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Wanting to try vaping but i am a non smoker.

Discussion in 'How do I get started?' started by NewbieRay, Nov 26, 2016.

  1. NewbieRay

    NewbieRay New Member

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    So i have been wanting to try vaping for a while now but i am a non smoker. I dont know, i have always just liked the sound of it all the options you get. I would like to try it but i don't know if i should. If i do end up trying it i would like to know what i should start with and how often i would need to replace things on it.
     
  2. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Honest suggestion, don't.
     
  3. Markw4mms

    Markw4mms #Team Jimi Supporter Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    I have to agree. If you don't smoke, why would you choose to put anything other than air into your lungs?
     
  4. nightshard

    nightshard I don't drip, I drop. Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Gold Contributor

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    Don't try vaping and don't try smoking either.
     
  5. conanthewarrior

    conanthewarrior Gold Contributor

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    I think what everyone is giving is very good advice. If you have never smoked, please don't take up an alternative to smoking.

    I can understand it seeming interesting, but it is only a safer way for people who have smoked to get their fix. Depending on which area of vaping interests you, you could still look into something to learn, that will be of a better benefit to vaping.

    Say for instance, the way mods work interests you. You could learn about electronics and possibly get onto a course, and then depending how far you wanted to go either make electronic projects as a hobby, or even for work.

    Just don't smoke or vape, please. If the flavours interest you, most are based on things that already exist. If you like the sound of apple pie, have an apple pie! :).
     
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  6. daddyrabbit

    daddyrabbit New Member

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    Super honest tip: Don't open with "I've never smoked, but I want to vape." You'll never get the answer you're looking for, only people trying to talk you out of it.
     
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  7. Whiskey

    Whiskey Senior Moderator Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor

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    Noticing a ton of these type threads lately, weird:confused:
     
  8. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    I say vape away if you want to

    Is it better not to? Probably.

    But people start smoking every single day, vaping is better.
     
  9. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    Well... to be totally honest, we don't know exactly the long term effects of vaping. We do know, they are much less harmful than smoking. 95% to 99% less harmful, but even PG, VG and flavoring will have some effect. If you do try vaping, stick to 0mg nicotine. You aren't addicted to it now from cigarettes, no need to start using it.

    Since it isn't addictive without the nicotine, if you want to try, you have that freedom to do so, and there will be lots of help here if you need it. (and you will)
    So to start off.. NEVER CHEAP OUT ON YOUR BATTERIES! Use only high drain Sony, Samsung or LG. Samsung 25r is a decent battery to start with.

    2nd start with a regulated PVD (personal vaping device *also called a mod*) Regulated is software controlled and is much more forgiving than a mechanical mod (basically, a flashlight with a heating coil instead of a bulb, but with a much more powerful battery) There are 2 types of mechanical mods. Hybrid and non-hybrid. The non-hybrid have a floating 510 positive pin so are much safer than the hybrid, where the positive pole of the tank sits directly on the battery. I will not use a hybrid.

    However, start with a regulated mod. They are safer. Not 100% safe (rarely the chips fail), but that is why we say don't cheap out on the batteries.

    Of course, the best advice is not to start vaping if you don't smoke. But should you choose to, do it safely. Ask questions in here before trying stuff as you learn. An example is I once saw someone say they wanted to use copper wire. This is a hard NO! Mainly, because the resistance of copper is far below a safe level, and 2ndly, heating copper creates copper oxides, which are not healthy. Just as an example mind you. (but don't try it.)

    Basically, like everyone else, I recommend not starting vaping if you never smoked and aren't trying to quit. But if you do choose to start for your own reasons, we'll help you when you need it.
     
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  10. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    Yeah, I think 90% is because of youtube and cloud tricks and 10% because they see others doing it and want to try. By and large, it is far better to try vaping than some other stuff out there.

    All we can do is make sure they know the facts about vaping safely, not using nicotine (no need to start an addiction) and ram battery safety down their throats until the either get the message or choke on it. LOL. Even regulated mod protection circuits can fail, so preaching about using the best batteries is likely one of the best bits of advice we can give.
     
