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Ordering from China (actually anywhere) Support Group...

Vape Fan

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How did your order get into the country? Are there Customs facilities in Syracuse? I thought they were only in port cities, with the exception of Chicago.
Looks like Syracuse has a port of entry. But here's what tracking looks like, sat at 3/29 for over 2 months, then just 2 days to my box. Weird, and untrustworthy.
trck.png

Doesn't happen very often but Its not unusual for mail to be delivered to me the same day it reaches Phoenix hub. #9 shows about 1am arrival and was trucked to Mesa then picked by my carrier a few mins later.

US has been ready to vote?
 
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Vape Fan

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Usps finally coming through with my 3fvape order. Only 3 or 4 weeks after everthing else I ordered.

Sent from a pile of wood chips
My last 2 orders were placed on the same day. Diff vendors. Mod + matching rta.
Mod delivered 4/22, RTA on 6/1 :mad:
 

Rhianne

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Fasttech order, DHL says it'll be delivered today by the end of the day, I'm betting on tomorrow:


Monday, June 01, 2020
Location Time Piece
14 With delivery courier BOSTON, MA - USA 10:07
1 Piece

13 Arrived at Delivery Facility in BOSTON - USA BOSTON, MA - USA 07:10
1 Piece

12 Departed Facility in CINCINNATI HUB - USA CINCINNATI HUB, OH - USA 03:39
1 Piece

11 Processed at CINCINNATI HUB - USA CINCINNATI HUB, OH - USA 02:16
1 Piece

UK order finally left NYC:

June 1, 2020, 5:01 am
Departed USPS Regional Facility
QUEENS NY DISTRIBUTION CENTER
Your item departed our USPS facility in QUEENS NY DISTRIBUTION CENTER on June 1, 2020 at 5:01 am. The item is currently in transit to the destination.

Soon

SQ Topside should be here in about 2 hours. Currently with mail carrier.

Dual nic orders show "in transit to destination".

Hopefully I'll be done with tracking stuff this week.

I’m in Queens. You’re in NY?
 

Creature0069

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I’m in Queens. You’re in NY?

Nope, my Topside Carbon has been there a week though. ;)

I grew up in Latham, NY though, very close to Albany. Live in Mass now. Last time I was in the city, Sandy Duncan played Peter Pan on Broadway. Field trip in 5th grade. lol
 

Rhianne

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Nope, my Topside Carbon has been there a week though. ;)

I grew up in Latham, NY though, very close to Albany. Live in Mass now. Last time I was in the city, Sandy Duncan played Peter Pan on Broadway. Field trip in 5th grade. lol

Usually mail gets held up in Brooklyn, after having to go to Metro NY no matter where it is. It’s very strange!

Hope things are okay in your area, considering the riots and everything else.

The city now is not somewhere I want to be. It’s depressing, I used to love it as a kid.
 

Creature0069

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Usually mail gets held up in Brooklyn, after having to go to Metro NY no matter where it is. It’s very strange!

Hope things are okay in your area, considering the riots and everything else.

The city now is not somewhere I want to be. It’s depressing, I used to love it as a kid.

Yeah it came from the UK. Landed at customs, went to Queens and has been "In transit" now for 2 days.

Still just locked down and quiet here. Thankfully. Pretty sure most of the "riot" types live in and around Boston, I'm near Cape Cod.
 

gsmit1

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I’m in Queens. You’re in NY?
I never lived in Queens, but i drove deliveries to every corner. I had stops in Brooklyn, Manhattan (Chinatown to Washington heights), The Bronx, Westchester and eastern Jersey. One stop on Staten Island. White Plains up to southern Connecticut (occasionally Hartford) and one time they sent me to Agawam Massachusetts. I'm pretty sure I did more driving in the NYC area in 5 years than most people do in their whole lives. :wait: No fun.
 

nadalama

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Well the postal service strikes again.

Order from eciggity (in Hawaii) that they still had as estimated delivery yesterday, has now been changed to Delivery Date Unknown, and tracking hasn't updated with an actual location since May 30.

Honest to god, I think they've gone flop-bot.
 

~Don~

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Well the postal service strikes again.

Order from eciggity (in Hawaii) that they still had as estimated delivery yesterday, has now been changed to Delivery Date Unknown, and tracking hasn't updated with an actual location since May 30.

