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To Date which US Presidential candidate will you be voting for & why?
- Thread starter SMOKIE
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I agree. But there are non starters. Open borders and tpp are non starters for me. It's pretty basic stuff. That's why I asked.
Gary is great, for a Miss America pageant. But I want the borders closed to illegals and good trade.
I'm not sure why you are looking forward to the debates. As far as I know, Gary is not polling well enough to be in them.
same stupid shit they said about Regan....you'd think they could come up with something original after all this time,but nope...anybody right of Hilary is a crazy white nationalist or Uncle Tom whose going to blow up the world...God the Libertarian party has gone to hell.
Agree, those are big boxes.
But no president will be able to stop immigration and shut down our boarders. Can people freely travel back and forth like they can within the EU? No, but there has to be some sort of system to allow immigration and it needs to be a stonger tighter vetting than what we have in place now.
And that is what Johnson wants to put in place.
The globe is well traveled now, it used to be the wealthy that could hop on a ship and travel to another country, then hop on a plane, now it doesn't cost much at all to travel across the globe. People will move to other countries and ours will be one of their choices, we can't just shut the world out but we do need to do a better job of screening those that are allows in.
There are people that think we shouldn't allow anyone else in. But that's unrealistic and if that policy were in place for the past decade or century or centuries some of you (and myself) may not live here today.
Yeah, the world is different now with terrorism and other nasty acts but that's the world we live in today so work on a system that can deal with it.
A wall is not the anwer, it's political fodder to get people riled up on an idea (they took our jobs!) But it's an asinine idea.
But no president will be able to stop immigration and shut down our boarders. Can people freely travel back and forth like they can within the EU? No, but there has to be some sort of system to allow immigration and it needs to be a stonger tighter vetting than what we have in place now.
And that is what Johnson wants to put in place.
The globe is well traveled now, it used to be the wealthy that could hop on a ship and travel to another country, then hop on a plane, now it doesn't cost much at all to travel across the globe. People will move to other countries and ours will be one of their choices, we can't just shut the world out but we do need to do a better job of screening those that are allows in.
There are people that think we shouldn't allow anyone else in. But that's unrealistic and if that policy were in place for the past decade or century or centuries some of you (and myself) may not live here today.
Yeah, the world is different now with terrorism and other nasty acts but that's the world we live in today so work on a system that can deal with it.
A wall is not the anwer, it's political fodder to get people riled up on an idea (they took our jobs!) But it's an asinine idea.
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I doubt he will make it to the debates but I am looking forward to the main candidates speaking intelligently and being called out when they spew stupid fucking shit like deport all the Muslims or build a wall and any of the other bat shit crazy things hillary and trump say.
[QHUOTE="fq06, post: 1344362, member: 9214"]Agree, those are big boxes.
But no president will be able to stop immigration and shut down our boarders. Can people freely travel back and forth likhnger tighter vetting than what we have in place now.
And that is what Johnson wants to put in place.
The globe is well traveled now, it used to be the wealthy that could hop on a ship and travel to another country, then hop on a plane, not it doesn't cost much at all to travel across the globe. People will move to other countries and ours will be one of their choices, we can't just shut the world out but we do need to do a better job of screening those that are allows in.
There are people that think we shouldn't allow anyone else in. But that's unrealistic and if that policy were in place for the past decade or century or centuries some of you (and myself) may not live here today.
Yeah, the world is different now with terrorism and other nasty acts but that's the world we live in today so work on a system that can deal with it.
A wall is not the anwer, it's political fodder to get people riled up on an idea (they took our jobs!) But it's an asinine idea.[/QUOTE]
I'm
THe only thing I find asinine is your idiotic assertions of what is and is not possible...you mouth this tripe like it is the law of gravity..which it is not...we have had massive immigration before and stopped it and closed our borders and the world did not end, the country in fact prospered, we had massive immigration around the turn of the last century and the citizens demanded and end to it,we ended it and the fucking sky did not fall...globalist soundbites are getting fucking passé.....The future is unwritten.....sounded like a Hilary speech
But no president will be able to stop immigration and shut down our boarders. Can people freely travel back and forth likhnger tighter vetting than what we have in place now.