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  11. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Well, what the heck motivates someone to want to smoke a cigarette for the first time?

    The same forces are probably at play with vaping
     
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  12. AndriaD

    AndriaD The FDA can bite me. Vive la revolution! VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    If one has never smoked, nicotine is not addictive. So if you have some condition that would benefit from nicotine, go right ahead and use it, but use a very low level, because it really will give you an upset stomach if you're not accustomed to it. -- sharp stabby little pains, nausea, or even vomiting if you go really overboard, which is easy to do with vaping because it takes 5-15 minutes to be fully absorbed from vapor, as opposed to 5-15 SECONDS from smoke. If you try nicotine and feel dizzy or light-headed, LAY OFF IMMEDIATELY, or you'll be facedown in the toilet quite soon.

    Other than that... use your own best judgment. If you're an adult in good health, there is no reason not to vape. If you have any sort of lung or breathing or cardiovascular problem and aren't already a smoker, then it's probably better if you don't vape.

    Andria
     
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  13. Rabbit Slayer

    Rabbit Slayer Silver Contributor ECF Refugee

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    "Should we really be that bothered about addiction in and of itself, if it doesn't come with any other substantial harms?" said Munafo

    I haven't seen a single site with any sources to any studies done on nicotine addiction, just misinformation on dozens of vaping and pseudoscience sites...

    Got a link to any real information on the subject?
     
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  14. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    You need to do some more research. Nicotine IS addictive, and the additives put in tobacco make it even MORE addictive. Caffeine is also addictive, which is why you have some people drinking 15 cans of Coke or Pepsi a day or they can't move until that 2nd cup of coffee.
    Now PURE nicotine is NOT AS addictive as it is in cigarettes with the extra additives, but it is still addictive. If it weren't, we wouldn't still be vaping with it, since I have been cigarette free for over 8 months, that addiction is long past, but I am still addicted to the nicotine, just using a much lower level now.

    http://tobaccoharmreduction.org/faq/nicotine.htm

    So it is about as addictive as coffee, but far less addictive than cigarettes.
     
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  15. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    In a way, yes we really do, as vapers. No need to give nay sayers any more ammo than they already have made up. All we can do, is make new vapers aware of the facts about nicotine and if they decide to use it, that is on them. Strictly speaking, if all you want to do is vape, you really don't need the nicotine, so why put extra junk in your system. Nicotine is not totally benign so does carry some risks. Just much lower than the risks of tobacco smoking.

    See previous post for link
     
  16. AndriaD

    AndriaD The FDA can bite me. Vive la revolution! VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    "Dependence producing" and "addictive" are NOT the same thing. Being dependent on either caffeine or pure nicotine (absent the other substances in burned tobacco) is NOT the same as being addicted to narcotics or street drugs of the white powder variety. One may feel crummy if one doesn't get the morning coffee, but one does NOT go out and rob a convenience store or mug somebody to get money to buy it. One may feel crummy if one doesn't get that morning coffee or vape, but one does not suffer the EXTREME withdrawal symptoms of a habitual smoker going cold-turkey.

    Some of you are conflating in a very bad way. I repeat: if one has NEVER smoked, nicotine is NOT addictive. Mildly dependence producing, PERHAPS... but no one who has ever taken part in clinical research of nicotine, who was not previously a smoker, has been prompted by that exposure to nicotine to start jonesing for a cigarette, a patch, or a piece of nicotine gum.

    The reason for the extreme addictiveness of cigarette smoking is two-fold: the combined and synergistic effects of nicotine and the MAOIs found in tobacco, and the EXTREME rapidity of delivery of those chemicals to the brain when consumed in smoke. Vaping does not contain the MAOIs, unless one is adding WTA, and it takes a GREAT deal longer to arrive at the brain, removing or mitigating in two different ways the potential for addictiveness.