Honest to god, I think they've gone flop-bot.

I have an order that says delivery today by 8pm, last scan was this morning still in VA.

Then I have an item being shipped from 120miles away, probably take 5 business day as usual.

I can get a RTA from Budapest in 2 days, a RDA from the UK in 2 days, but something in state and only 1.5hrs away... a week


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

nadalama

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I have an order that says delivery today by 8pm, last scan was this morning still in VA.

Then I have an item being shipped from 120miles away, probably take 5 business day as usual.

I can get a RTA from Budapest in 2 days, a RDA from the UK in 2 days, but something in state and only 1.5hrs away... a week


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

See what I mean? Their systems are all crazy.
 

gopher_byrd

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Well the postal service strikes again.

Order from eciggity (in Hawaii) that they still had as estimated delivery yesterday, has now been changed to Delivery Date Unknown, and tracking hasn't updated with an actual location since May 30.

Honest to god, I think they've gone flop-bot.
My wife ordered some face masks last month from Old Navy. Don't ask me why from them, I have learned to not ask her about shopping. Anyway, they have allegedly been in the distribution center 75 miles from us since last Friday and no expected delivery date. We put in a ticket, local PO calls and says maybe next week and are blaming covid. Sorry I'm not buying that. :cuss2:

Now to get vape related, my order from Eciggity made it here in a week from Hawaii after going through the same postal distribution center as my wifes masks. :crazy:
 

MrMeowgi

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My wife ordered some face masks last month from Old Navy. Don't ask me why from them, I have learned to not ask her about shopping. Anyway, they have allegedly been in the distribution center 75 miles from us since last Friday and no expected delivery date. We put in a ticket, local PO calls and says maybe next week and are blaming covid. Sorry I'm not buying that. :cuss2:

Now to get vape related, my order from Eciggity made it here in a week from Hawaii after going through the same postal distribution center as my wifes masks. :crazy:
That's crazy.

Sent from a pile of wood chips
 

Synphul

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One of these days I feel my corona mail will show up. Of course by then it'll probably be covid x.4 season 18 or something. My great grandkids will huddle around and ask 'granpappy, what's that?'.. Well you see young'uns, back in the day we found this great way to kick cigarettes called vaping. (Dusting off the relic rta). So what we'd do is.. It'd be like the smithsonian opening up mail, getting sent the sword excalibur from king Arthur himself, postmarked in the early 6th century. But hey, usps was all over it. They apologized, mail was slightly delayed due to the plague.
 

gsmit1

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Their estimated delivery day is meaningless. Utterly meaningless.

For instance I have one right now that's due to arrive yesterday.

Like @gopher_byrd said. I had like 6 or 7 (8?) orders all sitting for days either at my local PO or the Detroit hub across town. I order some wire from Kidney Puncher and it blows by everybody and gets here first. :confused: While the rest of them from a couple weeks earlier are still sitting there. There's just no satisfactory explanation for that.
 

Creature0069

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2 of 3 orders show:

June 4, 2020, 7:10 am
Out for Delivery
NEW BEDFORD, MA 02745
Your item is out for delivery on June 4, 2020 at 7:10 am in NEW BEDFORD, MA 02745.

A nic order is somehow back in mail purgatory. All 3 left the local distribution hub at the same time yesterday, only 2 made the 40 minute drive to my town. :slowclap:
It is entirely possible it just wasn't scanned but who knows. :popcorn:
 

Rhianne

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One of these days I feel my corona mail will show up. Of course by then it'll probably be covid x.4 season 18 or something. My great grandkids will huddle around and ask 'granpappy, what's that?'.. Well you see young'uns, back in the day we found this great way to kick cigarettes called vaping. (Dusting off the relic rta). So what we'd do is.. It'd be like the smithsonian opening up mail, getting sent the sword excalibur from king Arthur himself, postmarked in the early 6th century. But hey, usps was all over it. They apologized, mail was slightly delayed due to the plague.

Omg, that was funny. Thanks, I needed a good laugh first thing this morning. :giggle:
 

Rhianne

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2 of 3 orders show:

June 4, 2020, 7:10 am
Out for Delivery
NEW BEDFORD, MA 02745
Your item is out for delivery on June 4, 2020 at 7:10 am in NEW BEDFORD, MA 02745.

