Become a Patron!
To Date which US Presidential candidate will you be voting for & why?
- Thread starter SMOKIE
- Start date
- Status
the GOP are focused on getting Hilary elected.
I disagree.
With Cruz out, it's an easy path to 1237. He can't be denied.
That don't mean some won't work under the radar to smash him in the general, but the nomination is secure.
Well, that's shocking!!! I'm now a member of the "Elite" for reaching an opinion of my own accord!!
YAYYY!!! Do I get to learn the Secret Handshake now too??? 
And how did this jump to being about any purported levels of violence perpetrated by Trump supporters??? I believe I neither mentioned nor inferred anything of the sort. I was speaking solely about the "protesters" at the May Day and Trump rallies respectively and the probability that a respectable portion of them were only there to partake in hooliganism for no other reason than they're idiots.
I'm not delusional enough to think that reforms are the be-all end-all answer to the problem. But there has to be something done to break the current system. I'm of the opinion that it is the system that allows for the corruption of politicians, not that politicians are corrupt by nature. It's all part of The Game, and the easiest way to change The Game is to change the rules of the game.
Congress is at the lowest approval rating it's seen in decades. The public is fed up with the whole mess that is professional politics and we're starting to see that embodied with the emergence of a candidate like Trump. I may not care one iota for the man, but I have to admire the fact that he's thrown a big stinky boot in the pot. For that, he has my gratitude.
Lee Harvey Oswald was Innocent. Blame the fella's in the car with JFK!
***TRUMP2016*** He's for our Vets, Against ILLEGAL Immigration, Against the Refugees (terrorists), He's all for our 2nd Amendment, He's for growing this country-Taxing companies that leave the US & import their junk back to us. Grow our military (which atm is almost WW2 Size) ....
My opinion: FIRE & Re-Hire BETTER ppl for the VA, get real doctors in there NOT wannabe's, Serve ALL Vets NOT Specific Vet Era's. My father is a Nam Vet n recently received a letter. Any vets over 2003 are free, any under gets screwed *BS*.
DEPORT ALL the illegals in this country, make them come back the RIGHT WAY!
SEND Back ALL the refugees (which ARE terrorists) & DON'T allow anymore into this country, unless FULLY Screened/Processed.
Trump's point on the 2nd Amendment works well with me & responsible gun owners. National Concealed Carry *2 thumbs up* & Have ALL States recognize other states ordinances.
*I'll personally add, he should make a LAW that ANYONE whom dis-respects the American Flag,US Soldier or Impersonates a US Soldier *Gets a felony & Jail time OR deported (american or not)*
Taxing the companies that leave to Mexico, Japan etc. But turn around & send the crap back to us *Import* I agree with the 30% Tax when they leave & the 30% Tax on their goods (import). So yes they'll get taxed 60% BUT will eventually come back HOME, and business would be pumping in the US once again. We used to be a Great Nation, but we have NOT been that way for a long sad time! Abolish the NSA/TSA/FDA/EPA etc... They are dumb branches that DON'T do anything!
GROW & ADVANCE: Our Military NEEDS to grow!
ABOLISH Osamacare, LIMIT Congress/Senate etc to 4yr Term Limits (NOT this 30+yr BS), CUT Wages of politicians, LIMIT Ex-President earnings to $200k/year NOT the almost $500k *osama wants*. I'd also say CUT Wages of sports players, and give the wages to the people who ACTUALLY EARN IT our US Soldiers.
OK All done, Take care ya'll!
My opinion: FIRE & Re-Hire BETTER ppl for the VA, get real doctors in there NOT wannabe's, Serve ALL Vets NOT Specific Vet Era's. My father is a Nam Vet n recently received a letter. Any vets over 2003 are free, any under gets screwed *BS*.
DEPORT ALL the illegals in this country, make them come back the RIGHT WAY!
SEND Back ALL the refugees (which ARE terrorists) & DON'T allow anymore into this country, unless FULLY Screened/Processed.
Trump's point on the 2nd Amendment works well with me & responsible gun owners. National Concealed Carry *2 thumbs up* & Have ALL States recognize other states ordinances.
