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Where did the flavor go?

C.Alexander

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Newbee at rebuildables, but not vaping. I have been vaping for about 5yrs now, and decided to try RTAs and now RDAs. The problem is that while I am getting better than ever throat hit and vapor, the flavor is barely detectable. I have watched several great videos to learn how to make the coils, but the flavor still seems subdued. I am probably missing the forest, for the trees.
I have tried VCT-A1, Kanger subtank mini, Griffin, TFV4, and the Haze RTA, and several more.
At the moment I am using 24ga at between 0.1 -.5.
Different cottons have been tried, at the moment using Japanese organic pads, other than ease of use not much difference.
I just figure I must be missing something obvious. So any thoughts would be appreciated.
 

morfius1963

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I have the alliance V2 with dual parallel Clapton coil that I made. only been vaping for eight months and have learned a lot in these eight months. My V2 sits on top of a H cigar VT 200. The flavor is phenomenal.


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JERUS

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Newbee at rebuildables, but not vaping. I have been vaping for about 5yrs now, and decided to try RTAs and now RDAs. The problem is that while I am getting better than ever throat hit and vapor, the flavor is barely detectable. I have watched several great videos to learn how to make the coils, but the flavor still seems subdued. I am probably missing the forest, for the trees.
I have tried VCT-A1, Kanger subtank mini, Griffin, TFV4, and the Haze RTA, and several more.
At the moment I am using 24ga at between 0.1 -.5.
Different cottons have been tried, at the moment using Japanese organic pads, other than ease of use not much difference.
I just figure I must be missing something obvious. So any thoughts would be appreciated.
What are you comparing to as a starting point? I find the Haze to be the purest flavor, Griffin right up there on robust flavor (more vapor more flavor but it's a little faded). I like to do twisted or beyond for coils. I find strait wires often provide too much localized heat often scorching the cotton (I'll even see rings of burnt cotton when I pull the wick out).

What I'd recommend first is either twisted or parallel builds. Parallel is just straitening two strands of wire and wrapping them together keeping them parallel, very simple (all of these have youtube guides worth checking out). My other simple build would be just twisted, it's easy just grab anything with a loop and some pliers, take the strand of wire feed it through the hoop half way, grab both ends with the pliers and start twisting the hoop (I like a actual clip paper clip using the handle to feed through, I've seen others using coffee mugs, but anything that fits that concept). Then from there you can combine the two for Zipper coils which is nice. From there it's best to have a drill but you can do Chain Link (Twist one direction, then cut it in half and twist those two together in the opposite direction). Chain link is not really better than Zipper or Parallel on flavor though, just looks cool and works well. From there you enter into Claptons, but IMO Claptons are worth skipping over and jumping to Fused claptons, they aren't much harder to make and MUCH better on flavor. From there it gets much more complicated.

If you are interested in dropping some cash and getting some premade coils that will show you what's what in the Griffin I'd highly suggest hitting up @CrazyChef with his website Purecoils.com, or @raymo2u , both are great at making coils and will get you something that will blow your mind. IMO worth the money if you can't make something solid yourself, and then even if you can if you want to step up to something crazier and better (Crazychef's aliens certainly blow my fused Claptons out of the water).

Anyways, yeah single wire builds compared to the factory coils you're not going to see much improvement, IMO in the TFV4 the RBAs are better with simple twisted and noticeably better with beyond that. But, if you own the Griffin or Haze, plop some Fused claptons in there and you'll know why people use RTAs. The haze though, well even a simple twisted build gave me much better flavor than I've ever gotten from any tank before that.
 

CrazyChef

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Thanks, @JERUS ! :D

@C.Alexander - Yeah, It's gotta be the coil(s) you're using that are keeping you from getting all you can from your rigs and juices.
A 24 gauge coil is okay for a single coil build, but like JERUS said, you're really missing out on what the real flavors are by not using better "flavor builds". If you have the stuff to do it, definitely try to make a fused Clapton. The difference is night and day compared to a single wire coil build.
 

raymo2u

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I just made some for VaporCarp...If you got the tools and time it only takes a minute to learn and making them is satisfying...not to mention I find making coils a stress reliever
 

JERUS

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I just made some for VaporCarp...If you got the tools and time it only takes a minute to learn and making them is satisfying...not to mention I find making coils a stress reliever
Absolutely, the only time I make coils is right when I get home from work. I'll toss on a good show, pour a glass of whiskey, drink it, and get building, by the time I'm done building I'm relaxed and happy and able to enjoy my evening (whiskey is optional but a nice addition :D)
 

C.Alexander

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I was using the Iclear, VCT, Subtank. The Haze has better flavor, for me, than the Griffin.
I guess I just need to get better at different coils. I am just using 24 Kanthal at the moment.
 

JERUS

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I was using the Iclear, VCT, Subtank. The Haze has better flavor, for me, than the Griffin.
I guess I just need to get better at different coils. I am just using 24 Kanthal at the moment.
Try wrapping it in parallel, and try twisting it up, those two would be where I'd start and you should notice an increase in flavor. The Haze is a flavor beast though. I still find I get a better flavor from it, but I just get more from my griffin (which has more complex and dual coil builds). Think powdered drink mix. Haze is my favorite mix, just perfect. The Griffin I use 6oz instead of 8oz of water but a lower quality mix, so it's not as good of a flavor but it's richer.

