ml bottle I used to vape through in 2-3 days in the past takes me about a month now.

Gennies do really well with tobacco based or fruit flavors, but if you like your bakery and cremes, I think cotton wicked atomizers are much better suited.

My setup of choice is an Anatolian 18500 mech with a LeZephyr @ .85ohms vaping either with Blacknote or Vaponaute e-liquids.

Have you seen the le mirage, vaponaute is releasing looks killer.

 

[Flavor Alchemist]

As an ex smoker I prefer mtl. One of the first things I noticed was a more airy draw even on cig-a-likes. Makes sense, we're not really pulling the air/vape 'through' anything like the length of a compacted tobacco filled tube which creates the resistance. Carto's on the cig-a-likes have a pretty tiny hole by comparison and as a result of that and the tiny coils inside, the length of time a person can physically draw into their mouth, not much vapor is happening. For me it meant less satisfying sensation. In addition to the tight draw I was also looking for 'volume' of the puff to try and match a cig.

I'm not sure it's possible to duplicate the restriction of a cig along with the vapor cloud equivalent. Sort of have to pick one or the other. Currently vaping on a pen style halo triton which I'm sure like other pen vapes has two tiny airflow holes, a narrow chamber tube and a somewhat restrictive drip tip. Even that seems 'airy' to me. Sometimes I plug off one of those tiny holes around the battery connection so it cuts the airflow in half.

My first rta is in the mail, never used one before so no clue what to expect. I opted for the ehpro bachelor, a lot of reviews said it's good on flavor, it's a single coil postless deck. Just drop the coil legs in and tighten the grub screws from the side. Snip the wicking to the edges of the deck and call it a day. Single coil, less battery consumption and juice consumption, less wire (depending on type of coil made). Airflow hole directly beneath the coil. Unfortunately it doesn't meet you specs, not sure about the inner diameter of the air chamber but I know it's a side air intake near the bottom. Supposedly it can be closed off pretty tight but again no real personal experience so can only pass along what other reviewers have said.

Eventually I think I'll end up replacing the stock drip tip with one more like a kayfun or similar pen style tip.

Interesting that you mention the Bachelor........Not sure whether you got the "Bachelor" or the "Bachelor Nano"......... I just got the Bachelor Nano, and it has a MTL kit that you can get from E-Ciggity......If ordering the Bachelor Nano from them, you must request them to include the MTL Kit with it......In that Kit is a couple of smaller diameter inserts that get put into the air tube one is 1 mm......and the other is 2 mm.......In addition, you get a drip tip which has a reduced throat for air restriction.......This kit is only available with the Bachelor Nano......It can also be ordered for about 5 bucks separately, but they don't list it on their website..........I will be building this weekend and starting preliminary vapes.......Looking forward to it.....

 

[KKen]

Have you seen the le mirage, vaponaute is releasing looks killer.

Yeah, I don't really dig it, seems to be following the same template many atomizers are going with more airflow. When I first got the LeZephyr, I honestly did not like, but after reducing the wick holes and being able to use smaller diameter coils, I got, in my opinion, a much better flavor profile.

I like it so much now I retired my MCR303 for the time being

Have also been enjoying another setup that's sort of under the mainstream radar:

Dicodes Dani Extreme V2 w/ a 17mm Animodz Chiwawa dripper. I run between 16-18Watts with a mesh slug. MTL of course

 

[r055co]

I do both, MTL and DL, all depends on my mood and where I'm at or doing. While I have a variety of MTL devices by far my favorite is my Squape. I really enjoy it with a SS 32x2/38 fused Clapton, flavor is out of this world. Now that I feel somewhat comfortable with my FDApocolypse stash I want to save my pennies and get the new Squape X.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

 

[Synphul]

Interesting that you mention the Bachelor........Not sure whether you got the "Bachelor" or the "Bachelor Nano"......... I just got the Bachelor Nano, and it has a MTL kit that you can get from E-Ciggity......If ordering the Bachelor Nano from them, you must request them to include the MTL Kit with it......In that Kit is a couple of smaller diameter inserts that get put into the air tube one is 1 mm......and the other is 2 mm.......In addition, you get a drip tip which has a reduced throat for air restriction.......This kit is only available with the Bachelor Nano......It can also be ordered for about 5 bucks separately, but they don't list it oh their website..........I will be building this weekend and starting preliminary vapes.......Looking forward to it.....