    Andria
     
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  17. daddyrabbit

    daddyrabbit New Member

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    I will say this, I am one of those who started vaping without smoking. Heard about the awesome flavored is why. Saw a Blu at a gas station and gave it a shot.

    When I first started, I was vaping for about 3 hours a day at 6. Unless I'm doing it wrong, I can set it down for days and not feel a single craving. Take from that what you will.
     
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  18. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    THE POINT IS WHY USE NICOTINE if you never smoked. Is that hard to understand?
    Extreme? Hardly. Unpleasant yes, but hardly on a level with more powerful substances which I can't name.. forum rules. IOW, I did quit cold turkey before, but I didn't jump off any buildings or rob little old ladies for a cigarette. I never said nicotine would make you start jonesin for a cigarette, I said nicotine was addictive and you would get DTs from cutting it out. Not as bad as some substances or smoking, but still unpleasant. Try quitting coffee (and tea) cold turkey and no pop with caffeine. See how that goes. Generally, we use the word addictive to describe the action and dependency rather than write a 10 thousand word thesis on brain pathways affected by the act of smoking (or vaping) and those affected by the actual drug itself.

    Granted, it is much easier to stop using nicotine than it is to give up smoking, but as a member of a vaping forum you should not be fueling the anti-vape propaganda that vaping is a gateway to cigarette smoking, by saying nicotine is "safe" to use and does not cause addiction, which we generally say when talking about nicotine. The 100% correct term would be addiction to vaping caused by a dependency on nicotine, just the same as we say addicted to nicotine when smoking, it is actually addicted to smoking due to a dependency on nicotine. To be precise, dependency is worse than addiction. I've never heard of anyone becoming addicted to drinking shoe polish, but I have heard of alcoholics melting shoe polish to extract the alcohol from it. I've seen people running around the city here, picking up cigarette butts. Is it because they are addicted to smoking or dependent on nicotine?

    So you will have to forgive all us ignorant people who say addictive when it is actually the dependency on the drug. I've never robbed a store to get cigarettes either. Maybe some have. So strictly speaking, you don't become addicted to street drugs either, you become dependent on them, and addicted to pipes or needles. You can become an alcoholic on beer just as easily as you can on whiskey, smoke or vape, nicotine is still nicotine.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2016
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  19. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    So you suffer no side effects of nicotine withdrawal?
    Even when I smoked, I didn't crave cigarettes, it was the nicotine I wanted. And of course it became a habit, when you light up whether you wanted one or not.
     
  20. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    There are health benefits to nicotine use, especially for people genetically disposed to diseases such as Parkinsons and Alzheimers.

    I certainly thought about such radical actions when quitting tobacco cold turkey, most other former smokers I've ever talked to very much hated the process and many - myself included - decided the bad effects of smoking were not as bad as the negative effects on our mental health and reverted back to smoking.

    Where did you get that conclusion that she is promoting the myth that vaping leads to smoking???

    Not one credible study has ever proven this.

    There is plenty of evidence that nicotine (without the alkaloids in tobacco) is habit forming, but not addictive. Cold hard fact.
     
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  21. conanthewarrior

    conanthewarrior Gold Contributor

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    I can speak from experience in regards to withdrawal from both cigarettes, and also alcohol and something seen as much more dangerous, which I do not think I can name due to forum rules.

    Withdrawal from the illegal one was hell, and you feel as if you will die. With alcohol though, I nearly did die from withdrawal, and was hospitalised during my detox and had seizures, and also some lasting damage was left.

    Cigarettes are still very addictive, or habit forming, as we know there are people with illnesses such as cancer who still continue to smoke. Compared to withdrawal from alcohol or the other though, it makes you feel a bit off most definitely, but I would of gladly died during severe alcohol withdrawal to end the pain. Cramps literally everywhere in your body at once, shakes so bad you can't even feed yourself (If you even wanted to eat, and shakes is a bit of an understatement), the feeling of absolute terror, hearing things that are not there are just some of the fun to be had before the seizures begin.

