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To Date which US Presidential candidate will you be voting for & why?

Which US Presidential candidate will you be voting for?


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Tpat591

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Member For 4 Years
Not me. I don't think you should pay taxes.




You should obey basic laws. Don't steal or murder and the like. The rest are,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,lets say,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,up to you if'n you want to obey.




You should advocate for the dissolving of the federal(CENTRAL) government as it exists today. We were never meant to have one. We were meant to have 50 governments United for a common defense and the Liberty of the Individual.

But, here's the rub. I think that's true no matter who is President. Trump was always just a step in that direction. And he still is. I've never agreed with everything Trump is about but there is no one that would have done those things different.

Trump is doing more on the border than anybody would have done.

No matter who is President you should not pay federal tax, you should not obey unjust laws and you should advocate for the dissolving of a CENTRAL government.
Speaking for those of us behind enemy lines in Democrat Strongholds (Jersey, Cali, etc.), the only thing keeping us from going completely off the cliff is the Federal Government. It does serve to check state government insanity just as the tree branches supposedly do knowing their authority can be challenged by a higher authority.
 

Time

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Speaking for those of us behind enemy lines in Democrat Strongholds (Jersey, Cali, etc.), the only thing keeping us from going completely off the cliff is the Federal Government. It does serve to check state government insanity just as the tree branches supposedly do knowing their authority can be challenged by a higher authority.

The Federal Government does not do that for you. The Constitution does. :)

Those of us in red states also rely on the Constitution to minimize the boot on us from "conservatives". Namely, the religious right.
 

Tpat591

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The Federal Government does not do that for you. The Constitution does. :)

Those of us in red states also rely on the Constitution to minimize the boot on us from "conservatives". Namely, the religious right.
The Constitution is just a piece of parchment and does not hold the veiled threat of the FBI/DOJ breaking down your governor's door and putting him behind bars for his crimes...However unlikely it may actually happen, the Federal Government sworn to uphold that Constitution provides enough of a veiled threat to make these power mad criminals think twice before instituting full blown Communism.
 

Tpat591

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hellcatrydr

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To want something and to be able to achieve it are two different things. Look at the history of the last 70 or so years of conflicts. Cities are relatively easy to conquer and control, whereas remote, mountainous areas are nearly impossible.

WOLVERINES!!! :)
 

Time

Platinum Contributor
Member For 4 Years
The Constitution is just a piece of parchment and does not hold the veiled threat of the FBI/DOJ breaking down your governor's door and putting him behind bars for his crimes...However unlikely it may actually happen, the Federal Government sworn to uphold that Constitution provides enough of a veiled threat to make these power mad criminals think twice before instituting full blown Communism.

And that's where you and I part ways, ideologically.

You're fighting for/advocating for control of the agencies/government. As you seem to think they can rule over you and thus rule over those you don't like.

I'm for getting rid of them altogether. I certainly don't hold any opinion that they rule over me. If they want to try we'll have that discusion Ruby Ridge, Waco or Bundy style. I don't care what "laws" or authority they think they have.

The Constitution is not a piece of paper. It's an idea that's written on paper.
 

pulsevape

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Member For 4 Years
That's because you live in Oakland.

I think I'm going to be fine. :)
That old boy up in Ruby Ridge and Bundy thought the same way....but the goverment was willing to make the trip to the middle of nowhere to put their boot on their necks.
 

Time

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That old boy up in Ruby Ridge and Bundy thought the same way....but the goverment was willing to make the trip to the middle of nowhere to put their boot on their necks.

Oh, you're bound to get some bruises in a fight. The Bundy's and Randy Weaver were free in the end.

Besides, it's better to die on my feet than live on my knees. Even if it's Pat's "patriots" that want to rule.

Hopefully, it won't get to that.
 

SMOKIE

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Tpat591

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And that's where you and I part ways, ideologically.

You're fighting for/advocating for control of the agencies/government. As you seem to think they can rule over you and thus rule over those you don't like.

I'm for getting rid of them altogether. I certainly don't hold any opinion that they rule over me. If they want to try we'll have that discusion Ruby Ridge, Waco or Bundy style. I don't care what "laws" or authority they think they have.

The Constitution is not a piece of paper. It's an idea that's written on paper.
False. I am recognizing that our forefathers recognized that any government placed in the hands of the wrong people can become a system of oppression and therefore brought about a system of government that provides checks and balances at multiple levels to safeguard against such abuse by assuring there would always be a method to intervene should it become necessary.