And that is what Johnson wants to put in place.
The globe is well traveled now, it used to be the wealthy that could hop on a ship and travel to another country, then hop on a plane, not it doesn't cost much at all to travel across the globe. People will move to other countries and ours will be one of their choices, we can't just shut the world out but we do need to do a better job of screening those that are allows in.
There are people that think we shouldn't allow anyone else in. But that's unrealistic and if that policy were in place for the past decade or century or centuries some of you (and myself) may not live here today.
Yeah, the world is different now with terrorism and other nasty acts but that's the world we live in today so work on a system that can deal with it.
A wall is not the anwer, it's political fodder to get people riled up on an idea (they took our jobs!) But it's an asinine idea.[/QUOTE]
I'm
THe only thing I find asinine is your idiotic assertions of what is and is not possible...you mouth this tripe like it is the law of gravity..which it is not...we have had massive immigration before and stopped it and closed our borders and the world did not end, the country in fact prospered, we had massive immigration around the turn of the last century and the citizens demanded and end to it,we ended it and the fucking sky did not fall...globalist soundbites are getting fucking passé.....The future is unwritten.....sounded like a Hilary speech
Ah, so it's not possible to control the border. How the fuck does Israel do it? Most countries that still have the desire, do a fine job of curbing illegal immigration. Try to sneak into Iran or North Korea or Israel. See how that works out for you.
What does a "stronger tighter vetting" have to do with illegal immigrants? By definition, they get no vetting at all. So, Johnson's plan is tighter vetting of lawful people and no vetting of unlawful people. That makes perfect sense. LOL. I think I'll use that here at home with my pets. Only adopt good animals, but do nothing about strays that make themselves at home. I'll just go ahead and feed them. Now that right there is an asinine policy.
Good fences make good neighbors. And I kill strays.
fq06...offers nothing more than...conventional wisdom...conventional wisdom,is what you offered in the old USSR in order to get a better apartment,or a better job, or a car...you were a....good party member....if you were a political dissident, you got shit...nobody in the old USSR went to the gulags because they were political dissidents...they went to the gulags because they were mentally ill and a threat to society.....is it any different here,now......
YOu mouth the convention wisdom you get a pat on the head and people tell you what a clever little boy you are,and for a lot of turds that is enough for them......you get a job on the networks spouting the conventional wisdom for six figure, or you teach in a university spouting the conventional wisdom....for five figures.....and what has the convention wisdom and their proponents bought us....a ruined economy..a people that are taxed to death in order to pay an unplayable national debt.massive unemployment..at least for citizens...a near police state,and a never ending string of wars where are young men and our wealth are stolen from us...convention wisdom is for idiots.
YOu mouth the convention wisdom you get a pat on the head and people tell you what a clever little boy you are,and for a lot of turds that is enough for them......you get a job on the networks spouting the conventional wisdom for six figure, or you teach in a university spouting the conventional wisdom....for five figures.....and what has the convention wisdom and their proponents bought us....a ruined economy..a people that are taxed to death in order to pay an unplayable national debt.massive unemployment..at least for citizens...a near police state,and a never ending string of wars where are young men and our wealth are stolen from us...convention wisdom is for idiots.
I didn't say it's not possible to control the boarder.
I thinknwe sucks at it and that needs to be improved.
Build a wall, don't expect Mexico to pay for it but build it. That will keep wanderers out but we still need to fix the way we allow people that we have no idea of who they are or what they have done or what terrorist factions they belong to inside our boarders.
They don't have to sneak in, they get a free pass to come in.
WTF....was that pointless ramble.
But that isn't Johnson's policy. Johnson's policy is to make it easier to legally immigrate. Which is fine, but does not address illegal immigration. His theory is, if it's easier they'll just take the legal route. Sounds good. But he offers no plan for the illegals. Those that would mule drugs. Those that don't pass the vetting, that in his article yesterday he did not even mention tighter vetting. If he does want tighter vetting, he offers nothing to stop those that do not pass from coming in anyway, making his whole policy moot.