    Ideally, you don't want to withdraw from anything that is physically addictive- not many substances are, Alcohol is one, nicotine is another, then one class of painkillers is another, both legal and illegal forms. Another class of medication used to treat anxiety is also physically addictive, again I am not sure I can name them though.
    Other drugs are psychologically addictive, still not nice to be addicted too, but do not cause the terrible physical side effects of not using them.

    If I HAD to go through withdrawal of a physically addictive drug, it would be Nicotine. The effects of not having a vape are nowhere near as bad as I found when not having a cigarette though, and this is not meant to downplay how strong addiction to cigarettes can be, again there are people that have illnesses that are killing them and can not quit- that is a strong addiction.

    I have never heard of anyone robbing a store or selling their bodies for cigarettes though, which can happen with other addictive substances, both physically addictive ones, and some psychologically addictive drugs.
     
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  22. AndriaD

    AndriaD The FDA can bite me. Vive la revolution! VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    All of this: exactly. And I'd say that insisting that "nicotine is as addictive as {street narcotic}" does more to fuel the gateway theory, than realizing that nicotine by itself is not addictive. It's certainly the ANTZ position, at any rate, which some people have bought wholesale -- "I was so addicted to smoking so it must mean that nicotine really is as addictive as {street narcotic}" -- which is pure conflation. Nevermind those THOUSANDS of other chemicals, it MUST be the nicotine! :facepalm:

    I smoked for 39 yrs, and never could use more than 10mg nicotine in my vaping, or it made me deathly sick. But I sure was diehard-addicted to smoking -- going for an HOUR without a cigarette was enough to make me completely psychotic, until vaping, and adding WTA -- which does contain the MAOIs. Reducing my nic level from that 10mg to 3mg has been as easy as falling off a log, barely even noticed it -- but the WTA which I absolutely required just to stay smoke-free took 15 months of very determined effort to get rid of, and was STILL very challenging, even at that slow and measured pace.

    And yes, there are quite a few conditions that are helped immeasurably by nicotine -- anxiety, depression, schizophrenia, several disorders of the colon, many inflammatory and auto-immune disorders, ADD, ADHD, Parkinsons...

    Andria
     
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  23. Rabbit Slayer

    Rabbit Slayer Silver Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Vaping is 100% safe and better than breathing normal air

    unsubstantiated claims are unsubstantiated
     
  24. AndriaD

    AndriaD The FDA can bite me. Vive la revolution! VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    understand4you.jpg

    Andria
     
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  25. happy valley

    happy valley Bronze Contributor

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    This^

    If I were not a longtime smoker I would never start vaping.
     
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  26. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    A bit off base Whole tobacco alkaloids are what is used and bind to the receptors and are not MAOI.
    The MAOI were added later to make cigarette tobacco more addictive since people where quitting on the advice from the Surgeon General. The could not have that since it was the profit on the line.

    Without the Alkaloids the MAOI are delivered in an ineffective manner for the body to use and are seen as unusable without an adjuvant which the alkaloids provide to cross the blood brain barrier, so the maoi are micro dosed in a rapid manner use. But that is not the entire story about how adjuvants work but close enough.
    Add combustion and viola instant addicts just add tax.

    Funny how WTA in tobacco, and nicotine in and of it's self is pretty benign in and of itself but only becomes wickedly addictive when it is processed and tinkered with. Kind of like how medicine is approaching the MMJ effectiveness concept, but cutting off their nose to spite their face missing the mark.
     
  27. AndriaD

    AndriaD The FDA can bite me. Vive la revolution! VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    MAOIs are naturally occurring in tobacco, and since they're alkaloids, they're almost certainly in WTA also. WTA is pretty addictive; as I said, lowering my nic has been a piece of cake, but my 15 month step down from WTA took determination and persistence; I would suffer the usual depression/etc starting about 2 days after each reduction, and it would ease in a few days. Next month, same thing.