*I'll personally add, he should make a LAW that ANYONE whom dis-respects the American Flag,US Soldier or Impersonates a US Soldier *Gets a felony & Jail time OR deported (american or not)*
Taxing the companies that leave to Mexico, Japan etc. But turn around & send the crap back to us *Import* I agree with the 30% Tax when they leave & the 30% Tax on their goods (import). So yes they'll get taxed 60% BUT will eventually come back HOME, and business would be pumping in the US once again. We used to be a Great Nation, but we have NOT been that way for a long sad time! Abolish the NSA/TSA/FDA/EPA etc... They are dumb branches that DON'T do anything!
GROW & ADVANCE: Our Military NEEDS to grow!
ABOLISH Osamacare, LIMIT Congress/Senate etc to 4yr Term Limits (NOT this 30+yr BS), CUT Wages of politicians, LIMIT Ex-President earnings to $200k/year NOT the almost $500k *osama wants*. I'd also say CUT Wages of sports players, and give the wages to the people who ACTUALLY EARN IT our US Soldiers.
OK All done, Take care ya'll!
Um, our system is to elect reps. The electorate does that. Voters. It's actually pretty simple. The only way to change that is to restrict who the voters can vote for. Then we don't have a true election.
No, restricting the electorate by restricting who they can vote for and restricting the electorate by shutting down access to reps through lobby restrictions is ridiculous. You can't take the peoples voice away and still have a government by the people. The people might be stupid, as they've been for some time, but a government by the people for the people requires unrestricted access.
People get what they vote for. Everybody knows Hillary is corrupt, yet millions vote for her. No reform will change that. The only thing that will change that is people not voting for corruption. To pretend some rule will keep the corrupt out is laughable. Believe what you want. People are corrupt by nature. There has never, and will never be, an uncorruptable system. Changing the rules of a game has never made it impossible to cheat. You just find different ways.
And your second paragraph proves my point. The electorate has thrown a big stinky boot in the pot, not Trump. Trump can't vote himself into the nomination. The electorate can produce change, and since there has been no reforms, the change thus far has only come from the electorate. The system can work when the electorate wants it to work. No reforms needed. Just voters that want something other than corruption.
We don't have true elections as it is, so what's the difference? Anyone running for office at the state or federal level is going to need at least the tacit support of the one of the parties to stand a reasonable chance of making the ballot. The party apparatus spoon-feeds us candidates, not from those that would represent us, but rather those that will toe and support the Party Line. In return, they get the money, the greased palms and back-room deals. Yes, that's a cynical view, but that's The Game I was referring to. The rules need to be changed. How they get changed is another matter. And what they get changed to is yet another matter. Democracy is flexible enough to accommodate and even allow such things to happen. Where you're absolutely correct is that those changes have to come from us, the governed.
The ultimate truth is that whatever faults or problems this economy, government and nation has is not the fault of the liberals or the conservatives.
People who shrill shit like that are mindless turd-hurlers.
Stand up. Go to the mirror. Look at what you see.
That's where the problem is.
We have the government and nation and economy that we created. Through action or inaction - they are one and the same.
sorry my bad ...misread your post.Well, that's shocking!!! I'm now a member of the "Elite" for reaching an opinion of my own accord!!
And how did this jump to being about any purported levels of violence perpetrated by Trump supporters??? I believe I neither mentioned nor inferred anything of the sort. I was speaking solely about the "protesters" at the May Day and Trump rallies respectively and the probability that a respectable portion of them were only there to partake in hooliganism for no other reason than they're idiots.
It's been a slow evolution but in my lifetime there's been Perot,Nadar,Ron Paul, and now Trump and Sanders..I think a helluva alot of people are voting not so much for Trump,but to put a monkey wrench in the control of the Kingmakers. Trump is a protest vote against the control of the parties and people way of saying that they are willing to vote outside of party lines. With the advent of the internet and without the total control of the media by the kingmakers I think people are being more active and better informed....but the power of the propoganda machine is still huge.