Johnson's policy does nothing to curb illegal immigration from those that would take advantage of an open border. It only makes more people legal.
http://www.cnn.com/2016/08/29/opinions/making-legal-immigration-attainable-johnson/
There is nothing to like about Johnson's immigration policy. It's a non starter.
I heard another libertarian offer the idea that open borders does not work in a massive welfare state....so Gary's idea is that we will make it legal for the wages of the poorest in the country to be driven even farther down.....brilliant...we will legalize serfdom.
"For the record, in my opinion, if a young woman is enterprising enough to sneak across the border for the purpose of having a child who will then be eligible for citizenship in the U.S. — and who can, 21 years later when he or she has reached adulthood, perhaps sponsor family members for legal status, that might be a family who will make pretty good Americans." Gary Johnson on anchor babies(an offensive term according to him)
Immigration, legal immigration, is why Britain voted to exit the EU. The cost was more than they could bear.
Oh. And broad trade deals that they had no control over.
It's sad really. That the US is(hopefully) following Britain, and not leading in these matters of economy and crime.
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So to stop illegal immigration we need a wall and military across the entire length of the boarder. That would mean bringing a large population of military personnel back from other countries we for whatever reason feel we need them there.
I just don't see that happening. I think it would be a good thing to stop people from illegally crossing but our boarder is so vast it's not like a small country like Iran, N Korea & Isreal.
Britain was forced to allow immigrants and will continue to be forced even after they leave the EU like other countries that enjoy the trade benefits of being in the EU but are outside it. In that respect there's no difference other than being able to say they are not a EU member.
I just don't see that happening. I think it would be a good thing to stop people from illegally crossing but our boarder is so vast it's not like a small country like Iran, N Korea & Isreal.
Britain was forced to allow immigrants and will continue to be forced even after they leave the EU like other countries that enjoy the trade benefits of being in the EU but are outside it. In that respect there's no difference other than being able to say they are not a EU member.
Cognitive dissonance won't solve anything. Either you think illegal immigration needs fixed or you don't.
I mean, you can dance around it for an eternity but it really isn't that complicated. It's rather simple.
Yeah, simple right? 
Trump can just come in and wave his comb over at the multi billion dollar drug smuggling industry, the Mexican cartels that run Mexico (yeah, they'll pay for a wall) and all the uncomplicated problems just vanish. He can tell them that they're fired
Terrorist with sophisticated cells backed with millions of dollars will somehow lose their funding and supporters because Trump the great is now president and he decided that they shouldn't cross our boarders
Just fix it, that's the solution we've been overlooking this whole time
Trump can just come in and wave his comb over at the multi billion dollar drug smuggling industry, the Mexican cartels that run Mexico (yeah, they'll pay for a wall) and all the uncomplicated problems just vanish. He can tell them that they're fired
Terrorist with sophisticated cells backed with millions of dollars will somehow lose their funding and supporters because Trump the great is now president and he decided that they shouldn't cross our boarders
Just fix it, that's the solution we've been overlooking this whole time
Yeah, simple right?
Trump can just come in and wave his comb over at the multi billion dollar drug smuggling industry, the Mexican cartels that run Mexico (yeah, they'll pay for a wall) and all the uncomplicated problems just vanish. He can tell them that they're fired
Terrorist with sophisticated cells backed with millions of dollars will somehow lose their funding and supporters because Trump the great is now president and he decided that they shouldn't cross our boarders
Just fix it, that's the solution we've been overlooking this whole time
I suppose you have a better idea? Maybe a unicorn draped in rainbows waving it's horn causing magic glitter to rain down over a land of Utopia. Gary can give you that, if you partake of his magic green bud. He certainly hasn't offered anything else.
