Liquid nicotine needs stricter regulation, state says

[Mike H.]

So?

I'm not allowed to save money by switching to vaping?

I find it interesting that you insist that you know what's best for how much of my own money I get to keep. Why do you insist on volunteering my money to the government? If $352 is nothing to you, let me know. I'll send you my address so you can mail me a check. It's only $1 a day. You apparently don't need it.

you can do what you want with your money...If you switched to vaping you're already saving money ,i will assume.

I was trying to avoid the whole tax argument thats also in this thread but i just cant now.

There arent very many reasons you may or may not get away with out paying taxes and gloating about it.

1.) You're a welfare recipient who collects less than the amount required to even have to file taxes.

2.) You arent employed by a legit company or a boss whos evading taxes as well?..(boss possibly being you IF self employed and cheating on taxes to not owe?)

3.) You dont even work and live in moms basement?

4.) This one is just a toss up but, maybe you were possibly in prison once and miss big bubba and youre trying to get back in?

If its none of those 4 then please write a book on how to shaft the government and get away with it, you wont need my 365 dollars a year...youll have millions pouring in

 

[Time]

People won't read. They don't read bills to see what's in them. They don't read laws.

you can do what you want with your money...If you switched to vaping you're already saving money ,i will assume.

I was trying to avoid the whole tax argument thats also in this thread but i just cant now.

There arent very many reasons you may or may not get away with out paying taxes and gloating about it.

1.) You're a welfare recipient who collects less than the amount required to even have to file taxes.

2.) You arent employed by a legit company or a boss whos evading taxes as well?..(boss possibly being you IF self employed and cheating on taxes to not owe?)

3.) You dont even work and live in moms basement?

4.) This one is just a toss up but, maybe you were possibly in prison once and miss big bubba and youre trying to get back in?

If its none of those 4 then please write a book on how to shaft the government and get away with it, you wont need my 365 dollars a year...youll have millions pouring in

LOL. First you want to volunteer my money to the government, now you just outright try to insult me when I call you on it.

Keep guessing, you fell short. I will add that the answer is on VU.

You never did answer my question though and while your attempt at an insult is an interesting distraction, I still kind of want to know. Why do you feel inclined to volunteer my money to the service of the government?

 

[efektt]

http://www.idsnews.com/article/2015...-says?_h=a748589c-2208-4c69-917d-aac7e983b4ee

"Currently, in order to purchase an e-cigarette a person needs to be at least 18 years old, but there are no age restrictions on the purchase of e-liquids."

They can say it over and over again but I still am never going to believe this.
If "ecigs" are illegal for minors in Indiana than eliquid sure as hell is too.
This weasel is looking for a "it's for the children" way to slip a tax through - 5150


It should truthfully read:
Liquid nicotine needs to be taxed, state says

I apoligize for starting the derailing of your thread. All talk that is not related to the originak post should be taken to a new thread.

 

[Mike H.]

People won't read. They don't read bills to see what's in them. They don't read laws.


LOL. First you want to volunteer my money to the government, now you just outright try to insult me when I call you on it.

Keep guessing, you fell short. I will add that the answer is on VU.

You never did answer my question though and while your attempt at an insult is an interesting distraction, I still kind of want to know. Why do you feel inclined to volunteer my money to the service of the government?

Im asking how you avoid paying taxes...those were just things that came to mind...Hardly insults but possible legit reasons.

Im not volunteering your money at all....this discussion is on how the government is telling us we have to pay them money to continue to vape.

YOU started with the other end of this whole tax thing...not me.

So answer how you get away with not paying taxes...Home owner? Business owner?.. A legit job with a company?

If none of those apply, please enlighten us.

 

[freemind]

this isnt a movement, nor is anyone against me personally. this is a fact i am trying to tell you. if you refuse to read the law that no one can deny then there is nothing further to say on that and you willfully accept that you choose to ignore very important information regarding the use of violence by our government against the people.

and yes i do know the federal government a specific duty to uphold a national defense system. which is why there is a tax, but if it were required it would be struck down by the supreme court based on the constitution overriding it. so they had to word it constitutionally by making sure it was voluntary on paper, then they enforce it as if it were required to keep the entire nation paying something they really dont have to. this is not legal, this is putting people in cages for abiding by the law. and that is not an opinion

No, you'd LIKE this to be a movement. One you don't have to have any skin in.

I am well aware of the use of violence the government, federal, state and local, use against the people. I don't live under a rock.

P.S. the Federal government has MORE duties than just national defense. Yes, they over step those boundaries LEGALLY so long as no one can strike down laws and regulations to the contrary.