A nic order is somehow back in mail purgatory. All 3 left the local distribution hub at the same time yesterday, only 2 made the 40 minute drive to my town. :slowclap:
It is entirely possible it just wasn't scanned but who knows. :popcorn:

Mixing is verboten to you by order of USPS. :giggle: Hope you do get your orders soon, though.
 

Jinx'd

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2020-05-26 05:41 SHENZHEN, Arrived at Sort Facility SHENZHEN
2020-06-04 07:10 Shitcago area, Out for Delivery, Expected Delivery by 8:00pm

can't complain about that

i have another from here in the states. its on tour of the Shitcagoland area. or at least thats what tracking says. i bet its been in my local PO, and they will bring it when they feel like it.
 

AvaOrchid

Member For 4 Years
I guess this would be the place for this. So usually I love FastTech I mean I like them in general more than some American suppliers because I feel like they're more trustworthy. I ordered something on March 12th and it shipped March 16th. Well I thought it was lost because from March 16th to two days ago no update even on the tracker apps and it just basically said hey it's lost no activity for 60-plus days.

Suddenly it shows up in Central Florida rather than the usual Miami and go straight to the main Hub that delivers the mail to my County without apparently going through customs or at least didn't get any updates about it going through customs. It's supposed to be here today.

I am shocked because I really did think it was lost since orders placed after March have arrived. Now I know when you order from China sometimes things happen and I don't order things that I need quickly. And I know that there was a global pandemic and that that caused shipping disruptions but I also fundamentally believe that when they're shipping disruptions and things get started back to normal you should probably ship the first things that were ordered not the latest thing.

Anyhow I had contacted FastTech a couple times and basically got the blow off that I'll have to wait because Coronavirus. And I was getting ready to write something nasty without being insulting and then it shows up well we'll see hasnt gotten to my house yet
 
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Jinx'd

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I guess this would be the place for this. So usually I love FastTech I mean I like them in general more than some American suppliers because I feel like they're more trustworthy. I ordered something on March 12th and it shipped March 16th. Well I thought it was lost because from March 16th to two days ago no update even on the tracker apps and it just basically said hey it's lost no activity for 60-plus days.

Suddenly it shows up in Central Florida rather than the usual Miami and go straight to the main Hub that delivers the mail to my County without apparently going through customs or at least didn't get any updates about it going through customs. It's supposed to be here today.

I am shocked because I really did think it was lost since orders placed after March have arrived. Now I know when you order from China sometimes things happen and I don't order things that I need quickly. And I know that there was a global pandemic and that that caused shipping disruptions but I also fundamentally believe that when they're shipping disruptions and things get started back to normal you should probably ship the first things that were ordered not the latest thing.

Anyhow I had contacted FastTech a couple times and basically got the blow off that I'll have to wait because Coronavirus. And I was getting ready to write something nasty without being insulting and then it shows up well we'll see has an extra gotten to my house yet

2-3 years ago i ordered a small bulb on ebay, from china. it took 3 months to get here. i gave up on it, then it shows up.
 

nadalama

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I sent 3Avape another nastygram day before yesterday, and last night got a response from them that they will provide an "acceptable solution" if there's no movement on my package by June 15. This is the one that I ordered on April 12, an Asmodus Pumper mod.

I want the mod, dammit. If I hadn't, I wouldn't have ordered it. :gaah:
 

MrMeowgi

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I sent 3Avape another nastygram day before yesterday, and last night got a response from them that they will provide an "acceptable solution" if there's no movement on my package by June 15. This is the one that I ordered on April 12, an Asmodus Pumper mod.

I want the mod, dammit. If I hadn't, I wouldn't have ordered it. :gaah:
Ha ha I told them June 15th as well. You in my head?. Lol. Have to file by the 21st so want to have enough time. But told them if the package doesn't move by the 15th I'd be requesting a refund. They were like it's at the airport. I said yes I know, it's been at the airport for 2 weeks waiting for a plane and my 3fvape orders are coming over from China no problem. So why are they having issues with their shopper and no other China store is. Also mentioned in the message to them I know of two other people that are having shipping issues with them as well.


Edit: I'm actually talking to them through the PayPal message center. One step away from filing so they see it too.
How does that work out. Not supposed to use PayPal for vape related products but here we are filing with PayPal and paying with PayPal.

