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kelli

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for myself, i can peacefully co-exist here and at ECF. when i want to be at a nanny state forum run by heavy handed moderators, where i have to weigh everything i say, i will go there.

when i want to be self aware, free thinking and able to express my opinions without fear of reprisal, i will come here.

easy peasy! :)
 

StrappedKaos

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Honestly Kellie, we may not have agreed on much in the outside but out of all the KPC you and katmar would at least follow up with information instead of just pushing the topic towards meaningless banter. I will say that even if you wont agree with me, many people agree that a small group of people on there were in it just to bait and and harass others because they didn't even use the site for vaping after being members for over 5 years, just happy time in the outside. I said it before and I will say it again.... I might not agree with what you say but I will fight to the death for your right to say it, but i like others join these sites not only for vaping but also to talk about all things that we enjoy with fellow vapers.
 

ripple69420

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Can you say Progressive because this is what it is. Is ECF formed in Russia or maybe China? Seems like EFC has failed once again. What were they thinking? Well IM sure when they see all the supporters pulling out Including all mine they may learn this is America and freedom of speech is what this country is based on and what we the people live for. The only word I can think of pertaining to this is (STUPID).
I was wondering that myself wally. The way they are and the way their rules are makes me think that they come from a country that doesn't believe in freedom of speech or any freedoms!!! Someone said above that they have the right to set up the site and have any rules they want and I believe that too! I also worry about people like them trying to force their will on others.
 

driter

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Seems to me that any forum has the right to set their own rules. Seems fair. So if I don't agree with the rules I just don't have to go there but if I do I should play by their rules in their house. A number of forums have been "spin offs" from ECF and each has rules and yes they ban members also.

Two competing forums going to war with each other seems counter productive to me and splits the vaping community into factions. Freedom not only applies to speech but other moral and ethical positions. All our freedoms should be respected and where we disagree we should be able to debate in a civilized manner.

I hope clickbang approaches this in a civil manner and not in a "hatchet attack".
 

tombaker

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It matters on many different levels. They are the biggest vaping forum in the world. You cant link to anything that deals with my name or this site. Simple things like giveaways all the way up to breaking news on new mods - not longer can be posted.

ECF represents itself as the forum for the community, the oldest, the biggest. Most people on the internet understand forums, and rules of them. Content will be made by discussions, a back and forth, and with the exception of personal attacks and swearing and such, the content will remain, the discussions will continue without being edited. That is the expectation of all users and all readers, and many readers won't be logged in, or with even have login IDs. There are plenty of examples of users being "moved on" and banned from ECF for simple mistakes, but there is a bigger problem.

ECF (http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com) bans, deletes, and controls content of what posters write. They ban people based on content.

I was banned because I disagreed and backed it up about what Bill Godshall, and CASAA were doing, and what the FDA can do under the regulations.
Banned for ideas.

For new readers, ECF represents themselves as the defacto standard of Vaping discussion forums. But what they are delivered is controlled content determined by the Oliver Kershaw and Chris Price, the owners. I have major issues with controlled content, in a discussion forum, being represented out as a Community.

I have plenty of personal examples, of my OP threads with 13K views and 800 replies, being locked down. A similar sized thread being moved away into a locked down area, behind a password required login. This was done so thread posters would still see the replies, but it would be censored from Google. My first thread had the title changed, because retired1 moderator, a vaper of just 6 months, said they did not want Google results showing up with a title with BPA inside of Polycarbonate Clearomizers, and the consequences of Tank Crackers Juices.
Saying anything critical of CASAA is met with attacks, by Moderators called "CASAA Moderators" SonicDSL specifically.

Let me give another example of a ban I witnessed. A thread was created by me about Hayward CA, discussing whether they would Zone Out the 5 Vape Shops in the town, and ban all new stores. A vendor in that town said he would show up to the City Council. His posts were removed, and he was banned.....why?.....because he was a Vendor, Store owner, who was writing in a section not approved for Vendors, and he was not registered as Vendor as of yet with ECF.​

I dared to address some of the pure out wrong information being written by Bill Godshall, and being Globally Stickied on all thread Categories, including stickyed where you have to click to get past them, even if not logged in. Here is a post by the site Owner Chris Price about Bill Godshall. Such devotion: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...odshall-update-2014-06-13-a.html#post13434294

My problem is that ECF bans content, and removes those who express ideas different that the site owners, and represents itself as a forum of the community. When in actuality they are a profit based organization, sucking in volunteer writers, editing their words and/or removing them, while sucking in vendors to have the privilege to speak. Speak up, and be banned.