    Andria
     
  28. daddyrabbit

    daddyrabbit New Member

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    Gonna get long-winded here:

    If withdrawal symptoms include tingling in hands or feet, sweating, nausea, headaches, coughing, insomnia, difficulty concentrating, anxiety, irritability, depression, and weight gain, then no. I took my family out of town on vacation this past weekend and left the pens at the house. Nothing changed and I didn't drive like a bat out of Hell with its wings on fire to get back home to vape up. Quite honestly, the way some people speak on nicotine, I thought it would do far more to me than it did. If nothing, it gave me a light-beer buzz and maybe a little more focus and concentration that I didn't miss after it wore off. It's done no more to me than caffeine from a strong cup of coffee. Then again, only 6mg here and a cig is what...18?

    As a non-smoker into vaping, I did weeks of research before making that decision and because any Johnny Afro can create a website these days, it was very difficult to disseminate Big Tobacco propaganda from anti-vapers from the F*ck the FDA'ers from actual legitimate data. But, up until vaping, tobacco was the primary vehicle for nicotine intake, so any studies done with nicotine most likely had tobacco along side it, so, by proxy, who's to say that one of those other 4,000 chemicals doesn't exasperate the effects and addictiveness of nicotine that's simply absent in vaping? Any one of those components can be the true addictor and nicotine is simply guilty by association.

    I will also say this, about five years ago, I became hooked on opiates following a surgery. I can't speak for smokers as I've never smoked, but if this is what "vaped" nicotine does to me, then it is absolutely NOTHING compared to opiates - it's affect or dependency. The highs are much higher and the lows are much more devastating. Oxys, Percs, Loris, H, your body literally turns against you in ways that words can barely go into. Take all of the above and add full-on mood swings, bladder control (imagine having the urge to pee, but your bladder is empty or "weak stream"), constipation, cold sweats, loss of sex drive, impotency (in case you do get the drive back, but no gas in the tank), suicidal thoughts and tendencies, runny eyes and nose (at the same time), diarrhea (with constipation, imagine a gun wanting to fire, but the barrel was plugged up, like in the cartoons), high blood pressure, rapid heartbeat, the "shakes", and night terrors - and that's after it wears off in an an hour or so. There are no patches for that sh*t. I would rather be waterboarded than go through the 96 hours of shaking that sh*t off.

    Anybody who tells you that nicotine is as addictive and dependent as heroin, has never did heroin.

    I won't dare say that nicotine is not addictive, that's been scientifically proven, but A, only one-third of people who try nicotine actually get addicted to it; and B, people need to stop putting nicotine on the level of H, X, Benzos, Opiates, Salts, Spice, Meth, and Coke. As someone who has used that stuff, it's not even close.

    My confusion comes in most anti-FDA'ers and pro-vapers alike constantly rant that smoking and vaping isn't the same thing, but when someone who's never smoked decides to take it up, you treat it as if it is the same thing and try to talk them out of it - I mean, if it's not the same thing, why not? We're all adults here. Like me, by the time I made it to this website, my decision was made and the supportive answer is "smoking and vaping can have potential negative side effects in the form of foreign debris in your lungs as well as addiction and dependency if you choose to add nicotine to your mix, but if you must choose between the two: vape."

    Contrary to popular belief, vaping was not invented nor outright designed to help people quit smoking - but as an alternative to smoking (see bold print above). Hell, go to every ecig site and in their small-print terms and conditions, you will see that "our products are not intended and make no claims to be a smoking cessation device." But, since an estimated 87% of vapers are (ex)smokers, they treat cessation as the de facto reason to vape and it simply is not. I mean, you can drink Moonshine or you can drink a Beer - one is far more destructive than the other and both will eventually destroy your liver, but I won't tell someone that just because they've never experienced hard liquor that they shouldn't try a Bud Light. But, I will say, as someone who has gotten so black-out drunk that I've forgotten all concepts of time and space, you shouldn't drink, but if you choose to drink, drink this and do it responsibly.

    End noobie rant.
     
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  29. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Many other factors outside of WTA are in play with that.
     
