roxynoodle
Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
ECF Refugee
It's a clone, from FT.
Become a Patron!
ECF Refugee Thread All welcome though
- Thread starter The Cromwell
- Start date
-
- Tags
- ecf
- Status
It's a clone, from FT.
JuicyLucy
My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
ECF Refugee
VU Challenge Team
Member For 5 Years
That's where I'm getting mine.
JuicyLucy
My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
ECF Refugee
VU Challenge Team
Member For 5 Years
Evening fugee's......hope everyone had a lovely day.......
Tis --- how is your evening?
Just Duckie.....U?.....
roxynoodle
Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
ECF Refugee
I hope the children made you a nice dinner and washed the dishes to....Oh, I'm sorry! And on Mother's Day
My evening was decent.
I had a nice day with family today. 2 cutie pie little kiddos were there and I love cutie pie kiddos. They can be tricked into thinking yard work is fun!
Good times. Good food!
Good times. Good food!
JuicyLucy
My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
ECF Refugee
VU Challenge Team
Member For 5 Years
Just Duckie.....U?.....
Tippy top - stress free, that's what I aim for
roxynoodle
Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
ECF Refugee
Petey might not be into doing dishes, I bet he left them for u...........
He sure did. I think he called me a bitch under his breath earlier when I rolled his cage out to vacuum underneath it.
Well fugee's, I ran across sumptin earlier tonight but been busy as hell here at work and havent had a chance to share it until now.
It seems back in Febuary a judge has already ruled on sumptin that may be very beneficial to us.
http://www.churnmag.com/news/new-york-court-rules-that-vaping-is-not-smoking/
This little tidbit I find awesome. "However, the judge ruled that this argument was invalid. After all, vapor devices just do not match up with the state’s current definition of “smoking” and cannot be treated as tobacco products if they contain no tobacco."
The FDA decided they had the right to regulate vaping because they deemed it as a tobacco product, which is the only way they can regulate it for if it wasnt deemed tobacco, they dont have the authority to regulate it. Seems like the entire FDA and their fucked up regulations can be taken to court and the FDA can be force to butt the fuck out of vaping since vaping is NOT a tobacco product in the legal definition.
This link here is what the FDA can regulate and there is no category that vaping will fall under.
http://www.fda.gov/AboutFDA/Transparency/Basics/ucm194879.htm
It seems back in Febuary a judge has already ruled on sumptin that may be very beneficial to us.
http://www.churnmag.com/news/new-york-court-rules-that-vaping-is-not-smoking/
This little tidbit I find awesome. "However, the judge ruled that this argument was invalid. After all, vapor devices just do not match up with the state’s current definition of “smoking” and cannot be treated as tobacco products if they contain no tobacco."
The FDA decided they had the right to regulate vaping because they deemed it as a tobacco product, which is the only way they can regulate it for if it wasnt deemed tobacco, they dont have the authority to regulate it. Seems like the entire FDA and their fucked up regulations can be taken to court and the FDA can be force to butt the fuck out of vaping since vaping is NOT a tobacco product in the legal definition.
This link here is what the FDA can regulate and there is no category that vaping will fall under.
http://www.fda.gov/AboutFDA/Transparency/Basics/ucm194879.htm
roxynoodle
Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
ECF Refugee
I think that's actually our best hope, but if that happens I expect them to create a new category and come back with essentially the same regulations. However, it buys time.
Are we better off with the Cole bill, and losing new innovation, but getting to keep what we have? It would also make it easier for new products then to show equivalence.
The FDA is putting out a lot of flat out lies. I argued with my boss earlier tonight about it because "the FDA said this" and the FDA said that" so it must be gospel because that is what the FDA said. Tried to explain it but some people are so closed minded that you cant explain shit to them.
They will say and do anything to protect the folks who line their pockets with cash, BT and BP.....simple as that...they're corrupt, just like all gov related agencies.
roxynoodle
Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
ECF Refugee
I had an argument with my mother this morning because she said, "They needed to do this because kids are going crazy using them, and they make so much smoke!"
Not sure why I bother though. I've explained to her 100 times it's not smoke. And about the correlation between the smoking rate diving among teens, how most don't use nic, how nic is not addictive outside of tobacco, yadda, yadda.
That is sooooo true! I get aggravated when I try to actually inform people that don't understand it sometimes. "Those things blow up", "That's worse than smoking", "People use those for drugs", etc... I recently had a guy holler across a parking lot, "Those things don't work ya know!"
I went into great detail about why batteries blow up, took my own mod apart, showed what I carry in my purse for batteries, explained the details of what I'm using and got, "Well ok, but you be careful." LOL.
I went into great detail about why batteries blow up, took my own mod apart, showed what I carry in my purse for batteries, explained the details of what I'm using and got, "Well ok, but you be careful." LOL.