It's not your fault that you think the US is now so weak that Mexican cartels and terrorists now rule the roost. You simply are looking inward, at yourself, and feel,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,inadequate. You're projecting. I, on the other hand, feel the US can certainly handle cartels and terrorists if given the opportunity to do so.
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When I was younger democrats like this ...tried to offer intelligent discourse,they attempted to use logical and honest inquiry to the issues.....now they don't even try they just lie,and keep lying., as the Hilary campaign has proven without a shadow of doubt, the media is in the bag of the DNC,and so they don't even attempt thinking,they just hammer the people 24/7 with propaganda....we end the incentives that attract illegals ,we make it easy for them to be here,we even give them fucking free money for being here they will keep coming...we make it one big pain in the ass to be here illegally they will go away.....as an illegal told me once......Look if you let us come we will....you offer no defense just empty worn out disproven platitudes....Have you noticed how Hilary supporters are so ashamed of themselves and their candidate that they can't even be honest about voting for her.....they say they ar voting for a third party or sitting out the election,but then defend the hags positions endlessly.
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THanks for this quote...I knew Gary was a moron,but I didn't realize exactly how stupid he was.....what I find offensive is calling a criminal who has nothing but contempt for the laws and the rightful wishes of a free people,an immigrant.....
Death threat from the cartels?for fucksakes we aren't even dealing with an actual legally elected government,we are dealing with a narco terrorist state.
He's coming back with a check for the wall. Lmfao.
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I'd love to be a fly on the wall for that meeting. I doubt that asshole down there ever suspected that Trump would call his bluff and actually go down there.
After Trump's meeting he's going back to AZ to give a speech laying out his immigration platform. That will be the icing on the cake for today.
After Trump's meeting he's going back to AZ to give a speech laying out his immigration platform. That will be the icing on the cake for today.
Depends on what he says...there seems to be a lot of waffling going from trump about the illegals.
Maybe.. if he lied more and stole more and had more of them jailed ... they would vote for him.
Maybe the women Latinos and blacks should actually listen to what the candidates are saying instead of what other people tell them the candidates say.
So far it seems people are more interested in supporting lies and protesting trutj..
Remember.. Hands up don't shoot... never happened... except at a protest march.
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I see Anthony wiener is up to his old tricks again......is it just me,or does anyone else find it surreal that democrats are voting for a woman whose closest confidante is a jihadi apologist,married to a sex addict who post pictures of his penis to strange women,and carries classified documents on the front seat of her car next to the cat food.....
Free shit.....
Dude is such a creep. He literally lives like 10 blocks from me. Just a straight up freak. He was actually Chuck Schumers hand picked heir apparent. Chuckie gave him his start in politics. Guy just crashed and burned.
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I'm not sure he crashed and burned...or just got caught.....I have a feeling that he is typical of our political class ,Bill Clinton used to go on trips to he private island of a known pedophile...that English guy Seville I think.....you look at the perversion on all levels of the Roman elite when Rome fell...is this any difference...why anyone would have faith in this government is mindboggeling
So there are no laws that you have contempt for?
I recognize the right of a free people to institute a society,and a system of law to ensure a civil society..anarchy is nothing more than the right of the strong to prey on the weak. I believe in arepresentaive government not anarchy, nor a tyranny of oligarchies.without immigration laws the ballot box is irrelevant.I believe the constitution does not extend to forgiven nationals. Hell if I believed in anarchy I would just move to Mexico.
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If acknowledging that the deportation of 10 to 30 million illegals won't happen on day 1 is waffling . If saying your going to start with those that have committed other crime beyond the one of being here illegally is waffling....
I don't see where He has softened his stance. I do see He is starting to accept reality.. that nothing he wants to do can be done overnight or without help.
He us a businessman and more importantly a salesman...... He has goals and objectives that maybe fixxed... but unlike a politician his route to the goal is negotiable. To a point.
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Sounds like a very political answer to me...he could do lots of stuff like withhold federal funding to any sanctuary city in the US,increase funding for ICE and th border patrol,demand any city receiving federal money will forfeit that money if it's police departments don't enforce immigration laws,or don't cooperate with ice...I don't expect over night I expect a system that will make it unbearable for an illegal to live here illegally. I expect a system that will actually punish people for hiring illegals not just on paper but put them in jail.