)
Don't forget John Anderson in that list..
Trump has taken the GOP, turned it upside-down and given it a vigorous shaking. The cruft and detritus are falling to the floor.
I would tend to agree with your sentiment that people are supporting him as a means of protest against the apparatus. One could hope that they (the RNC) get the message from the constituency that they are no longer satisfied with the product they're pitching.
Do we want to start taking bets on how long Reince Pribus and some of the other gang at the RNC will be employed following the election?
When Trump started his bid for being the R nominee he said some crazy shit. Like build a wall... with a door for legal entry. He immediately made enemies with the Ds and the Rs. Outrageous. But folks responded. Not all liked it, but a lot did. But anyone with political ties hated it with a passion. The news media really hated it. He grew more popular with the people. It was just the start.
Trump never backed down to what all the politicos and news media had said would be his demise. In fact, he doubled down and said he would make the Mexican government pay for the wall. Outrageous! Now he's a dead candidate with all the vitriol from the press and almost all political entities D and R. Except the American people said in a pretty loud voice... yeah we want to hear more, we might be down with that. News media is pissed, Ds are pissed, Rs (his own party) is pissed, but the people said yep... we want to hear more, we're kinda thinking the same way but were afraid to say it.
FF to today. Trump is the presumptive candidate for the Rs... regardless of their massive effort to block him. His own party FFS. Just weird really. Not politics as usual.
I will vote Trump. Not because I believe he can do all he says he will, no candidate every has really. But because I'm willing to try something that might be bad for 4 years (in contrast to what I'm pretty sure would be bad if Hillary gets elected), just to tell all the news media and the politicos that business as usual is over in Washington. At worst, I think we can weather 4 bad years to get to a totally different take on politics in the next election.
Business as usual is over for politics in America, and that's what I'm voting for.
Trump never backed down to what all the politicos and news media had said would be his demise. In fact, he doubled down and said he would make the Mexican government pay for the wall. Outrageous! Now he's a dead candidate with all the vitriol from the press and almost all political entities D and R. Except the American people said in a pretty loud voice... yeah we want to hear more, we might be down with that. News media is pissed, Ds are pissed, Rs (his own party) is pissed, but the people said yep... we want to hear more, we're kinda thinking the same way but were afraid to say it.
FF to today. Trump is the presumptive candidate for the Rs... regardless of their massive effort to block him. His own party FFS. Just weird really. Not politics as usual.
I will vote Trump. Not because I believe he can do all he says he will, no candidate every has really. But because I'm willing to try something that might be bad for 4 years (in contrast to what I'm pretty sure would be bad if Hillary gets elected), just to tell all the news media and the politicos that business as usual is over in Washington. At worst, I think we can weather 4 bad years to get to a totally different take on politics in the next election.
Business as usual is over for politics in America, and that's what I'm voting for.
UncleRJ
Will write reviews for Beer!
Staff member
Senior Moderator
VU Donator
Platinum Contributor
Member For 4 Years
ECF Refugee
Reviewer
Moderator
As a resident of the state of Ohio, I am glad that Kasich had his beyond sorry ass handed to him courtesy of Trump.
At the minimum he is dangerous.
I also had the displeasure of having to listen to his speech today that was supposed to include the fact that he had gotten his but kicked.
30 minutes of my life that I will never get back.
30 minutes of hot air with him thanking everyone and blowing BS scented smoke up our skirts or kilts depending on your pleasure.
Brought up some drivel about a father that had a son suffering from cancer following him from state to state kinda like some kind of Asshat Messiah for giving him and his son hope.
And a black lady thanking him for "Bringing us all Together".
Where did he bring us all "Together"? At a flipping pancake house as all he has done since he entered the race in July of "15" is eat his way around the country displaying really piss poor table manners much of this being paid by the Ohio taxpayers.
Sorry, but my rant is over now and good riddance to Kasich!
I'm not sure how 'true elections' is defined. That people fall for lies, deception and false narratives does not imply that the election process is flawed, it implies that the electorate is flawed.