Sent from a pile of wood chips
 

nadalama

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Ha ha I told them June 15th as well. You in my head?. Lol. Have to file by the 21st so want to have enough time. But told them if the package doesn't move by the 15th I'd be requesting a refund. They were like it's at the airport. I said yes I know, it's been at the airport for 2 weeks waiting for a plane and my 3fvape orders are coming over from China no problem. So why are they having issues with their shopper and no other China store is. Also mentioned in the message to them I know of two other people that are having shipping issues with them as well.


Edit: I'm actually talking to them through the PayPal message center. One step away from filing so they see it too.
How does that work out. Not supposed to use PayPal for vape related products but here we are filing with PayPal and paying with PayPal.

Sent from a pile of wood chips

Well that would be a little creepy, wouldn't it? ) No, they told me June 15. I told them I'd wait ONE MORE WEEK and then I was filing with Paypal, and I was through talking directly to them, and I was discussing this with all my friends on VU, and there's another member in the very same mess, and it's gonna cost them business, DID THEY UNDERSTAND? By the time I wrote them again I was seriously pissed.

So they came back to me with June 15. Fine, I'll wait that long, but not one more day past that. I'd still rather have the mod, though.
 

gsmit1

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I took the liberty of using your tracking number to look more closely at the tracking detail. I hope you're ok with that.
I meant to answer this sooner. No of course I don't mind.

I'm not sure how you're determining that customs sent it back to 3F.
 

Synphul

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I meant to answer this sooner. No of course I don't mind.

I'm not sure how you're determining that customs sent it back to 3F.
I think what nadalama was getting at, if you use that tracking number there's 2 sets of data. One in english on top and there's like 4 lines/dates of info. Below that in the chinese scribble if you translate the page to english there's 11 lines of data. More info going on there. It says it was delivered to air transport zhengzhou yada yada 4-8. Then it says 5-15 zhengzhou processing center return, note: security return. Then it says 5-15 it shipped again.

That's the same shit my package did. Only mine said delivered to the zhengzhou airport 4-5 and 5-14 it marked back in zhengzhou airport returns, note: security return. Reshipped 5-14.

So either it made the trip and customs shipped it back over a 'security return' issue, or it's been sitting in china all this time fucking around zhengzhou and they entered a 'whatever error' and are finally shipping it.
 

nadalama

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I think what nadalama was getting at, if you use that tracking number there's 2 sets of data. One in english on top and there's like 4 lines/dates of info. Below that in the chinese scribble if you translate the page to english there's 11 lines of data. More info going on there. It says it was delivered to air transport zhengzhou yada yada 4-8. Then it says 5-15 zhengzhou processing center return, note: security return. Then it says 5-15 it shipped again.

That's the same shit my package did. Only mine said delivered to the zhengzhou airport 4-5 and 5-14 it marked back in zhengzhou airport returns, note: security return. Reshipped 5-14.

So either it made the trip and customs shipped it back over a 'security return' issue, or it's been sitting in china all this time fucking around zhengzhou and they entered a 'whatever error' and are finally shipping it.

Yes. Exactly.

I was told that my package from 3Avape was kicked back from Customs, and I believe @Nailz and @MrMeowgi were also told the same thing. In my case they issued a different tracking number for the second attempt at shipping. Again, I think Meowgi had this same thing happen, not sure about nailz.
 

Synphul

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Yes. Exactly.

I was told that my package from 3Avape was kicked back from Customs, and I believe @Nailz and @MrMeowgi were also told the same thing. In my case they issued a different tracking number for the second attempt at shipping. Again, I think Meowgi had this same thing happen, not sure about nailz.
Yea that's best I could figure it meant. No real explanation from anyone what it means on the tracking pages. Asked FT they never answered with a guess. I never saw it show up in customs. But then maybe it only shows if it clears customs, if it doesn't clear maybe they just boot it back.
 

MrMeowgi

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Yes. Exactly.

I was told that my package from 3Avape was kicked back from Customs, and I believe @Nailz and @MrMeowgi were also told the same thing. In my case they issued a different tracking number for the second attempt at shipping. Again, I think Meowgi had this same thing happen, not sure about nailz.
They gave me a new tracking number as well after customs kicked it back. Then it was sent back out. Now awaiting a plane since 5/12/. Like really?