What you are failing to see is two things.
1 A law is a law until it is struck down. It doesn't matter if you think it isn't. It doesn't matter if you claim to know it's not law. What you say is NOT the final word. What the judge says, IS. A man of principle locked away in prison, is STILL a criminal according to the laws and everyone's perception based on his public record.

2 If you don't like something, then make a move to change it. Meaning, get off your own duff and make change. I spent a lot of years trying to educate people. Know why it doesn't work? Because people have to get off their asses and DO something to make change. Your references to the law as written and some author going into minute detail about how the tax laws are wrong, makes NOT ONE TINY difference. Not one. Because no one is going to do a damn thing to change things.

You are not doing absolutely ANYTHING in this conversation, other than arguing. Arguing with me. On one hand, I agree the tax laws are unconstitutional. On the other, is the reality they are NOT being challenged and struck down. So, reality is that they are the LAW. Bitching how I am SOOOO wrong makes not ONE iota of difference. Because I am right. They ARE the law of the land, just like ANY other law, until it is challenged and struck down. Your stance is not freeing ANYONE still in prison for tax evasion.

If you are not willing to get your hands dirty, and put some skin in the game, what are you other than a town crier that no one is listening to? How "right" are you, that armed with this information, you are not doing a damn thing to make life better (for yourself or others)?

There are far larger issues that exist. More important rights are being squashed. What about them? Where is our hero of "right" on those? You fail to see, people just honestly don't give a shit about this stuff. I know. Been there, done that.

Never forget, the victor writes history, and to go further, makes the laws and rules. You can do one of three things in life.
1 Bitch about stuff
2 Live under the rules and realize you don't care to fight.
3 FIGHT and make change.

 

[M5amhan]

No, you'd LIKE this to be a movement. One you don't have to have any skin in.

I am well aware of the use of violence the government, federal, state and local, use against the people. I don't live under a rock.

P.S. the Federal government has MORE duties than just national defense. Yes, they over step those boundaries LEGALLY so long as no one can strike down laws and regulations to the contrary.

What you are failing to see is two things.
1 A law is a law until it is struck down. It doesn't matter if you think it isn't. It doesn't matter if you claim to know it's not law. What you say is NOT the final word. What the judge says, IS. A man of principle locked away in prison, is STILL a criminal according to the laws and everyone's perception based on his public record.

2 If you don't like something, then make a move to change it. Meaning, get off your own duff and make change. I spent a lot of years trying to educate people. Know why it doesn't work? Because people have to get off their asses and DO something to make change. Your references to the law as written and some author going into minute detail about how the tax laws are wrong, makes NOT ONE TINY difference. Not one. Because no one is going to do a damn thing to change things.

You are not doing absolutely ANYTHING in this conversation, other than arguing. Arguing with me. On one hand, I agree the tax laws are unconstitutional. On the other, is the reality they are NOT being challenged and struck down. So, reality is that they are the LAW. Bitching how I am SOOOO wrong makes not ONE iota of difference. Because I am right. They ARE the law of the land, just like ANY other law, until it is challenged and struck down. Your stance is not freeing ANYONE still in prison for tax evasion.

If you are not willing to get your hands dirty, and put some skin in the game, what are you other than a town crier that no one is listening to? How "right" are you, that armed with this information, you are not doing a damn thing to make life better (for yourself or others)?

There are far larger issues that exist. More important rights are being squashed. What about them? Where is our hero of "right" on those? You fail to see, people just honestly don't give a shit about this stuff. I know. Been there, done that.

Never forget, the victor writes history, and to go further, makes the laws and rules. You can do one of three things in life.
1 Bitch about stuff
2 Live under the rules and realize you don't care to fight.
3 FIGHT and make change.

when did i ever say the law wasnt the law? i said the law of the land says paying federal taxes is optional, or as worded voluntary and as you keep saying that is the law of the land and should be enforced as such. however, they are enforcing it like it is required and they have everyone believing it is required because the consequences are real. do you understand what im saying? people need to understand these type of things, its not a movement or anything like that. its a piece of information, you can sling shit at me all you want but it makes no difference

 

[Time]

Im asking how you avoid paying taxes...those were just things that came to mind...Hardly insults but possible legit reasons.

Im not volunteering your money at all....this discussion is on how the government is telling us we have to pay them money to continue to vape.

YOU started with the other end of this whole tax thing...not me.

So answer how you get away with not paying taxes...Home owner? Business owner?.. A legit job with a company?

If none of those apply, please enlighten us.

You are volunteering my money. You basically said the 40% is no big deal. "Are we really that broke?"