  30. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    and by definition, no nicotine in ANY form is addictive, it is all dependency forming. Smoking is addictive, to get the rush from the dependency forming nicotine. Addiction takes place in the reward pathway of the brain, dependancy takes place in the thalamus and brainstem.

    1) There are better medications and the harmful side effects outweigh any supposed benefits.
    2) OH I thought about it. Thought about mass murdering spree too.. lol
    3) Hence I said myth. Main point is, you have no business suggesting someone start taking a drug they are not currently using. Not to mention, the "benefits" have not been studied long enough to be PROVEN. Caffeine does exactly the same thing, along with dozens of foods. The INTERNET ARTICLES you googled and are quoting as fact, SUGGEST that nicotine MAY help delay the effects, but have not been proven to do so and has certainly never been proposed as a treatment, since many other drugs are safer and more effective.

    and again, and most importantly, you are NOT the OPs doctor. You have no right, legal, moral or otherwise to suggest that anyone starts using drugs. Especially since the person never smoked and you have no idea if they are allergic or sensitive. Sever (although rare) reactions can include.
    • Abnormal Heart Rhythm
    • Atrial Fibrillation
    • Fast Heartbeat
    • Giant Hives
    • Hives
    • hypersensitivity drug reaction
    • Inflammation of Skin caused by an Allergy
    • Itching
    • Rash
    • Redness of Skin
    • Seizures

    Other side effects are listed here
    http://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-7...icotine-gum---buccal/details/list-sideeffects

    So tell us all again how harmless nicotine is and how beneficial it is? The nicotine in gum and patches is the same as in vape juice, without the additives in tobacco. And explain how it is up to you to recommend people to start using drugs they have not used before. In other words, answering questions about vaping is one thing, suggesting someone start using drugs is totally different. Maybe the OP wants to vape as a hobby, or as a replacement for snacking, or blowing vape rings, or to join in with peers that vape. I don't know their reason for wanting to try it, but I am fairly sure it is not to become drug dependent. The big difference is, you can enjoy vaping, fairly harmlessly, with 0 nicotine, and it does not cause you to feel anxious if you stop. Hell, even after 3 months off cigarettes I found myself taking my pop cans to the depot for vape juice between paydays, since I am still dependent, even though I have been at 3mg since my 2nd month vaping when i started using RDAs and a sub ohm tank.

    Now back to the OP, as others have said, if you don't smoke, don't use nicotine. You don't need it. You will probably enjoy vaping more, since it will not make you nauseous, light headed or headaches if accidentally vape to much.
     
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  31. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    Same here. But like a lot of other things, some people just want to try it to see what it is all about.

    I've been thinking lately, to only vape 0mg flavored ejuice, and only use nicotine in non-flavored pg/vg base. Just to get my nic fix when I get antzy. Im at the point now, where I can vape most of the day without nicotine. ( I mix my nic as I fill the dropper bottles, and sometimes just vape from the mixing bottles that have no nic)
     
  32. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    I get ya but they have to put that small print there due to the FDA. If not having that small print there they would be ass fucked and crushed out of our reality due to the FDA wrecking people that make claims outside of their paradigms. MANY many many examples of the cartel that is Big Pharma and the FDA lock stepping to do so.
     
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  33. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    I guess you never eat tomatoes, potatoes and or eggplant then.
     
  34. daddyrabbit

    daddyrabbit New Member

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    Just the wording of that made it awesome. "Crushed out of our reality." I'm putting that on a Alabama Crimson Tide t-shirt when we win the title.
     
  35. daddyrabbit

    daddyrabbit New Member

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    This, I can agree with.
     
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  36. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    and you obviously have only done a quick google search without researching the levels of nicotine in plants of the nightshade family. (of which potato, tomato and eggplant are in)

    I hope you are hungry... 20lbs of Eggplant contains as much nicotine as a cigarette.