The State of NJ under Murphy (a governor elected in a 2017 election that was so rampant with election fraud DHS used it as one of a 4 state case study in it's Election Integrity report submitted to the POTUS in March to justify a wide-sweeping election fraud sting in 2018) just imposed one of the most stringent and overreaching set of gun control laws in the country in a state that already had some of the most stringent & overreaching set of laws already on the books. All one has to do is look at the Obama administrations abuse of the FISA courts, the weaponization of the FBI, CIA, IRS and every other aspect of government to know that when an organized crime family holds power in government, you will not find it represents the will of the people. That same corruption & weaponization that existed in the Obama administration exists in all these liberal bastion states like NJ & California today many times worse than at the Federal level today & they care nothing for the ideas on that parchment, in fact they would burn it tomorrow if they had an opportunity. The only way to clean these liberal bastion states of the corruption is by using the powers and tools of a strong federal government enforcing the Ideas in the Constitution to root out the evil that would destroy the Nation.

You and I think differently without a doubt. You think if you just fire all the criminals in DC they just go away and stop trying to destroy the nation & they aren't likely to find you in the woods caring nothing about your fellow citizens who are still in the line of fire. You think if you get rid of the CIA, FISA & the NSA they are just gonna stop spying on everyone's cell phones? That is just as STUPID as thinking 2 planes flew a hundred knots faster than the structural limits where the wings would have fallen off long before flying into 2 of the most formidable structural steel buildings ever built buttressed by over an acre of reinforced concrete at each floor and didn't crush like a beer can against the side of it and fall to the ground then sonehow lit fires that could not have burned hot enough to melt the steel causing three buildings to fall to the ground. It is utterly naive bullshit to believe either. Days after 911 Trump visited ground zero and in an interview with a reporter there he said there was no way those airliners caused the aftermath, but smartly backed off those statements for his own survival until he was in a position to strike back using the full force of the Presidency You can find that interview on YouTube today. He was smart enough to recognize a conspiracy for what it was & smart enough to learn all he could about it before considering taking it on.

If you eliminate the NSA, CIA, FBI all that spying will only continue in the private corporate sector MIC for the enemies of our nation to mount outright attacks against our nation or continue to subvert our republic from within using the same methods they have employed for the last 60+ years while leaving us defenseless to stop it. You are never gonna put that genie back in that bottle and return us to a time before they shot & killed JFK so you are wasting your time putting it forward that gutting the Federal Government will solve your problems. You got a cancer, you use every tool in the arsenal to find out where it is, to what full extent it has grown, & the environmental source that caused it and cut it ALL out immediately while eliminating the source, then you use chemo to make sure anything that remains dies off. You continue to perform regular scans using the best tools at your disposal to make sure it does not reoccur. That is the only chance you got to survive it. Like it or not, the best tools at your disposal are those contained in a strong Federal Government justly administered and closely monitored against corruption by a patriotic, attentive & engaged populous.

Hiking into the woods to fight a gorilla war of attrition, while effective throughout history and an excellent last resort, presupposes that you have already lost the war and have resigned yourself to becoming the cancer in another body until you have in turn killed it. What remains is a dead body that was once your country and the dead body that was your enemy's occupation and the aftermath will never resemble your ideals of what once was.

POTUS understands the difference. He is appearing weak while using the tools at his disposal behind the scenes to map the enemy, monitor comms, strategically leverage enemies into allies & preparing the battlefield conditions to his favor by forging alliances while shining the light of truth on the real enemy & their methods making them painfully obvious to those who are asleep, marshaling his forces, growing his power base, and preparing for the battles to come. The more people he wakes, the stronger he becomes & the better for all because the final battle may never actually need to be fought. He is reeducating the public using conspiracy threads about what it is that made this country great and spreading that message across the world while he takes out global criminal cartels.
 
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Time

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The only way to clean these liberal bastion states of the corruption is by using the powers and tools of a strong federal government enforcing the Ideas in the Constitution to root out the evil that would destroy the Nation.

No, my fine Sir.

The only way to stop it is for the individuals of those state to simply refuse to be ruled. The Federal Government is not going save you. Trump is not going to save you. Only you can refuse to be ruled over.

Case in point. XXXX is Federally illegal. Many States are ignoring the Federal Government. Even extremely red States like Utah.