This isnt some conspiracy against e cig users...Its a tax other business's pay already to sell cigarettes or beer or chewing tobacco or whatever else falls under ATF regulation bull shit.

Were not going to stop the tax no matter how much we rebel or protest or complain about it.

We should consider ourselves lucky its not a full on ban of anything vape wise and can get us tickets or jail time to have it in our possesion.

people are already paying stupid prices for e juice b4 this tax so whats 40 percent tax on the price...40 cents more on the dollar?

So now the $5.00 dollar 10ml bottle of juice is $7.00...are we really that broke?..Maybe some will stop screwing people with the rediculous prices they charge and make it so its affordable with the tax included.

Not paying income tax is a simple matter. It's not hard. It's not illegal. It requires no book. I don't have much taxable income. I suspect that you'll want to know more so, as a disabled vet, much of my income is not taxable income.

You think 40% sales tax is no big deal. It's not worth fighting over. Propose a 40% sales tax on fast food and see what happens. People will fight it and they'll win. They'll fight it because they don't want their money taken. But, if they aren't the ones that have to pay it, they don't care if vapers pay a 40% sales tax. The tax is a punishment for doing what some people think is wrong. I'm not going to say it's okay to pay the government because I'm doing something that people don't want me to do. You won't see a 40% tax on food, clothes, toothpaste and ect. The sin tax is just that. A tax to punish you for what you are doing.

 

[Mike H.]

You are volunteering my money. You basically said the 40% is no big deal. "Are we really that broke?"



Not paying income tax is a simple matter. It's not hard. It's not illegal. It requires no book. I don't have much taxable income. I suspect that you'll want to know more so, as a disabled vet, much of my income is not taxable income.

You think 40% sales tax is no big deal. It's not worth fighting over. Propose a 40% sales tax on fast food and see what happens. People will fight it and they'll win. They'll fight it because they don't want their money taken. But, if they aren't the ones that have to pay it, they don't care if vapers pay a 40% sales tax. The tax is a punishment for doing what some people think is wrong. I'm not going to say it's okay to pay the government because I'm doing something that people don't want me to do. You won't see a 40% tax on food, clothes, toothpaste and ect. The sin tax is just that. A tax to punish you for what you are doing.

Ok ,so you dont HAVE to pay tax on most of your income...This is some key information left out with that part of the argument.

I could probably speak for most when i say it just sounded like you were coming across as some anti tax rebel who just refuses to pay taxes because you want to.

Thank you for you service to the country by the way.

What ever the tax will be its far better than banning it and making it illegal...Not that many wont aquire nicotine and other things illegally but its a start at least...People will be able to fight to lower the tax and for other issues concerning vaping but its a starting point at least...I agree 40 percent is alot considering the percentage of tax on other things but its better than a ban for now and is affordable to most.

 

[Time]

Ok ,so you dont HAVE to pay tax on most of your income...This is some key information left out with that part of the argument.

I could probably speak for most when i say it just sounded like you were coming across as some anti tax rebel who just refuses to pay taxes because you want to.

Thank you for you service to the country by the way.

What ever the tax will be its far better than banning it and making it illegal...Not that many wont aquire nicotine and other things illegally but its a start at least...People will be able to fight to lower the tax and for other issues concerning vaping but its a starting point at least...I agree 40 percent is alot considering the percentage of tax on other things but its better than a ban for now and is affordable to most.

I guess we should define "ban vaping". I don't think vaping will ever be fully banned. I think vaping will be regulated to the point that the way most people on this forum vape will be effectively banned. ecigs will never be banned. The only changes that will occur is the cost and type of vaping and who will be allowed to compete. I think before it's over, the average person will have a choice of big tobacco closed tank ecigs and a huge sin tax.

Allowing a sin tax is a concession. It concedes that vaping deserves special attention from government. It sets president. And of course, it costs people allot of money.

 

[Whiskey]

http://www.idsnews.com/article/2015...-says?_h=a748589c-2208-4c69-917d-aac7e983b4ee

"Currently, in order to purchase an e-cigarette a person needs to be at least 18 years old, but there are no age restrictions on the purchase of e-liquids."

They can say it over and over again but I still am never going to believe this.
If "ecigs" are illegal for minors in Indiana than eliquid sure as hell is too.
This weasel is looking for a "it's for the children" way to slip a tax through - 5150


It should truthfully read:
Liquid nicotine needs to be taxed, state says

I believe this was the subject at hand, This is the news area and 5150sick works mighty hard to get these stories out to the members. This is the first time I have seen one of his threads get so derailed the way it has, I'm gonna suggest that you guys start a new thread outside the news area to continue your debate, much appriciated