I had a similar conversation with my mom this morning. I was like "really?, sure the the news reports 100% the truth, and full facts unbiasedly, so keep relying on them too". This, after she just had both her lung covers removed and replaced, and smoked for 45 years.
Slowly we been winning as being accepted as vapors. There is still a long way to go but we have made huge strides in people learning about vaping and that it is not harmful like the naysayers claim, but we have a very long way to go and the FDA didnt help at all. With a little luck the FDA will be defeated for now. They will keep trying because government is losing way too much money by us not smoking but a couple lawsuits claiming that it isnt tobacco and therefore the FDA doesnt have the authority to regulate it and a few judges that have an ounce of common sense and the FDA will be defeated for now.
Hope you're right. The media has been proven dangerous in spreading propaganda and vaping is just one example.
Good morning all!
Good morning everyone. Hope everyone has excellent days, today.
Prime example. Fredricks of Hollywood is still in business
On the Deeming crap here is an excerpt from the PMTA application process draft doc.
This is the killer right here. Vaping will be dead. One must have a study performed by FDA guidelines for each PMTA application/device/liquid that shows that the product is appropriate for the protection of the public health
...............
"Section 910(c)(1)(A)(ii) of theFD&C Act requires that FDA deny a PMTA and issue an order that the product may not be introduced or delivered for introduction into interstate commerce where FDA finds that:
You have not shown that the product is appropriate for the protection of the public health"
This is the killer right here. Vaping will be dead. One must have a study performed by FDA guidelines for each PMTA application/device/liquid that shows that the product is appropriate for the protection of the public health
...............
"Section 910(c)(1)(A)(ii) of theFD&C Act requires that FDA deny a PMTA and issue an order that the product may not be introduced or delivered for introduction into interstate commerce where FDA finds that:
You have not shown that the product is appropriate for the protection of the public health"
pwheeler
My dad is Mr. Wheeler, I am Paul
VU Donator
Silver Contributor
Member For 4 Years
ECF Refugee
Good morning and GFY! Monday again....another rough week, it looks like. All this talk about the FDA regs just pisses me off to no end. I don't know what will happen with lawsuits and such, but the FDA is determined to make it impossible to keep vaping alive except for the crappy cigalikes. BT and BP have big pockets and I know it's their intent to drive everyone back to tobacco use again. Too much money being lost, and our spineless government just goes where the money is. To hell with the health of it's citizens. Healthy citizens don't bring in as much money.
top of the morning and happy monday, folks
haleysdadda
AKA BILL
VU Donator
Silver Contributor
Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
ECF Refugee
Good morning all & GFYs! Been away for a minute because of some shit going on! Just wanted to let you all know that I'm at least lurking! I just refuse to post about the new regs because it bums me out & for some reason I still have faith in our constitution & our judicial system! I will always sign ALL petitions against this tyranny! Enough with the heavy & let's get to the happy! I've had my Boreas, @raymo2u coil, & Hohmwrecker G2 set-up for almost a week now & IMHO this rig is the best ever! @Robert Cromwell the G2 might not be true temp control with Kanthal but whatever it is it works really well & provides an adjustable awesome vape! Gotta get ready for work! Love y'all!
The G2 definitely as close to temp control as you could get, its no different then any other TC device....It just does it differently.Good morning all & GFYs! Been away for a minute because of some shit going on! Just wanted to let you all know that I'm at least lurking! I just refuse to post about the new regs because it bums me out & for some reason I still have faith in our constitution & our judicial system! I will always sign ALL petitions against this tyranny! Enough with the heavy & let's get to the happy! I've had my Boreas, @raymo2u coil, & Hohmwrecker G2 set-up for almost a week now & IMHO this rig is the best ever! @Robert Cromwell the G2 might not be true temp control with Kanthal but whatever it is it works really well & provides an adjustable awesome vape! Gotta get ready for work! Love y'all!
Im glad your enjoying the coils and might I add that setup is one of the best in combination IMO!!
pretty interesting perspective on the FDA enema here from Matt at Suck My Mod... good overview and good advice, in regards to not panicking, getting informed and working as a community...
Could an independent group then not do such a study? For example a study could be done by an international health organization offering open source studies. This group offers the study preformed to FDA guidelines except for the money required by the FDA, or is it the money that the FDA wants more so than compliance with health standards?
I suspect even if an independent study were submitted and the product had crossed all the t's and dotted all i's, the money would remain the hold up. Nothing so far quells that suspicion.
The way I read it the study must be performed by the manufacturer of the product or someone they pay to do the study and done to FDA requirements with the results submitted with the PMTA application.
and with juice it will require studies on ALL of the flavorings and ingredients used in EACH product.
I just can't see it happening except by a very large company on a very limited variety of juices.