You seem intent on blaming the system for our government. So, you and I can never agree. Before a problem can be fixed, the core reason for the problem must be correctly identified. Changing the tires on my car because I keep getting flats won't go very far to fixing the issue if I don't stop driving over the bucket of nails I spilled in the middle of the driveway.
The electorate of the country is a bed of nails. They fall for the two party system. They fall for the lies, deception and false narrative. They elect the corrupt. You can change the tires(rules) all you like but the bed of nails is still there. You will still get corruption because you have not identified the problem. Until you pick up the nails, you've done nothing to solve the problem. Changing the tires only delays the next flat tire.
Now, you will either see the truth in that or you won't. Our government has been changing tires for a very long time on a long list of subjects. They make new rules, laws, regulations, and policy but never fix a fucking thing. If you think the government way of solving problems by buying new tires without ever identifying the true cause of the countries problems has been working out okay then by all means, change the tires for the voters. It won't solve anything, but it will make you feel as though you had for a short time.
I'd ask that you re-read my post, and particularly the last section of it:
Although not specifically stated, I would include what our electoral system has become in that point. The electorate - over the course of generations - has allowed, aided, abetted and otherwise manufactured the current system for selecting our highest ranking officials. We have allowed two groups to consolidate the power, money and mechanism for placing people on the ballot. The ideal of the Citizen Statesman died long ago because getting into office requires becoming beholden to one of those groups to attain office. That is the system that is broken.
The underlying current that we share and agree on is that it is up to us, the people of the electorate, to change that system if we are dissatisfied with it. And I think that is a growing sentiment in this country. How we accomplish it if that is our goal is open to debate. And experimentation. As I said, our democracy allows for us to change things up when we need to.
That piece of shit wanted to tax vaping products at some ridiculous rate in Ohio the last I heard. Glad that jackass is pouting in a corner somewhere now.
Yes, you get part of it. But laws won't change nothing, they will make it worse.
There is no government system except districts and the electoral college. The two parties were created by the electorate. Nobody is forced to vote for them. There is no law that says you have to vote for one or the other. I know because I have never voted for an R or a D for President and I've voted several times. You're talking about making laws to prevent some people from running for office(term limits), making laws to prevent the free access to elected officials(lobby), and making laws to prevent some from contributing to election campaigns. All of which are antidemocratic. They are more likely to do the opposite of what you think you want. By their very nature, election laws like what you think the country needs create restrictions on the electorate. They don't restrict the parties, they restrict the people.
I like my Senator. Most who look him up, that deem themselves conservative, like his voting record. I don't want him replaced and to be frank, I don't appreciate people trying to make it illegal for me to vote for him. So, in a friendly manner and a smile, I'll kindly tell you to fuck off if you think I should not have the right to vote for the man for another term. I don't want your restriction placed on me.
I like the NRA. I like other groups that lobby. I do not want my ability to join groups that share my view and to lobby congress as a group to be taken from me. I might want to lobby a congressman through CASSA. So, in a friendly manner and a smile, I'll kindly tell you to fuck off if you think I should not have the right to join CASSA and lobby congress to do away with vaping regulations. I don't want your restrictions placed on me.
I do not like my Congressman. He's a RINO of the worst sort. He has corruption written all over him. I want to do all I can to get him defeated to include funding his opponent. I don't want to be restricted in my ability to do so. So, in a friendly manner and a smile, I'll kindly tell you to fuck off if you think I should be restricted from funding a group opposed to the man. I don't want your restrictions placed on me.
Those are examples. If and when you find yourself restricted due to the very laws you propose, you'll understand.
Besides all that, Trump and Sanders have proven election reforms are not needed, more so from Trump. The electorate on the GOP side rejected the millions thrown against Trump. They rejected the lobby groups against Trump. They rejected the GOPe. No restrictive laws were needed. Only the electorate was needed. How it works out is anybodies guess but it should be readily apparent that the electorate has a voice when they choose to use it. There is nothing wrong with the system. The system is not broken. The electorate can always choose who they want. They just have to do it. Making laws only restricts us more. The cure for corruption is and always has been the electorate, not laws. Laws have never bothered the corrupt.