But ECF is savvy to have even come up with a new term, so new users don't catch wind of the controlled message. No one shows as BANNED as is standard for nearly all forums. The authors just show up as "moved on". As if they just left, freely. And when you are "moved on", you can never see your PMs again, any contacts made are eliminated, they can not write to you, and you can never see what they wrote to you. Any time you spent doing something for the community and any friends or contacts you made....vanished and locked away from sight.​
 
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driter

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Funny thing is that I was banned from a forum because I expressed my dislike for all the fowl language and sexual content . Banned because I didn't fit the "mold" of the majority. That forum touted it had no rules. I just moved on and went elsewhere. No sense crying over spilled milk.
 

kelli

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Funny thing is that I was banned from a forum because I expressed my dislike for all the fowl language and sexual content . Banned because I didn't fit the "mold" of the majority. That forum touted it had no rules. I just moved on and went elsewhere. No sense crying over spilled milk.

you may have a problem here then. just sayin'....

(we talk about chickens a lot)
 

kelli

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Honestly Kellie, we may not have agreed on much in the outside but out of all the KPC you and katmar would at least follow up with information instead of just pushing the topic towards meaningless banter. I will say that even if you wont agree with me, many people agree that a small group of people on there were in it just to bait and and harass others because they didn't even use the site for vaping after being members for over 5 years, just happy time in the outside. I said it before and I will say it again.... I might not agree with what you say but I will fight to the death for your right to say it, but i like others join these sites not only for vaping but also to talk about all things that we enjoy with fellow vapers.

we have a basic difference of philosophy about a lot of things, but isn't that what makes life interesting? :)
 

kelli

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For new readers, ECF represents themselves as the defacto standard of Vaping discussion forums. But what they are delivered is controlled content determined by the Oliver Kershaw and Chris Price, the owners. I have major issues with controlled content, in a discussion forum, being represented out as a Community.

I have plenty of personal examples, of my OP threads with 13K views and 800 replies, being locked down. A similar sized thread being moved away into a locked down area, behind a password required login. This was done so thread posters would still see the replies, but it would be censored from Google. My first thread had the title changed, because retired1 moderator, a vaper of just 6 months, said they did not want Google results showing up with a title with BPA inside of Polycarbonate Clearomizers, and the consequences of Tank Crackers Juices.
Saying anything critical of CASAA is met with attacks, by Moderators called "CASAA Moderators" SonicDSL specifically.

i wondered how one of the mods you mentioned moved up the chain of command so fast. he was a moderator after just a few months, then an administrator shortly after that. he ragged on me constantly about every little thing. they did their best to break my spirit over there, but i persevered. kinda sorta.
 

Zamazam

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I went back to a dying thread on ECF regarding the Hana Modz V3 clone where there has been a few posts linking to VaporJoes blog regarding news about the clones. Today I see that "VaporJoe" is now the equivalent to cursing on the ECF. Completely censored! Add to that, and I kinda, sorta understand why, "Vapingunderground" is also censored. I realized this when I couldn't send a direct link in a private message to someone who had asked about the forum. So now there no linking to anything on the blog without complications. There's a lot of good information on the ECF, but I think they may be taking this a bit far at this point... It's not censored because it's distasteful, but rather because of possible loss of traffic? Thoughts?

The censorship is due to turfism and knowing that a good number of folks will move over to a forum where they can discuss and debate, question and relate matters of the vaping community without harpies parsing every sentence for political correctness. A bigger reason is that ECF is pissed that a competitor is in the ring and taking away their stranglehold on vendors and advertising $$. In the end, its about money and competition.