I have a 2X24gSS/40gK wrap Fused Clapton in my Haze, and some 3X26gK/38gK Alien coils in my Griffin right now. Both amazing. Then I have 2X26gK/40gK in my Avocado. Haze purest flavor, Griffin richest, Avocado right in between the two. All three excellent and I rotate them and keep different flavors in each. Though my Favorite flavor is in my Griffin (keylime Pie from V³).
 

VapeVillian

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Try wrapping it in parallel, and try twisting it up, those two would be where I'd start and you should notice an increase in flavor. The Haze is a flavor beast though. I still find I get a better flavor from it, but I just get more from my griffin (which has more complex and dual coil builds). Think powdered drink mix. Haze is my favorite mix, just perfect. The Griffin I use 6oz instead of 8oz of water but a lower quality mix, so it's not as good of a flavor but it's richer.

I have a 2X24gSS/40gK wrap Fused Clapton in my Haze, and some 3X26gK/38gK Alien coils in my Griffin right now. Both amazing. Then I have 2X26gK/40gK in my Avocado. Haze purest flavor, Griffin richest, Avocado right in between the two. All three excellent and I rotate them and keep different flavors in each. Though my Favorite flavor is in my Griffin (keylime Pie from V³).
These are some great builds. Something OP may want to try is nichrome80 as the wrap, or the cores (if you want a faster ramp up) to bring out a crisper flavor. I also find its much easier to wrap w/ nichrome80 than w/ kanthal.

Just my $.02

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EndDetour

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I started building 1/8" 28awg kanthal A-1 coils and found the most satisfying build after that was parallel coils. And you don't need to stop at 2 wires, mix and match at your pleasure between straight wire, twisted, braided, Clapton... By the way if you have a drill handy twisted wire is much easier and clean. Then I found fused claptons. I kinda skipped over standard guitar strings. And then on to more interesting builds. Most more satisfying than the last. I would suggest going onto YouTube and learning basics. Dare I say rip trippers. I found inspiration when watching twisted messes', squid dude's and ohmboyoc's videos to make more complicated builds. If you trip over to the "post your builds" thread on this forum( and start from the beginning you find a shmorgesborg of inspiration from avid builders, feedback, comprehensive explanations, and an idea of what kinds of wire are better for different build before you go ordering something you'll regret.


-every animal has an adequate amount of gray matter in its cranium to tan and preserve its own hide-
 

C.Alexander

Member For 4 Years
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Thanks all!, I found a roll of 28ga kanthal and started some twisting with the drill. Tried 2,3 and 4 strands, 3 looked the best (as i over-twisted the others)
so I made a .5 ohm coil for the Haze. Definite improvement !! Unfortunately I also came across a couple of boxes of old (pre sub-ohm) wood mods and bottom feeders. Hehe, wouldn't want to try those with the new atties and tanks. If I can find a free photo site I will upload some pics.
 

CrazyChef

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FYI, You can just drag and drop your pictures right into your forum message.
 

EndDetour

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Thanks all!, I found a roll of 28ga kanthal and started some twisting with the drill. Tried 2,3 and 4 strands, 3 looked the best (as i over-twisted the others)
so I made a .5 ohm coil for the Haze. Definite improvement !! Unfortunately I also came across a couple of boxes of old (pre sub-ohm) wood mods and bottom feeders. Hehe, wouldn't want to try those with the new atties and tanks. If I can find a free photo site I will upload some pics.
If you over twist just reverse the drill. Same if you let go too soon and it snaps into a wave, just twist and untwist a bit until it straightens out.
The hardest time I had when I first started with 28awg kanthal A-1 was how springy it was. Even if I got really tight wraps by hand it would expand into a much larger inner diameter.
Heat the wire with a lighter or torch until I glows red and move your way down the wire. This will take out the spring in its step, it will also give it a curve. Throw that wire on the drill and twist for 20-40 rotations and it should straighten the hell out of it for you. This will make it much easier for parallel coils keeping the wraps tight and prevents twisted wire from having one or more elongated wires. Just my $.02.
P.s. If you hammer your twisted wire on something flat and smooth you'll get more surface area=more flavor and more vapor, less ramp time, and an interesting looking coil.


-every animal has an adequate amount of gray matter in its cranium to tan and preserve its own hide-
 

raymo2u

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Thanks all!, I found a roll of 28ga kanthal and started some twisting with the drill. Tried 2,3 and 4 strands, 3 looked the best (as i over-twisted the others)
so I made a .5 ohm coil for the Haze. Definite improvement !! Unfortunately I also came across a couple of boxes of old (pre sub-ohm) wood mods and bottom feeders. Hehe, wouldn't want to try those with the new atties and tanks. If I can find a free photo site I will upload some pics.
If you cant resize the pics (if you dont know how). Download Gyazo and then you can drag a cross hair over what you want to screenshot, then just right click the pic on the screen that will pop up and copy the Image link. Go to your post/reply, and then click the picture next to the smile button and then paste the image link in that and it will load the screenshot onto the post so people can view it.
If you have Windows you should be ab le to right click your normal picture on your computer and then click "Edit". Then go to the Edit Tab at the top and click Resize, resize it by 55% and then save it and drag it to your post. Then you can choose for it to be a Thumbnail or Fullsize Image in the post.
 

C.Alexander

Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
little better view of the grain.
 

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C.Alexander

Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
I will have to rewire anything used with todays sub-ohm stuff. Spend a couple of months messing with RDAs and coil building first.
 

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