None of those laws that I'm aware of were changed through legislation. They were changed by ballot initiatives. They were changed by each individual voter. And they were changed by people that refuse to be ruled on this issue.

There is one and only one way. That way is for you, as an individual, to refuse to be ruled over. And if you chose to rule over others or have others ruled, you concede that you too can be ruled. You live your life unruled and by example you attract people that also do not want to be ruled and when there are enough of you, the "ruler" can't do a fucking thing about it.

In other words, it's not the Federal Government that will save you. It's the people. And you will NEVER get people on your side by appointing a ruler over them. You get people on your side by being free and then they also want to be free.

You are confusing freedom with justice. What you want is justice. Sure the government is corrupt. On all sides. That's what you focus on, the corruption. You want justice more than you want freedom. I'm afraid that justice is often a pipe dream. It doesn't always happen. Get over it and live free. And for fuck sake, don't impose a Federal Ruler over me. I don't want a King Trump or anyone else smiting your enemies. The fucks might smite me.
 

Time

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Member For 4 Years
You and I think differently without a doubt. You think.............................

I think I'm free, Pat. And that's all I think. Despite the insistence of the Federal Government and yourself that I am not, I assure you that I am. ;)

I think justice for criminals and the corrupt is nice when it can be achieved, but I'm not going to give up my freedom for it because it would not be justice.

I think I don't want a ruler at all. Not one of liberal control nor a ruler of your choosing.

I think I vote for Reps and Presidents, not to do my bidding but to protect my right to do my own bidding.

Fuck the Federal Government and all it's agencies. Be free yourself and maybe you'll convince others to be free too. It's quite impossible to force people to be free. :giggle:
 
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Tpat591

Diamond Contributor
Member For 4 Years
I think I'm free, Pat. And that's all I think. Despite the insistence of the Federal Government and yourself that I am not, I assure you that I am. ;)

I think justice for criminals and the corrupt is nice when it can be achieved, but I'm not going to give up my freedom for it because it would not be justice.

I think I don't want a ruler at all. Not one of liberal control nor a ruler of your choosing.

I think I vote for Reps and Presidents, not to do my bidding but to protect my right to do my own bidding.

Fuck the Federal Government and all it's agencies. Be free yourself and maybe you'll convince others to be free too. It's quite impossible to force people to be free. :giggle:
But it is quite possible for an out of control tech monopoly to trace your cell phone deep in the woods even if it is off so long as the battery is connected and target you from foreign shores or a control room in silicon valley in a multitude of ways any time they wish...You'll live free as long as they have no vested interest in targeting you... but the second you connect to the internet and spout your rather deeply held beliefs someone, somewhere may decide to rethink that decision and take your arrogant ass out with the push of a button and You might just be incinerated alive in your home, or your car, or walking through the woods like so many Californians just were. Is that really freedom? You may argue you lived free and died free so it was worth it, but in the end...

The only thing that may make them think twice before doing so is the realistic possibility there may be a response of overwhelming force of repercussions for doing so. You take out the Federal Government, you take out that possibility of a response against the bad actors and you have already lost.

As I said, we have a fundamental difference of opinion, and that's fine, but you will never put the Genie of Technology back in the bottle unless you send us all back through time to the stone age. The best you can ever hope for is freedom guaranteed by the threat of Mutually Assured Destruction.
 
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Time

Platinum Contributor
Member For 4 Years
But it is quite possible for an out of control tech monopoly to trace your cell phone deep in the woods even if it is off so long as the battery is connected and target you from foreign shores or a control room in silicon valley in a multitude of ways any time they wish...You'll live free as long as they have no vested interest in targeting you... but the second you connect to the internet and spout your rather deeply held beliefs someone, somewhere may decide to rethink that decision and take your arrogant ass out with the push of a button and You might just be incinerated alive in your home, or your car, or walking through the woods like so many Californians just were. Is that really freedom? You may argue you lived free and died free so it was worth it, but in the end...

The only thing that may make them think twice before doing so is the realistic possibility there may be a response of overwhelming force of repercussions for doing so. You take out the Federal Government, you take out that possibility of a response against the bad actors and you have already lost.

As I said, we have a fundamental difference of opinion, and that's fine, but you will never put the Genie of Technology back in the bottle unless you send us all back through time to the stone age. The best you can ever hope for is freedom guaranteed by the threat of Mutually Assured Destruction.