I used to be an admin on a couple political sites, I had to constantly reign in my mods from banning or censoring people because of their political beliefs, spammers and trolls were another story.

ECF is pissed off because of a lost of advertising $$, plus the fact that their coveted status as the largest vaping topic site has been challenged. Let them continue to censor and ban people, its their loss and vapingunderground's gain.
 

Fear

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i wondered how one of the mods you mentioned moved up the chain of command so fast. he was a moderator after just a few months, then an administrator shortly after that. he ragged on me constantly about every little thing. they did their best to break my spirit over there, but i persevered. kinda sorta.

Well, howdy!
 
Wow!!! What an eye opener. I have been a member of ECF for years. I don't have as much time as I wish to spend on them but I find myself putting one and one together and now getting the whole picture. It also caught my eye that more people are listed as "Moved On" lately and the moderation of the forum has gotten, shall we say "gestapo" like in past year. What a absolute disappointment that was once a great forum but I am truly turned off by their actions lately and am glad we now have a excellent place to go. Thank you VaporJoe for this opportunity!
 

Chainvapor

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i cant even remember my password to ECF, and frankly IDGAF. with shit like that why would anyone want to go back?

i bet their mods will lurk here and ban any users with the same username on their forum that has switched to vapingunderground.

I am wondering if that is part of the reason they were so quick to permanently ban me over bullshit. Oh well. There loss.

CV :)
 

supermarket

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I was wondering that myself wally. The way they are and the way their rules are makes me think that they come from a country that doesn't believe in freedom of speech or any freedoms!!! Someone said above that they have the right to set up the site and have any rules they want and I believe that too! I also worry about people like them trying to force their will on others.

Now that is a ridiculous post.

One thing many people fail to understand, is that there is no laws protecting your freedom of speech on the internet.

I can't tell you guys how many times I've heard someone ranting about freedom of speech in reference to an online message board. A message board is on a web-site run by a person or company. The person or company makes ALL the rules. You have no RIGHTS to post there, NO rights to freedom of speech, no rights to ANYTHING. Posting on any message board is a privilege, not a right.

Having said that, ECF makes their stance clear. They are a board centered around e-cigs, but pretty much based around CASAA, with EXTREMELY strict and conservative posting guidelines. If that is the type of atmosphere people like, then it is perfect for them. Me personally, I prefer the more open and free flowing atmosphere here at VU. In fact, the ONLY reason I will continue to post at, and browse ECF, is because of the huge member base. Once VU gets maybe 1/3 of the traffic that ECF gets, I doubt I'll visit their site much anymore at all.

I also kind of wish that this forum had the layout more similar to ECF's, or VBB/UB or whatever message board software that is. I like it a lot better than whats here, but I can make sacrifices :)
 

tombaker

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Clickbang Radio on Tuesday will be taking this issue up.. ITS GOING ON THE CHOPPING BLOCK!

Whats click bang? Check out when i was on the chopping block a year ago:

https://soundcloud.com/soundcloud.com%2Fvp-live%2Fthe-vaperjoe-fasttech-1
It is an all time classic. Russ does an amazing job moderating.
I listen to these things and sometimes pick out stuff that I think nobody focuses on. Listen at around 1:12 and specifically at 1:13.20

“I wouldn’t have told you about it, I would have had been having MODS....” then

“I know ever single one of the MODs in there, I could have had them delete all of the PRO Joe posts, I left them there, because I wanted to start a conversation about it.

So very generous of him to leave up the posts by other people he disagrees with, and he can have the Mods do his bidding.
 

5150sick

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I am wondering if that is part of the reason they were so quick to permanently ban me over bullshit. Oh well. There loss.

CV :)

I was just over there. I am not banned yet. I may decide to fuck with em' until I get banned next time I'm bored.
 

Galaxyrider

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I love this bar... uh.. FORUM! I had hell getting on ECF, after seeing this, I'm going to go back and tell them to drop me from their rolls. I'm gonna ban them!
 

Galaxyrider

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I really don't have a dog in this fight but.....

I'm pretty new to the ECF forum and only been a member for a couple months. I've been following VaporJoes blog for even less time but I think it is top notch and I joined this forum after hearing about it on the blog.