I'll have to check into it, get ahold of eciggity which is where I got my bachelor. I got the standard not the nano but maybe I can still get the mtl kit from them if it's packaged separately. Someone also mentioned a possible mtl kit from fasttech but not looking forward to a month or longer shipment if I can avoid it. Much appreciated!

 

[pulsevape]

Yeah, I don't really dig it, seems to be following the same template many atomizers are going with more airflow. When I first got the LeZephyr, I honestly did not like, but after reducing the wick holes and being able to use smaller diameter coils, I got, in my opinion, a much better flavor profile.

I like it so much now I retired my MCR303 for the time being

Have also been enjoying another setup that's sort of under the mainstream radar:

Dicodes Dani Extreme V2 w/ a 17mm Animodz Chiwawa dripper. I run between 16-18Watts with a mesh slug. MTL of course

Whoa that is some fine shiznick. I love drippers smaller than 20 mmm

 

[KKen]

Its a very simple, but extremely well made dripper. If you are a fan of SS mesh wicks and like higher VG juices, I wouldn't hesitate to pick this up if you get a chance to grab one. For 50/50 blends, such as the Blacknote line, or even the 60/40 Vaponaute e-journey line, I find the throat hit quite amplified, so I've been vaping mostly Boyds Bounty with this setup

 

[r055co]

Finally got around to getting a few 18350 batteries, trying them out with my Cartel and Squape rocking some RY4.
Damn I sure love the Squape!

 

[StillWaters]

As an ex smoker I prefer mtl. One of the first things I noticed was a more airy draw even on cig-a-likes. Makes sense, we're not really pulling the air/vape 'through' anything like the length of a compacted tobacco filled tube which creates the resistance. Carto's on the cig-a-likes have a pretty tiny hole by comparison and as a result of that and the tiny coils inside, the length of time a person can physically draw into their mouth, not much vapor is happening. For me it meant less satisfying sensation. In addition to the tight draw I was also looking for 'volume' of the puff to try and match a cig.

I'm not sure it's possible to duplicate the restriction of a cig along with the vapor cloud equivalent. Sort of have to pick one or the other. Currently vaping on a pen style halo triton which I'm sure like other pen vapes has two tiny airflow holes, a narrow chamber tube and a somewhat restrictive drip tip. Even that seems 'airy' to me. Sometimes I plug off one of those tiny holes around the battery connection so it cuts the airflow in half.

My first rta is in the mail, never used one before so no clue what to expect. I opted for the ehpro bachelor, a lot of reviews said it's good on flavor, it's a single coil postless deck. Just drop the coil legs in and tighten the grub screws from the side. Snip the wicking to the edges of the deck and call it a day. Single coil, less battery consumption and juice consumption, less wire (depending on type of coil made). Airflow hole directly beneath the coil. Unfortunately it doesn't meet you specs, not sure about the inner diameter of the air chamber but I know it's a side air intake near the bottom. Supposedly it can be closed off pretty tight but again no real personal experience so can only pass along what other reviewers have said.

Eventually I think I'll end up replacing the stock drip tip with one more like a kayfun or similar pen style tip.

I'm kinda at the same place as you. I have an Ipv d3 with a Gemini rta on the way. I am doing the same "blocking" on my current setup (ego battery with aspire clearo). With all the airflow options on the Gemini, I'm hoping for a tight draw, but I guess we shall see!

 

[mercury7]

I'm kinda at the same place as you. I have an Ipv d3 with a Gemini rta on the way. I am doing the same "blocking" on my current setup (ego battery with aspire clearo). With all the airflow options on the Gemini, I'm hoping for a tight draw, but I guess we shall see!

How did the airflow on the Gemini work for you?

 

[Canadian Vaper]

Curious of anyone has tried the UD Tidus.. It's a vape designed for MTL.. They sent me one for testing but I'm out of town and won't be able to test it until Monday.. I've been thinking of using it as a stealth vape since it's so small compared to my current stealth...

What nic level/ratio are you all using? I'm currently on 3 drip/6 tank, I was thinking 12 for this? may splurge and get a bottle of high pg just for it since most of my diy recipes are geared towards clouds...

http://www.yourcig.com/product/ud-tidus-kit.html