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What most people fail to realize is that an anchor baby from any country is a conduit for the entire family to come to the U.S. Once the kid reaches adult age and comes to the U.S. and gets settled, he or she can then petition for immediate family members to come over. Then any family member who becomes a naturalized citizen can do the same, and so on.
Pregnant Chinese women flock to San Francisco, California, and Washington State, live in dorm like conditions, push out a kid a couple months later on the American tax payers dime, and then fly back to China. It's the new Chinese retirement plan. 21 years later the kid can come back and petition to have his parents and relatives come over. The U.S. government is trying to clamp down on this practice, but our Traitor in Chief thwarts the effort of the agencies tasked with enforcing the immigration laws. If people get offended that someone openly states the truth, then they need to consider what will happen to the schools, taxes, social cohesion, and their own back yards.
Open borders will not benefit America, nor does it benefit any country with relative prosperity. Immigration should benefit a country, not weight it down with people that cannot or will not contribute to the society and it's advancement. Unfortunately, a large percentage of immigrants that want to come to America are functionally illiterate and not exactly willing to learn a new language or learn to read. Rather than integrate into the fabric of America, they insist on creating their own enclaves. There is nothing wrong in wanting to speak your mother tongue with others from your area or country, but that tends to get in the way of their progress when 20 years later, they still insist on speaking their mother tongue and trying to force others to adopt and accept their language and cultural practices and get insulted and sometimes violent when other American's don't acquiesce. In the not so distant past Immigrants learned the language and culture and worked to fit in and become part of America's melting pot. Not any more.
IMO we dont need to increase funding in the government at-all. We do need to audit and realocate every penny the government spends.. I think the government should go on a diet, just like they forced businesses to do over the last 30 years. IMO if business can cut 5-10 percent from there spending every year year after year and still function....... So can the government. The government needs to start be cutting directly about 25-30% of the bureaucratic workforce. From what I see the government uses 3-5 people to do what a business is forced to with 1.
Trump is NOT a politician.... Yet because he is running for office the media treats him as one. Trump, IMO is A-political.....
Some of those things he can do via the executive order... He can order the laws to be enforced...... Just like Obama has done to not have them enforced. BUT, in order to make any changes permanent, he will need the help of the, states, congress and courts. Remember Congress controls the money, or at least is supposed too. The president is just supposed to sign the checks.
We are in the shitter because congress over the last 3 presidents at least.. Only passes laws the presidents will sign, for the most part. Instead of passing laws the country needs and FORCING the president to veto or sign them and explain WHY and why not. Congress, could end the immigration issue, on the next budget bill that comes to them.. They have wimped out for the last 6 years, now. I believe we have another CR coming at around the time of the election. They could attach a defunding bill and enforcement bill with any CR, or required funding bill, and not back down..... When the press, blames them, for when the president shuts down the government with his veto.
It's taken about 100 years to get into the position we are in..... Hopefully it wont take another to get out of it. I do know Trump will have be dead for years, by natural causes, by the time most of what he wants can be completed. The wall, I know, he can do NOW. Just needs to hire the crews. It has after-all been funded several times, since The dems promised to have it built back in 1987 with the Amnesty bill Reagan signed. Thing has recieved so much money so far, the thing could be built of gold and come in under budget.
we don't need to spend any money on a wall... we stop giving free money to illegals we stop letting them into our schools,we don't issue driver licenses, we institute e-verify for employment.we enforce...that's right enforce our already existing immigration laws.we increase the fines for hiring illegals and we jail repeat offenders....we put the army on the border hell special forces on the border until the drug cartels leave mexico...it wouldn't costs us an extra cent...they are only here because our political clas REFUSES to enforce the law......don't pay your income tax for 10 or 20 years and see if you get an amnesty.