That said......why do you think any of you have the right to use ECF to advertise this forum? It seems very dishonest to me for someone to start their own forum and then go over to a competitors forum and try to poach its members which is exactly what some of you in this thread freely admit to doing. In my mind, it is theft. If I owned ECF, I would absolutely do the same thing they just did and add it to the filter.

Look, this forum is going to be HUGE and may likely some day soon eclipse ECF. You obviously have your shit together and a very loyal memberbase. Don't turn this place into an anti-ECF forum where everyone just sits around and bitches about ECF. Don't dedicate any energy into poking at or posting on ECF. You are better than that. Make your own way, set yourself apart from the competition and then concentrate on what you are, not what someone else isn't. Stupid fighting like this polarizes communities and hurts you in the long run.

..........and holy hell, don't contaminate your blog with that kind of petty shit.
REAL soon I think! :)
 

Galaxyrider

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I opened a ticket on ECF..
MY MEMBERSHIP
Please drop me from your rolls, and remove my name.

I said it nicely.. hoping that they will do it quickly!
 

The Ocelot

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Don't miss ECF one bit, and definitely don't regret getting banned for arguing with classless wife. LOL
Sometimes it just felt like you were dealing with people like this over at ECF:

vxkfph.jpg

Excuse me. I am the ProVarinati Princess and made the Pax Vobiscum banner. It means Go in Peace. I post it when trolls are on the loose. I have no idea who the creature in the picture is. An ECF mod perhaps?

The blocking thing is nutz! I used to post links to Joe's blog all the time when people were looking for deals, now suddenly they have a problem with it?

1gg.gif
 

Galaxyrider

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haha I got banned for talking about the TFA flavor mary jane ha !!!! then I proceeded to rebel and welp here I am. I am glad it happened. VU is way better
I keep seeing that name.. Mary Jane, is that really a mxrijuana taste alike?? Don't laff, I dunno! hahaha
 

Giraut

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Could somebody sum up in a few words what beef ECF has with Vaporjoe? I briefly saw a thread on ECF about the word "Vaporjoe" being censored, but before I could ask what it was all about, the thread got "rendered" and disappeared. So I'm mildly interested - "mildly" being the keyword here, mind you...

FWIW, I have nothing against ECF, because it's their house and I was their guest. Their house, their rules after all. But some mods rewrote/moved/sanitized a few of my posts, and I got tired of their shenaningans.

The final straw was when I called certain kinds of mods dumb, and an overzealous political correctness officer of theirs reckoned I was "insulting", rewrote my post and issued me an "infraction". I really couldn't help but laugh: I felt I had gotten slapped on the wrist for hurting the poor little sensitive Care Bears' feelings :)

So I figured I'd find me another forum in which people wouldn't be so easily offended. And what better forum than the one the Care Bears just censored eh? ;)
 

kelli

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Could somebody sum up in a few words what beef ECF has with Vaporjoe? I briefly saw a thread on ECF about the word "Vaporjoe" being censored, but before I could ask what it was all about, the thread got "rendered" and disappeared. So I'm mildly interested - "mildly" being the keyword here, mind you...

FWIW, I have nothing against ECF, because it's their house and I was their guest. Their house, their rules after all. But some mods rewrote/moved/sanitized a few of my posts, and I got tired of their shenaningans.

The final straw was when I called certain kinds of mods dumb, and an overzealous political correctness officer of theirs reckoned I was "insulting", rewrote my post and issued me an "infraction". I really couldn't help but laugh: I felt I had gotten slapped on the wrist for hurting the poor little sensitive Care Bears' feelings :)

So I figured I'd find me another forum in which people wouldn't be so easily offended. And what better forum than the one the Care Bears just censored eh? ;)

that is my biggest gripe with that place.....the deleting and editing of posts. i had it happen a number of times and when i bitched about it, i was given a "vacation" and "serious infraction" demerits. holy fillet of fuck, it's not like i killed anybody!

and as far as their problem with joe, i assume it's because he is a rebel (i.e. free thinker) with opinions. they HATE that!
 