The cure for corruption is and always has been to inform the electorate. To sway others. Just as I'm attempting right now. I might fail as I have failed many times in the past but making laws that restrict voters does not make up for my failures. I can't make laws to restrict people from voting for people that I consider corrupt. It's undemocratic. It's not a representative republic if people cannot vote for who they want. It's not a representative republic if people cannot form groups to lobby their reps. It's not a representative republic if the people are restricted.
Last edited:
^^^THIS^^^
Exactly.
I think Time is right. I don't think we need laws to restrict people from office per se, though I like the idea of term limits for the president and I'm not crazy about lifetime appointments to the surpreme court nor the extent of the the power 9 lawyers hold over the ballot box.
What I do think we need is more honest journalisim,more transparent knowledge of election finance whose funding these politicians, and I think we have aknowledge that we are brainwashed..the people have to aknowledge the extent and the influence that massive amounts of money and control is able to use the media from political adds, to entertainment, to music industry to create a popular narritive...but then you are asking the electorate to think....and thinking is not really encouraged by either party...thinking is something most americans find offensive and dangerous. they find it destabelizing and anti-social.We are told thinking is tearing the country apart and that a mindless unquestioning adhernce to the manufactured narritive is .."crossing the aisle" creating bridges....which is bullshit.....the elite aren't afraid or riots, and blood in the streets, actually they encourage it and laud it and justify it....look how they created the false narritive about the Micheal Brown case of the gentle giant and kept pushing that narritive..they want riots not thinking....what they find dangerous what they are really afraid of what they really will crucify you for is...thought crimes.....thinking,questioning the narritive...is verboteen
anyone who discusses the extent of the control especailly over thought is immediately ridiculed by the brainwashed as "conspiracy therorist" and is then labeled a domestic terrorist..thus the old adage..
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."
What I do think we need is more honest journalisim,more transparent knowledge of election finance whose funding these politicians, and I think we have aknowledge that we are brainwashed..the people have to aknowledge the extent and the influence that massive amounts of money and control is able to use the media from political adds, to entertainment, to music industry to create a popular narritive...but then you are asking the electorate to think....and thinking is not really encouraged by either party...thinking is something most americans find offensive and dangerous. they find it destabelizing and anti-social.We are told thinking is tearing the country apart and that a mindless unquestioning adhernce to the manufactured narritive is .."crossing the aisle" creating bridges....which is bullshit.....the elite aren't afraid or riots, and blood in the streets, actually they encourage it and laud it and justify it....look how they created the false narritive about the Micheal Brown case of the gentle giant and kept pushing that narritive..they want riots not thinking....what they find dangerous what they are really afraid of what they really will crucify you for is...thought crimes.....thinking,questioning the narritive...is verboteen
anyone who discusses the extent of the control especailly over thought is immediately ridiculed by the brainwashed as "conspiracy therorist" and is then labeled a domestic terrorist..thus the old adage..
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."
Last edited:
SMOKIE
THE MODFATHER
Staff member
VU Senior Leadership
VU Senior Administrator
Senior Moderator
VU Donator
Platinum Contributor
VU Live Leadership
Show Host
Reviewer
Vape Media
VU Live Host
Member For 5 Years
Most people are sick,and tired of the incumbent politicians always being elected into office with saying for years we need a outsider that is not a politician or G.R.I.P. Today Trump is that man, some people do not like his attitude or his stands so what did you expect of a non political candidate.
Be careful what you wish for in the future because it might come true.
Be careful what you wish for in the future because it might come true.
UncleRJ
Will write reviews for Beer!
Staff member
Senior Moderator
VU Donator
Platinum Contributor
Member For 4 Years
ECF Refugee
Reviewer
Moderator
Don't forget taking vacations. Lots and LOTS of them
And don't you know that President Carter is thankful that he's now #2 on that list!
LMAO...yes and Huma will take Monica's place
Hey Obama works in entertainment too.
He's a comedian and his foreign policy is considered a joke all around the world.
- Status