    You see, where you google plants that contain nicotine, I researched plants that contain nicotine in sufficient amount to be suitable for extraction. I am in Canada, and we can't import nicotine. So we are limited to buying unflavored ecig juice or looking to other methods. BTW... the unflavored ecig juice is more efficient than extracting it at home. (50ml of 50mg unflavored ejuice will make 1.5L DIY juice at 3mg/ml (aprox). You can extract nic from pretty much any plant in the nightshade family, but it is faster and easier just to buy the unflavored ejuice at higher nic levels.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2016
  37. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Why I suggested he did not start to begin with.
     
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  38. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    yeah, and why I am so anti nicotine. Like I was saying, telling someone it is ok to use any drug because of some supposed and limited benefit is just plain stupid. Most of us are trying to get down to 0 nicotine and beat the habit. Although I will probably still vape as it keeps me busy while on the PC or gaming or watching tv and for the cloud chasing aspect. *lol* I will only give finer details about that IN the cloud chasing forum. Since it isn't a topic for new users or general vapers that are not trying for those massive clouds. I'm working toward competition levels. So no flavor or nicotine. Yummy.. :blech:
     
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  39. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Wow ok you go with that thought process and concept, it is more apparent that the levels of smugness are impressive. A shining example of being our own worst enemy.. I mean with friends like you who needs the ANTZ.
     
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  40. daddyrabbit

    daddyrabbit New Member

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    Now I feel bad for that diatribe. He asked "should I", then asked, "If I do, how?"

    I was under the impression that his decision was made (as mine was) and you guys were trying to talk him out of it; but, if you're an adult and have to ask...
     
  41. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    You are not their doctor either and so have no business telling another adult how to conduct their life. That's like telling them not to drink coffee - caffein is a drug that has similar properties to nicotine.

    We all just want to help people - but spouting ANTZ propaganda to keep a nonsmoker from vaping is ridiculous.

    I smoked 2.5 PAD for 37 YEARS and have to keep lowing my nic level because the nicotine is just too much - am down to 1 mg naturally.

    I would never help someone become a smoker - but will help any adult become a vaper.
     
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  42. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    No he was just asking about vaping in general, as a non smoker. You know, pros, cons, etc. Of course there is the dont do it if you dont smoke school of thinking, but I know many non smokers just want to vape for whatever reason. Flavor? Hobby? Avoiding snacking? And then it got to vaping is ok but suggest no nic, since they aren't addicted to smoking. Then someone saying nic is ok and beneficial. And of course, you never tell anyone to start using drugs of any kind, unless you are their doctor.
     
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  43. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Nah I got it, it was not a response to him but the theme of the responses.
     
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  44. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    If you notice, you are the only one telling them to use nicotine. The question was about vaping. Not about using nicotine. You are telling people it is healthy and the fact is, you are either just flat out lying or flat out ignorant of the facts. All people have been suggesting, is if they want to vape, since they never smoked, and wanted to try vaping, then vape without nicotine. Anyone suggesting another person start using drugs is just plain stupid. I don't care what the drug is.

    The original question, was about is vaping safe for a non smoker. It is low risk, but not as safe as not vaping. Vaping without nicotine is less safe. If you don't need to use nicotine as a replacement for smoking, there is no reason to use it, and certainly no reason to EVER suggest a non nicotine user to start! I am sure if they wanted to start using nicotine, they can figure that out on their own without you being the resident drug pusher.
    This is all I am going to say on the topic.
     
  45. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Damn you just can't help yourself giving medical advice wrapped in smug, double downed with stupid and injected with half information.
     
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  46. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic VU Donator Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    Not quite dude
     
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  47. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    Who?
     
  48. gbalkam

    gbalkam Silver Contributor

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    And that is all I have been saying.
     
  49. Whiskey

    Whiskey Senior Moderator Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor

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  50. BigNasty

    BigNasty ECF Refugee Platinum Contributor ECF Refugee

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    You and being insulting to people calling them drug pushers, but who's head is up their own ass?
    But then again I have not spent thousands of hours of my own research on food as medicine and health. I only google searched it.
     
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