Um, I'm not out in the woods. And you're paranoid.

Nobody is trying to take me out. Nobody is going to try to take me out. And I'm pretty free with my deeply held beliefs, even here on the internet. I just don't think out of the 325 million people in this country, I'm high on the priority list for silicon valley hit men. :giggle:

You agree with the rantings of conspiracy theorists and anonymous people citing "sources". I'm more prone to agree with people such as the Bundy's and Ron Paul. People with faces, names and reputations that cite the Constitution, Founding Fathers and the like.:)
 

pulsevape

Diamond Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Or in real life: The Viet Cong of Vietnam; the Mujahideen and later Taliban of Afghanistan, the various insurgents in Iraq, just to name a few that neither the Russian or the US military were ever able to put down completely.
In real life the US wasn't trying to defeat the Viet Cong, the US goverment was trying to run up a war debt so the men who own the Federal Reserve could make a fortune on the money they lent us... and the US created the Mujahiden...both were good for the bussiness of war,and of no real threat to the US goverment....American patriots on the other hand who believe in the Consitution are a real threat to the US goverment. those who want to end the Fed are a real threat.Remember America has never treated any forgien enemy worse than it treated the Americans who wanted to seccede from the Union, people who thought the US goverment had violated the Consitution ....they had a scorch earth policiy and they destroyed the economy of the South for over 100 years....as Russell Means one of the spokesmen for the American Indian Movment said...."we are all on the Reservation now"....
 
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Tpat591

Diamond Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Um, I'm not out in the woods. And you're paranoid.

Nobody is trying to take me out. Nobody is going to try to take me out. And I'm pretty free with my deeply held beliefs, even here on the internet. I just don't think out of the 325 million people in this country, I'm high on the priority list for silicon valley hit men. :giggle:

You agree with the rantings of conspiracy theorists and anonymous people citing "sources". I'm more prone to agree with people such as the Bundy's and Ron Paul. People with faces, names and reputations that cite the Constitution, Founding Fathers and the like.:)
Wasn't Ron Paul nearly beaten to death in his front yard?

Lets not forget Bundy was a rancher who didn't want to pay his Federal grazing fees despite them being a 93% discount on the price of Cattle Feed & seized a federal office of land management in a standoff when the BLM tried to round up his cattle that were trespassing as they grazed on Federal Land and sell them to pay the over $1 million in arrears. The Cattleman's Association considered him an embarrassment to Cattlemen everywhere & his actions very unfair to the other cattlemen who paid their fees even if you & many others think he is a hero. The conspiracy theory there He put forward was HRC & BO wanted to use the arrears to confiscate his ranch because the land was rich in uranium & they wanted to confiscate it & sell it to U1's Rosatom.

I actually agree the power of the Federal Government does need to be greatly reduced in most areas but also believe it needs to be increased in areas of critical infrastructure. I believe all contracting with foreign entities to provide enumerated services on our behalf needs to be ended immediately and all federal assets currently owned by foreign entities to provide these services need to be immediately seized by the Executive Branch and the ownership of those assets returned to the American people who actually paid for them. I believe only American Citizens who maintain no allegiance or citizenship in foreign countries should be contracted to provide these services if they are contracted at all.

This especially applies to ownership of Ports, Airports, Media Assts, Internet Infrastructure & Security Keys, Social Networking, Banking Infrastructure, Security & Operation of all public & military equipment, offices & infrastructure. Foreign Ownership of any of the aforementioned is a recipe for Disaster and it is much more common than you are aware. The UAE & Israel own many of our port facilities, SERCO is controlled by the UK Crown and owns many of our government office services including the Patent Office, US Government Personnel Records offices, Satellite Data Mission control rooms, Defense Communications infrastructure, Air Traffic Control, administers Obama-care Records administration and operates freely in six sectors of public service provision: Health, Transport, Justice, Immigration, Defense, and Citizens Services at the Federal, State & Local levels. These are only isolated examples of a much larger problem. Washington DC and The Federal Reserve are Sovereign Cities owned by the City of London for Christ sake. This is all a recipe for disaster.

You don't make those kind of sweeping changes without a strong military to back up your authority to do so. You also don't do so by denying these things exist and writing them off as wild conspiracy theories.
 
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SMOKIE

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PoppaVic

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Well.. Yes - if they are dragging those officials FROM here to mexico - and heading south. Works for me.
 
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