Sent from a pile of wood chips
 

SteveS45

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So my order on Amazon that I didn't know was coming from China with an expected Delivery Date of June 16 to July 8 is in New Jersey and a USPS Shipping Label was created USPS awaiting package. So now lets see how fast it moves and how many detours it takes to get here.
 

SteveS45

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Just saw that an Amazon Warehouse in California burned down this morning. Hope no one has an order that was supposed to come out of there~!
 

Nailz

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Yes. Exactly.

I was told that my package from 3Avape was kicked back from Customs, and I believe @Nailz and @MrMeowgi were also told the same thing. In my case they issued a different tracking number for the second attempt at shipping. Again, I think Meowgi had this same thing happen, not sure about nailz.

They gave me a new tracking number as well after customs kicked it back. Then it was sent back out. Now awaiting a plane since 5/12/. Like really?

Sent from a pile of wood chips

Yep exactly the same for me, except mine had been waiting for a plane since 4/23 :wait:

But did just get another order from 3fvape in 3 weeks, I choose the express ship and that actually works pretty good, had 6 orders shipped through express ship and all have been less than month since order time, half of them in 2 weeks.

So my advice, is only buy from China if can select express ship or DHL of course.
 

MrMeowgi

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Got a message from 3avape today through the PayPal message system. " sorry your delivery is taking so long would you take $7.49 refund". Are you effing kidding me. I told him I planned to wait till June 15th to file the claim to see if the package would arrived but since they insulted me that much I told them I'd go ahead and file the claim today which I did.

How about they send me the money back that I paid plus an extra $7.49 that seems fair right?
Explain to PayPal that they're having an issue with their shipper because I've received numerous other shipments from China since placing this order and they still have no idea what's going on with it. so just do the claim and be done.

Sent from a pile of wood chips
 

SteveS45

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So it sat in New Jersey for a couple of days and Bam here this morning~! Was scheduled between 10:30 and 2:30 but was here around 9AM or so. 8 days earlier than the estimates so I can't complain even though I like to~!
 

Nailz

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Got a message from 3avape today through the PayPal message system. " sorry your delivery is taking so long would you take $7.49 refund". Are you effing kidding me. I told him I planned to wait till June 15th to file the claim to see if the package would arrived but since they insulted me that much I told them I'd go ahead and file the claim today which I did.

How about they send me the money back that I paid plus an extra $7.49 that seems fair right?
Explain to PayPal that they're having an issue with their shipper because I've received numerous other shipments from China since placing this order and they still have no idea what's going on with it. so just do the claim and be done.

Sent from a pile of wood chips

I'm getting really close to do paypal dispute, still waiting for my order to even get to the US that I placed on March 30th :wait:
 

MrMeowgi

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I'm getting really close to do paypal dispute, still waiting for my order to even get to the US that I placed on March 30th :wait:
One of the messages they sent me was" we resent it and it's waiting for a plane at the airport". I told them they gave me that same notification on 5/12. It's still waiting on a plane as far as I know. Them asking if I'd take a $7 refund pushed me over the edge. How about pay me what I payed you. Or send me the$7 and go ahead and PayPal me $30 of their own money. Like wth. Who would just take a $7 refund for the $40 you sent them?

Sent from a pile of wood chips
 

Nailz

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One of the messages they sent me was" we resent it and it's waiting for a plane at the airport". I told them they gave me that same notification on 5/12. It's still waiting on a plane as far as I know. Them asking if I'd take a $7 refund pushed me over the edge. How about pay me what I payed you. Or send me the$7 and go ahead and PayPal me $30 of their own money. Like wth. Who would just take a $7 refund for the $40 you sent them?

Sent from a pile of wood chips

I just emailed them, telling them I will starting a paypal dispute soon, this beyond crazy now.

What pisses me off, mine got sent back, they asked me to pay another $10 to send DHL, I said no just refund me, so then they tell me, no it's ok they will pay to ship it again, but used the same crap service as the 1st time, she made out they was going to pay for DHL shipping.

I really don't care about the money, it wasn't a lot, and really lost interest in the product too now, it's just not right the way to are providing service, and if people like us don't do charge backs, then they just going to keep on taking people's money and not care, they get enough complaints through paypal, their account could be suspended.
 

nadalama

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One of the messages they sent me was" we resent it and it's waiting for a plane at the airport". I told them they gave me that same notification on 5/12. It's still waiting on a plane as far as I know. Them asking if I'd take a $7 refund pushed me over the edge. How about pay me what I payed you. Or send me the$7 and go ahead and PayPal me $30 of their own money. Like wth. Who would just take a $7 refund for the $40 you sent them?