Alright. So at least the point is the FDA does not require being paid themselves. Do you follow where I am going?
That means:
The FDA cannot regulate the costs of the studies.
The FDA may only offer guidelines for the studies, but must accept studies done independently.
Any independent study needs to positively show the product as appropriate for health protection. Vaping is harm reduction from tobacco cigarettes, ergo protecting health.
Correct?
Understand, I am not looking at this as a loophole but rather as the noose the FDA made for itself, given adequate rope.
Big question is, who specifically deems appropriateness? Under what authority?
And then levy the three magic questions.
What is the EXACT AMOUNT of fraud that ANY man or woman has the right to
commit?
What is the EXACT AMOUNT of fraud that ANY man or woman has an actual
obligation to endure?
What is the BASIC PREMISE that is being operated off of, in the instant
case?
Let the FDA answer those, if they may. Have doubts they would, even if they could.
They may suggest they are acting in public interest of health. Doing so then admits their fraud. This abolishes the premise of the case they are attempting to use. Fraud is fraud and anything connected to fraud is tainted. It is fraud when cigarettes kill, pharmaceuticals kill and yet they remain on the market. Consumers found something that helps save lives but it has to be pulled off the market, oddly? So they are acting in public interest? Difficult to see that at best.
Last edited:
Morning fugees
roxynoodle
Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
ECF Refugee
Good morning and GFY!
Taking Pete to the birdie doctor to find out if he has any new health issues we need to address.
Taking Pete to the birdie doctor to find out if he has any new health issues we need to address.
Good luck! Fingers crossed
My guess is that the FDA will want to make it so that devices suck. Internal battery only, and limited to very low power with pre-built coils. RDAs done, RTAs done.
I think I am making myself sick thinking of the many ways they will find you dismantle and destroy vaping as a whole. They could just simply deny approval for anything not a Blu, VUSE, NJOY, or other cig-a-like garbage that the the tobacco companies sell. Pretty much open season for them. In the long run, if they completely killed vaping, it's no sweat off their back and more people will buy ACTUAL tobacco products, so they still win.
I think I am making myself sick thinking of the many ways they will find you dismantle and destroy vaping as a whole. They could just simply deny approval for anything not a Blu, VUSE, NJOY, or other cig-a-like garbage that the the tobacco companies sell. Pretty much open season for them. In the long run, if they completely killed vaping, it's no sweat off their back and more people will buy ACTUAL tobacco products, so they still win.
roxynoodle
Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
Member For 2 Years
Member For 1 Year
ECF Refugee
JuicyLucy
My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
ECF Refugee
VU Challenge Team
Member For 5 Years
Good morning all & GFYs! Been away for a minute because of some shit going on! Just wanted to let you all know that I'm at least lurking! I just refuse to post about the new regs because it bums me out & for some reason I still have faith in our constitution & our judicial system! I will always sign ALL petitions against this tyranny! Enough with the heavy & let's get to the happy! I've had my Boreas, @raymo2u coil, & Hohmwrecker G2 set-up for almost a week now & IMHO this rig is the best ever! @Robert Cromwell the G2 might not be true temp control with Kanthal but whatever it is it works really well & provides an adjustable awesome vape! Gotta get ready for work! Love y'all!
GFY Bill - was wondering where you were all weekend. Hope all is well and come back soon!!!
JuicyLucy
My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
ECF Refugee
VU Challenge Team
Member For 5 Years
Prime example. Fredricks of Hollywood is still in business
For all your Mother's Day shopping needs! Hilarious!
Oh and GFY everybody
You and me both in the making yourself sick in thinking about it. This is why I'm thinking in positive terms of making the FDA irrelevant. If they are irrelevant due to fraud especially, they have no authority or power at all to decide anything regarding vaping. Going after that Big Tobacco money sure does seem to present motive of fraud.
Worst restaurant experience EVER was one year for our wedding anniversary I made reservations at a popular place on the Seattle waterfront. When we arrived, they had lost the reservation. Waited 10 minutes for them to find us a table - the place was mostly empty, but it was early in the dinner serving. Once at the table, we waited 20 minutes for a server to come greet us and give us menus. Once we had the menus, we waited another 25 minutes before a glass of water showed up on the table. Our server was nowhere to be seen. We had been forgotten and ignored. We got up and walked out. The restaurant closed about a year later. I wonder why?
*chuckles* Somewhat reminds me of similar anniversary dinner me and wife had. We went to an Italian style place and took quite a bit to get a server. Then, my wife asks, "does the order come with garlic bread". The server seemed to want to melt into the floor.
"We don't have garlic bread. I'm sorry. But we do have bread that you can put garlic butter on" they told my wife.
We still look back and wonder why we went ahead and ate our dinner there. No garlic bread in an Italian style place? We ought to have left right then but no, we stayed and had a dinner.
- Status