So, I remember conversations of the past. Not here, mind you, but long before the internet. Around the time of NAFTA.
Much of the talk from the early globalists was about improving third world countries. Bringing them up to our standards of living. It was part of the "free" trade talks. Clinton and Bush era talk. Even before that.They wanted all countries to be equal economically. To wipe out poverty worldwide. They wanted the average person in Mexico to have the same standard of living as the average person in the US, as an example.
Dems(Union folks) were right about some things. Mainly, they were right that it would be impossible to raise countries up to our economic position. Most of us realized that in order for third world countries to be on equal footing with the US(meaning the people of those countries standard of living) that the US must fall. Our standard of living had to go down to meet a third world countries rise up. This has always been the goal of the globalists and we see it happening. The results of globalisation are here but have just started.
Mass Immigration and so called "free" trade were and are used to further the goal. We gave these countries with low standards of living our manufacturing, driving up their wages and standard of living and lowering ours. Mass immigration brings more poor people here and removes poor people from the other countries which lowers our standard of living and raises theirs.
Those of us with memories, that remember the politics of old(recent history), understand that what is going on is intentional. It was quite open and deliberate. There really is no need for elaborate conspiracy theories. The conspiracy was and is playing out in front of our eyes.
As I've said many times in this thread, I don't get how people do not remember their opposition to these policies that they had 30 years ago. Now, many of them embrace the very policies they did not like back then. They no longer oppose the very things that now cause their problems. They knew it would turn out bad, they have been proven right, and yet they now embrace mass immigration and so called "free" trade.
The mass brainwashing is astounding. It's absolutely amazing. I find myself in awe every time I speak with someone that has forgotten the positions of their past.
I aggree with everything said here......
If I didn't know better I would believe, we were being trained to be submissive, like well... Slaves. Figures, considering who the Dems are and who the Repubs are portrayed as, if not becoming.
Trumps meeting and speech in Mexico was a slam dunk.
CNN hasn't had time to find their Trump bashing spin yet and even the most ardent bashers are having a hard time finding a way to spin it. But it's early, they have not gotten their marching orders from Hitlery and the DNC yet.
There should be some interesting media spin when Clinton hands out the orders to the Clinton News Network. But, for now, I'm enjoying the deer in the headlights look on the talking heads faces.
CNN hasn't had time to find their Trump bashing spin yet and even the most ardent bashers are having a hard time finding a way to spin it. But it's early, they have not gotten their marching orders from Hitlery and the DNC yet.
There should be some interesting media spin when Clinton hands out the orders to the Clinton News Network. But, for now, I'm enjoying the deer in the headlights look on the talking heads faces.
Say what you want about Trump, he hit a home run today.
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They have no idea how to spin this. They're barely treading water on this one.
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It's very difficult to watch but I like to see how public opinion is formed. It's like watching this video.
Your post @Time regarding globalization nailed it right in the x-ring (sorry--was at the range today 
)
Most people do not pay attention enough to understand that the absolute decline in wages based on purchasing power is a direct result of this push toward globalization. Maybe if the talking heads who explain it properly wore football jerseys more people would pay attention and understand.
)Most people do not pay attention enough to understand that the absolute decline in wages based on purchasing power is a direct result of this push toward globalization. Maybe if the talking heads who explain it properly wore football jerseys more people would pay attention and understand.
Your post @Time regarding globalization nailed it right in the x-ring (sorry--was at the range today
Most people do not pay attention enough to understand that the absolute decline in wages based on purchasing power is a direct result of this push toward globalization. Maybe if the talking heads who explain it properly wore football jerseys more people would pay attention and understand.
The thing is, people knew it. 25-30 years ago, people knew. Now, even while they see the result, they no longer know.
The brainwashing is amazing. See above social conformity video.
Oh I turn to CNN and MSNBC first... after every live political speech I see.. I try to watch all of Trump or Hitlery I can. Live.
Just so I know what the News is lying to me about. Or just how stupid most of the highly educated talking heads are.
Fact Is ALL The news sources suck. But they are all we really have.
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