The Ocelot

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i'd like to know how the USPS delivered those with that address.
giggle.gif

There aren't many ocelots who receive mail at all, but I'm the obvious choice for vaping gear.;

The font is different over here. I misread your signature as: Don't you mess with a little girl's dream...cause she's liable to grow up a man.
 
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HeadInClouds

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that is my biggest gripe with that place.....the deleting and editing of posts. i had it happen a number of times and when i bitched about it, i was given a "vacation" and "serious infraction" demerits. holy fillet of fuck, it's not like i killed anybody!

and as far as their problem with joe, i assume it's because he is a rebel (i.e. free thinker) with opinions. they HATE that!

Censorship of my PMs there was the final straw for me!

They consider this a website with 'inappropriate content' - that's why they don't allow mention of or links to vapingunderground. It's the only part of their (hilariously long and detailed) posted rules that could possibly apply.
 

kelli

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There aren't many ocelots who receive mail at all, but I'm the obvious choice for vaping gear.;

The font is different over here. I misread your signature as: Don't you mess with a little girl's dream...cause she's liable to grow up be a man.

heehee. maybe ocelot needs her peepers checked. ;)
 

CurlyxCracker

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Censorship of my PMs there was the final straw for me!

They consider this a website with 'inappropriate content' - that's why they don't allow mention of or links to vapingunderground. It's the only part of their (hilariously long and detailed) posted rules that could possibly apply.
That doesn't explain VaporJoe being censored though. His blog was allowed before...
 

5150sick

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That doesn't explain VaporJoe being censored though. His blog was allowed before...

Not only that it is also the NAME the man goes by in the Vaping Community!
I know how pissed off I would be if a place I donated to decided my NAME was not allowed to ever be written again!

3 hours until Clickbang!!!
 

wllmc

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I keep seeing that name.. Mary Jane, is that really a mxrijuana taste alike?? Don't laff, I dunno! hahaha
haha no I dont know , someone just asked about it and me having a scene of humor I made the mistake of making a joke. ECF aint having that
 

kelli

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Now that is something you don't hear everyday. I think I have found my new catchphrase when I'm frustrated. Thanks for that

so welcome. and i think that's the first time i said the f word on this forum. guess i lost my virginity so to speak.
 

WiSilverVape

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so welcome. and i think that's the first time i said the f word on this forum. guess i lost my virginity so to speak.

Yeah, I have to be so careful what I say at work and the world is so damn PC that it feels weird to use strong language here.....but I'll fucking get the fuck over it. :confused:
 

Chowder

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Excuse me. I am the ProVarinati Princess and made the Pax Vobiscum banner. It means Go in Peace. I post it when trolls are on the loose. I have no idea who the creature in the picture is. An ECF mod perhaps?

The blocking thing is nutz! I used to post links to Joe's blog all the time when people were looking for deals, now suddenly they have a problem with it?

1gg.gif


THE PRINCESS HAS ARRIVED! I always enjoyed the wealth of information you provided on the ECF. It was always an honor conversing with you over there! Let me be one of the first to welcome @The Ocelot to the Underground!
 

CurlyxCracker

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Joes and Rage on nova atm. Russ isn't there though
 

realsis

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Hi, I know this is a older thread but I felt I needed to put my 2 cents in. First I want to thank you joe for giving us a place to speak freely and express ourselves without fear of persecution. I want to say, I am a member of both forums. However early on when I joined ecf I almost got banned and got a infraction and a warning for a completely and totally innocent post. This instantly left a sour tastell in my mouth. The post was this "hi all, a friend from my husband's work tried my juice and now she wants me to sell her some. I was quite s suprised as i don't sell and just make it for home use. I was wondering what I should charge if I sell it to her. I was very s uprisingly she requested this. What do you think is a fair charge?" ....my thread was shut down, I got a warning and a black mark of infraction. I also noticed a * astrik appeared by my name that was not there before. My post was innocent. I think they are going way to far with their moderation. I felt ashamed, embarrassed and I shouldn't have been made to feel that way over that post. They need to loosen the reigns a little or they are going to loose potentially valuable members of their community. That said, again thank you for a forum we can be free to speak in
 

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