Sent from a pile of wood chips

I think they may have locked me out. I can't even sign on at 3AVape today. I don't know, maybe everyone is having this problem, but if not, they've locked me out.

Funny what a coincidence that is, seeing that they just sent you that ridiculous message today. This must have been their day to actually get something done.
 

Just Frank

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I've been shopping at Cigabuy and Sourcemore sporadically over the last few months. Orders from there have averaged less than a month for delivery. My Fasttech free shipping orders will prolly show up in December at this rate. It won't stop me from making more orders from there though :D.

China's shipping costs have gone insane (or the some vendors charging anyways). I was going to order 4 mods from Evezon until I saw $37 for shipping. They can keep them if that's how they want to play it.
 

Rhianne

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Got a message from 3avape today through the PayPal message system. " sorry your delivery is taking so long would you take $7.49 refund". Are you effing kidding me. I told him I planned to wait till June 15th to file the claim to see if the package would arrived but since they insulted me that much I told them I'd go ahead and file the claim today which I did.

How about they send me the money back that I paid plus an extra $7.49 that seems fair right?
Explain to PayPal that they're having an issue with their shipper because I've received numerous other shipments from China since placing this order and they still have no idea what's going on with it. so just do the claim and be done.

Sent from a pile of wood chips

What in the world was $7.50 for? Although in Chinese money, it’s prolly like $50 or something. But that’s crazy.
 

Rhianne

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So it sat in New Jersey for a couple of days and Bam here this morning~! Was scheduled between 10:30 and 2:30 but was here around 9AM or so. 8 days earlier than the estimates so I can't complain even though I like to~!

People from NY like to complain! :giggle:
 

Rhianne

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One of the messages they sent me was" we resent it and it's waiting for a plane at the airport". I told them they gave me that same notification on 5/12. It's still waiting on a plane as far as I know. Them asking if I'd take a $7 refund pushed me over the edge. How about pay me what I payed you. Or send me the$7 and go ahead and PayPal me $30 of their own money. Like wth. Who would just take a $7 refund for the $40 you sent them?

Sent from a pile of wood chips

They resent it?? Omg, that’s too much. I guess they meant regret it. :facepalm:
 

Rhianne

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I've been shopping at Cigabuy and Sourcemore sporadically over the last few months. Orders from there have averaged less than a month for delivery. My Fasttech free shipping orders will prolly show up in December at this rate. It won't stop me from making more orders from there though :D.

China's shipping costs have gone insane (or the some vendors charging anyways). I was going to order 4 mods from Evezon until I saw $37 for shipping. They can keep them if that's how they want to play it.

By the time you add $40 shipping, you can get a better deal in the US. I ordered from Sourcemore because they had stuff I couldn’t find here anymore. And with Deeming and bans hanging over our heads, I panicked a bit. (Cuomo is a dick.) But now I’ve stocked up my stash a bit more, and feel better. It’s like a Vapocalypse security blanket for me.
 

Synphul

Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
I emailed fucktech again, I mean fasttech. Starting to get funky glitches with my tracking, sometimes it shows sometimes it doesn't. It didn't say the tracking expired, it just went from saying it'd been shipped (again) to saying a label has been created like a brand new order. Then back to tracking, back to label created. There's a fantastic human centipede with heads lodged in assholes someplace.

My previous emails had been pretty nice, but fuck patience. 5mo is patient enough. I was like look, other people are ordering from china, getting their shit in 3-4 weeks. They ordered well after I did. I ordered in jan, with all your fuckery it didn't even leave out until early april. Mid may I get a notice 40 days later it bounced back and forth to china and got shipped again. It's been over 3 weeks since it said it shipped - again. Was like I emailed asking for help determining what's going on, you replied a week later finally saying you'd look into it. It's been weeks and silence. So wtf gives. Patience has its limits.

Honestly not sure if I'll use FT again or not. And for the $20 or so worth of shit I paid for 5mo ago and still haven't gotten, if it's bad press and shit recommendations they want. I'll make sure they get their fucking $20 worth and then some.
 

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